New bowler help (video)

[Tavataar]

Hi everyone!

I have recently gotten more into bowling with some of my friends (purchased my first ball - Slingshot 15lb) and I have a couple questions about what I should be focusing on.

Here are two sets of clips, first one from two weekends ago, second one from last Sunday:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Z0z2zTTCdA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uner9sddetU

I realize that I need a lot of work on my form, and probably my wrist strength as well. I had been bowling a 14lb house ball and averaging around 140 with it (one 224 game) but I think I had been using a ball with oversized holes which allowed me to just muscle it down the lane with some revs. With the new, 15lb ball I am barely able to get any revs out of it, and thus no hook, even with trying to emphasize my follow through.

1. I had the ball drilled conventional and not finger tip. Was this a mistake? I have heard that I should still be able to get some revs on the ball even with the conventional grip, so I then wonder if it is a strength issue. I definitely have problems keeping my hand at 6/7 o'clock, during the forward part of the swing I tend to rotate my hand over the ball due to the weight. Should I keep the conventional grip for awhile until I am more used to the weight of the ball?
2. Is it possible that my ball was just drilled incorrectly? When the pro was asking me whether I sometimes wanted to be able to throw the ball straight, I said "sure, why not". I wonder if he took that to mean whether I always want to bowl it straight (http://imgur.com/krkSOE8 picture of the ball)
3. What are the top things I need to be working on form wise? I am trying to be conscious of my arm position (close to my side), keeping my body low, and follow through. I feel like my right leg is doing awkward things by staying behind me.

I appreciate any and all advice!

Thanks,
Tav

[ArtVandelay]

I am not an expert, and its tough to tell whats going on with the release by looking at the video...

Wait for someone else to give you advice, but if my 2 cents matters: are you letting your thumb clear the ball first? It looks like you are releasing everything at the same time, which is why I think the spin is funky and more helicopter than roll. But I dont know much about a conventional grip.

Thats my guess... Let the thumb clear and use your fingers to lift the ball and create the spin.

[billf]

Both of those clips were the same bowler? That's decent progress on your own in two weeks. I couldn't see your body as well in the second video so I will point out the obvious things from the first one. If they were corrected just ignore me.

1. The pushaway. I prefer a hinge but to each their own. HOWEVER, you are pushing up and away. It's a push away not an up and away. How can you maintain your sight on the target if you lift the ball in front of your eyes?

2. Your timing is off the whole time. Your body is already stopped at the foul line and waiting for your arm/ball as you are still at the apex of your back swing. In your video it starts out of time with your first step of your right foot. That's when the push away should begin; with the right foot and never further out than your step. Your arm and leg will then both cross your body and go behind you at the same time and rate. The next time your right foot hits the floor push hard off the ball of your foot into your slide. By keeping your weight forward on your left foot (heel is the brake) you will be able to obtain a decent slide. As the ball passes the ankle of your slide leg, rotate your hand/wrist at that time. Maintaining the proper hand orientation seems easier for most people when they try to point their index finger at the target through the entire swing while keeping some pressure on the ball with this finger.

3. Get it re-drilled finger tip grip. It's better for accuracy and promotes a better hook and rev potential.

Work on your footwork and timing then we can all discuss the many variables of the release to get the ball to do more.

P.S. I've NEVER seen a ball drilled like that before but can't say it's wrong when I don't really know what the driller was trying to do.

[mxjosh]

theres not much anyone can help u with via video if just starting out. I would get with a coach so u can get the basic steps and timing down. You may think u are doing something right from the internet advice but it may be way off.

Its taken me many coaching sessions and a year to get where Im at and I still have more to work on. but knowing the basics from a coach watching u do it right will speed up your progress a lot. A lot of the changes made to my form felt unnatural. After much practice, its now natural. Learning to bowl properly is not at all natural. I am good at many sports and Ive never felt as awkward as I do when learning proper form.

[J Anderson]

Hi everyone!

I have recently gotten more into bowling with some of my friends (purchased my first ball - Slingshot 15lb) and I have a couple questions about what I should be focusing on.


1. I had the ball drilled conventional and not finger tip. Was this a mistake? I have heard that I should still be able to get some revs on the ball even with the conventional grip, so I then wonder if it is a strength issue. I definitely have problems keeping my hand at 6/7 o'clock, during the forward part of the swing I tend to rotate my hand over the ball due to the weight. Should I keep the conventional grip for awhile until I am more used to the weight of the ball?
2. Is it possible that my ball was just drilled incorrectly? When the pro was asking me whether I sometimes wanted to be able to throw the ball straight, I said "sure, why not". I wonder if he took that to mean whether I always want to bowl it straight (http://imgur.com/krkSOE8 picture of the ball)
3. What are the top things I need to be working on form wise? I am trying to be conscious of my arm position (close to my side), keeping my body low, and follow through. I feel like my right leg is doing awkward things by staying behind me.

I appreciate any and all advice!

Thanks,
Tav

1. I always used to think that a conventional grip was easier until I finally got a ball drilled with a finger tip grip. I agree with Billf that you should have it re-drilled.
2. I don't have an answer to this.
3. Again as Bill said your push away should be level or downwards not up, and should start as the right foot starts forward and as the right foot touches the lane the ball should drop into the swing.
To me it looked like the ball was coming behind your back. I think you were holding the ball in front of your body instead of inline with your shoulder.
It also looked like you were stopping the backswing short, causing your wrist to bend backwards. I think this will go away once the timing gets fixed.

It also seemed like you were adjusting which board you started on without looking down. You should always know which board you're starting on, because the easiest adjustments to make are with the starting point and the target.

