Aslan's Scores (of the non-lady kind) [Archive] - Page 6

Aslan

03-06-2016, 03:11 AM

Sweeps in Las Vegas: medium-heavy oil synthetics

465 Series: 172-162-131
Game 1 was clean until frame 6 when I couldn't convert the 4-6-7 split and then chopped a 1-2 in frame 8. Couldn't strike worth a darn.

Game 2 started off wonderfully; chopping a 1-2-4-8...then a chopped 1-2-10 in the 4th and a missed single 10-pin in the 5th. Stayed clean the rest of the way in a game that was impossible because the machine kept breaking down and when they tried to move us, the opponents threw a fit because their anchor had the front 7.

Game 3 we moved to a different pair...another chopped 4-6-7...a chopped 2-4-5-8...and 4 missed single-pins.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.52 pins
Strikes: 30% (10 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (5/10)
Most common single pin leave: 7-pin and 10-pin (3x each)
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 6-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 53% (7/13)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4-8 (3x).

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 155.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 173.00.

What can said about my bowling game that can't also be said about Afghanastan?

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0535/6917/products/failuredemotivator.jpeg?v=1403275992

http://tagmag.info/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/limitations.jpg

http://www.blackframefame.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/920.jpg

I spend 3 days practicing two weeks ago. I waste a vacation day to get to Vegas early and practice. And...well...that was $200 NOT well spent. And I come away this time with one less bowling ball because I gave away the Jab to that guy I promised it to. I kinda wanted to reneg on the agreement...since the Loaded Revolver and Jab are the two balls I primarily use...especially after seeing that he bought a new ball...but when I mentioned it to him, he said the Hyroad Pearl he bought wasn't working very well for him. I figured if I didn't give it to him...I'd be battling karma for the remainder of the Monday league...so, easy come easy go.

Lesson with Mark tomorrow. Lesson with Missy on Wednesday. I thought the slump was over...not so sure now. I just couldn't get the ball to get back to the pocket. Lots of 1-2-4-8s, 1-2s, 2-4-58s, etc.. And when I tried to straighten out the line to get to the pocket...I'd go through the nose and leave a 4-6-7 split.

And it was a mental disaster as well. The opponents were loud and obnoxious...and they'd hit the pocket light...go through the nose....strike Brooklyn...and seemed to find a way to get the pins to fall. I'd hit the pocket and leave a 10-pin or 9-pin or 7-pin. Add to that the Gold Coast having a MAJOR problem with Lane 15...it broke down 3 times...and that took up nearly an hour. Then we got moved to a new pair...had to re-figure that out.

And like last year...the people throwing straight balls...with tons of handicap...and horrible form/technique...they did pretty good. The truly elite bowlers... they did good too. But the guys like me that have 190-210 averages...inflated by an easy house shot at the AMF center...we got smoked.

Aslan

03-09-2016, 02:31 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

536 Series: 157-200-179

Game 1 I started out with the Dark Encounter but I just couldn't carry. Switched to the Loaded Revolver in frame 7 after two straight flat 10s. But it took me the rest of the game to try and adjust...had a 4-6 split in the 9th...not a great game.

Game 2 I managed to string a few strikes together early on...but only salvaged the 200 because of decent spare shooting. 7 /, 7 2, 7 /, 7 / isn't necessarily indicative of finding the pocket. But only one open frame...I always struggle with the 6-9-10.

Game 3 the spare shooting was awful. A missed 7-pin in the 6th, missed 6-10 in the 8th, then a missed 10-pin in the 9th.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.70 pins
Strikes: 39% (2 turkeys and 7 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 7-pin (4x)
Also left a single 5-pin (1x) and single 10-pin (3x).

Multiple Pin spares: 63% (7/11)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 and 6-9-10 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 178.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 189.67.

I really hate having lessons at easy houses...and it looks like I'm doing well...then I can't perform on Mondays in a normal house. During my lesson with Mark...I was striking so much it was almost boring. Last night...I made some good shots...spare shooting was "okay" at best...and I'm back to being a 170s bowler. :(

Now, I could just say "screw it"....I mean, this is just for fun right? But...the team is a complete MESS. The new guy and young girl are former friends/couple...and they hate each other. So he spent the whole time ignoring her...and she didn't like that very much. By the end of Game 1, some girl showed up and there was some drama between the girl and the girl on our team. So...that other girl left...figured that was the end of it...but then before Game 3...the girl on our team went out to smoke and claimed this other girl threatened her. Then our teammate started crying and sobbing and claiming that girl had drugged her and raped her and she was afraid for her life.

I literally couldn't make this up. Meanwhile, the guy on the team was drinking shots like a maniac...trying to cope with his broken heart caused by the girl teammate...so between the two of them over 3 games, they probably bowled less than a 500. My 200 helped us squeak out one point at least.

So, the girl got escorted out to her car by a security guard...but later that night returned to the bowling alley bar. She said she only had $7 so the other woman on the team paid her bowling fees...but I guess guys were buying her drinks...I guess she wasn't as terrified as she let on given she returned to the alley to hang out in the bar. I gave the young kid a ride to a nearby bar where he was meeting some friends. I came home and watched "Better Call Saul" and went to sleep. I may be a c&*ppy bowler...but at least my life is generally drama free...I can be thankful for that. 6 more weeks of this hell(o)....then I can take some time off...away from crazy people...let by elbow heal up...I think I have tendonitis and/or a ligament strain...too much trying to "help" the ball using my fingers...which are not meant nor designed to propel a 15lb object.

Oh well...I got another lesson tomorrow...not sure why....but, what the heck.

Amyers

03-09-2016, 01:32 PM

Aslan

03-13-2016, 03:02 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

489 Series: 169-145-175

Only a few opens in Game 1...but only a few strikes...so I guess it evened out.

Game 2 I struck even less...and missed a couple 10-pins by a hair.

Game 3 I only had a few opens...struck a bit more...but one open was in the 10th...so there goes that game.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.25 pins
Strikes: 28% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 2 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (2x)
Also left the 2-pin, 4-pin, 5-pin, and 7-pin (1x each).

Multiple Pin spares: 46% (7/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-7 and 4-7-10 splits (2x each)

Splits: 33% (2/6).

Average over 3 games: 163.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 169.67.

Just wasn't making great shots. And this house isn't very forgiving....unless you're an old man with poor form that hits brooklyn 2/3 of the time....then for some reason it's rather forgiving. :mad: Game 1 my thumb insert was probably a little too tight. That should help the ball hook more...but I think it was messing with me mentally and causing my release to be funky. Game 3 I was very "inside"...which is not my strength...but it was good practice.

And I can't complain too much. I bowled horribly but won $13...so the whole thing only cost me $17. And $10 of that was strike ball and 50/50...which I normally don't do...but figured I'd try my luck.

Aslan

03-14-2016, 11:59 PM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

591 Series: 197-202-192

Game 1 was okay...a 4-6-10 split in the 7th frame away from a clean game.

Game 2 I switched to the Loaded Revolver...but couldn't quite carry...great spare shooting though. Only open was a 4-7-10 split in the 1st frame.

Game 3 I felt great and was striking like mad...but a big 4 split in the 5th frame...then my first missed single-pin in the 8th...and opened on a 2-8 sleeper in the 10th.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.09 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 4-bagger, 1 turkey, 3 doubles, and 3 singles)
Spares: 62% picked up

Single Pin spares: 87% (7/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 10-pin (6x)
Also left a single 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 37% (3/8)
Most common multi-pin leave: 6-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/4)

Average over 3 games: 197.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 200.67.

Things kinda came together in Game 3. Balance, form, release....everything was clicking. Then I lost the line...couldn't quite get it back. Spare shooting seemed automatic...but once I missed one...then I kinda knew the 10th wasn't gonna be great.

Still a tough house though. The shot is further inside than I like to play...between 11-15 at the arrows...a little miss room on the outside...but not much...and virtually no miss room inside.

Best series in this league this season...so I'm not gonna get too upset. It's progress. Combining the two things I've been working on with the coaches seems to be working.

Amyers

03-15-2016, 12:05 AM

Congrats man i know you have struggled there. Pretty nice series for a guy who was threatening to quit.

Timmyb

03-15-2016, 06:34 AM

Nice bowling!

Aslan

03-15-2016, 03:14 PM

Nice bowling!

Congrats man i know you have struggled there. Pretty nice series for a guy who was threatening to quit.

Thanks all.

Yeah, I thought it was "just me", but my coach is a pro and she says she likes bowling there because it's a challenge. She wants me to keep bowling there and even work on my outside and inside lines...away from the track...to expand my ability a bit. Personally I don't think I've quite mastered the track yet.... :confused: ...but...I'll add it to my training/practice routine.

The main, physical, things I'm working on are:

1) Improving my launch angle.
2) Staying low at the line.
3) Improving my spine tilt.

Spine tilt and low at the line....kinda go together. I have trouble with my release when I raise up at the line. It moves my hand position towards the top of the ball versus under the ball....and I can't get anything on the shot. By staying low....it forces my hand into the proper position (under the ball). But, when you're 41.5 years old....with a "questionable" knee and are nearly 6 feet tall...trying to get as low as Mike Fagan can be difficult.

Once I started getting lower...it's a matter of launch angle. Sometimes I get low...but with no spine tilt...throwing at the dots...I end up throwing the ball DOWN instead of OUT....which puts my hand on top versus beneath the ball again. Spine tilt helps me get the ball OUT...

...and that leads to launch angle...which is the most important of the three. Even if I stay straight and tall...I can still make good shots lofting the ball...because my launch angle is good. It's not ideal to loft the ball 15ft...but it works. On the flipside...I can get so low my slide leg knee is dragging on the floor...but if my launch angle is sending the ball DOWN instead of OUT...I'll end up with nothing/less on the shot.

