Dumping sandbagging whatever

[Hot_pocket]

I dont know if there was a Thread about this but Why must people dump these days? What happen to the integrity of the sport? I dont know if its the same all over but i Know here its kind of a known without out shame kind of thing. I know there are still some out there who don't do it because they see there skill as a gift and also see dumping as a negative. I understand money is necessary but if it was why make yourself out to be a crappy bowler just to make it. What are others people views on it is what i want to know. Do you do it because everybody else does it so that you can be at a somewhat even field ? Do you despise it? I want to hear these thoughts.

[Ball99999]

My experience with handicaps is this... if we play our best for a few weeks, lots of people get handicaps against us. So if we don't hit our average.. teams who hit their averages will beat us. Even if they bowl say 130 average vs say 220 average.
In that kind of case I understand why people do this.

[Hot_pocket]

My experience with handicaps is this... if we play our best for a few weeks, lots of people get handicaps against us. So if we don't hit our average.. teams who hit their averages will beat us. Even if they bowl say 130 average vs say 220 average.
In that kind of case I understand why people do this.

I understand it for reason of competition somewhat. When i was a Jr. bowler i bowled on a 4 man team. We used to give up anywhere between 80-200 pins a game which i could understand because my teammates an I had high avgs but as an adult bowler giving up 40-50 pins to a bowler you know is not a 170 180 or even a 190 bowler it sucks.

[J Anderson]

I understand it for reason of competition somewhat. When i was a Jr. bowler i bowled on a 4 man team. We used to give up anywhere between 80-200 pins a game which i could understand because my teammates an I had high avgs but as an adult bowler giving up 40-50 pins to a bowler you know is not a 170 180 or even a 190 bowler it sucks.

I just heard that Junior bowling is going away from handicaps. Bowlers will be grouped by ability or skill level and every thing will be scratch.

[striker12]

i hate sandbaggers i was in a turnny ocne before guy had a lower avg then me and my avg was only 154 mines low cause i had a bad start of the year and started in the 140s and got it up but this summer is has gone down did really bad.

back on topic this one guy he has a 142 avg and he shot constint 200s in 10 games lowest game of 228 highest game 268 and he was kicked out of the turnnys for sandbagging they could not say it was luck cause it was the same oil amount we have been playing on for awhile and the people ik that had 200 avgs could barly get 200s

[RoccoRock]

There's one group of tourneys that go around here. If you click on results, the same 3 or 4 guys always win. I bowled in the tourney once, and saw the averages of these bowlers. I did the math on there averages, and the final numbers they put up each tourney. Seems like every tourney, they bowl 30 to 40 pins above there average a game. They carry 180 averages, but never bowl a game under 200. In a league I used to bowl in, the same team wins every year, and it's because they are the ultimate sand baggers. Now, the flip side to all that, is my team. People think we sand bag. We have a bowler with a 135 average, and every now and then he busts out a 210, 220 game. Week to week, he bowls 100 pins above his average for a series. I hear it every week "what a sandbagger." Really? You ever hear of, getting better? He had not bowled in 15 years when the league started, so it was rough for him. Then he started practicing, and started hooking the ball, and he got better. Same goes for me. I have a rough first half of the season. I was using the wrong ball, trying to play lines that didn't work. Second half of the season, I bought a new ball that was better for me, I figures out how to play the lanes better, and I bowled above my average for 10 or the last 13 weeks, propelling my team into 3rd. Some peopl were pissed, but the guys who knew bowling, and know what the game is about, they just saw me and my friend getting better.

[backlasher]

Whether it's bowling, politics or anything else, a person's integrity can have a price. For some, that price is really low.

[striker12]

yeah rocco i had a bad start of this year but once and awhile i pulled out a 200 game but everyone there knew who i was and kenwim a good bowler but going 8 weeks in a row throwing only 300 series and 400 series they seen soemthing was wrong and then they started ot watch me bowl and it was me sometimes but it was also me getting hard splits jsut the last 3 weeks i have put up a 200 game the in order no clue was the weeks where for the summer league i pulled up a 210-201-207 and all with another good game form 170-190 and the 3rd gmae every week was low other then last week should of been high but not one person at my bowling allie shot over 180 on wed and theres people there with 200 avg problem was and with me too they where spray the ashfault stuff out bakc of the bowling allie and sprayed it jsut up along the vent that brings air in and thats all we could smell by the 3rd game. everyone was getting light headed and after throwing the ball noclue what they where doing i did the same as that i was throwing at a 10 pin and threw it at the 7pin. for cscoring a 103 and missing a 500 series by 10 pins

