Who is the all time best sports player?

[The KingPin]

Many would claim that Jordan, Bird, Gretzky, Tyson and others are the best sports player ever. Who do you think is and why?

[ArtVandelay]

In what regard though? Are we going by pure numbers? Talent? What? I mean, you almost have to break it up into all the different sports.

But I'll get this started with someone no one will see coming. The greatest athlete of all time (in a major sport, hockey, baseball, football or basketball) is Mario Lemieux.

The guy had it all. The size, the reach, the power, the speed. The only thing he didn't have was health. If he had Gretzky's health, if he had Gretzky's help (for the most part, Lemieux played his career with relative unknowns, it wasn't until the penguins took Jagr that he had a TRUE weapon to work with. Gretzky had all kinds of help, not the least of which was some guy named Messier), he would have had all of Gretzky's records. The guy was a monster on the ice, and perhaps the most feared player ever, in the open ice. He played on days when he could hardly lace up his own skates, his back hurt so bad. He beat Hodgkin's disease. He made a comeback and showed that even though he was older and slower, he was still amazing. There's simply too much to say about the guy, he was amazing in every aspect of the word. Sadly, his career can be summed up in just two words: What if?

Hockey players are the most talented athletes of the major sports. Batting, in baseball, is the single most difficult thing to do in sports, but when you combine every aspect of a sport, hockey players are the best athletes. They have to combine skating, hitting, eye and hand coordination, spacing, you name it.... You can't look at the puck when you're carrying it (are you listening Mr. Lindros?????), you will get killed. Head up, believe it's there, feel it on the stick.


So there you have it. Your thoughts?

[The KingPin]

In what regard though? Are we going by pure numbers? Talent? What? I mean, you almost have to break it up into all the different sports.

But I'll get this started with someone no one will see coming. The greatest athlete of all time (in a major sport, hockey, baseball, football or basketball) is Mario Lemieux.

The guy had it all. The size, the reach, the power, the speed. The only thing he didn't have was health. If he had Gretzky's health, if he had Gretzky's help (for the most part, Lemieux played his career with relative unknowns, it wasn't until the penguins took Jagr that he had a TRUE weapon to work with. Gretzky had all kinds of help, not the least of which was some guy named Messier), he would have had all of Gretzky's records. The guy was a monster on the ice, and perhaps the most feared player ever, in the open ice. He played on days when he could hardly lace up his own skates, his back hurt so bad. He beat Hodgkin's disease. He made a comeback and showed that even though he was older and slower, he was still amazing. There's simply too much to say about the guy, he was amazing in every aspect of the word. Sadly, his career can be summed up in just two words: What if?

Hockey players are the most talented athletes of the major sports. Batting, in baseball, is the single most difficult thing to do in sports, but when you combine every aspect of a sport, hockey players are the best athletes. They have to combine skating, hitting, eye and hand coordination, spacing, you name it.... You can't look at the puck when you're carrying it (are you listening Mr. Lindros?????), you will get killed. Head up, believe it's there, feel it on the stick.


So there you have it. Your thoughts?


How about talent? Who brings it when it is needed? Is Kobe Bryant the basketball star of today? I am not sure. You see great people do great things at certain times. So does making a winning goal or shot make you a hero? Yes but for how long?

I think when you can do it over and over again that makes you the best.

[NoTapNorm]

I have to agree with Kevin regarding hockey players. I had the privilege of watching Gretzky with all the teams he played for (yes, even in the WHA Edmonton days). One could only imagine the line of Gretzky, Lemieux, and Messier.... What other brand of athlete has to skate at full speed, keep control of the puck, watch out he's not hit and shoot at the same time? Granted, futbol (soccer) athletes run a close second, only because they're on solid ground and not ice.

As far as an individual player- Gretzky

[Cerberus]

I think this should be an easy pick. I mean if your asking who the greatest sports player ever is, you go with the greatest athlete. And anyone who knows anything about sports, knows the greatest athlete is and always will be Jim Thorpe. I mean to pick anyone over him is just plain ridiculous. The man won gold in the Olympics in the Pentathalon, and Decathlon. And then went on to play professionally in the NFL. He is considered by almost everyone as the greatest athlete of this century. I would find it hard pressed to even consider anyone over him.