So, those are the big three things...trying to take shorter first steps (so I don't run out of room at the foul line...which forces me to rise up so I don't foul)...

...getting in a good, balanced finish position where my slide foot stays on the floor and I have a little forward spine tilt...

...and then launching the ball OUT (not DOWN, not UP)...letting it come off my fingers...with as little effort/force as I can.

I don't move as much (laterally) as I used to. And I don't have the 5-ball arsenal anymore...so I don't change balls as much.

Now...the MENTAL side...that's still a huge work in progress. I MUST find a way to miss a make-able spare...and not have that lead to disaster. As long as I'm drilling corner pins and 6-10s and 4-7s....I seem unstoppable. Then I miss ONE 10-pin in the 8th frame...and then my only other non-split open was the next frame on that lane...I almost KNEW it was coming...my mind had conceded that I could no longer bowl. Once I miss or chop a non-split...it's like a snowball rolling down a snowhill....gets worse and worse. I have to learn to accept imperfection...and not let it cripple me.

Aslan

03-20-2016, 03:24 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

524 Series: 176-215 (clean)-133

Only two opens...but one was a split...so I guess it isn't the end of the World.

Game 2 I finally shot my first clean game since I don't remember when.

Game 3 I was clean on the left lane...opened every time on the right lane. :( Good Times.

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r260/AnimeBoyCrazy_2006/-funny-/Frustration.jpg

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.53 pins
Strikes: 37% (1 turkey, 1 double, and 7 singles)
Spares: 65% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (6/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin, 6-pin, and 10-pin (2x each)
Also left the 5-pin and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 58% (7/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/1).

Average over 3 games: 174.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 180.33.

Once my feet got left of 25 and my target left of 15...I just can't make that shot. My coach wants me to practice the inside line more...work on things outside my comfort zone. Granted, I'm not 100% confident about my ability to play INSIDE my comfort zone...but whatever. The good news is, got my first clean game in quite awhile and as long as I stayed between 18-25 with my feet and 12-15 with my target...I was actually playing well...and thats not really my "comfort zone"...but I just didn't have a shot up the track.

Tried the Dark Encounter to start...but with two decent shots resulting in a flat 10-pin and weak 5-pin...I just think the low RG and solid cover of that ball..even hand polished....I just can't seem to get it to conserve any energy...finds the pocket...but doesn't carry. I sure hope when I switch arsenals and start using the Defiant Edge...that I don't have the same problem with the low RG. Otherwise...I'm gonna go from only being able to throw the Loaded Revolver to only being able to throw the Track300A...and that is NOT an upgrade.

Amyers

03-21-2016, 09:52 AM

I think you have the opposite problem than what you think with the Dark Encounter. You don't have enough surface underneath the polish on that ball. if you just hand applied the polish on that ball the OOB surface on the Dark Encounter was 2000 grit and I'm sure you had not had the ball resurface recently before you applied the polish so the actual surface of the ball was probably around 4k to 4500. Take it to your proshop have them take the ball to 1k or 500 and apply polish over it. There is a reason why the OOB finish on pretty much every ball on the market with polished finishes is 500-1500 before polish. I know your getting ready to switch arsenals but $25 is very little to pay to learn a lesson.

Aslan

03-21-2016, 02:50 PM

Amyers

03-21-2016, 03:09 PM

I brought the Dark Encounter to 1000 by hand before polishing it by hand.

Bringing a ball down to 500 is foolish. It may get back to the pocket better, but will have no energy left and there will be no carry....not on a THS. I'm just really disappointed in Columbia300. The Encounter was the worst ball I've ever thrown. And the Dark Encounter is almost as bad. The cover material just isn't strong...it's sad when a Brunswick solid with a 2000 surface and an RG of 2.574...hooks Brooklyn. Yet a Columbia with a surface of 1000-1500 with a 2.50 RG...can't make it back to the pocket. RG should MEAN something....2.574 is a BIG difference from 2.50.

And maybe the DE is hooking sooner....maybe that's the problem...like the Asylum...it's hooking so soon...it's just dead 3/4 of the way down the lane. But that worries me...with my speed and rev rate...that I have to use a high RG pearl....in order to have even a tiny bit of energy conservation on a THS. And it angers me...that I have to mess with the DE with sandpaper and a ball spinner....just to get it to go long and snap.

I think given my speed/style/rev rate and experience with my first two arsenals...I really need to put my next arsenal together with 3 polished pearls...2.51, 2.53, and 2.56 RGs. I don't see how I can realistically throw a 2.48-2.50 RG ball...unless I put more speed on my shot...which messes with my form. I'm tempted to just throw one ball...work on my physical game...making small physical changes rather than get in too deep with arsenals and surface changes. Having tried that in the past...I end up doing too much second guessing and it just kills my game.

Their is no way that ball is burning up even at 500 grit plus polish the overall surface of the ball is going to be 4500 to 5500 I can't burn that up at my speed unless I throw the ball in the dry then anything will burn up including plastic. As to the Colombia cover stock strength I really have no idea but I can't figure out why Hammer can have fine aggressive covers and Colombia can't since both are EBI companies but I've never owned one and really the only higher end Colombia ball's I've seen anyone throw is the Mad Antics and the Meltdown both of which looked ok but nothing special to me.

Hitting the ball by hand is not the same thing as putting it on a spinner

RG has nothing to do with the amount a ball hook only somewhat to where it will hook on the lane.

Having three polished pearls with Rg's of 2.51, 2.53, and 2.56 sounds like a way to build an arsenal of the three balls that do the same thing and have no ability to handle any oil. you can do it on a THS maybe unless you run into the THS's I've been seeing here lately that have oil outside of 8 then your dead meat.

Mike White

03-21-2016, 04:46 PM

Their is no way that ball is burning up even at 500 grit plus polish the overall surface of the ball is going to be 4500 to 5500 I can't burn that up at my speed unless I throw the ball in the dry then anything will burn up including plastic. As to the Colombia cover stock strength I really have no idea but I can't figure out why Hammer can have fine aggressive covers and Colombia can't since both are EBI companies but I've never owned one and really the only higher end Colombia ball's I've seen anyone throw is the Mad Antics and the Meltdown both of which looked ok but nothing special to me.

Hitting the ball by hand is not the same thing as putting it on a spinner

RG has nothing to do with the amount a ball hook only somewhat to where it will hook on the lane.

Having three polished pearls with Rg's of 2.51, 5.53, and 2.56 sounds like a way to build an arsenal of the three balls that do the same thing and have no ability to handle any oil. you can do it on a THS maybe unless you run into the THS's I've been seeing here lately that have oil outside of 8 then your dead meat.

RG effects when the ball stops hooking, not when it starts.

NewToBowling

03-21-2016, 05:09 PM

I prefer hooking never stops **zing**

Mike White

03-21-2016, 07:04 PM

I prefer hooking never stops **zing**

There comes a time where she either has to retire, or develop clientele from the blind community.

Mike White

03-21-2016, 07:07 PM

Having three polished pearls with Rg's of 2.51, 5.53, and 2.56

You have a ball with a 5.53 RG?

Oh no, time for another recall.

Aslan

03-21-2016, 07:28 PM

You have a ball with a 5.53 RG?

Oh no, time for another recall.

So what. So he has a ball with over the double the standard RG and Amyers just won his first PBA major title....it's not like he wasn't going to do that anyway. Rg is just something RotoGrip made up to sublimily try to sell their products.

Blacksox1

03-21-2016, 07:50 PM

I'm tempted to just throw one ball...work on my physical game...making small physical changes rather than get in too deep with arsenals and surface changes. Having tried that in the past...I end up doing too much second guessing and it just kills my game. Aslan quote, that I thought, I would never read ! I agree with this message, and approve of its use.

Amyers

03-21-2016, 08:47 PM

You have a ball with a 5.53 RG?

Oh no, time for another recall.

Thank you for being kind enough to serve as the spelling and grammar police for this site so we can ignore bowlers problems and not actually consider relevant advice on this forum.

Mike White

03-21-2016, 09:35 PM

Mike White

03-21-2016, 09:37 PM

Thank you for being kind enough to serve as the spelling and grammar police for this site so we can ignore bowlers problems and not actually consider relevant advice on this forum.

Relevant advise in the Aslan's Scores thread... Shirley U. Jest.

Timmyb

03-21-2016, 10:05 PM

Thank you for being kind enough to serve as the spelling and grammar police for this site so we can ignore bowlers problems and not actually consider relevant advice on this forum.

Taking this a little too seriously, I think.

Amyers

03-21-2016, 11:01 PM

Taking this a little too seriously, I think.

Not really I'm still waiting for the first relevant post he's come up with since he's been back. It's fine to take pot shots at what I posted if you've got the magical solution for Aslan then post it instead of taking shots at mine.

Mike White

03-21-2016, 11:44 PM

Not really I'm still waiting for the first relevant post he's come up with since he's been back. It's fine to take pot shots at what I posted if you've got the magical solution for Aslan then post it instead of taking shots at mine.

You posted the following:

RG has nothing to do with the amount a ball hook only somewhat to where it will hook on the lane.

To which I responded with:

RG effects when the ball stops hooking, not when it starts.

Was that taking a pot shot, or being non-relavent?

If you don't understand how the different RG values effect the ball, how can you intelligently decide which to use?

As for the 5.53 RG comment, that was humor, and if you can't laugh at your own (insignificant) mistakes, you're wrapped too tight.

Amyers

03-22-2016, 12:01 AM

You posted the following:

To which I responded with:

Was that taking a pot shot, or being non-relavent?

If you don't understand how the different RG values effect the ball, how can you intelligently decide which to use?

As for the 5.53 RG comment, that was humor, and if you can't laugh at your own (insignificant) mistakes, you're wrapped too tight.

The comment on the Rg was in response to Aslan believing that RG controls the amount of hook and the purpose of my response was to illustrate that Rg effects where the ball will hook on the lane to some extent along with the surface and strength of the cover stock which is correct to the best of my belief. two balls with the same cover and surface the ball with the higher Rg will go longer before hooking.