[Hot_pocket]

I just heard that Junior bowling is going away from handicaps. Bowlers will be grouped by ability or skill level and every thing will be scratch.

best idea ever they should do that with leagues and tournaments Class a b and c

[Hot_pocket]

There's one group of tourneys that go around here. If you click on results, the same 3 or 4 guys always win. I bowled in the tourney once, and saw the averages of these bowlers. I did the math on there averages, and the final numbers they put up each tourney. Seems like every tourney, they bowl 30 to 40 pins above there average a game. They carry 180 averages, but never bowl a game under 200.

Thats the stuff i dont like i think people should get re rated instantly after a certain amount over average their first set of scores for the tournament be thrown out and u get another entry at a re-rated average. Here its like accepted to dump because you know just about everyone and everybody knows they cant win without doing it because of everyone else doing it in leagues. tournaments are a different story here they will re-rate you almost instantly specially if your from out of town because thats what most people do dump to win a tourney in another state

[Hot_pocket]

Whether it's bowling, politics or anything else, a person's integrity can have a price. For some, that price is really low.

Its ridiculous if you ask me if your gifter with a skill use it to the best of you ability in the good way not to make yourself seem like a bad bowler.

[panbanger]

There's one group of tourneys that go around here. If you click on results, the same 3 or 4 guys always win. I bowled in the tourney once, and saw the averages of these bowlers. I did the math on there averages, and the final numbers they put up each tourney. Seems like every tourney, they bowl 30 to 40 pins above there average a game. They carry 180 averages, but never bowl a game under 200.

So would this mean that they sandbag during their league play, then play "normal" for the tournaments? I'm not really familiar with this and just trying to figure out in my head how this would work. I'm guess they're in a "fun" league that doesnt have much in the way of prizes, so keep their averages down for the big money tournaments?

[Hot_pocket]

So would this mean that they sandbag during their league play, then play "normal" for the tournaments? I'm not really familiar with this and just trying to figure out in my head how this would work. I'm guess they're in a "fun" league that doesnt have much in the way of prizes, so keep their averages down for the big money tournaments?

its exactly what they do but its also benefits them in leagues because if you can dump for a season and come back with that average you can make 1st place money in brackets and pots and other side bets that are handicap. The easiest is when you have teammates because you can take turns bowling bad while winning. I was a 211 when i started my league last season but finished at 203 (my league has a 10 pin drop rule so i was at 201 till the last couple weeks ) I was just struggling and they knew i was because everyone knew me and i shot 300 but would only put up numbers every other week.

[RoccoRock]

its exactly what they do but its also benefits them in leagues because if you can dump for a season and come back with that average you can make 1st place money in brackets and pots and other side bets that are handicap. The easiest is when you have teammates because you can take turns bowling bad while winning. I was a 211 when i started my league last season but finished at 203 (my league has a 10 pin drop rule so i was at 201 till the last couple weeks ) I was just struggling and they knew i was because everyone knew me and i shot 300 but would only put up numbers every other week.

Yes, some people are very skilled at sandbagging. We used to bowl against a team that won the league every year. Here is how they did it. Almost every game we played against them, they trailed going into the 10th, by a few pins, or just ahead by a few. Then all 4 bowlers would strike out the 10th, or the first two would, and our first two would stink, so there second two had wiggle room to tank, and still win the game. Just show up and bowl. So annoying. I would have no problem with re-establishing averages every 5 weeks or so. I would rather carry a nice big avearage, than have a crappy average, a huge handicap, and win games cause I sucked for a few weeks, then figured it out. My personal goal is to have the highest average in the leagues I'm in. Now, I'm no where close, and with using a sanctioned average that is so low, I have no shot of having high average.

[Hot_pocket]

Yes, some people are very skilled at sandbagging. We used to bowl against a team that won the league every year. Here is how they did it. Almost every game we played against them, they trailed going into the 10th, by a few pins, or just ahead by a few. Then all 4 bowlers would strike out the 10th, or the first two would, and our first two would stink, so there second two had wiggle room to tank, and still win the game. Just show up and bowl. So annoying. I would have no problem with re-establishing averages every 5 weeks or so. I would rather carry a nice big avearage, than have a crappy average, a huge handicap, and win games cause I sucked for a few weeks, then figured it out. My personal goal is to have the highest average in the leagues I'm in. Now, I'm no where close, and with using a sanctioned average that is so low, I have no shot of having high average.

sounds about right those are the same guys who wouldnt step up to a scratch league because they would really have to bowl.