[ArtVandelay]

I think this should be an easy pick. I mean if your asking who the greatest sports player ever is, you go with the greatest athlete. And anyone who knows anything about sports, knows the greatest athlete is and always will be Jim Thorpe. I mean to pick anyone over him is just plain ridiculous. The man won gold in the Olympics in the Pentathalon, and Decathlon. And then went on to play professionally in the NFL. He is considered by almost everyone as the greatest athlete of this century. I would find it hard pressed to even consider anyone over him.

From an overall standpoint, there's no question. But this question is vague enough to allow for interpretation. hahahahaha.

[jwensil]

From an overall standpoint, there's no question. But this question is vague enough to allow for interpretation. hahahahaha.

nice response... I would say Michael Jordan for basketball, but he took everything from Dr. J. and built on it. Crosby for hockey currently, but he has taken everything from Gretzky and built upon it. But who's better, the student that took everything and built upon it or the person who was the originator?

Tyson was greatest in sheer strength and toughness, but then there's Ali. This is definitely a vague question but gets you thinking :)

[Cerberus]

If we are going sport by sport, then here is my list of the all time greatest of the ones that matter.

Baseball
Ty Cobb (More votes than Ruth for hall of fame; voted in same year)

Basketball
Bill Russell(More championships and better understanding of game than anyone ever;Jordan is media hype)

Football
Joe Montana(I do not even see anyone arguing this one)

Hockey
Wayne Gretzky(They call him the great one)

Athlete
Jim Thorpe

LOL argue amongst yourselves now :)

[ArtVandelay]

If we are going sport by sport, then here is my list of the all time greatest of the ones that matter.

Baseball
Ty Cobb (More votes than Ruth for hall of fame; voted in same year)

Basketball
Bill Russell(More championships and better understanding of game than anyone ever;Jordan is media hype)

Football
Joe Montana(I do not even see anyone arguing this one)

Hockey
Wayne Gretzky(They call him the great one)

Athlete
Jim Thorpe

LOL argue amongst yourselves now :)

Joe Montana? Really? Give me Tom Brady... hahahahaha.

I'll give Montana his due, but for football, give me that guy he was throwing to. He was pretty decent, and I don't think we'll ever see anyone APPROACH what he did.

[Cerberus]

Joe Montana? Really? Give me Tom Brady... hahahahaha.

I'll give Montana his due, but for football, give me that guy he was throwing to. He was pretty decent, and I don't think we'll ever see anyone APPROACH what he did.

I agree Rice is up there, but without the right man throwing him the ball, he is just a wide out. Plus you have to give a lot of that credit to Bill Walsh. It was his system. But no one has ever been as cool under pressure as Montana. He was a true great at the QB position. I think these days Peyton Manning has revolutionized the way Qb's play the game. He knows every position and every coverage. And he does a great job of exploiting them. But I have to give Montana the nod on the football. I was surprised no one was arguing Jordan or Ruth. When you throw out Cobb most times you get Ruth back.

[kev3inp]

OK, I disagree with Montana. Yeah, he was a good quarterback, but without guys that could actually catch the ball, no matter how hard they knew they were going to get hit, he would have journeyman numbers at best. And he had a damn good line to protect him, too. The only other line that good was Marino's and I HATE the Dolphins.

Jordan was hype? You never saw him play live. If he had players who could hit an open shot more often he'd be the career leader in assists. Kobe is hype. Shaq is has-been hype. I could make a case for Jabbar, however.

Hockey, perhaps Gretzky, or Orr, ( I like the way that looks), Esposito; not Lemieux??, not even a mention?? Lots of others.

Any of the "best" in sports took what the previous stars showed was possible and built on it. That's the mark of greatness. To take what the superlative talent was and add to it.

[ArtVandelay]

I agree Rice is up there, but without the right man throwing him the ball, he is just a wide out. Plus you have to give a lot of that credit to Bill Walsh. It was his system. But no one has ever been as cool under pressure as Montana. He was a true great at the QB position. I think these days Peyton Manning has revolutionized the way Qb's play the game. He knows every position and every coverage. And he does a great job of exploiting them. But I have to give Montana the nod on the football. I was surprised no one was arguing Jordan or Ruth. When you throw out Cobb most times you get Ruth back.