You are correct that Rg also effects how long the ball can hook but that isn't the only effect.

Timmyb

03-22-2016, 12:42 AM

Not really I'm still waiting for the first relevant post he's come up with since he's been back. It's fine to take pot shots at what I posted if you've got the magical solution for Aslan then post it instead of taking shots at mine.

Okay, I'm still a newbie on here, but I'll be daring and post a little advice. This place is loaded with irrelevant postings. If you feel that one of them is, just don't reply to them. Easy!

Amyers

03-22-2016, 12:49 AM

Okay, I'm still a newbie on here, but I'll be daring and post a little advice. This place is loaded with irrelevant postings. If you feel that one of them is, just don't reply to them. Easy!

I don't mind irrelevancy in itself but if we cut what was intended to be helpful into a series of grammatical corrections and arguments about definitions that really don't concern the original post to where the original message is lost who does that help but maybe I failed to find the humor in it and over reacted after taking a few posts in aggregate if so apologies.

Aslan

03-22-2016, 12:59 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

617 Series: 217 (clean)-191-209

Sanded the Dark Encounter down to 1000 abralon and hand polished it...just to show Amyers I at least "sort of" listen to him. Granted I didn't bring it to the pro shop to put it on the ball spinner...but I just can't bring my self to pay $25 to do something so basic to a ball I paid $75 for. But I DO plan on investing in my own ball spinner....gonna start looking on Ebay.

Game 1 felt great...the Dark Encounter was hitting very well...just had trouble carrying the 7-pin from time to time...but I resisted the urge to make a ball change.

Game 2 I started off with a flat 10-pin...and missed it...so I needed to do my best to not lose my mental focus...a missed single-pin in the first frame has a tendency to really kill me...but I kept things clean except for a 4-10 split in the 9th frame. Switched to the Loaded Revolver after the first couple frames...probably should have switched earlier...but I'm trying not to switch too early.

Game 3 I felt good...had to make a small adjustment in the 10th with my hand position and target...and it worked well and I salvaged the 209...only open was a 4-7-9 split in the 6th frame.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.26 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 turkey, 5 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 78% picked up

Single Pin spares: 88% (8/9)
Most common single-pin leaves: 7-pin (3x)
Also left a single 2-pin, 6-pin, 9-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 60% (3/5)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 205.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 209.33.

I think most of my struggles at this house were not only that it's a tougher shot than at the AMF house...and transitions faster due to the age of the lanes...but the pattern really seems more narrow. I can't play the 7-11 track at this house...and I can't use my speed up the outside. I have to play 12-15...not my comfort zone...not as much miss room as the AMF house...but there IS a shot there...I just have to execute better and more consistently.

Took 3 out of 4 points from one of the top teams in the league. Still had to deal with drama between the two youngsters on the team...8 more weeks...8 more weeks. :( :rolleyes:

Thanks everyone for your help...it's been a rough ride in the new house...but I'm still hanging in there.

Mike White

03-22-2016, 01:09 AM

The comment on the Rg was in response to Aslan believing that RG controls the amount of hook and the purpose of my response was to illustrate that Rg effects where the ball will hook on the lane to some extent along with the surface and strength of the cover stock which is correct to the best of my belief. two balls with the same cover and surface the ball with the higher Rg will go longer before hooking.

You are correct that Rg also effects how long the ball can hook but that isn't the only effect.

RG effect how much force (torque) on the surface of the ball is required to accelerate the balls rev rate.

Cover stock, surface prep, rev rate off the hand, and depth of oil effect effect when the ball starts hooking.

Before the ball senses friction (oil gets thin enough for the cover stock to come in contact with the lane) there isn't any torque on the surface of the ball, therefore RG is irrelevant.

Since the cover stock isn't changing, and the surface prep isn't changing, what ultimately determines where the ball begins to hook is the depth of the oil between the ball and the lane.

If you use a polished ball, hooking begins when the oil is thinner, roughing up the surface it begins while the oil is thicker.

As soon as the ball senses friction, the torque begins, and the ball begins to hook.

Most of this early hook is what you think of as the ball reading the mid lane.

Before the end of the pattern (on a THS) the ball (thrown from left to right) will hook shortly after exiting the side of the oil pattern.

But it can only hook until it's back snug up against the oil

To hook further left, it would need to climb up the wall of oil, but in climbing up towards the top the oil, it loses friction, and slides back to the right where the oil is thinner, where again it senses friction.

I can't hook left, and going right causes more friction, so it follows the edge of the oil with minimal friction.

This continues until the end of the pattern where the oil thins lengthwise.

If the ball hasn't lost axis rotation, the lack of oil to the left of the ball will allow a clear visual change of direction, which will continue until the rev rate matches the speed of the ball.

Before the end of the pattern, the torque on the bottom of the ball from friction will be rather small.

So the ball won't rev up a significant amount.

However the friction that does allow the ball to hook, also causes the ball to lose axis of rotation, and slightly rev up the ball.

The less the ball has a rev rate to start, the faster it loses axis of rotation.

This is the problem Aslan is fighting. Low rev rate, quick loss of axis of rotation, and the ball doesn't generate any hooking momentum into the pins.

As the ball gets to the end of the pattern, the oil thins, and friction increases.

This makes the hook more visible, the loss of axis more visible, and the increase in revs more visible.

Those changes will continue until the rev rate matches the speed of the ball.

At that point, all of the forces are in line, all axis of rotation that is going to be lost is lost, there is no more torque on the bottom of the ball to increase rev rate because the surface of the ball is rolling on the lane.

Remember RG effects how much force is required to accelerate the rev rate.

The lower the RG, the ball will rev up faster with the same torque (friction from the lane), and therefore match the speed of the ball earlier, and the ball will quit hooking earlier.

Increase the RG, and it revs up slower (needs more torque to accelerate the rev rate), match speed later, and quit hooking later.

You can also keep the RG the same, and instead increase the roughness of the surface.

This will cause the ball to begin hooking earlier (rougher senses friction in thicker oil), it will rev up earlier due to more torque from friction, and quit hooking earlier.

Polishing the ball delays the hook, reduces the torque, and makes the hook end later.

The problem with too much polish is the ball doesn't read the mid lane as well, so it won't snug up against the oil line as easily.

That means to hit the same spot down lane, you need to be more accurate.

Also, the less friction doesn't cause the ball to lose axis of rotation as quick, so when the ball reaches the end of the pattern, there is plenty of side roll still in the ball for it to hook more drastically.

You know this as skid / snap.

If you don't put in any revs to begin with, you get skid / die / roll.

So when you go into the pro shop and ask for a ball that skids then snaps, the proper response from the pro shop is, I can give you the skid, but the snap you have to bring yourself.

Amyers

03-22-2016, 09:44 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

617 Series: 217 (clean)-191-209

Sanded the Dark Encounter down to 1000 abralon and hand polished it...just to show Amyers I at least "sort of" listen to him. Granted I didn't bring it to the pro shop to put it on the ball spinner...but I just can't bring my self to pay $25 to do something so basic to a ball I paid $75 for. But I DO plan on investing in my own ball spinner....gonna start looking on Ebay.

Game 1 felt great...the Dark Encounter was hitting very well...just had trouble carrying the 7-pin from time to time...but I resisted the urge to make a ball change.

Game 2 I started off with a flat 10-pin...and missed it...so I needed to do my best to not lose my mental focus...a missed single-pin in the first frame has a tendency to really kill me...but I kept things clean except for a 4-10 split in the 9th frame. Switched to the Loaded Revolver after the first couple frames...probably should have switched earlier...but I'm trying not to switch too early.

Game 3 I felt good...had to make a small adjustment in the 10th with my hand position and target...and it worked well and I salvaged the 209...only open was a 4-7-9 split in the 6th frame.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.26 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 turkey, 5 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 78% picked up

Single Pin spares: 88% (8/9)
Most common single-pin leaves: 7-pin (3x)
Also left a single 2-pin, 6-pin, 9-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 60% (3/5)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 205.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 209.33.

I think most of my struggles at this house were not only that it's a tougher shot than at the AMF house...and transitions faster due to the age of the lanes...but the pattern really seems more narrow. I can't play the 7-11 track at this house...and I can't use my speed up the outside. I have to play 12-15...not my comfort zone...not as much miss room as the AMF house...but there IS a shot there...I just have to execute better and more consistently.

Took 3 out of 4 points from one of the top teams in the league. Still had to deal with drama between the two youngsters on the team...8 more weeks...8 more weeks. :( :roll eyes:

Thanks everyone for your help...it's been a rough ride in the new house...but I'm still hanging in there.

Congrats on a nice series Aslan.

Aslan

03-22-2016, 02:13 PM

Congrats on a nice series Aslan.

Thanks.

And I have to say...Mike's post below is a pretty good and straight forward look at exactly what the ball does in relation to the oil patterns.

And that's why I'm worried about my next arsenal...

If I go with:
Defiant Edge (2.49 RG, Pearl, 1500 Polished)
900Global Bullet Train (2.553 RG, Hybrid, 2500 Polished)
Track 300A (2.57 RG, Pearl, 4000 Polished)

The Defiant Edge is going to rev up early...but it's surface will counter that and delay the hook phase. So one thing is trying to go early...the other late.

The Bullet Train has a very aggressive cover....and I'd have to really surface and polish it (not by hand) to delay the hook...which the higher RG will match up with.

The Track300A is virtually a plastic ball...a low-level, basic cover, a high RG...so it'll give me a great deal of length and the ability to play drier or beat up patterns...or shorter patterns...but I don't see it having much "snap" with my current speed/release.