[panbanger]

I think sandbagging is poor sportsmanship. There's no way to prove that it's being done though. I would really be mad though if it was happening right in front of me!

[Hot_pocket]

I think sandbagging is poor sportsmanship. There's no way to prove that it's being done though. I would really be mad though if it was happening right in front of me!

No there are ways its one of those things where its like if you average 180 you can expect 180-190 an a occasional high 200 but if you see someone who generally has a 180 shooting 200 2 out of 3 games or missing obviously easy spares or even the person who carries 4 balls and know exactly what in their bag works for certain lane conditions but still takes out the wrong ball to use during league their doing it on purpose. Especially those who like to bowl tournaments thats what they use their low averages for.

[edpup316]

I think we should just start cutting people whether they are sandbaggers or not. Ya we hurt some feelings of low avg bowlers that actually have a good day but it would out the more likely chance of that person being a sandbagger.

[panbanger]

Or better yet, we could hit them with actual bags of sand! And make them change their names to Sandy.:cool:

[striker12]

im a half sand bagger and half not cause i have a few good days and the other days i have bad days but more bad days then good but for the past 3 weeks ihave had a few good games of 200 but always end up with one game beeing below avg.

[edpup316]

im a half sand bagger and half not cause i have a few good days and the other days i have bad days but more bad days then good but for the past 3 weeks ihave had a few good games of 200 but always end up with one game beeing below avg.

Your not a sand bagger. Your inconsistent. Baggers do it on purpose.

[RoccoRock]

I may ask my league if they will allow me to re establish my average this season. We use our USBC sanctioned average, but with me totaly changing my style, to me that data is no longer relivant. I'm not even saying I think my average will be higher now, it could be lower, or the same depending on a few things, but I think it's more fair to the league, and myself to get a composite average of what I am actualy doing right now.

[striker12]

edpup reason why i say half and half is cause at the start of the year i started with a 179 avg then 2nd week went up to a 190 and then it droped down to a 148 was not making my spares and leaving alot of bad splits but out of it all there was only 1 spare thati made all season the 1-2-4-10 and the 1-2-10 i convert4ed that everything and once was lucky when i did not hit the right spot on the 1 pin and it missed the 10pin to the left but bounced out of the back and came up and hit the 10pin i got lucky there.


and another joke someone there ead to me one week when i ahd a 156 avg my highest game was 112 lowest 76 and he sead im haing such bad luck hope im not driving home tonight.

[J Anderson]

I may ask my league if they will allow me to re establish my average this season. We use our USBC sanctioned average, but with me totaly changing my style, to me that data is no longer relivant. I'm not even saying I think my average will be higher now, it could be lower, or the same depending on a few things, but I think it's more fair to the league, and myself to get a composite average of what I am actualy doing right now.

If your league is like most, you will only use the book average for the first 3 or 4 weeks. By the fifth game your average will be a truer reflection of your current performance, and by the eighth week last seasons average will be cosigned to history and no one will care unless you run into a ten pin drop rule.

[Hot_pocket]

i think we should just start cutting people whether they are sandbaggers or not. Ya we hurt some feelings of low avg bowlers that actually have a good day but it would out the more likely chance of that person being a sandbagger.

lol cut throat

[Hot_pocket]

Or better yet, we could hit them with actual bags of sand! And make them change their names to Sandy.:cool:

lmaooo

[Hot_pocket]

I may ask my league if they will allow me to re establish my average this season. We use our USBC sanctioned average, but with me totaly changing my style, to me that data is no longer relivant. I'm not even saying I think my average will be higher now, it could be lower, or the same depending on a few things, but I think it's more fair to the league, and myself to get a composite average of what I am actualy doing right now.

They wouldnt allow it i mean you start off with your old average anyway and then you establish one after a few weeks but the only way you establish a new average is not bowling for some years and even then your assigned one till your rated or you switch hands

[billf]

Every league has their own by-laws governing this. Given that it's a different style (2 handed to 3 finger) the USBC would allow it but still up to the league.