I'm a Red Sox fan. Do you honestly think I'd try to argue for ruth? Give me a break!!!

I would think Teddy Ballgame should get some consideration, though.... He wasn't too shabby. And as pitchers go, there was a guy named Cy something-or-other.... I think there's an award named after him now.

[Cerberus]

OK, I disagree with Montana. Yeah, he was a good quarterback, but without guys that could actually catch the ball, no matter how hard they knew they were going to get hit, he would have journeyman numbers at best. And he had a damn good line to protect him, too. The only other line that good was Marino's and I HATE the Dolphins.

Jordan was hype? You never saw him play live. If he had players who could hit an open shot more often he'd be the career leader in assists. Kobe is hype. Shaq is has-been hype. I could make a case for Jabbar, however.

Hockey, perhaps Gretzky, or Orr, ( I like the way that looks), Esposito; not Lemieux??, not even a mention?? Lots of others.

Any of the "best" in sports took what the previous stars showed was possible and built on it. That's the mark of greatness. To take what the superlative talent was and add to it.

Well I would disagree on the Montana comment. He did leave the team and bring a not so good team to the playoffs with the Chiefs. Not to mention when he arrived everything kind of just went together. He was so clutch too. You can go back and see the hundreds of interviews by his teammates where they back him and how cool he was under pressure. Plus he was a great leader.

As for Jordan I contribute him to more hype. Allan Iverson and others have similar numbers. Stats do not mean all that much in my book. He was there for 5 years and the Bulls were crappy. They added the talent around him and he wins 6 titles. Yeah when he left they lost, so it shows he was good, but without his support he was not that great. I have to go Russell. He won on every level. So you can not say it was always his teammates. And if you check some of the older highlights you could see how great of a leader he was. There were nights he got 2 points and his team won. He realized that the game was not about one person. It is a team sport and he played it the best ever. He lead USF to two national championships in 1955 and 1956. At one point they won 55 games in a row. John Wooden once called Russell "the greatest defensive man I've ever seen".

Plus the 11 NBA titles do not hurt. And for a couple of those he was player/coach. I never saw Jordan do all that.

[ArtVandelay]

OK, I disagree with Montana. Yeah, he was a good quarterback, but without guys that could actually catch the ball, no matter how hard they knew they were going to get hit, he would have journeyman numbers at best. And he had a damn good line to protect him, too. The only other line that good was Marino's and I HATE the Dolphins.

Jordan was hype? You never saw him play live. If he had players who could hit an open shot more often he'd be the career leader in assists. Kobe is hype. Shaq is has-been hype. I could make a case for Jabbar, however.

Hockey, perhaps Gretzky, or Orr, ( I like the way that looks), Esposito; not Lemieux??, not even a mention?? Lots of others.

Any of the "best" in sports took what the previous stars showed was possible and built on it. That's the mark of greatness. To take what the superlative talent was and add to it.

Jordan transformed the game. It used to be a game for the big men. Be brought attention to the 1 and 2 guard positions. There's really no question what he did for the game was amazing.

As far as hockey, Gretzky has the numbers, no question. I love Gretzky as much as the next guy, but IMHO, Lemieux was the most talented there ever was. He simply didn't have the health to back up everything else. If he had been blessed with Gretzky's great health, I think the record books would look a lot different. Plus, Gretzky had Messier for a while. Who did Lemieux have? Before Jagr showed up, I think Ron Francis might have been his best help. Anyone remember the guy?

[ArtVandelay]

................
As for Jordan I contribute him to more hype. Allan Iverson and others have similar numbers. Stats do not mean all that much in my book. He was there for 5 years and the Bulls were crappy. They added the talent around him and he wins 6 titles. Yeah when he left they lost, so it shows he was good, but without his support he was not that great. I have to go Russell. He won on every level. So you can not say it was always his teammates. And if you check some of the older highlights you could see how great of a leader he was. There were nights he got 2 points and his team won. He realized that the game was not about one person. It is a team sport and he played it the best ever. He lead USF to two national championships in 1955 and 1956. At one point they won 55 games in a row. John Wooden once called Russell "the greatest defensive man I've ever seen".

Plus the 11 NBA titles do not hurt. And for a couple of those he was player/coach. I never saw Jordan do all that.