And my concerns are that one of the two things below happens:

A) The Bullet Train cover is too strong...even surfaced and polished...so it essentially is like my Lethal Revolver...where I can't use it anywhere near the track...it'll either hook too much or have no energy left at the pocket. I end up using the Defiant Edge as my starting ball...but despite the weaker cover and polished surface...the RG revs up too soon...and again...no energy left at the pocket.....similar to the problems I have with the Melee Jab and Dark Encounter. Then I end up just using the 300A...which is a very weak ball...so I'm essentially downgrading from the Loaded Revolver to the 300A.

or

B) I start with the Defiant Edge...but, like the Dark Encounter and Jab...a THS just isn't long/wide enough...so it wants to hook too early...and reacts too drastically when it's out in the dry. So I end up using the Bullet Train...which I have to keep getting polished every 1-3 weeks....because otherwise it'll hook even sooner than the Defiant Edge. And, as above, I end up using primarily the 300A....and same as above...I'm just downgrading from the Loaded Revolver to the 300A.

Now, to look for a "positive silver lining" scenario...:

There IS a possibility...that I could start with the Bullet Train, ball down to the 300A, then use the Defiant Edge the way I used the Jab (before giving it away)...relying on there to be enough "carry-down" by Game 3 that the Defiant Edge won't over-react too soon. This scenario actually might work well....but it relies on the controversial theory of "carry-down"....which is realistically only there...if I'm on a team and/or bowling against right-handers that throw plastic or urethane at/towards the break point. If everyone is throwing resin...and soaking up the oil (versus pushing it down lane)....this theory falls apart.

:confused:

Amyers

03-22-2016, 03:00 PM

The Bullet Train is already drilled have you tried it out recently since you've lowered your speed? Rather then fret yourself to death and polish every ball you own it may be time to commit to moving in a bit. Not saying to start hooking the lane but start learning to play 12-14 instead of 10-12. If your going to throw the ball like a tweener your going to have to learn to stand where tweeners throw from and quit trying to make the balls allow you to play the track.

Aslan

03-22-2016, 03:16 PM

The Bullet Train is already drilled have you tried it out recently since you've lowered your speed?
No. I tried on Sunday...but I took it with me to the center at like 6PM and they said they wouldn't have an open lane until like 9:30PM so I went home. But I might try again tonight...just throw a couple games with it and see what it does. It's 16lbs versus my current 15lb arsenal...so I don't like intermingling the two on league night.

Rather then fret yourself to death and polish every ball you own it may be time to commit to moving in a bit. Not saying to start hooking the lane but start learning to play 12-14 instead of 10-12. If your going to throw the ball like a tweener your going to have to learn to stand where tweeners throw from and quit trying to make the balls allow you to play the track.

That's a valid point. My coach echoes that point. It's now part of my practice regiment to try and play one game inside for that very reason.

But moving inside is a double-edged sword. Most Pba bowlers have a "limit" to the angle they can play. That's why you still see the majority of them targeting 1-19. For me to get "too far" inside...I'll need to upgrade from stroker-tweener to cranker-thumbless.

Right now, my "limit" is about 15 (target) and 24 (feet). I can move further inside...but I'd need to drastically improve my rev rate and/or drastically lower my speed.

I figure an elite bowler needs 3 speeds, 3 lines, and 3 hand positions. I have 1.5 hand positions, 1.5 lines, and 1.5 speeds. So, I still need a LOT of work to really open up the lanes and be successful. And I say "and a half" because the hand positions aren't consistent, my ability to play the outside line...1-3 boards is still hit or miss...and while I can go from a 14-17mph speed to a 15-21mph speed...my form/timing/balance suffers at the higher speed.

Amyers

03-22-2016, 03:54 PM

No. I tried on Sunday...but I took it with me to the center at like 6PM and they said they wouldn't have an open lane until like 9:30PM so I went home. But I might try again tonight...just throw a couple games with it and see what it does. It's 16lbs versus my current 15lb arsenal...so I don't like intermingling the two on league night.

That's a valid point. My coach echoes that point. It's now part of my practice regiment to try and play one game inside for that very reason.

But moving inside is a double-edged sword. Most Pba bowlers have a "limit" to the angle they can play. That's why you still see the majority of them targeting 1-19. For me to get "too far" inside...I'll need to upgrade from stroker-tweener to cranker-thumbless.

Right now, my "limit" is about 15 (target) and 24 (feet). I can move further inside...but I'd need to drastically improve my rev rate and/or drastically lower my speed.

I figure an elite bowler needs 3 speeds, 3 lines, and 3 hand positions. I have 1.5 hand positions, 1.5 lines, and 1.5 speeds. So, I still need a LOT of work to really open up the lanes and be successful. And I say "and a half" because the hand positions aren't consistent, my ability to play the outside line...1-3 boards is still hit or miss...and while I can go from a 14-17mph speed to a 15-21mph speed...my form/timing/balance suffers at the higher speed.

As you get more comfortable with that inside line you will have begin to have more success with it. I rarely move right of 16-17 but can go to 20 but I'm not real comfortable there. I try to keep it between 10-15 most nights. Unless you have guys throwing sandpaper you really shouldn't have burning up issues with any of your balls on a freshly oiled THS if you can throw the ball over 15 comfortably.

Aslan

03-24-2016, 01:21 PM

I wish I was a morning person.

I wanted to practice yesterday morning and this morning...just can't seem to get myself out of bed.

I have tomorrow off...definitely will be practicing. I really want to bust out the ole Bullet Train and see what it looks like. I'm sure my doctor would be unhappy about me going back to 16lb equipment...but I have too many 16lb balls undrilled...I need to start using some of them...if it hurts my game...then I'll go back to 15lbs...but I think the difference for me is marginal.

Aslan

03-24-2016, 08:24 PM

Afternoon Practice:
Monday Bowling Center: Older Brunswick Synthetics

Got out of work early pre-holiday...decided to see how the Bullet Train behaves with my new lower speed.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.45 pins
Strikes: 31% (1 double and 5 singles)
Spares: 66% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin and 10-pin (2x each)
Also left a single 2-pin and 5-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 66% (6/9)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5-8 and 1-2-8 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 173.50.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 183.00.

Took most of Game 1 to figure out the line. Friggin lanes were burnt up pretty bad. Kinda messed up when your plastic ball hooks being thrown at a 10-pin. I also think these balls have a slightly different span...a little shorter....made the thumb slide out more.

Aslan

03-25-2016, 04:11 PM

AM Practice:
Monday Bowling Center: Older Brunswick Synthetics

Off for Good Friday; figured I'd throw the rock around a bit.

499 Series: 179-168-152

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.47 pins
Strikes: 26% (1 turkey, 1 double, and 4 singles)
Spares: 62% picked up

Single Pin spares: 72% (8/11)
Most common single-pin leave: 3-pin and 9-pin (3x each)
Never left a single 5-pin, 6-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 53% (7/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2, 4-7, and 6-10 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 166.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 177.00.

It's just really frustrating that in order to practice on league conditions; I have to practice during league play or enter a tournament or something...any other time it's just burnt up nonsense. I don't have the shot nor rev rate to be standing 31-34 and targeting 12-20.

First game I just used the Dark Encounter...tried to get back in the groove with my 15lb equipment and different span. Game 2 I switched to the Loaded Revolver midway through. Midway through Game 3 I was totally out of options and tried to increase speed and use the Lethal Revolver...but switching speeds is tough...timing got all out of whack.

Aslan

03-27-2016, 03:02 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

464 Series: 154-168-142

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.52 pins
Strikes: 25% (2 doubles and 4 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 72% (8/11)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 5-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 27% (3/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/1).

Average over 3 games: 154.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 165.33.

Not sure what was going on. Seemed like maybe they didn't oil the leagues pre-tournament. But it also could be that me and the two other RH strokers were all playing on top of each other's lines. On the left lane, by the end of the night I was standing with my left toe on 32-33 targeting 20-21 at the arrows...definitely inside my comfortable line/zone.

Score doesn't show it, but I actually started settling down and throwing better shots in Game 3. Just had some thumb fit issues that caused me some intermittent problems.

Aslan

03-28-2016, 01:19 PM

Easter Holiday Practice:
Monday Bowling Center: Older Brunswick Synthetics

542 Series: 196-208 (clean)-138

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.06 pins
Strikes: 37% (1 turkey, 1 double, and 7 singles)
Spares: 65% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (9/12)
Most common single-pin leave: 3-pin (3x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 4-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (3x)

Splits: 25% (1/4)

Average over 3 games: 180.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 191.33.

I was bored. Was planning on golfing...but couldn't get a morning tee time. I should've just stayed home...I'm just so sick and tired of houses not oiling their lanes except for league play. I had to try and ignore that...just focus on improving my physical game...because there's nothing I can do about the conditions. But again...just like Saturday morning....when I'm standing left of 30...aiming around center arrow...it's kind've a joke.

NewToBowling

03-28-2016, 02:56 PM

Looks like my scores last night. 2 semi good games and one turd. Sometimes I think there is no inconceivable way I should bowl anything under 150 and I go out and prove myself wrong.

Amyers

03-28-2016, 03:04 PM

Looks like my scores last night. 2 semi good games and one turd. Sometimes I think there is no inconceivable way I should bowl anything under 150 and I go out and prove myself wrong.

It's not just you NTB

Aslan

03-28-2016, 03:52 PM

Looks like my scores last night. 2 semi good games and one turd. Sometimes I think there is no inconceivable way I should bowl anything under 150 and I go out and prove myself wrong.

Yup. I think those games are meant to remind us...we're not professionals...or even anywhere in the realm of professionals.

During my recent Motiv investigation...I watched the two major events...and I haven't watched the National Tour in some time...I watched a LOT of the women's tour and PBA50 last season. Well...I watched these guys just GUNNING the ball at 4-pins, 10-pins, 7-pins....as if it was nothing....an afterthought.

