Grip it and rip it, or relaxed hand release?

[AZBowla]

Hi there, as some of you know I am the proud owner of a new, freshly drilled DV8 Marauder. Love the ball except for one thing - it likes to hang on my thumb. Happens at least once every session. I almost chucked it into the ceiling tiles last night, that's how hard it hung on to me this time. I knuckled it for a while after that (fingertipped the thumb) and I immediately felt back in control, although it also made it harder to have a consistent release because my middle and ring fingers were moving around with each shot. With my old ball, the thumb hole is enormous so I've always had to squeeze that one. The new one is drilled so that I don't have to do that, but old habits die hard. I've found that I *like* to squeeze the ball and I feel more confident when I fingertip the thumb hole on this new ball because I'm not wondering in the back of my mind if it's going to suck in my thumb and end up taking me with it down the lane with every shot.

So my question to the group is this: Should I get the thumb hole drilled bigger so I can squeeze this thing (grip and rip) and stop worrying about it, or should I leave it as is and train myself to stop fighting the ball and relax my hand more? I'm having the ball I won here drilled next weekend (not this one coming up, but the one after), so I want to make a decision on this by then so I can have both balls drilled the same way. I figure having the exact same grip on both balls will be one less thing to worry about and keep track of when bowling. Right now, I use my old ball for spares on the left side, and I have to keep reminding myself that I have to hang on to that one, which isn't helping me learn NOT to hang on to the other one.

Thanks for your advice, gang.

[75lockwood]

I would take it back to the pro shop, the thumb should not be that tight, normally you should have the thumb hole so its a bit loose to compensate for swelling, and when your thumb is "smaller" you can add tape to get a conferrable grip.

you may not need to have the thump plugged to fix this, often the pro shop can just expand the thump slightly either by shaving down the slug or drilling it out a bit more.

the marauder shouldn't be taking your thumb prisoner!

if it's just a matter of you not letting go, then relax your hand and let the thumb come out freely, but i don't know how this could cause you to "almost chuck it into the ceiling tiles"

[AZBowla]

I exaggerated a bit on the whole ceiling tiles thing, but it did end up flying into the air and landing hard halfway down the lane before unceremoniously flailing itself into the gutter. I was lucky that it didn't go into the next lane over. It really screws up my mental game when that happens, and I've already been back to the pro shop twice to have them shave a little more out of it. The fingertips are perfect and the span is dead on when I put my thumb all the way in it, I'm just scared to do it because I'm always worried it's gonna hang on to my thumb and end up launching into the air like a basketball going up for a 3 pointer. Very frustrating.

[GoodGorilla]

You shouldn't have to put any grip pressure on the ball for it to hang on to you in your swing. I had a ball with this issue, and I just told the pro shop about it. He opened up the ball to a minimum, tried the ball again, opened it a bit more, and it was good. I trust my pro shop operator.

[AZBowla]

You shouldn't have to put any grip pressure on the ball for it to hang on to you in your swing. I had a ball with this issue, and I just told the pro shop about it. He opened up the ball to a minimum, tried the ball again, opened it a bit more, and it was good. I trust my pro shop operator.

Yeah, I must be squeezing it when I shouldn't be. I trust my guy too and he insists it's big enough. I'm going to leave it as is for now and try to just keep my hand relaxed throughout my entire arm swing. Time for some arm swing and release drills at home tonight! I really should stop squeezing as that just robs my swing of power when I do. As Yoda said, I must "unlearn what you have learned".... ugh.

[75lockwood]

Yeah, I must be squeezing it when I shouldn't be. I trust my guy too and he insists it's big enough. I'm going to leave it as is for now and try to just keep my hand relaxed throughout my entire arm swing. Time for some arm swing and release drills at home tonight! I really should stop squeezing as that just robs my swing of power when I do. As Yoda said, I must "unlearn what you have learned".... ugh.

if only this was the matrix, then it would be as easy as downloading the correct method :cool: <-- neo LOL

[AZBowla]

if only this was the matrix, then it would be as easy as downloading the correct method :cool: <-- neo LOL

Wouldn't that be awesome? Not only would I do that but I'd also have a custom bowling simulation with my own personal lanes and every bowling ball I could ever want at my disposal. Picture the scene in the original movie where Neo says he needs lots of guns - only in my Matrix, it'd be rows and rows of bowling balls. LOL!!