I'll never, in a million years, argue Russell as the greatest. I'm a Celtics fan, after all. ESPECIALLY when you consider the racial barriers he had to overcome, and Boston is not the easiest of places to do that!

BUT, that being said.... Calling Jordan hype... Well, that's a tough one, pal. I don't think anyone could really say anything negative towards Jordan and be taken too seriously. The game was QUITE different before Jordan. He changed things, he did things no one else did, and showed that a guard can take over a game. Don't believe me? Name the top 5 centers in today's game. Now name the top 5 centers of the 70s and early 80s. Compare and contrast. The game has gone away from the big men. Part of that has to do with the 3 point line, but a larger part is what Jordan showed the world.

[Cerberus]

I'll never, in a million years, argue Russell as the greatest. I'm a Celtics fan, after all. ESPECIALLY when you consider the racial barriers he had to overcome, and Boston is not the easiest of places to do that!

BUT, that being said.... Calling Jordan hype... Well, that's a tough one, pal. I don't think anyone could really say anything negative towards Jordan and be taken too seriously. The game was QUITE different before Jordan. He changed things, he did things no one else did, and showed that a guard can take over a game. Don't believe me? Name the top 5 centers in today's game. Now name the top 5 centers of the 70s and early 80s. Compare and contrast. The game has gone away from the big men. Part of that has to do with the 3 point line, but a larger part is what Jordan showed the world.

I would disagree, but I think the best player in the NBA today is Tim Duncan. And a lot of people think I am nuts, but I mean come on he is the best player. He never gets the credit he deserves. So for you to say it is a guards game, I do not think so. Guards can score, but in the game today, defense is more important. And not many great defensive guards.Plus I would take Chris Paul over Kobe and James any day. Give me someone who is going to lead and do what the situation calls for. Duncan is the best now. And Russell best ever. But that is my opinion. But I never liked Jordan, without Nike pushing him so hard, I do not think he would be so big. He made great plays, but was given all the calls. Take away all the calls and he is another Iverson. Plus , I saw Jordan shut down by a lot of big men and great defenders over the years. Give me the team players.

And just to through another name out there, Robert Horry. Or as many know him Big Shot Rob. You know he has more titles than Jordan. He has 7. And he was always a much better team player than Jordan. Just another one of those great players who do not get enough credit. Now what if he had the same Nike type push?

[ArtVandelay]

I would disagree, but I think the best player in the NBA today is Tim Duncan. And a lot of people think I am nuts, but I mean come on he is the best player. He never gets the credit he deserves. So for you to say it is a guards game, I do not think so. Guards can score, but in the game today, defense is more important. And not many great defensive guards.Plus I would take Chris Paul over Kobe and James any day. Give me someone who is going to lead and do what the situation calls for. Duncan is the best now. And Russell best ever. But that is my opinion. But I never liked Jordan, without Nike pushing him so hard, I do not think he would be so big. He made great plays, but was given all the calls. Take away all the calls and he is another Iverson. Plus , I saw Jordan shut down by a lot of big men and great defenders over the years. Give me the team players.

And just to through another name out there, Robert Horry. Or as many know him Big Shot Rob. You know he has more titles than Jordan. He has 7. And he was always a much better team player than Jordan. Just another one of those great players who do not get enough credit. Now what if he had the same Nike type push?

It's okay. I can understand your dislike for Jordan. I hate Kobe, but it's by choice. I'm a Celtics fan. I don't like anyone in a yellow and purple jersey (LSU included, sorry guys, blame LA). I HATE derek jeter.... man...

But you're wrong about Jordan. I know I can't change your mind, but he was the single most dominant player of his day. EVER?? Highly debatable.

On a career level, I'll give you Duncan. But if you're talking about the single most dominant player TODAY, or even last year, I'd say you're nuts. He's had a great career. He doesn't get any publicity because he's not flashy, he just does the right thing, and he keeps his mouth shut. 5 or 6 years ago, I think he's in ALL the conversations for MVP (and he was), no question. But right now? Well, he's had a great career, but he's not what he once was. It happens to the best. Age will do that to you.