To me, that's the biggest difference of where I am NOW and where I need to be. I MUST be able to pick up 95% of my single-pin spares....or more so...95% of corner-single-pin spares. I can't honestly compete, even at the regional level....if I miss one out of every 3 or 1 out of every 4 single-pin spares.

Strike rate will come. Learning to adjust will come. Learning the ball specs/technical stuff...that'll come. But I need to KNOW....just like those pros KNOW...that when I leave one pin standing...it's almost automatic that it's a spare. It should be a RARITY if I ever miss one...probably due to sticky approaches or the ball slipping or something. And I'm nowhere near that right now. I'm getting better. 10-pins are closer to the high 60s (%) versus high 50s (%). Overall, high 60s has become high 70s. But still...there's no excuse in spare shooting.

Well...there's ONE....lanes so dry that your plastic ball hooks...stupid centers that don't oil their lanes all weekend...but still...on league night, NO excuses.

Mike White

03-28-2016, 04:12 PM

Yup. I think those games are meant to remind us...we're not professionals...or even anywhere in the realm of professionals.

During my recent Motiv investigation...I watched the two major events...and I haven't watched the National Tour in some time...I watched a LOT of the women's tour and PBA50 last season. Well...I watched these guys just GUNNING the ball at 4-pins, 10-pins, 7-pins....as if it was nothing....an afterthought.

To me, that's the biggest difference of where I am NOW and where I need to be. I MUST be able to pick up 95% of my single-pin spares....or more so...95% of corner-single-pin spares. I can't honestly compete, even at the regional level....if I miss one out of every 3 or 1 out of every 4 single-pin spares.

Strike rate will come. Learning to adjust will come. Learning the ball specs/technical stuff...that'll come. But I need to KNOW....just like those pros KNOW...that when I leave one pin standing...it's almost automatic that it's a spare. It should be a RARITY if I ever miss one...probably due to sticky approaches or the ball slipping or something. And I'm nowhere near that right now. I'm getting better. 10-pins are closer to the high 60s (%) versus high 50s (%). Overall, high 60s has become high 70s. But still...there's no excuse in spare shooting.

Well...there's ONE....lanes so dry that your plastic ball hooks...stupid centers that don't oil their lanes all weekend...but still...on league night, NO excuses.

My plastic ball always hooks if I want it to, and likewise never hooks if I don't want it to.

If I can get my plastic ball to go straight, you have ZERO excuse.

You miss a 10 pin because you miss your mark, or walk crooked, not because of the lanes.

One tell tale sign you need to work on accuracy is the rate you miss the head pin on the 1st ball.

Missing the head pin leads to harder spares, which leads to more opens, and lower scores.

Aslan

03-28-2016, 05:49 PM

You miss a 10 pin because you miss your mark, or walk crooked, not because of the lanes.

Agree and disagree.

It's like shooting a rifle with a bent barrel. Sure, you can be accurate...but ya gotta know how bent the barrel is.

My accuracy at my target I can control. Sometimes it's +/- a board...that's not bad. What the ball does after hits that target....that I can't control....until I see what it does. I remember a certain MWhite bowler in Temecula...facing the mighty Aslan and youngster ZDawg....and a hot, humid, rainy day...in February or something like that. I remember that MWhite guy...not being able to find a pocket with a flashlight and a search party...at least in Game 1. By Game 2 and 3...he adjusted....found a line...and suddenly was making a game of it. I doubt your struggles in Game 1 in Temecula were because you temporarily weren't accurate. Correct? :cool:

If I always stand in the same place...always aim at the same spot...with my plastic ball...and it always when thrown straight over that spot....hits the 10-pin. THEN, when I do that again...same spot, same ball, same starting spot....and just before it gets to the 10-pin it kinda 'moves'....that's dry lanes. If I wanted to change my hand position to shoot spares....I wouldn't need a plastic ball.

Problems hitting the pocket are different. I can't control the ball after it hits my target. Unfortunately, it's taking me FAR FAR too long to get "my line"....it takes like 15 frames on a pair...say 7 shots per lane...that's far too long.

At this new house (actually an old house)...there's an added level of difficulty because the lanes break down quickly. Saturday I ran into a lot of trouble because 3 of us were older strokers....all throwing over 10-14 boards with resin equipment. The one guy hit left of the rack almost every time and was about to just give up. The other older guy tried to adjust....tried different balls...was really struggling. I faired a 'little' better only because I was at least aware enough of the problem...that I was trying to stay ahead of them. When the one guy came to me and complained about "how dry the lanes are"; I tried to tell him that it didn't help that he, me, and the other guy were all throwing over the same spot/line...and he looked at me like I was speaking farsi....so I just smiled and nodded my head.

Aslan

03-29-2016, 12:15 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

458 Series: 152-171-135

Why does God hate me?
http://36.media.tumblr.com/7ee45d934d9a6da2de6826ca7034f74c/tumblr_njt9njfzNl1tp42tfo1_500.jpg

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.12 pins
Strikes: 12% (2 singles)
Spares: 62% picked up

Single Pin spares: 90% (9/10)
Most common single-pin leaves: 6-pin and 10-pin (3x each)
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 4-pin, nor 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 47% (8/17)
Most common multi-pin leave: 6-10 and 3-10 split (3x each)

Splits: 0% (0/6)

Average over 3 games: 152.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 156.33.

Good times.
http://i0.wp.com/listarticles.info/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Funny-Pictures-of-People-Having-a-Really-Bad-Day-17.jpg

Our league has two too many teams. That means, each week...one gets shafted and has to bowl on the other side of the house. Normally...not a big deal. But, today...they decided "heck with that OILING" thing...and only oiled half the lanes they used for the other league. So, we got to bowl on completely dry conditions...which were probably last oiled Saturday night.

I know what you're thinking..."Okay, okay...so your ball hooked too much...that doesn't mean they didn't oil the lanes." Fair...but lets look at the evidence:

USUALLY...I stand center and target about 12-13. Thats my opening shot give or take. For Game 1 tonight, I was standing about 29 and aiming roughly 16-17. By the end of Game 2, I was standing about 41-45...aiming 23-26. By the last two frames...I decided to just go back to the center/12-13 and throw my Ebonite Maxim spare ball...it struck brooklyn. I actually had to stand 23-24...and aim 13-15....with a PLASTIC ball!!

Game 2 I actually had a shot at a clean game...but I couldn't convert the 3-6 baby split with my resin ball...because it wouldn't get close to the 10-pin. I actually almost converted the 6-7 split in the 10th frame...kicked the 6-pin over gently and it nudged the 7-pin...just not enough to knock it over.

So...even though we found a player to replace the drama queen and everyone had a better time bowling...obviously I wasn't too happy. I practiced Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday....all on burnt conditions...and I accepted that. Thats to be expected. But this wasn't fair. Maybe they just made a mistake...I get that...but the other team pre-bowled....because I guess it's a common problem for whatever team has to bowl on that side. So, they got close to fresh conditions after league play...we got dried up snot. So, first time for this believe it or not...but I left my name and phone number for the manager with a note asking that the lanes be oiled pre-league. Thats just not right. If they refuse to oil pre-league, like at my old Tuesday center...at least everyone has the same disadvantage. When you oil all 20 lanes on one side...then make two teams bowl on the burnt up Easter holiday conditions...espcially when the team we bowled pre-bowled on the other half of the center...thats borderline illegal. I know it's probably not "technically illegal"...but how is that fair??

I give tonight 3.75 :( out of 5 :( faces (I can't actually give 3.75...there's a post limit of 2 and they don't come in fractions).

Second worst series in this league.

Bright side....spare shooting was above average for single-pins. And I guess given our team really has no shot...it's kinda good to get a sandbag series in there with 6-7 weeks until sweeps.

Mike White

03-29-2016, 12:25 AM

Agree and disagree.

It's like shooting a rifle with a bent barrel. Sure, you can be accurate...but ya gotta know how bent the barrel is.

My accuracy at my target I can control. Sometimes it's +/- a board...that's not bad. What the ball does after hits that target....that I can't control....until I see what it does. I remember a certain MWhite bowler in Temecula...facing the mighty Aslan and youngster ZDawg....and a hot, humid, rainy day...in February or something like that. I remember that MWhite guy...not being able to find a pocket with a flashlight and a search party...at least in Game 1. By Game 2 and 3...he adjusted....found a line...and suddenly was making a game of it. I doubt your struggles in Game 1 in Temecula were because you temporarily weren't accurate. Correct? :cool:

Is your memory that short.

We were bowling on lanes that had been oiled backwards, inside out, however you want to call it.

The further to had the ball to the right, the less it hooked, and closer to the middle the more it hooked.

So yes, it took a bit of time to find an angle to the pocket that had a chance of carrying, yet didn't get far enough right to skid thru the back ends.

If you watch the video, I identified the problem after the 3rd frame, but I guess I was in denial until I hooked past a 5 pin in the 6th.

I scored better than you did on those miserable lanes, but you out handicapped me because you averaged worse than I did on normal league conditions.

If I always stand in the same place...always aim at the same spot...with my plastic ball...and it always when thrown straight over that spot....hits the 10-pin. THEN, when I do that again...same spot, same ball, same starting spot....and just before it gets to the 10-pin it kinda 'moves'....that's dry lanes. If I wanted to change my hand position to shoot spares....I wouldn't need a plastic ball.

When in your entire life have you hit the same spot twice in the same day? Within 5 boards isn't the same spot.

IProblems hitting the pocket are different. I can't control the ball after it hits my target. Unfortunately, it's taking me FAR FAR too long to get "my line"....it takes like 15 frames on a pair...say 7 shots per lane...that's far too long.

I have a flashlight and a search party you can borrow to find your line, since I'm not using it.