[75lockwood]

Wouldn't that be awesome? Not only would I do that but I'd also have a custom bowling simulation with my own personal lanes and every bowling ball I could ever want at my disposal. Picture the scene in the original movie where Neo says he needs lots of guns - only in my Matrix, it'd be rows and rows of bowling balls. LOL!!

Lol if that was reality then id be ok with living in the matrix :cool:

[billf]

Once per session isn't the equipment. As you suspected it a bowler induced error. As you also stated, gripping and ripping will rob you of power (speed and revs) plus has shown to reduce accuracy. As for identical, have your old ball's thumb plugged and drilled to match. As you also said, it's hard enough to learn not to grip never mind complicating it more by having a ball you HAVE to grip. You're going to have a lot of things changing now that you're getting more serious, which is great, just add less grip to the list. I still grip on occasion. It sucks but that's life.

[AZBowla]

As always Bill you're the sage voice of wisdom. :) I also had some additional confirmation this evening when I picked up the ball and attempted to do some armswing drills. My fingers and thumb were all sore from not holding the ball right last night and I could barely hold the ball, plus my thumb was too swollen for the drills to do any good. I put the ball away shortly after getting it out. I will have to give my hand a break and wait for the soreness and swelling to go down before I can try this again. Even if I chose not to listen to anyone here, my hand won't let me get away with holding the ball incorrectly for long. So there's my answer.

As for the old ball, I'm going to have it plugged and redrilled, but not for me. My teenage son wants to get serious about bowling too, so the ball is going to be handed down to him since it's a good beginner's ball. I've got the new plastic ball I won here that I am going to be using for those left side spares and (sigh) I'm going to have it drilled just like the Marauder so it's one less thing to think about.

I guess after all the reading I've done I should know better, so I will just have to keep practicing once my hand will allow it again.

[75lockwood]

As always Bill you're the sage voice of wisdom. :) I also had some additional confirmation this evening when I picked up the ball and attempted to do some armswing drills. My fingers and thumb were all sore from not holding the ball right last night and I could barely hold the ball, plus my thumb was too swollen for the drills to do any good. I put the ball away shortly after getting it out. I will have to give my hand a break and wait for the soreness and swelling to go down before I can try this again. Even if I chose not to listen to anyone here, my hand won't let me get away with holding the ball incorrectly for long. So there's my answer.

As for the old ball, I'm going to have it plugged and redrilled, but not for me. My teenage son wants to get serious about bowling too, so the ball is going to be handed down to him since it's a good beginner's ball. I've got the new plastic ball I won here that I am going to be using for those left side spares and (sigh) I'm going to have it drilled just like the Marauder so it's one less thing to think about.

I guess after all the reading I've done I should know better, so I will just have to keep practicing once my hand will allow it again.

OOOO get your son an account on here as well! i can give him a few suggestions on what equipment to get....

[Mike White]

OOOO get your son an account on here as well! i can give him a few suggestions on what equipment to get....

75lockwood, that has to be the worst advice EVER!!!

Another new account on here means yet another week before I can be a repeat ball winner. :)

[Cochese]

More good advice from our experts! I have been trying to mess with my grip and swing, trying to get more revs and crank it up a little more instead of just working on consistency. It hasn't been working out so good. I practiced yesterday and instead of messing with grip, I concentrated on mainly hitting my mark and also on keeping my shoulder low. Amazing how good timing produces such a better throw than trying to "force" revs on the ball by messing with cupping and wrist cock.

[scottymoney]

Something I am going to try that I saw in a training video on youtube from Norm Duke. I never thought of it before, but after seeing it I thought wow that probably makes a huge difference. The thing I am talking about is he teaches to use your non bowling arm to hold the ball weight up until the armswing. This makes sense as I think it may take pressure off the bowling arm until it is truly needed allowing for the bowling arm to stay a bit more relaxed and "freash". I had always put most of the weight on the bowling arm as soon as I picked up the ball. I will be giving this a try this weekend when I go practice with the wife. I am guessing it will reduce strain on the arm and make me grip less as I my arm won't be holding as much weight to start off with.