LeBron... I wanted him to fail, and fail miserably. I hated how he wanted to skip his senior season of HIGH SCHOOL to enter the draft. I hated his huge sponsorships he signed before he ever set foot on a court. I hated a lot about him. But the guy's good. He has NOTHING around him, and he will still put in 40, and make it look easy. He's a great player.

The best player right NOW, almost has to be LeBron or Kobe from a talent stand point. But my favorite player right now? I really like what Chauncy Billups does. I think he's a heck of a player, does all the small things, plays hard nose defense. I've always liked his game, despite the fact he played for detroit until recently.

[kev3inp]

Jordan shut down by big men? What games were you watching? Well, whatever, dude.

[Cerberus]

Jordan shut down by big men? What games were you watching? Well, whatever, dude.

He was shut down many times in his career, you do not remember because of all the hype.He is top 5 of all time, but not the best. He was carried by his great team around him. Like I said look at the years before they surrounded him with all those great players. He did not win then. See always with the media hype. The media destroys everything. No one will ever convince me Jordan is ahead of Russell. I would take Duncan, Russell, and Horry over Jordan any day. Take away all those calls they always gave him, he is nothing. Just another Iverson, but more flashy.

[ArtVandelay]

Horry has no place in this thread, man. Hate to say it... At his peak, he was a serviceable role player. He was a GREAT journeyman, who always seemed to land on the right team. Why? Veteran leadership, and nothing more. He was not dominant, he was not a force, and he does not belong in this thread. Who were the other players on his championship teams? He was a role player at best, the stars of those teams were the championship winners.

BUT, I'll give you Horry on your team, I'll take Jordan on mine! hahahahaha.

But you know what? I'm the same way you are about Peyton Manning. I think he's overrated as hell. I've gotten to the point where I can call his interceptions. He always looks the same way in the pocket when he's rattled. He gets happy feet, and immediately backs up as if to say, "Don't hurt me" after he throws. I can't stand the guy. He got lucky, and played well in ONE game. That was it. He tried his best to blow the Super Bowl he won, but Rex Grossman wouldn't have it. Grossman was determined to lose that game at all costs. Rhodes should have been Super Bowl MVP that year (look at the stats). Manning was average at best. The game he DID play well in was the game before when he kept New England off the field for the whole 2nd half.

And his brother is overrated too. I'm a Patriots fan. I've watched that Super Bowl more times than I care to mention. He got lucky on his throws. He was throwing off his back foot for most of the game, just lobbing them up there and hoping for the best. Who should have been Super Bowl MVP? Tuck. But the qbs get all the credit.

But in fairness, Brady only deserved the first Super Bowl MVP he got. Mike Vrabel deserved the 2nd, and Deion Branch got the 3rd (rightfully so). QBs get ALL the credit. But go through Peyton's career, even back to his days in Tennessee. He's a big game choker. Always has been, always will be. His only hope is if his teammates bail him out. But football is a team sport, and they have every right to do so.

[ArtVandelay]

And I do have to say, you won't find anyone in professional basketball who DOESN'T get shut down every now and then. Jordan came through more often than not. Everyone gets shut down.

[Cerberus]

And I do have to say, you won't find anyone in professional basketball who DOESN'T get shut down every now and then. Jordan came through more often than not. Everyone gets shut down.

The true greats never really get shut down. They manage to make a difference elsewhere. Or they lead their team by doing something else. They are multidimensional. Jordan was really one dimensional. I will say he changed the way SOME people played the game, but not all. Defense still wins championships. And without his teammates he did not win.

Lets look at Jordan before he was surrounded by talent.

Rookie year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1985.html
They finished with a record of 38 - 44

Second year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1986.html
They finished with a record of 30 - 52

Third year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1987.html
They finished with a record of 40-42

Fourth year(The year they added Scottie Pippen)
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1988.html
They finished with record of 50 -32 (First time he made the playoffs.)
Playoffs:
Lost NBA Eastern Conference Semifinals (4-1) versus Detroit Pistons
Won NBA Eastern Conference First Round (3-2) versus Cleveland Cavaliers

Now as you can see until the got Pippen, Jordan was not winning much. And I can continue this showing the acquisition of more players and they get more wins. Russell won on every level. I will give you that Jordan was good, sometimes great(when not getting every call from the officials), but he was not even close to the best.