At this new house (actually an old house)...there's an added level of difficulty because the lanes break down quickly. Saturday I ran into a lot of trouble because 3 of us were older strokers....all throwing over 10-14 boards with resin equipment. The one guy hit left of the rack almost every time and was about to just give up. The other older guy tried to adjust....tried different balls...was really struggling. I faired a 'little' better only because I was at least aware enough of the problem...that I was trying to stay ahead of them. When the one guy came to me and complained about "how dry the lanes are"; I tried to tell him that it didn't help that he, me, and the other guy were all throwing over the same spot/line...and he looked at me like I was speaking farsi....so I just smiled and nodded my head.

Mike White

03-29-2016, 01:30 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

458 Series: 152-171-135

Aww Boo Hoo, they may not have oiled, so you shoot 458.

I subbed tonight in a make up session. We get there at 4 pm when the place opens, and I ask the mechanic if he was about to oil the lanes.

He said not until 5 pm, and then only for those lanes the league will be on.

So we get stuck on 5 & 6.

Leagues usually use the high end of the house, and work down based on their size, so 5 & 6 is rarely a league pair, except Friday night which has two leagues that together fill the house.

My normal Urethane won't stay on the right side for the first few practice balls.

I've just drilled up a brand new Mix to try out the OOB surface. (My old Mix scans between 4000 and 3000 in the track area, the new Mix scans at 5500)

The goal is the play against the oil line, and not have the ball hook brooklyn like my old Mix does.

Problem is, today there wasn't an oil line to play against.

I had a 4-6, and a 4 pin I whiffed, otherwise clean mostly spares, stinking 176.

Next I went double, greek church, double, then went into / X / X mode for a 197.

Last game was 3 bagger, 3-9-10, where I got the 3-10, then a 9 pin, then off the sheet for 255.

On Friday night, maybe Saturday morning junior oil.

This is why I would like to see low oil be considered a valid sport condition.

You can swing the ball if you've got enough hand to get the ball back, but don't expect any help is terms of hold area.

For many who try a sport condition, the ball doesn't hook until it gets back to the ball return.

And thats after spending $1000 or more on equipment.

With low oil, cheap balls will hook.

NewToBowling

03-29-2016, 09:33 AM

With low oil, cheap balls will hook.

How will ball manufacturers maximize their profits if all they release are cheap balls :)

Aslan

03-29-2016, 10:15 AM

If you watch the video, I identified the problem after the 3rd frame, but I guess I was in denial until I hooked past a 5 pin in the 6th.
MWhite = The University of Michigan. They don't "lose", they just run out of time.

On the plus side...I wish you were on the National Tour. I'd love to hear Kimberly Pressler interview you after a loss.

She's used to hearing things like, "Yeah, I ran into some trouble out there...just couldn't get my shot figured out...didn't execute well...but it was a positive experience and better luck next time." And with you she'd get;

MW: "Well, I make WAY better shots than the other guy...but he got to bowl during a time when the fans were oscillating slightly more....thus breaking down the lanes more...and you probably didn't notice it, but there was a slight earthquake tremor in Pakistan....the ripple moved across the planet...and hit Reno...just as I was about to throw the ball. Also, 925rpm rev rate...I have much less room for error than most bowlers...so much is a micro fracture in the lane integrity...can really screw with my shot drastically...and I've complained before....that this center does not use a 7.92 lb/gallon density oil...they use a 6.98 lb/gallon oil....which everyone knows...allows some players an advantage..."

KP: "Okay then...thanks..."
MWhite: "...and of course, this was a reverse block pattern..."
KP: "Okay...and we're out of time...but thank you and good luck...or whatever..."

Of course I watch that video. It's one of my favorite Youtube videos...because it shows that Aslan is a dominant bowler compared to MWhite and ZDawg...as does the 2nd annual AVZBHMSCI...where I was also dominant. So yes...I highly recommend people watch them (click on the bowl.com ID in my signature). :cool: We're gonna have to set up the 3rd Annual Billy Hardwick Memorial Aslan vs. ZDawg Southern California Invitational....it's past due. But I think ZDawg is injured or something. Probably just some elaborate sandbagging attempt... :confused:

This is why I would like to see low oil be considered a valid sport condition.
I would like to see the USBC specify that sanctioned league play be on fresh conditions.

As I told the pro shop guy at Concourse...I don't care what pattern you put down. If you wanna save money on oil...put a 15ft pattern out there. I don't care. I'll eventually figure it out as will the rest of the league. But you can't oil at 9AM and then each night you have no idea what you're getting. It's not a level playing field...and it punishes RHers FAR more than LHers. It's bad for the leagues and it's bad for the sport. If they want to put out the PBA Shark pattern or Scorpion pattern...more power to em! If they want to put out a USBC White pattern...more power to em!! But just make sure you oil every lane...30 minutes prior to league...everyone has a level playing field. I don't think that's too much to ask. How much is lane oil? $1000/gallon? Maybe I'm in the wrong business? Isn't oil supposed to PROTECT the lanes? Why would a bowling center want to save $5 on oil and risk screwing up their $10,000 lanes? Bad business...plain and simple.

Whats next? They don't want to buy more pins so you shoot at however many the pinsetter puts down? They don't want to pay their water bill so bowlers have to wear diapers? Electric bill too expensive...so everyone bowls in the dark and wears miner's helmets? For crying out loud! It's bad enough I can't practice on league conditions...now I can't even bowl league on "league conditions"? I guess I can only truly practice over holiday weekends...to get the true 'feel' for what league play is like.

Friggin bowling. I'd seriously consider quitting...but I hate golf and am too old and broken down to do anything that involves actual cardio.

NewToBowling

03-29-2016, 10:37 AM

Mike White = salty.

Not sure the relationship between you two but there is some angst there. Not sure if just playful ribbing or something more :)

Mike White

03-29-2016, 11:40 AM

MWhite = The University of Michigan. They don't "lose", they just run out of time.

On the plus side...I wish you were on the National Tour. I'd love to hear Kimberly Pressler interview you after a loss.

She's used to hearing things like, "Yeah, I ran into some trouble out there...just couldn't get my shot figured out...didn't execute well...but it was a positive experience and better luck next time." And with you she'd get;

MW: "Well, I make WAY better shots than the other guy...but he got to bowl during a time when the fans were oscillating slightly more....thus breaking down the lanes more...and you probably didn't notice it, but there was a slight earthquake tremor in Pakistan....the ripple moved across the planet...and hit Reno...just as I was about to throw the ball. Also, 925rpm rev rate...I have much less room for error than most bowlers...so much is a micro fracture in the lane integrity...can really screw with my shot drastically...and I've complained before....that this center does not use a 7.92 lb/gallon density oil...they use a 6.98 lb/gallon oil....which everyone knows...allows some players an advantage..."

KP: "Okay then...thanks..."
MWhite: "...and of course, this was a reverse block pattern..."
KP: "Okay...and we're out of time...but thank you and good luck...or whatever..."

Of course I watch that video. It's one of my favorite Youtube videos...because it shows that Aslan is a dominant bowler compared to MWhite and ZDawg...as does the 2nd annual AVZBHMSCI...where I was also dominant. So yes...I highly recommend people watch them (click on the bowl.com ID in my signature). :cool: We're gonna have to set up the 3rd Annual Billy Hardwick Memorial Aslan vs. ZDawg Southern California Invitational....it's past due. But I think ZDawg is injured or something. Probably just some elaborate sandbagging attempt... :confused:

I would like to see the USBC specify that sanctioned league play be on fresh conditions.

As I told the pro shop guy at Concourse...I don't care what pattern you put down. If you wanna save money on oil...put a 15ft pattern out there. I don't care. I'll eventually figure it out as will the rest of the league. But you can't oil at 9AM and then each night you have no idea what you're getting. It's not a level playing field...and it punishes RHers FAR more than LHers. It's bad for the leagues and it's bad for the sport. If they want to put out the PBA Shark pattern or Scorpion pattern...more power to em! If they want to put out a USBC White pattern...more power to em!! But just make sure you oil every lane...30 minutes prior to league...everyone has a level playing field. I don't think that's too much to ask. How much is lane oil? $1000/gallon? Maybe I'm in the wrong business? Isn't oil supposed to PROTECT the lanes? Why would a bowling center want to save $5 on oil and risk screwing up their $10,000 lanes? Bad business...plain and simple.

Whats next? They don't want to buy more pins so you shoot at however many the pinsetter puts down? They don't want to pay their water bill so bowlers have to wear diapers? Electric bill too expensive...so everyone bowls in the dark and wears miner's helmets? For crying out loud! It's bad enough I can't practice on league conditions...now I can't even bowl league on "league conditions"? I guess I can only truly practice over holiday weekends...to get the true 'feel' for what league play is like.

Friggin bowling. I'd seriously consider quitting...but I hate golf and am too old and broken down to do anything that involves actual cardio.

Ok two ways to skin that cat.

You want practice to be more like league, simple, make league more like practice... so you can shoot 450 and whine about it.

Back in the 80's, the oiling machine didn't remove previous oil.

That was done twice a week (graveyard shift) using a big floor buffing machine, and walking up and down the lanes with it.

The reason you are having such difficulties with oil at 9am, and bowl at 6 is because resin balls change the oil pattern so much.

Solution, Lets get rid of resin balls.

Lane oil was originally used to protect the lanes, but now so much more oil is used to provide the wall in the middle.

Get rid of the wall, proprietors would save money, but whiners will whine.

Mike White

03-29-2016, 01:37 PM

How will ball manufacturers maximize their profits if all they release are cheap balls :)

Why do you bowl?

To compete, or to donate to ball manufacturers?

NewToBowling

03-29-2016, 01:55 PM

Why do you bowl?

To compete, or to donate to ball manufacturers?

I bowl for the ladies

Mike White

03-29-2016, 01:55 PM

Mike White = salty.

Not sure the relationship between you two but there is some angst there. Not sure if just playful ribbing or something more :)

It's just the Aslan thinks his put together events represent a true test of skill.

He claims he dominated me, but the facts are I out bowled him.

