What the pro shop guy said...

[martinezsam2495]

He recommended me the Misfit, and he let me throw his ball ( a misfit) he said he got a 300 the night before with it, he was a PBA bowler for over 30 years, has 3 sanctioned 900 series and some other stuff, I tried out his ball and I learned some new vocabulary. He said for my style of bowling I need a good back end ball, since I play out then in. I threw the Misfit and it wasn't going into the pocket well, he recommended me another ball, a storm ball that isn't sold anymore, but remade and named Frantic. I had some good strikes with that ball, but it would go brooklyn too much, I only threw 3 shots with that ball, 2/3 strikes. 3rd shot was a stone pin in the middle who didn't want to fall, haha. I chose to get a Reckless, but it wasn't in stock so I have to wait, he said the price for drilling and all the inserts would be 176$ is that a good price?
I'm hoping I will have good power on the Reckless. He recommended me to talk to Mark Baker, a famous coach who coaches Barnes and other PBA bowlers, he said their good friends, and to give him a call to coach me. The problem is... he charges $80 an hour. :x

[eugene02]

wow $80 per hour is super expensive in my opinion.. i would learn from myself than.. $80 per hour for your rates would be $100 + for mine.. which means i could bowl a hundred games for 1 of my bowling center here.. i guess with that hundred game i would get better myself.. this is what i think.. Frantic ball dies out after 50games + or so as some of the people in this forum says. but it also depends on how you maintain the ball.. for me.. i think the reckless or Too reckless would be a good choice for you anyway.. both of the balls are similar i would say.. will have to let bill to say about this as he has more information about DV8 than i do.. :) Cheers! hope you'll get good with the ball and throw using 2 finger and a thumb! $176 = around $222 SGD.. which is the cost of a Misfit ball.. how great is it to stay on the other side of the world where the balls are cheaper compared to here in Singapore :(

[martinezsam2495]

The misfit was 110$ undrilled,
Yeah it is, but he said he could help perfect my form, he said I have a good release,
I got a towel to wipe the ball, come down to the US, the lanes here are cheaper as well ( in some places)

[eugene02]

lol.. flying there isn't cheap ~_~.. it cost thousands which i can play thousands of games here :) maybe next time when i'm working and all i might just fly down to US for some holiday trips to take a look :) in Singapore, Misfit is $220 SGD Drilled, Hell Raiser Revenge is $300 SGD Drilled. so i'm guessing the reckless might be $260 SGD Drilled. :)))

[Hampe]

80$ sounds about normal and might be a good investment. Having someone show you the proper form and technique is worth way more than practicing 100 or even 500 games with incorrect form. Trust me.....if the guy is good it's definitely worth it.

[eugene02]

to me, i watch videos online on how to throw a ball all this and i've learned :) different people different i guess..

[Hampe]

That's one way to do it for sure, but a video can't watch you from behind or the side and tell you what you're doing wrong. You may think you are doing exactly what you saw in the video, but experience will show that is rarely the case. You'd be suprised how much a good coach can show you and correct in your game in 1 hour.

[J Anderson]

$80/hour is about what lessons cost over here on the other Gold Coast. Thing is that most of the time the lessons are only 1/2 hour so you get to focus on fewer things and be on your way to perfecting them by the next lesson. The $80/ hour goes further than you think as long as you have the time to practice what you learn.

[bowl1820]

and Mark Baker includes video taping in that lesson.

Q. What types of lessons does Mark offer?
A. Mark offers lessons in a variety of formats and venues:
Individual lessons: Mark’s home center is Fountain Bowl in Fountain Valley, CA. He coaches there most Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays. He also goes to Surf Bowl in Oceanside every other Tuesday, and Buena Lanes in Ventura and Canoga Park Bowl every other Wednesday. The cost of a one-hour lesson is $80 per hour, which includes video.

This doesn't sound bad as a way to check it out.
Asher / Baker Weekly Clinics: The Asher / Baker weekly clinic is held most Saturdays at Fountain Bowl from 12:15 – 2 p.m. The clinic is open to bowlers of all skill levels, and each bowler will be helped by both Barry Asher and Mark Baker. The cost is only $10 per person.

http://markbakerbowling.com/coaching/

[eugene02]

That's one way to do it for sure, but a video can't watch you from behind or the side and tell you what you're doing wrong. You may think you are doing exactly what you saw in the video, but experience will show that is rarely the case. You'd be suprised how much a good coach can show you and correct in your game in 1 hour.

well, I do video myself playing before :) so yea.. only will get a coach when i'm in school which is in October when i will join their Bowling Team. so.. yup.. self train till than..

[billf]

The pricing around here is more varied. I'm in a very rural area where the cost of living is cheaper, a lot cheaper than if I moved to Columbus (80miles), Dayton (30miles) or Cincinnati(90miles). Those places are in the $60-$80 range for coaches per hour. Those prices also include lineage fees.
Now is everybody ready for this..................video taped lessons that last 90 minutes per lesson, you pay the lineage fees $25
It's less than I make at my current job but considering the average hourly working wage in my county is $10.32 hour you would get zero clients at $80 hour. That pricing starts Saturday when my bronze certification goes onto effect. I figure it's not too bad for a second job doing something I enjoy.