[Tokes]

Ok I'm glad I remembered this thread to go back to it. I had my first sanctioned league series yesterday I was really happy about then I get partnered with some random people thats cool I don't mind that. Then the game starts and they aren't caring just throwing talking about how it gets more serious later and don't try to hard now. Its about vegas not now in the league. I'm doing great finished my non sanctioned league 130-140 average. My series was a 180-133-145 so I was feeling it was even converting splits just had a problem of chopping it so I was missing some easy spares and my archnemesis the 7 pin. The whole time they just kept explaining the handicap and all that. I get it I'm an Accounting and Business Administration Major I don't want a crappy handicap when I know I can do better and I love looking at the league printout and seeing that average go up and list my high games and series. It was just kinda annoying I don't want to pay $18 a week and not take full advantage of it. I want to improve as a bowler. Sorry for the monologue had to vent a little cause I didn't really understand sandbagging till last night.

[Hot_pocket]

Ok I'm glad I remembered this thread to go back to it. I had my first sanctioned league series yesterday I was really happy about then I get partnered with some random people thats cool I don't mind that. Then the game starts and they aren't caring just throwing talking about how it gets more serious later and don't try to hard now. Its about vegas not now in the league. I'm doing great finished my non sanctioned league 130-140 average. My series was a 180-133-145 so I was feeling it was even converting splits just had a problem of chopping it so I was missing some easy spares and my archnemesis the 7 pin. The whole time they just kept explaining the handicap and all that. I get it I'm an Accounting and Business Administration Major I don't want a crappy handicap when I know I can do better and I love looking at the league printout and seeing that average go up and list my high games and series. It was just kinda annoying I don't want to pay $18 a week and not take full advantage of it. I want to improve as a bowler. Sorry for the monologue had to vent a little cause I didn't really understand sandbagging till last night.

wow yea thats dumping or some call it average maintenance. Handicap isnt a bad thing its a need for bowlers who arent high average bowlers but bowl decently so that its even . You arent wasting your money as long as you guys are still winning games if they are throwing games then thats crappy.

[TheSheibs]

Ah, yes. The sandbaggers. The people who don't bowl to their full potential for a number of reasons. i.e. wanting to keep their average down because of another league that requires a specific average, not caring about how they do in a specific league, Knowing they will win against a specific team without bowling their best, etc, etc. There are all kinds of reasons people come up with for not doing their best. There are some who do it because of a strategy that their team has come up with for whatever reason. Some who bowl in a summer league say that they don't care because it is a summer league and they are trying new things or taking it easy or whatever. IN MY OPINION, screw them. If you are not going to go out and give it your best shot, wither it be to help the team win or to get a new personal best, you should always try your best. If not, then screw them. I do not like people who sandbag and even though with my starting average and ending average being different by 29 pins, I was not sandbagging. I know that there were some people who thought that when I started to hit in the 180-213 range for three weeks in a row. But I was also bowling 6-20+ games a week in practice. Practice makes perfect. If i suspect someone of sandbagging, I have no problem going up to them and asking why they are not hitting their average. Most of the time the answer is that they are having an off night. That happens but it doesn't happen for several weeks in a row. And about not trying to hard at the beginning of the season, screw that. I'm out there to meet people, have fun, and improve my own average. If that means hitting a high average on the first night and then having it drop throughout the season, so be it.

I'll get off my soap box now before this turns into a novel.

[Hot_pocket]

Ah, yes. The sandbaggers. The people who don't bowl to their full potential for a number of reasons. i.e. wanting to keep their average down because of another league that requires a specific average, not caring about how they do in a specific league, Knowing they will win against a specific team without bowling their best, etc, etc. There are all kinds of reasons people come up with for not doing their best. There are some who do it because of a strategy that their team has come up with for whatever reason. Some who bowl in a summer league say that they don't care because it is a summer league and they are trying new things or taking it easy or whatever. IN MY OPINION, screw them. If you are not going to go out and give it your best shot, wither it be to help the team win or to get a new personal best, you should always try your best. If not, then screw them. I do not like people who sandbag and even though with my starting average and ending average being different by 29 pins, I was not sandbagging. I know that there were some people who thought that when I started to hit in the 180-213 range for three weeks in a row. But I was also bowling 6-20+ games a week in practice. Practice makes perfect. If i suspect someone of sandbagging, I have no problem going up to them and asking why they are not hitting their average. Most of the time the answer is that they are having an off night. That happens but it doesn't happen for several weeks in a row. And about not trying to hard at the beginning of the season, screw that. I'm out there to meet people, have fun, and improve my own average. If that means hitting a high average on the first night and then having it drop throughout the season, so be it.