[Kobra167]

1. I used to put a big hook on the ball with conventional drilling. about 400 revs with all fingers in the ball. I've recently switched to finger tip and it's a world of difference. Having already know what you have to do with get it to hook conventional driilling, it's not really worth your time learn. Take it back, and make it finger tip.

2. What the pro shop did drilling wise is fine. I have pretty close to the same layout on my slingshot. If you throw it correctly the ball will turn.

3. Your Follow through and your wrist position i would pick out first. Also sometimes your body weight is balanced on the wrong foot standing on the approach. It's causing you to sometimes to take a studder step. Studder steps will mess with your timing.

Start there.

[Tavataar]

Thanks so much for the feedback, I really appreciate it. I will go talk to the pro shop guy asap about re-drilling.

billf - thanks for the compliment : ) I have done a lot of technical sports in the past -- fencing, swimming, water polo, ping pong -- so I understand repeatedly practicing things. I watched a bunch of youtube videos about things to practice for my form, and then went and bowled probably 20 games or so between the videos I made. I was definitely working on pushing away and not lifting in the second video. I will focus more on my timing and footwork this weekend.

mxjosh - I have browsed the bowl.com coach page for people in Maryland, and I was thinking about asking some of them what they charge for lessons, etc.

J Anderson and kobra - thanks, I will try to incorporate the ball and wrist position as well as the balance into my approach and timing.

I will hopefully have more to show you guys soon.

-Tav

[Tavataar]

Week three of practice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QCCNkjg--Y

I went and talked to my local pro shop guy that drilled my ball, and asked him about fingertip and the fact that I wasn't getting very many revs with my current drilling, and also that I was struggling a bit with my form and timing. He said that he would like to see me bowling around 150 with the conventional grip before he drilled it fingertip. So I tried to focus a lot today on approach form and timing and just bowling the ball straight.

Things that felt good:
* I don't always do it in these clips, but I had some frames where I really dropped my right shoulder, and practically placed the ball onto the lane.
* I worked on getting more power off of my third step into my slide.

Things that didn't feel good:
* My right leg is still staying behind me and not going to my left. This may be an issue with my flexibility (very unflexible) or maybe I am just not used to that.
* I think I am still bowling a little out to the right. I need to tilt my core and give myself more room for the ball so that my bowling plane is more in line.

Thanks for any comments!

Cheers,
Tav

[swingset]

Things that didn't feel good:
* My right leg is still staying behind me and not going to my left. This may be an issue with my flexibility (very unflexible) or maybe I am just not used to that.
* I think I am still bowling a little out to the right. I need to tilt my core and give myself more room for the ball so that my bowling plane is more in line.


Walk up to the foul line, bend at the left leg, swing your right leg to the right so that you're in the release position...then swing the ball underneath you back and forth eventually letting it go. Teach yourself that position and how to stay in it and release the swing there.

Then, take your approach without the ball and finish bent at the left knee, right leg to the right.

Then, do it with the ball.

You have to talk your body into it, and that starts with being comfortable releasing in that position.

On the second note, the hips control where the ball swings and if your arm goes "out and around"...so move your hips out to the left ever so slightly on approach to allow the back swing to come back naturally and effortlessly, and pivot your hips very slightly to allow a free forward swing....then follow through straight and up.

[swingset]

This is a very basic video, but it breaks down the movements in a way that all bowlers should learn as "building blocks" of an approach to get timing and swing set up...then from there the fine tuning is much easier.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_NFS1e5q70

[SmilingBowler]

Great video post swingset!

[Bendial]

My advice would be to just slow things down a bit. Walk a little more natural and don't "strong arm" the ball down the lane

[Tampabaybob]

Week three of practice: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QCCNkjg--Y

I went and talked to my local pro shop guy that drilled my ball, and asked him about fingertip and the fact that I wasn't getting very many revs with my current drilling, and also that I was struggling a bit with my form and timing. He said that he would like to see me bowling around 150 with the conventional grip before he drilled it fingertip. So I tried to focus a lot today on approach form and timing and just bowling the ball straight.

Things that felt good:
* I don't always do it in these clips, but I had some frames where I really dropped my right shoulder, and practically placed the ball onto the lane.
* I worked on getting more power off of my third step into my slide.

Things that didn't feel good:
* My right leg is still staying behind me and not going to my left. This may be an issue with my flexibility (very unflexible) or maybe I am just not used to that.
* I think I am still bowling a little out to the right. I need to tilt my core and give myself more room for the ball so that my bowling plane is more in line.

Thanks for any comments!

Cheers,
Tav

Tav, Very good improvement from your first video to your third. What I saw in the video that may help you are the following things:

1. Your foot speed is good (slow, slow, quick, quick) and you have a good knee bend at the line, however, with your right leg staying straight behind you you're not allowing your right hip to open up too get the ball closer to your left(slide) foot. You want to get that right leg back behind you and over to your left with your right toes on the floor. This will help you stay balanced at the line and make for a smoother delivery.

2. Your push away on your first step seems to go in an upward motion. Try either pushing it out and down or just dropping it straight down on your first step. What you're doing with that pus away is unnecessary motion that can cause several other problems.

Other than that you're off to a good start. I do agree that you should go to a finger tip right away. I strongly disagree with that ball driller to wait until you're averaging 150 to get it redrilled. I start all of my kids (students) with a fingertip, even if they've never bowled before in their life. It's more comfortable and allows you to do so much more with the ball in the way of motion. I'd say get a second opinion from another pro shop in your area.
Good Luck and keep us appraised at how you're progressing.