His win comes from the fact that on normal conditions, I out bowl him by even more.

So I have to give him handicap based on normal conditions, but then we compete on something bizarre like reverse oil patterns, or next to a birthday party where kids spill water right near the approach.

He will comment about bowling on Wood, which was in such bad condition, it was begin torn out later that night.

Trying to get the ball the slide thru the heads was like getting a needle to slide across a record.

Every board in the heads was patched, so it was higher, or lower than the board next to it.

I tried to throw the ball dead straight like Aslan does, but all I had was urethane, and plastic, so the deflection was awful.

Also I didn't bring it up, but he violated our agreed upon rules.

We were supposed to bowl 1 game of practice, then bowl 3 games of competition.

I got there a bit early, and he was already down on the lanes practicing.

When we went to Vegas, we bowled on a more normal condition, and he got crushed.

We bowled together in a sport league, and even though I couldn't slide, he got crushed every week.

Mike White

03-29-2016, 01:57 PM

I bowl for the ladies

How's that working out for you?

I hope better than it's working out for Aslan.

Aslan

03-29-2016, 02:18 PM

I bowl for the ladies
On the one hand; I respect that. On the other...that's like getting into motorcycling for the "biker babes"...it's not the prettiest of pictures.

It's just the Aslan thinks his put together events represent a true test of skill.

....he dominated me, but the facts...I have to give him handicap....then we compete....which...I tried to throw the ball dead straight like Aslan does, but...I...was awful.

Also I didn't bring it up, but...When we went to Vegas, we bowled on a more normal condition, and....We bowled together in a sport league, and...I couldn't slide,...got crushed every week.
Read between the lines of whining and excuses.

Solution, Lets get rid of resin balls.
Where have I heard that before? Oh yeah, Mike says it every day.

Mike White = salty.

Not sure the relationship between you two but there is some angst there. Not sure if just playful ribbing or something more :)
Since we have a relationship (BOWLING) outside the bowlingboards...it's mostly just playful ribbing. I'm still trying to figure out a situation where I can actually beat him....and he won't have ANY excuses...but that's like trying to figure out how to make a functioning airplane out of elmers glue, a paperclip, and a piece of lint. Even if I bowl him scratch...he's going to have some crazy list of excuses. I beat him scratch on wood lanes...then he claims the lanes are horrible. I beat him at two neutral centers...he claimed it was because I got handicap and the patterns were some strange pattern that doesn't actually even exist in the oil machine...or that the approaches were too sticky.

He's like a less talented PDW...everything and anything can destroy his game...from a guy in a red shirt off in the distance...to a guy with a camera...to a water bottle noise. It's like taking a hypochondriac on a tour through a hospital. :p

Mikes a good guy. And yes, he's a better bowler than me. On equal conditions (sport)...over the course of an ENTIRE season...I averaged 149 and he averaged closer to 175? So, truth be told...he's THAT much better. But...I'm still 3-2 head-to-head against him. Granted, a 3rd Annual BHMAVZSCI would be quite the challenge with him averaging 199 and me bringing in the inflated 190. I'd have to insist we bowl at AMF Carter. That's where my 190 average is from...so...come on over and lets see if MWhite can keep his 450rpm urethane ball right of the head-pin there!?? :eek: The approaches are decent...so he won't fall on his *** this time (See previous BHMAVZSCI for the hilarious blooper reel...start of Game 2 or Game 3...I like to keep replaying it over and over when I'm bored...).

But we need the Z Master Flash...ZDawg is hurt...and I'd hate to make him drive all the way from San Diego to Fullerton. That's just mean. Too bad there's not another bowler in the SoCal area, from BB, that could step up and take his place....??? Don't say "Bunny"....she hates me....long story.

NewToBowling

03-29-2016, 02:28 PM

How's that working out for you?

I hope better than it's working out for Aslan.

Well I'm married. So not so good...

Mike White

03-29-2016, 07:01 PM

Well I'm married. So not so good...

Well at least something worked for you in the past.

Timmyb

03-30-2016, 12:16 AM

Sweet Jesus, if you two are friends, I'd hate to be your enemies. Pretty toxic s**t if you ask me.

NewToBowling

03-30-2016, 09:56 AM

That's just how they are. I don't think they take anything personally. Especially with Mike White. You have to have thick skin around him. I'm pretty sure he is a nice guy in real life (I hope :))

Aslan

03-30-2016, 12:56 PM

I don't think they take anything personally.

Ding Ding Ding

Believe me...having posted in forums for many years...either you have a thick skin and don't take things personally...or you avoid the internet. I've been called everything in the book...berated, teased, ridiculed, mocked, challenged, etc... And out of maybe 10,000 of those incidents...I 'maybe' reported things to a moderator...like 4 times total. And in most of those instances...it was for hypocrisy. I don't mind people acting like (insert word)....but if you dish it out, well, people in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks. So, if I get challenged...and I respond in turn...then they "tattle" and complain I'm a meaney....well, there's only a couple things I won't tolerate....and one is hypocrisy.

I have no problem sparring with Mr. White...he's a worthy adversary in many respects. But more than that, the odds of him getting offended and sending a PM to Bowl1820 saying "Aslan hurt my feelings" are equal to the odds of me picking up a 7-10 split. And for the record...thus far...I've never even come CLOSE to picking up a 7-10 split.

Mike White

03-30-2016, 09:05 PM

Ding Ding Ding

Believe me...having posted in forums for many years...either you have a thick skin and don't take things personally...or you avoid the internet. I've been called everything in the book...berated, teased, ridiculed, mocked, challenged, etc... And out of maybe 10,000 of those incidents...I 'maybe' reported things to a moderator...like 4 times total. And in most of those instances...it was for hypocrisy. I don't mind people acting like (insert word)....but if you dish it out, well, people in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks. So, if I get challenged...and I respond in turn...then they "tattle" and complain I'm a meaney....well, there's only a couple things I won't tolerate....and one is hypocrisy.

I have no problem sparring with Mr. White...he's a worthy adversary in many respects. But more than that, the odds of him getting offended and sending a PM to Bowl1820 saying "Aslan hurt my feelings" are equal to the odds of me picking up a 7-10 split. And for the record...thus far...I've never even come CLOSE to picking up a 7-10 split.

Try more like the odds of you picking up the 7-10 in every frame of a game.

Unlike some people who are "All Spoon, and No Fork"..

Translation, they can dish it out, but can't take it.

Aslan

04-03-2016, 07:38 PM

Saturday Practice: Older Brunswick Synthetics

505 Series: 145-170-190

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.42 pins
Strikes: 33% (1 double and 9 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 5-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (6/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 3-9 and 2-4-5 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 168.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 174.33.

&#^$

Mike White

04-03-2016, 07:56 PM

Saturday Bowling Center: Older Brunswick Synthetics

Single Pin spares: 77% (9/9)

&#^$

77% while 9/9 ?????

Which 2 of those 9 spares did you "not" miss?

Aslan

04-03-2016, 08:36 PM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

554 Series: 200-154-200
Game 1: Made good shots...picked up a nice 5-6-10 split in the 9th...missed a single 4-pin in the 7th to ruin the clean game.

Game 2: Just couldn't seem to carry. Made a lot of spares...but missed a 6-10 and couldn't convert the more difficult 1-2-8-10 and 7-10 split.

Game 3: Switched to the Loaded Revolver. Opened in the 1st and 2nd frame...clean the rest of the way.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.61 pins
Strikes: 33% (1 turkey, 3 doubles and 2 singles)
Spares: 70% picked up

Single Pin spares: 87% (7/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin (4x)
Also left a single 3-pin, 5-pin, 7-pin, and 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 58% (7/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 33% (1/3).

Average over 3 games: 184.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 188.33.

Made better shots this time than last week. Still frustrating that I can't score higher though. They keep wanting me in the side pot...but there's no point to it...can't take the side pot with a 200 scratch.

Aslan

04-03-2016, 08:47 PM

77% while 9/9 ?????

Fixed.

A 3-pin and a 10-pin.

Aslan

04-03-2016, 10:07 PM

Sunday Practice: Older Brunswick Synthetics

578 Series: 195 (clean)-190-193

Game 1 I couldn't really run any strikes together.

Game 2 I chopped a 3-9-10 split and missed a couple single-pins....including a 4-pin in the 10th to put a damper on the score. But thanks to some lucky brooklyns...I ran a 4-bagger together.

Game 3 I chopped a 5-pin off a 2-4-5-7 and couldn't convert a 1-3-9...but...again, with some luck, put a 4-bagger together to salvage the 193.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.59 pins
Strikes: 37% (2 4-baggers and 4 singles)
Spares: 70% picked up

Single Pin spares: 57% (4/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin and 7-pin (2x each)
Also left a single 2-pin, 4-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 76% (10/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 50% (1/2)

Average over 3 games: 192.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 200.00.

I'll take it. A consistent round of practice...despite some sub-par spare shooting and reliance on some lucky breaks. I don't think I have the right ball for the line I'm forced to play on these lanes when the oil pattern isn't fresh. Standing 27 and targeting 16-17...hooked through the nose. Standing 29 and targeting 17-18...doesn't make it back to the pocket. I tried some slight hand position variations...vertical targeting changes...but it's gonna take a LOT more practice to do those kinds of things consistently and in a repeatable fashion.

I'm anxious to see how the Defiant Edge and 300A perform. I think the 300A, despite it's overall weakness...will be a better match for these lanes conditions...maybe allow me to play outside the 13-board. And, once I am forced too far inside...I think the Defiant Edge will give me a ball that has enough "umph" to get back to the pocket. I think, despite it's differences, it'll give me that option I gave up when I gave away the Melee Jab last month. I just worry maybe the Defiant Edge will be a bit "too" much.