I'll get off my soap box now before this turns into a novel.

well said im with you on it how i feel is if u dump and i know you do it when i bowl you that low average wont save you because i will be trying my best to shoot 700 and up

[billf]

A guy on my team tonight bowled a 156 first game. Second game, second ball of tenth frame he very obviously put it in the gutter. I was livid. I asked him what the hell he was doing? Turns out it was a 156. Said he wanted a triplicate patch. Game three he miscounted and bowled a 182. I was thrilled he didn't accomplish his goal. I've wanted to replace him for over a year now but don't know another available bowler that can afford it.

[chrono00]

A guy on my team tonight bowled a 156 first game. Second game, second ball of tenth frame he very obviously put it in the gutter. I was livid. I asked him what the hell he was doing? Turns out it was a 156. Said he wanted a triplicate patch. Game three he miscounted and bowled a 182. I was thrilled he didn't accomplish his goal. I've wanted to replace him for over a year now but don't know another available bowler that can afford it.

did the gutter cost your team a win?

if not, thats one of those times I could let it slide. it's hard to bowl 3 in a row like that. i've doubled it with two 187's but never all 3 games.

[mdlee3]

I have a couple experiences with this type of thing from both sides of the argument.

A couple summers ago, I had thumb surgery. When fall league started, I started off with a low 500 series, like 510 or so. Now, keep in mind, I only average 180-185 usually so it wasn't that much of a drop off. On this particular day, I felt I was throwing a good ball, but I wasn't getting a lot of the carry I would usually get, probably due to still recovering from my surgery. The next week, I improved a little bit, bowling around a 540 series. The following week, I break out and bowl a 653 series. Now, everybody on the league knows how I bowl and knows I can range from about a 470 to about a 680 series. Unfortunately, this team we were bowling against was a new team in the league and to this day, they still swear that I sandbagged in that particular league.

On the same league, each season when we bowl this one certain team for the first time, they always bring in the captain's wife to bowl against us. This happens every year except for last season when we actually bowled this team the first week. Every year though, this woman never bowls until it's time to bowl against us. After that, she'll bowl against other teams. She usually starts with about a 130 average, but each time she bowls against us after that first time, she's always close to a 600 series, sometimes missing it by a few pins, one time she bowled a 698 against us with 60+ pins of handicap.

I'm completely against sandbagging and if I can prove somebody is doing it, I will speak to my league officers or tournament officials about it. Even if nothing gets done, it's better than just sitting back and letting it go with no complaints. Unfortunately, it's too hard to prove that somebody is sandbagging compared to just having a horrible day. I'll use my own bowling as an example. I leave a lot of 10 pins and I also go brooklyn a lot and if I don't get a strike, I will often leave the 5 pin. I'm generally horrible at the 10 pin, picking up just over 50% of them if I had to guess. I generally don't miss the 5 pin unless I pull it. However, if I wanted to sandbag, I could easily miss a few 10 pins on purpose or whiff on a 5 pin. That alone would keep my average low enough that I'd have a decent handicap. Now, I don't do that. It really aggravates me to miss single pin spares and I do want the highest possible average I can possibly get.

[billf]

I bowled against the guy I consider the best in the county last season. I beat him 8 of 9 games scratch. During "our" season series he averaged 258. I averaged 271 against him. The whole season was a 184. I wasn't sandbagging, at least not on purpose. I just tend to bowl better than normal against the better bowlers and awful against the lower average bowlers.

[Tokes]

Really I was just irritated that every time I missed a spare my teammates were like good job and every time I made a strike or spare they were like don't try so hard and don't score so high. Also, kinda embarassed that my teammate would go up say im not even trying a njust chuck it close to the gutter each time. Hopefully sunday goes better and we can win 1 of the 3 games.

[billf]

Last season my brother-in-law was on a team that wanted him to sandbag. What was odd is the guy pushing it would bowl his best. I think that guy just had insecurity issues and wanted to have the highest average on the team. It was a mixed league (2 female, 2 males) and his then wife was on the team.

[wdc1987]

We have a guy in our local house that tells us to drop our average by 25 pins atleast and then start going to the tournaments. But what do you learn by doing this. Id rather bowl to my full potential and come in last place so i can come back next time as a better bowler! I have seen guys drop their average during league because they were playing a team the next week that was getting 125 hc.