[martinezsam2495]

List of pro's Mark Baker has worked with,
Patrick Allen
Chris Barnes
Lynda Barnes
Josh Blanchard
Parker Bohn III
Jon Brandon
Jesse Buss
Joe Ciccone
Jason Couch
Tommy Delutz, Jr.
Mike Fagan
Wayne Garber
P.J. Haggerty
Tommy Jones
Jack Jurek
Doug Kent
Mika Koivuniemi
Tim Mack
Dan MacLelland
Wes Malott
Tennelle Milligan
Bill O’Neill
Ross Packard
Johnny Petraglia
Carmen Salvino
Walter Ray Williams, Jr.
Curtis Woods, Jr.

[martinezsam2495]

and Mark Baker includes video taping in that lesson.

Q. What types of lessons does Mark offer?
A. Mark offers lessons in a variety of formats and venues:
Individual lessons: Mark’s home center is Fountain Bowl in Fountain Valley, CA. He coaches there most Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays. He also goes to Surf Bowl in Oceanside every other Tuesday, and Buena Lanes in Ventura and Canoga Park Bowl every other Wednesday. The cost of a one-hour lesson is $80 per hour, which includes video.

This doesn't sound bad as a way to check it out.
Asher / Baker Weekly Clinics: The Asher / Baker weekly clinic is held most Saturdays at Fountain Bowl from 12:15 – 2 p.m. The clinic is open to bowlers of all skill levels, and each bowler will be helped by both Barry Asher and Mark Baker. The cost is only $10 per person.

http://markbakerbowling.com/coaching/

Yeah, Dan told me to go talk to him, if I'm really interested in becoming a better bowler, he said that he has experience teaching bowlers that use the 2 hand approach. Dan said I have good form, but sometimes my release is off, when I do my strike shot, you can tell the pins are just going to go flying by the way the ball aggressively hooks into the pocket.

[TheSheibs]

Out here in the bay area the going rate for lessons seems to be $40 and up.

[martinezsam2495]

Out here in the bay area the going rate for lessons seems to be $40 and up.

San Francisco Bay?

[ursus]

has 3 sanctioned 900 series and some other stuff, . :x

I highly doubt he has thrown 3 sanctioned 900 series. To my knowledge their is only one person that has thrown more than one in sanctioned play.

[martinezsam2495]

I highly doubt he has thrown 3 sanctioned 900 series. To my knowledge their is only one person that has thrown more than one in sanctioned play.

That's what he said, his name is Dan, I don't know his last name though,

[billf]

And I can say I'm president of the USBC and coach of the Olympic team, still doesn't make it true. If it sounds like a load of crap, chances are it is. Without proof you have to take everything with a grain of salt. There are a lot of insecure people out in the world who will lie (and usually believe their own lies) just to make themselves sound better.

[edpup316]

San Francisco Bay?

Yep in SF. Its cheap enough but i think the only guy out here that it would be worth it to have a lesson from would be Tony Reyes, he has a pro shop in San Jose. Unfortunetly i dont think he is giving any lessons anymore.

[ursus]

Here is a list of the Sanctioned 900 Series that have been approved by USBC, I don't see a Dan on there anywhere

USBC-Approved 900 Series (21)
Jeremy Sonnenfeld (R), Lincoln, Neb., Feb. 2, 1997
Tony Roventini (L), Greenfield, Wis., Nov. 9, 1998
Vince Wood (R), Moreno Valley, Calif., Sept, 29, 1999
Robby Portalatin (L), Jackson, Mich., Dec. 28, 2000
James Hylton (R), Salem, Ore., May 2, 2001
Jeff Campbell II (R), New Castle, Pa., June 12, 2004
Darin Pomije (R), New Prague, Minn., Dec. 9, 2004
Robert Mushtare (R), Fort Drum, N.Y., Dec. 5, 2005 and Feb. 19, 2006
Lonnie Billiter Jr. (R), Fairfield, Ohio, Feb. 13, 2006
Mark Wukoman (R), Greenfield, Wis., April 22, 2006
P.J. Giesfeldt (R), Milwaukee, Dec. 23, 2006
Rich Jerome Jr. (R), Baltimore, Dec. 22, 2008
Chris Aker (L), Winnemucca, Nev., Oct. 30, 2009
Andrew Teall (R), Medford, N.J., Nov. 2, 2009
Andrew Mank (R), Bellevue Ill., March 18, 2010
William Howell III (L), Middletown, N.Y., Oct. 21, 2010
Matt Latarski (R), Medina, Ohio, Nov. 28, 2010
Bob Kammer Jr. (R), Crown Point, Ind., Jan. 8, 2011
John Martorella Sr. (R), Greece, N.Y., April 12, 2012**
Jimmy Schmitzer (R), Riverside, Calif., April 20, 2012**

[The German Shepherd]

I don't see Glenn Allison on that list. Perhaps that list is not correct??