At least that is what I think it might do!

[75lockwood]

75lockwood, that has to be the worst advice EVER!!!

Another new account on here means yet another week before I can be a repeat ball winner. :)

Hold your horses! i still haven't won once! LOL

[GoodGorilla]

Something I am going to try that I saw in a training video on youtube from Norm Duke. I never thought of it before, but after seeing it I thought wow that probably makes a huge difference. The thing I am talking about is he teaches to use your non bowling arm to hold the ball weight up until the armswing. This makes sense as I think it may take pressure off the bowling arm until it is truly needed allowing for the bowling arm to stay a bit more relaxed and "freash". I had always put most of the weight on the bowling arm as soon as I picked up the ball. I will be giving this a try this weekend when I go practice with the wife. I am guessing it will reduce strain on the arm and make me grip less as I my arm won't be holding as much weight to start off with.

At least that is what I think it might do!

Norm says one of the top 3 things he can teach somebody. I tried it out, not very seriously. It didn't seem like it did anything, I'll probably try it again later. I do however put more than half the weight in my non ball hand.

[GoodGorilla]

Normally the ball will stick to my thumb if I turn the ball early, or accelerate the follow through when my thumb is still in the ball. I have had good thumb drills for several months now so I know what it should feel like. I had a ball drilled 2 days ago, and I asked the operator to open it a little right after I put my hand in it the first time.

[AZBowla]

Thanks for all the advice, guys. I'm going to have him open up the thumbhole just a tiny bit more when I go down there next weekend and then drill my spare ball to match the Marauder. After that, it's practice,practice, practice until I get this right. Going to spend alot of time working on armswing and release as those are my two big weaknesses right now.

[GeoLes]

if only this was the matrix, then it would be as easy as downloading the correct method :cool: <-- neo LOL

"Just relax your grip on that ball, Mr. Anderson"

[AZBowla]

"Just relax your grip on that ball, Mr. Anderson"

Actually I just need to realize the truth - there is no ball...

[J Anderson]

"Just relax your grip on that ball, Mr. Anderson"

Hey! Leave me out of this!

[Hammer]

Gripping the ball with your thumb can be a hard habit to break. What you should be doing is gripping the ball with your middle and ring finger and press your index finger and pinkie on top of the ball. Doing this will keep your wrist cupped or straight and it stays that way into the release. All the thumb does is take up space in the thumb hole. When the thumb isn't gripping the thumb will come out quickly near the release and that will let the ball fly off the tips of your bent fingertips as you hand quickly goes forward through the end of the swing. If you grip with the thumb as you are coming to the release you will lose accuracy to your target, lose revs and it could possibley cause you to pull your shot. You want to leave the thumb lying flat in the thumb hole and not pressing down on the thumb in the hole which will cause the thumb knuckle to rise and touch the other side of the hole which will cause it to stick. There are bad releases that can cause a thumb to stick even if the hole is drilled correctly.

[Tampabaybob]

AZ.......I also used to grip the heck out of my ball and always paid the price for it after bowling. This season, something I've been working on is a relaxed release. If you read several of the top coaches advice, these new balls are so strong that you no longer need to "grip it and rip it". Fast forward to yesterday, I drilled out my new ball that I won here, the Roto Grip Shatter, and I tried it right after drilling, using the relaxed release. No pain, no forced lift, just an easy release and rotation of my wrist, and the ball reacted as violently as if I had ripped it. The ball is a skid snap ball and it did exactly that. Great reaction, and hitting power and I didn't have to kill myself doing it. Hope that helps answer your question.