[Hot_pocket]

Really I was just irritated that every time I missed a spare my teammates were like good job and every time I made a strike or spare they were like don't try so hard and don't score so high. Also, kinda embarassed that my teammate would go up say im not even trying a njust chuck it close to the gutter each time. Hopefully sunday goes better and we can win 1 of the 3 games.

See this really dont like...they dump while losing games. People dont realize just how important the first couple weeks are when i won my first adult league even though it came down to a roll off...we were ahead by alot of points because we were bowling seriously. Throwing games while dumping is just a waste of money because know one is guaranteed bowling good.

[Ball99999]

So tonight was the first night of a new league I joined, not sure how I like it, it's rather expensive and they want $15 a week regardless if you're there or not. Anyway, I unintentionally sandbagged. I am not used to bowling on fresh oil at all and got nothing but splits and misses. Oye.

But other people talked about keeping their average low like they were proud of the strategy. When I get some new balls I think I'm going to really ramp up the competition though.

[got_a_300]

That is one thing I can proudly say is that I have never intentionally
sandbaged during my bowling days. I'll have to say that sometimes
it might look like I am when having a bad night but I always go after
each and every pin that I can get.

[J Anderson]

So tonight was the first night of a new league I joined, not sure how I like it, it's rather expensive and they want $15 a week regardless if you're there or not. Anyway, I unintentionally sandbagged. I am not used to bowling on fresh oil at all and got nothing but splits and misses. Oye.

But other people talked about keeping their average low like they were proud of the strategy. When I get some new balls I think I'm going to really ramp up the competition though.

You can not unintentionally sandbag. To sandbag is to deliberately bowl below your ability. If you are not used to the condition on the lanes and therefore have trouble adjusting to them, your low scores are not sandbagging.

[got_a_300]

You can not unintentionally sandbag. To sandbag is to deliberately bowl below your ability. If you are not used to the condition on the lanes and therefore have trouble adjusting to them, your low scores are not sandbagging.

John is correct about you can not unintentionally sandbag you either
sandbag or you don't sandbag having a bad night is not sandbagging.

[Ball99999]

Call it a point of pride then :P I like the idea that I'm a higher average bowler. I'm sure I'll get used to the oil though.

[got_a_300]

Oh yeah you'll get better as time goes by and you get used to
the lanes and oil.

[Hot_pocket]

So tonight was the first night of a new league I joined, not sure how I like it, it's rather expensive and they want $15 a week regardless if you're there or not. Anyway, I unintentionally sandbagged. I am not used to bowling on fresh oil at all and got nothing but splits and misses. Oye.

But other people talked about keeping their average low like they were proud of the strategy. When I get some new balls I think I'm going to really ramp up the competition though.

15 a week is cheap compared to here most leagues are 20-30 a week....whats your prize fund?

[Cuda K5]

I wouldn't doubt if the guys we bowled against last night thought I was sandbagging. I bowled a 133, 210, 223 ruined my chance at my first 600 series

I have bowled with the same 12 pound plastic ball since I was 13. The damn thing doesnt fit my hand perfectly and bounces off pins instead of hitting them. I managed to carry a 170ish average subbing last season with it. This is my first year being a regular member for a league so I decided it was time to get a good ball made. Started out with a 16 pound Nexxus and it was too heavy. Just had an HRR drilled and couldn't find the pocket at all the first league night I used it. Practiced and rolled a 236 game and a couple other 190's 200's. Then practiced again and I couldn't find the pocket at all again. Decided to throw my plastic ball and hit the pocket every time. Bowled a 232 one game. Last night I started with the HRR and bowled the 133. Threw a couple frames with it in the second game and just couldn't find the pocket so I switched to my spare ball and almost struck out with a 210. Then a 223 with my spare ball. I also bowled my highest game of 245 with it a month ago.

I want to be more consistant with a good ball but my plastic ball works so well I don't want to throw anything else lol

[MICHAEL]

best idea ever they should do that with leagues and tournaments Class a b and c

I AGREE 100 percent~~ similar to what AMF does each of the last few years in their big money tournament,,,, 4 different classes, and then the winner is pins over average in THEIR Class! Much more Fair then standard handicap!

[Hot_pocket]

I AGREE 100 percent~~ similar to what AMF does each of the last few years in their big money tournament,,,, 4 different classes, and then the winner is pins over average in THEIR Class! Much more Fair then standard handicap!

thats what i was actually referring to lol i bowled like crap in the scratch division.