Jay

[billf]

He probably meant to say in a 9 pin no tap league lol

[TheSheibs]

San Francisco Bay?

yep that be the one.

[martinezsam2495]

yep that be the one.

I live in Cali as well, haha,
maybe one day we can go bowling together

[billf]

Then thesheibs can drill into your head how to pick up the 7 pin and that a huge hook doesn't mean squat.

[martinezsam2495]

haha I know Bill, I am starting to see that a consistent shot is a better shot. :]
I don't throw it with a huge entry angle anymore, I just play from 4th dot, into 2nd arrow hook into pocket, as I was starting from the the right side throwing it at the gutter, then swinging into the pocket, sometimes it demolished the pins sometimes it just let that mocking 7 pin stay up, and I get that Tom and Jerry feeling..
Except the Pin is the sly mouse (Jerry) and I'm the cat who rarely gets his way ( Tom).

[J Anderson]

I don't see Glenn Allison on that list. Perhaps that list is not correct??

Jay

As I recall, Glenn's was the first 900 series ever, but it was never recognized by the ABC or what ever the governing body was at the time.

[TheSheibs]

I had someone who bowls 240-290 games regularly say that leaving a corner pin is your own fault and that you did something wrong. Not sure if that's true. I would think leaving the 5 pin is more your fault than a corner pin. Anyone know if there is any truth to this?

Sam, don't know. I don't really like to travel far to bowl, unless it's for a tournament.

[martinezsam2495]

When there is a tournament around here then, I'll let you know haha

[GeorgiaStroker]

As I recall, Glenn's was the first 900 series ever, but it was never recognized by the ABC or what ever the governing body was at the time.

That is correct. The ABC disallowed his series due to what they said were non-conforming lane conditions. Nobody else was posting high scores on those lanes but they still wouldn't award him the benefit of the doubt.

[J Anderson]

I had someone who bowls 240-290 games regularly say that leaving a corner pin is your own fault and that you did something wrong. Not sure if that's true. I would think leaving the 5 pin is more your fault than a corner pin. Anyone know if there is any truth to this?

There was a fairly long thread about what adjustment to make when leaving the ten pin. About half the posts were suggestions on how to cover the spare when you leave the ten but the rest were on the topic. My own opinion is that most of the time when I leave a ten pin, or a seven when I'm pretending to be a lefty, it is my fault. I was either a bit off on that one particular throw, or I'm not playing the right line for the conditions. Yet there are times when the pins might have been slightly off spot, or there might be a "dead" pin in the rack, and you'll get robbed on a perfectly good hit.

p.s.This is only my opinion based on 30+ years of bowling, no facts were harmed in the writing of this post.

[billf]

Wow, our class spent quite a bit of time on this; corner pins. Yes, if the rack was correct, the pins are in good shape and you left ANY pin, then you did SOMETHING wrong. Why, because the angle wasn't in the 4-6 degree area for a 'perfect' strike or the ball rolled out too soon. The ball SHOULD go into the roll phase before the pocket but if it does this too soon too much energy is depleted and it hits the pins like a marshmallow. The list of possibilities is quite long.

[J Anderson]

Wow, our class spent quite a bit of time on this; corner pins. Yes, if the rack was correct, the pins are in good shape and you left ANY pin, then you did SOMETHING wrong. Why, because the angle wasn't in the 4-6 degree area for a 'perfect' strike or the ball rolled out too soon. The ball SHOULD go into the roll phase before the pocket but if it does this too soon too much energy is depleted and it hits the pins like a marshmallow. The list of possibilities is quite long.

I think that with many of us, if we are watching anything after the ball passes our target, we are focused on a few things and don't really observe the entire shot. Probably just the way most brains are wired. With a long list of possibilities, we either need to replay the video, or retrain our brains to take in the whole picture.

[billf]

Plus at times it happens so fast you're like, did I see that right?

[Mike White]

and Mark Baker includes video taping in that lesson.

Q. What types of lessons does Mark offer?
A. Mark offers lessons in a variety of formats and venues:
Individual lessons: Mark’s home center is Fountain Bowl in Fountain Valley, CA. He coaches there most Fridays, Saturdays and Sundays. He also goes to Surf Bowl in Oceanside every other Tuesday, and Buena Lanes in Ventura and Canoga Park Bowl every other Wednesday. The cost of a one-hour lesson is $80 per hour, which includes video.

This doesn't sound bad as a way to check it out.
Asher / Baker Weekly Clinics: The Asher / Baker weekly clinic is held most Saturdays at Fountain Bowl from 12:15 – 2 p.m. The clinic is open to bowlers of all skill levels, and each bowler will be helped by both Barry Asher and Mark Baker. The cost is only $10 per person.

http://markbakerbowling.com/coaching/

I plan on going to Fountain Bowl in the near future... After I get my feet back under me. I'll let y'all know how bad it sucks. :)