Bob

[AZBowla]

Well an update on this - took my new Matrix ball that I won here to the pro shop to get drilled today - the guy pulled up my measurements from the last ball and asked me if everything was alright. I said yeah, except the thumb was too tight and I had to come back a couple times to get it adjusted as it kept getting hung up on my thumb. He says hmmm, let me see... and found out it was drilled not one but TWO sizes too small! How I wasn't getting hung up on it more often is beyond me (and him). He adjusted my Marauder to the correct size and drilled my Matrix ball to match. All I can say is wow what a difference! Both balls feel PERFECT now and I don't get hung up on either one at all. I can grip both of them nice and relaxed and these balls fly down the lane now and hit like a freight train. The Matrix ball is just the ticket for the dry lanes on open bowling, but I stuck with the DV8 for strikes and did pretty respectable - high score for the day was 188 and the new matrix ball takes care of single pin spares like it has a laser sight on it. I am now VERY happy with both balls and doing much better than I was before - no more need to knuckle the thumb hole. :D

[Tampabaybob]

It's nice to have a ball driller that can recognize a problem and help you fix it. There are probably plenty of bowlers that have a similar problem, but don't go to have it checked out. Glad you did, and as you can see, no more reason to 'grip it and rip it'. Good luck let us know how you're doing.

Bob

[AZBowla]

So last night after bowling like an idiot for the first 5 games, I'm not sure quite how it happened but something "clicked" and I went from an off-balance awkward looking swing to a nice relaxed almost Norm Duke form and my consistency improved dramatically. I wish I could figure out what I did but I went from bowling like a hunchback to standing nearly straight up at the point of release with my balance arm right where it needed to be and the ball doing exactly what I wanted and expected for the shot I was taking. I went from leaving opens on nearly every frame to two strikes, four spares in a row and another strike. The final game of the night I was also closing out almost every frame but time ran out and I didn't get a chance to finish up, but I was on track to at least a 180 game if not higher. Very exciting! I can't wait to go back out and continue to work on this. If I can keep this going I think I'll be ready to upload a video for some critiques.

[75lockwood]

Sounds great! i hate bowling by the hour because of this the machine just shuts off, if i throw my ball i tend to have to ask that the machine be turned back on so i can get it back...

Just think about the, 600 series on the horizon!

[AZBowla]

I just got a free two games coupon in my inbox from AMF (my GF did too) so I'm going to see if I can convince her to go with me on Friday and we'll each bowl our two free games and then pay for a third to get an average. That will tell me if I should bother with next month's upcoming ABT tourney or if I should wait until next year to start those.

[75lockwood]

I just got a free two games coupon in my inbox from AMF (my GF did too) so I'm going to see if I can convince her to go with me on Friday and we'll each bowl our two free games and then pay for a third to get an average. That will tell me if I should bother with next month's upcoming ABT tourney or if I should wait until next year to start those.

Go for it regardless!

go have fun at the tournament, will you win it all? probably not, but who cares? go have fun and get a feel for what its like so your ready next time!

[AZBowla]

Go for it regardless!

go have fun at the tournament, will you win it all? probably not, but who cares? go have fun and get a feel for what its like so your ready next time!

If I do, I'll go for the $25 win-a-spot option. Normally the entry fee is $75 but if you want you can pay just $25 and your first 3 games can win you a paid spot in the actual tournament. The way I figure it, if I do lousy than I'm only out $25 (most likely scenario) instead of $75 and if I do well then I get to bowl in a tournament for just $25. :D They also let you bowl even if you aren't a member, but if you win the winnings are applied towards your dues. So maybe if I'm lucky I'll win a free membership for next year out of it. We'll see. I need to get an ABT shirt though I think, or at least one with my name on the back from what the guy was saying. I'll have to shoot him an email and ask him if I need that before this next tourney or if I can just bowl in a normal shirt.

[UBowling]

My general rule for fit in the ball is that when you bowl, the ball should be releasing your hand, not your hand releasing the ball. I believe it is better to create a comfortable and tight fit in the ball so you can relax your hand and throw it the same way every time, so as far as the thumb hole goes, I recommend getting a good oval on it, and the sanding it out so it is a little big to accommodate swelling when it happens and then perfect the fit with white tape.

With that being said, I know of a lot of great bowling who grip the ball as tight as they can when they bowl. I think it is the weirdest thing.

[Tampabaybob]

After getting a new ball, I have always carried small pieces of sandpaper in my bag. This to me, is a must have in every bowling bag/kit so you can "tweak" your thumb hole to fit the way it feels good to you. You may not always have a pro shop available to you when you need it and having this available can be life saving. This way you're taking just a little out at a time.

Bob