[Ball99999]

15 a week is cheap compared to here most leagues are 20-30 a week....whats your prize fund?

I figure ~20 people * 30 weeks * $3.40 for the prize fund = probably around $2000.

[billf]

15 a week is cheap compared to here most leagues are 20-30 a week....whats your prize fund?

My three leagues are $13, $12 & $12. $8.50 each for lineage. $30 each a week I wouldn't be able to bowl so much. Prize fund for second place last year was $90. It sucks but worth not having to take a loan out to bowl lol

[billf]

I sandbagged a league five years ago. Since then I've broken my bowling thumb two straight years, broke my bowling wrist and was blind for 14 months. Hopefully the bowling Gods consider us even and will finally let me bowl a season without a major injury.
Yes, I learned my sandbagging lesson. I've struggled the last five years to get my average back to where it was then. What I sandbagged down to become the norm.

[MICHAEL]

I sandbagged a league five years ago. Since then I've broken my bowling thumb two straight years, broke my bowling wrist and was blind for 14 months. Hopefully the bowling Gods consider us even and will finally let me bowl a season without a major injury.
Yes, I learned my sandbagging lesson. I've struggled the last five years to get my average back to where it was then. What I sandbagged down to become the norm.

Wow Wild Bill blind for 14 months!!!! What caused that!! I have had my share of broken bones, including my right thumb, but BLIND!! What happened!!
(if you don't mind me asking)

[AngeloPD]

Those league fee are hella cheap Bill! my tueday night league is $20 a week!

[edpup316]

My three leagues are $13, $12 & $12. $8.50 each for lineage. $30 each a week I wouldn't be able to bowl so much. Prize fund for second place last year was $90. It sucks but worth not having to take a loan out to bowl lol

I wish my league fees looked like that. I bowl three nights a week at $23, $24 and $17. almost ended up bowling a fourth but realized my arm would fall off and my wallet would be empty.

[billf]

Our lineage fees have been the same for the last three years along with the league fees. County unemployment is currently as 18% and sure to keep climbing as manufacturing jobs continue to dry up. Other than factories and farms there isn't much else out here. Luckily the Honda plant and Honda transmission plant are back to full schedules. That Tsunami that hit Japan really hurt the local economy in West Central Ohio. The local company that makes the turbines for turbos is down to working 2 1/2 days a week. I don't see them staying open much longer.
Here's one that will really make you guys cry. I live in a big, old, farm house. I mow 5 acres with 165 acres of farmland. I pay $900 a month in rent and that includes electric and heat! Now that's damn cheap. When I moved here from South of Boston I couldn't believe how low the cost of living was here. But the pay is lower too, for most jobs.

[billf]

Mike, are you getting that old that you don't remember asking me about my eye several months ago? Metal tore through my right eye at work, born blind in the left. Ring a bell?

[MICHAEL]

Mike, are you getting that old that you don't remember asking me about my eye several months ago? Metal tore through my right eye at work, born blind in the left. Ring a bell?

Yes, Bill I am getting old!! By the day!! To answer your question, NO I don't remember! Add dementia to the list! Bill if you were born blind in the left eye, and metal tore through your right eye, how in the hell do you see??? Do you use a sonar device inplanted in your forehead?? Wow!!
I grew up in the country myself during my early years! In fact, my realitives ran with the James gang here in Kearney Mo. One was hung, for helping Jesse excape from a local farm here in town. The rope broke the first attempt, didn't upon second one! Our family farm was just across the way from the James Farm. ( Just a little history)!! My uncle Cleave, had a dairy farm, Fresh milk every day that he would deliver. Top 1/4 of the glass bottles was cream!! Great stuff!! Good Old Days!!

[chrono00]

i remembered the metal through the eye story (work injury right), but didn't know you were born blind in the left. is that permanent, or did you ever recover any sight in the left?

and mike, he doesn't need the eyes to bowl. if you forget the blind story, you probably forgot the story of how he still bowled while blind. a friend would lead him up to the correct spot on the approach and he would go from there.

you did pretty good too right?

[billf]

I averaged 195 blind. Dropped to 165 when the eye was fixed. Averaging well above both so far this year though.
The left eye is permanent. Doctors said they could try to repair it but would be very expensive and extensive rehab. The different parts inside that eye aren't lined up properly. I can see light and can tell something is there, just not what lol

The right eye is doing great now. It's nice being able to see the foul line, which ball is mine, etc I can even see the logo on the pins. Reading is a pain as I don't use my glasses to read anymore. Since I stopped wearing trifocals to bowl I have been hitting the correct mark more often.