[ArtVandelay]

The true greats never really get shut down. They manage to make a difference elsewhere. Or they lead their team by doing something else. They are multidimensional. Jordan was really one dimensional. I will say he changed the way SOME people played the game, but not all. Defense still wins championships. And without his teammates he did not win.

Lets look at Jordan before he was surrounded by talent.

Rookie year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1985.html
They finished with a record of 38 - 44

Second year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1986.html
They finished with a record of 30 - 52

Third year
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1987.html
They finished with a record of 40-42

Fourth year(The year they added Scottie Pippen)
http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_1988.html
They finished with record of 50 -32 (First time he made the playoffs.)
Playoffs:
Lost NBA Eastern Conference Semifinals (4-1) versus Detroit Pistons
Won NBA Eastern Conference First Round (3-2) versus Cleveland Cavaliers

Now as you can see until the got Pippen, Jordan was not winning much. And I can continue this showing the acquisition of more players and they get more wins. Russell won on every level. I will give you that Jordan was good, sometimes great(when not getting every call from the officials), but he was not even close to the best.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. hahahaha. Russell wasn't exactly surrounded by chumps. They had this coach, someone by the name of... eh, some color. hahahaha. He knew how to draft and build a team. Then there was some guy they ended up accidentally getting, I think Cousey was his name (I use it to put my beer in).... I think he was serviceable. hahahaha. I dunno, man. I'm as big a fan of Bill Russell as anyone, but Jordan was nothing to shake a stick at.

I'll TELL you who's really overrated, though! Phil Jackson. Never been a fan, not at all.

[Cerberus]

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. hahahaha. Russell wasn't exactly surrounded by chumps. They had this coach, someone by the name of... eh, some color. hahahaha. He knew how to draft and build a team. Then there was some guy they ended up accidentally getting, I think Cousey was his name (I use it to put my beer in).... I think he was serviceable. hahahaha. I dunno, man. I'm as big a fan of Bill Russell as anyone, but Jordan was nothing to shake a stick at.

I'll TELL you who's really overrated, though! Phil Jackson. Never been a fan, not at all.

I would agree with you on Jackson. He only goes to teams that have talent. I have never seen him coach a bad or decent team. That is the mark of a true great coach. Someone who builds them from scratch. They go in with a not so good team and then they mold them into a good team. Everyone of Jackson's teams were hand picked talented teams. And he was not the one doing the picking. So yeah I would agree with you on Jackson being overrated. I never liked him myself.

[ArtVandelay]

I would agree with you on Jackson. He only goes to teams that have talent. I have never seen him coach a bad or decent team. That is the mark of a true great coach. Someone who builds them from scratch. They go in with a not so good team and then they mold them into a good team. Everyone of Jackson's teams were hand picked talented teams. And he was not the one doing the picking. So yeah I would agree with you on Jackson being overrated. I never liked him myself.

You mean like THIS guy? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Auerbach) http://www.beginnerbikers.org/images/smilies/new/smug%5B1%5D.gif

What a great history...

[Cerberus]

You mean like THIS guy? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Auerbach) http://www.beginnerbikers.org/images/smilies/new/smug%5B1%5D.gif

What a great history...

Yeah, now that is a great coach. He had an amazing eye for talent. Though, he had a lot of help from a couple of his players. But, he always put a great team on the floor. You can not beat someone who has so much success and always did it his way. I would have to say he is the greatest coach without a doubt. At least the greatest professional basketball coach. :)

[ArtVandelay]

Yeah, now that is a great coach. He had an amazing eye for talent. Though, he had a lot of help from a couple of his players. But, he always put a great team on the floor. You can not beat someone who has so much success and always did it his way. I would have to say he is the greatest coach without a doubt. At least the greatest professional basketball coach. :)

I wouldn't back away from arguing greatest coach. I think that'd be fair to say! hahahaha. Of course....

There's always Coach Ditka. He might have something to say about that.....

Da Bears.....

[Jamski]

Anthony Joseph Foyt Jr.

The biggest, baddest man to ever wheel a race car.

[BladedBANDITOZ]

Jordan and Tiger

[ffemtreed]

No mention of Bobby Orr???? He would get my vote, with a very close second of Gretzky.

[Big Dog]

I am an old man. I have seen many players over the years. The ones who are truly great are the ones who go through their careers and are barely noticed. Football lineman who dont get penalties and block good. Safeties who may not make the tackle,but set it up. My pick is Claude Humphries of the Atlanta Falcons. It was a pleasure and previledge to watch that man play.

[comfortably numb]

Who is the best all-time sports player???? What a loaded question, huh? Let's narrow the question's substance down a little...the best player must come from the toughest sport, must also be the very best all-time in that sport, and must have multiple championships under his belt (not Her belt)...must also be a top-notch, world class athlete, who made other people around them better, thus the multiple championships, and finally, must be a true gentleman, who honored the sport he played and was a true sportsman....there is no question that the only person who fits the bill is the one and only....
MAGIC JOHNSON period

[kev3inp]

Jim Thorpe.

Magic? True gentleman? True sportsman? Ask Cookie and see if she agrees. Heard he "attained" the virus from too many rainbows on the road. And this guy went to college? Sure doesn't and hasn't sounded like it. Nice talk show, too.

[comfortably numb]

I guess you never sowed some wild oats before you got married, eh? As far as college goes, Magic is worth half a billion dollars but he can't talk right, so I guess his business smarts were just luck, huh? Basketball at the pro level is by far the most difficult sport to excel in, and the best athletes in the world are NBA players...Jim Thorpe might have been the 12th man on the Timberwolves...maybe.

[The Mayor]

The most demanding position in any sport is Quarterback in the NFL. Dan Marino is the most skilled and talented to ever play the position. There's no question in my mind, he's the greatest athlete ever. Put Marino on any of Montana's SB winning teams and they still win. Put Montana on any of Marino's teams, they don't win half as many games.

[kev3inp]

Sorry, he "attained" his virus after his marriage. Sure I sowed some wild oats, but did't "attain" any STDs. Being rich doesn't make you smart. Isn't this an "all time best SPORTS player?" I took that to mean more than one. If you're going with basketball, sorry, it's got to be MJ.

[The Mayor]

I'd have to agree with Kevin. Magic probably makes the back end of the top 10 on my list.
1. Jordan
2. Wilt
3. Russell
4. Jabbar
5. Olajuwon
6. Bird
7. Shaq
8. Magic

Or something like that...

[comfortably numb]

If basketball was an individual sport, I would have to agree with Whiskey and Kev (being from Chicago had absolutely no bearing on your choice of MJ, did it?)...however, the last time I looked basketball is a team sport, and not one player listed above Magic made his teammates better players or was a better leader. Magic reinvented the point guard position...who before Magic had ever heard of a 6'9" point guard? As for Magic and the HIV virus, he was married when he was diagnosed, but were you there when he attained it? If not, how do you know he was married when he got it? And, if we are talking about multiple-sports stars, Bo Jackson was a far superior 2-sport star than MJ. Bo was an All-star in both sports, and if not for injury, would have been in 2 Halls of Fame. MJ was a scrub baseball player, whose own ego had told him he could be a star in anything he wanted to do. MJ has probably lost more money gambling than he made at basketball...good thing he can sell underwear, huh?

[CMoore]

Michael Jordan all the way!

[The Mayor]

Actually, Jordan could've been a very solid baseball player. Watch the ESPN 30 for 30 they did about it. I had the same opinion as you before I watched it. It was very interesting. He was a great athlete and could've played any sport. Woulda been one hell of a wide receiver, methinks.

Can't believe no one has mentioned The Babe either. So far ahead of anyone of his era. Over a .340 BA, 714HR, 2 time 20 game winner as a pitcher.

[comfortably numb]

Golden Tate of the Seahawks says that race car drivers are not athletes, but I strongly disagree. Is it possible that the greatest sports player of all time is/was a race car driver????

[The Mayor]

I would say they are athletes, but I wouldn't put any of them in the top 25 ever. I would however put 2 golfers in the top 25! And should Michael Phelps be considered? 8 gold medals in one olympics in one of the hardest sports in existence is pretty impressive!

[comfortably numb]

How about boxers? Everything that makes a great boxer great also makes him a great athlete....Ali, Leonard, Hagler....stamina, quickness, strength, toughness.

[The Mayor]

Forgetting tennis players as well. Sampras, Federer, Borg, Connors, Martina N... lots of good players.