[Hot_pocket]

My three leagues are $13, $12 & $12. $8.50 each for lineage. $30 each a week I wouldn't be able to bowl so much. Prize fund for second place last year was $90. It sucks but worth not having to take a loan out to bowl lol

i would be bowling this season if it was that cheap. Here most of the GOOD leagues are 25-30 but of course bigger prize funds and more money to win during the season in pots brackets love doubles and cut the field ( eliminator). So this season im being the super sub

[chrono00]

I averaged 195 blind. Dropped to 165 when the eye was fixed. Averaging well above both so far this year though.
The left eye is permanent. Doctors said they could try to repair it but would be very expensive and extensive rehab. The different parts inside that eye aren't lined up properly. I can see light and can tell something is there, just not what lol

The right eye is doing great now. It's nice being able to see the foul line, which ball is mine, etc I can even see the logo on the pins. Reading is a pain as I don't use my glasses to read anymore. Since I stopped wearing trifocals to bowl I have been hitting the correct mark more often.


I can see the average dropping when you first get your sight back because your readjusting to a different style.

and no need to spend extreme amounts of money to fix the left eye, especially if they don't know it would definatly work? plus, if it was from birth, it's not like you ever had it working to know what your missing anyway

[billf]

Exactly. Plus I would have to re-learn how to do everything due to the depth perception being different.

[billf]

i would be bowling this season if it was that cheap. Here most of the GOOD leagues are 25-30 but of course bigger prize funds and more money to win during the season in pots brackets love doubles and cut the field ( eliminator). So this season im being the super sub


Here's the clincher. For volunteering the owner has decided that I get to open bowl for free AND can have all the fountain drinks I want anytime I'm there. That will save me $5 a night in soda alone. He even refunded the money I paid for my September's bowling pass ($25 a month for unlimited open bowling)

[AngeloPD]

WOW $25 a month for unlimited bowling??? You can't get that deal here!

[chrono00]

Here's the clincher. For volunteering the owner has decided that I get to open bowl for free AND can have all the fountain drinks I want anytime I'm there. That will save me $5 a night in soda alone. He even refunded the money I paid for my September's bowling pass ($25 a month for unlimited open bowling)


sounds like a pretty cool guy. don't suppose you could convince him to move to the philly suburbs and open a house out here could you?

[Fatal]

I would love to pay that $25 bill a month, Bill. Good deal.

[billf]

That's how I manage to throw 10-40 games a day. Only ten today between coaching sessions and the league :)

[bowl1820]

Think $25 is good for unlimited open bowling? The league play pass here is $15 a month for unlimited open bowling.

[billf]

Mine is free now anyway but that is a great deal. Nice to hear there are places that do take care of their league bowlers.

[Fatal]

Is it buy one get one in the pro shop too?! Haha

[MisterSinister]

Here's my opinion, coming from someone accused of sandbagging. When I started last year, I was terrible. I was lucky to break 130. I have gotten better since then. Every now and then, I bust out a monster game, or two, and have a solid series. Some people know, I'm just getting better, but some people just want to complain, and look for excuses why they lost. Here's the other thing. If your worrying about me, then your not concentrating on your own game enough. If I'm in your head, you've already lost. I'm not saying nobody sandbags, but it doesn't happen as much as some people think. There's just a lot of inconsistent bowlers, who occasionally either get lucky, or just have a good night.

[edpup316]

it doesn't happen as much as some people think. There's just a lot of inconsistent bowlers, who occasionally either get lucky, or just have a good night.

These arnt the poepl we are talking about, or at least they arnt who I'm talking about. Sand baggers are the poeple who bomb the entire league to get a favorable avg for a tourny or who bowl just well enough to win a point and then miss the easy spares after they have the point locked. If you bowl some really good games a couple weeks out of the seasons that def is not sand bagging mainly because your intent isn't the same as the sand baggers who save the 700 and 600's for important matchs

[AngeloPD]

Mine is free now anyway but that is a great deal. Nice to hear there are places that do take care of their league bowlers.

League players bowl for $2.50 each game instead of $3.50 during the day and $5.50 for nights and weekends. i hope my alley does unlimited bowling too!