Aslan

04-05-2016, 01:19 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

632 Series: 215-215 (clean)-202

Game 1 I was dialed in...missed a single 7-pin in the 4th and then chopped a 2-4-8 on the next shot...which I was almost sure was going to mentally derail me...but I finished strong.

Game 2 I couldn't seem to run any strikes together...but kept it clean.

Game 3...decided to stay with the Dark Encounter because it seemed to still be working on the right lane. Only opened on a chopped 1-3-6 in the 3rd...probably a better game than Game 2...but just couldn't keep the strikes going...probably the gin and tonic kicking in.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.09 pins
Strikes: 54% (3 turkeys, 2 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 66% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (3/6)
Most common single-pin leaves: 10-pin (3x)
Also left a single 4-pin, 6-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common multi-pin leave: 6-10 (3x)

Splits: 100% (1/1)

Average over 3 games: 210.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 214.33.

Clean game. Best series of the season in this league. Peaking just in time for sweeps. I led the team to take 3 points out of 4...first time that has happened since I can remember.

BUT...not happy with my spare shooting. Luckily 2 of those 3 misses were on 3rd shots in the 10th...but still. And yes, 1600b gorilla in the room...yes, a 215-215-215 triplicate would have essentially been one of the highlights of my existence...but I needed a 9 / in the 9th and could only manage a 7 /. Wouldn't have struck out anyways.

Definitely more fun with the current 4 though...good to have the drama queen gone.

Amyers

04-05-2016, 09:33 AM

Nice bowling Aslan

Aslan

04-10-2016, 04:33 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

629 Series: 220-206-203
All 3 games were similar. A 4-6-10 split away from a clean game in Game 1. I was clean in Game 2 until the 10th when I missed a single 9-pin. Game 3 I struggled early and made a ball change....then managed to finish strong. Only a couple opens; a 5-7 split and a single 10-pin.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.39 pins
Strikes: 57% (2 4-baggers, 3 doubles and 5 singles)
Spares: 69% picked up

Single Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x)
Also left a single 7-pin (2x), 2-pin, 6-pin, and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (2/4)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/2).

Average over 3 games: 209.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 217.67.

Felt really good. Had a lesson Wednesday and have been working a lot on my approach and finish position. My timing felt better tonight. The left lane played a lot different than the right lane. On the right lane I was always between 11-14 at the arrows...standing between 19-22; never moved much. On the left lane, I was always between 14-17 at the arrows standing 24-29.

Got a lesson tomorrow. Still working on form and the physical game. Hopefully carry will naturally be a result over time...kinda disappointing every night to really only be able to barely break 200.

mc_runner

04-10-2016, 04:51 PM

Nice bowling, how did you do in the tournament?

Amyers

04-11-2016, 09:50 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

...kinda disappointing every night to really only be able to barely break 200.

This coming from the guy who a couple of weeks ago was ready to quit because he was slumping and struggling to shoot 450. Glad to see your in a better place.

Aslan

04-11-2016, 06:43 PM

Nice bowling, how did you do in the tournament?
It's a weekly color-pin tournament that isn't really a "tournament". If you get strikes when there is a colored head pin, you can win money...get money for certain spares...etc...

It costs $20 and then $5 for 50/50 and $5 for strike ball. This week I got back $6. Some weeks I only get back maybe $2. Some weeks I get back like $18. I just use it as a way to practice on fresh conditions...the only chance each week that I get.

That being said, I try to measure myself against others on the pair. This week I had the high score each game...but I only really had one good player on my pair this week.

This coming from the guy who a couple of weeks ago was ready to quit because he was slumping and struggling to shoot 450. Glad to see your in a better place.

Thats bowling. It's very manic depressive. Golf is even worse. I make like 6-7 good shots and about 70 bad ones...which is why I tend not to play golf very often.

Monday Practice: Older Brunswick Synthetics

The guy at the desk said only one senior league had bowled on the lanes...so still some decent oil left.

523 Series: 194-136-193

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.93 pins
Strikes: 40% (1 4-bagger, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 44% picked up

Single Pin spares: 54% (6/11)
Most common single-pin leave: 2-pin, 4-pin, 6-pin, 7-pin, and 10-pin (2x each)
Also left a single 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 28% (2/7)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 174.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 193.33.

Given the horrid single-pin spare shooting...I decided to play a game of low-ball. 10-point deduction for gutter balls (2)...ended up with a 77. Not great...but it helped me settle down and get my head right.

Sche3067

04-11-2016, 10:27 PM

Bowled really bad at the start with a 135. I was having grip issues next game and ended up washing my hands on the 4th frame. I ended up with a 197. My last game was not looking great with 2 opens going into the 4th when I finally relaxed and went back to basics. I went on fire striking 6 times feeling great. I ended with a 217 picking up a easy baby split and pulling in the pocket to hard for 9 more eaving the 4. Its been a while since I have been this confident and can't wait to take it into the tournament on sunday

Aslan

04-12-2016, 12:31 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

656 Series: 216 (clean)-234-206

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.39 pins
Strikes: 57% (1 4-bagger, 3 turkeys, and 6 singles)
Spares: 84% picked up

Single Pin spares: 71% (5/7)
Most common single-pin leaves: 10-pin (4x)
Also left a single 6-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 100% (6/6)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: n/a

Average over 3 games: 218.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 226.67.

Obviously it's an annoying yet lovely compliment when you bowl well enough that the other team questions your average and half accuses you of being a sandbagging ringer. :roll eyes:

The turn-around has all been approach, timing, and finish position. Still a little bummed that I only was 50% on 10-pins...especially after putting some work into that this afternoon...but obviously I'll take a 656 any day of the week. And I like helping the team take back some of the points we squandered early in the season.

Still not good enough to take side pots. I'd need to be in the 250-260 scratch range...and I'm not quite there.

manke

04-12-2016, 12:03 PM

Nice bowling keep it up!!

Aslan

04-12-2016, 02:19 PM

Nice bowling keep it up!!

It's been a nice stretch recently:

4/2 Tourney: 200-154-200
4/4 League: 215-215-202
4/9 Tourney: 220-206-203
4/11 League: 216-234-206

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.12 pins
Strikes: 50% (3 4-baggers, 7 turkeys, 8 doubles and 18 singles)
Spares: 72% picked up

Single Pin spares: 73% (22/30)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (11x)
Never left a single 1-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 70% (22/31)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (6x)

Splits: 33% (2/6).

Average over 3 games: 205.92.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 211.75.

Granted, the numbers are a little lower if I throw in the 2 practices where I went 195-190-193-194-136-193...but even that isn't really that bad...for practice on beat up lanes. Now I just gotta keep this "peak" going through the 21st when the league sweeps in Vegas. I have a feeling I might be peaking a bit too early...raise my average just in time for sweeps...then poo the bed when it counts. Yikes.

Aslan

04-19-2016, 01:01 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

577 Series: 217 (clean)-169-191

Game 1 was clean. I couldn't keep pace with their high rev, palm balling anchor that shot a 242...but I kept us in it. Unfortunately, their 3rd bowler shot a 193 which was about 16 pins above his average...and our 3rd bowler shot a 93...about 9 pins below his average.

Game 2 I should've switched to the Loaded Revolver...but waited till about mid-way through. Not the ball's fault...my spare shooting was miserable. But, the team came through...not our team...their team just stunk it up.

Game 3 I knew their high rev palm bowler would tire and struggle...and he did. I was clean through 6 frames...on pace for a 279...then chopped a 3-6 in the 7th...and couldn't convert a 5-7 split in the 9th...then completely failed in the 10th missing a single 6-pin. Only 3 for 5 on corner pins...2 for 3 on the 6-pin.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.09 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 4-bagger, 2 turkeys, and 6 singles)
Spares: 46% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (6/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 6-pin (3x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 5-pin, 7-pin nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 14% (1/7)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 192.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 200.00.

Not my best night. But, this is what I get for blowing off practice this past Saturday.

Had a lot of ball fit issues. The thumb was a little too tight...probably the weather...it's been in the 90s out here. No bigee...I switched VISE inserts. But then it was a little too lose and I didn't want to mess with tape. The more difficult thing was the fingers were a bit tight. I have been trying to self-teach myself the banjo and I think my fingers were a tiny bit swollen.

Team split; 2 points each. Missed total pins by 7 pins. Not a 'bad' night...but honestly we only got 2 points because the other team was struggling. Was really hoping to have 3 more 200+ games...keep the streak alive...but couldn't quite pull it off.

Used a new polish on the Loaded Revolver. Came out looking pretty good...and it performed well.

Amyers

04-19-2016, 09:52 AM

J Anderson

04-19-2016, 12:11 PM

The Banjo? Really? As if you aren't weird enough without trying. LOL. I have the same problem with fit this time of year have to remove the tape from everything then when the weather changes add it back in.

The banjo is in fashion again, not just for hillbillies sitting on haybales. Old Crow Medicine Show and Mumford & Sons are both popular with people who might have no idea who Pete Seeger was.

Aslan

04-19-2016, 02:35 PM

The Banjo? Really? As if you aren't weird enough without trying. LOL.

If I were a typical elderly bowler on this site...I'd be very upset at that comment.

But...I'm not...because it's true. I actually was thinking "accordion"....but I figured banjo would be slightly less 'weird'. And accordions are really expensive.

The thumb fit always changes with the weather...but "finger fit" is something that is more difficult to deal with. Very few bowlers use and virtually no pro shops offer VISE or Turbo inserts for fingers. A pro shop guy told me that VISE makes interchangeable finger inserts...but I've never seen them in use.

Aslan

04-24-2016, 09:03 PM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

516 Series: 167-170-179

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.51 pins
Strikes: 25% (2 doubles and 5 singles)
Spares: 69% picked up

Single Pin spares: 80% (8/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (4x)
Also left a single 2-pin, 3-pin, 5-pin, and 6-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 61% (8/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3).

Average over 3 games: 172.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 179.00.

Not much to be said. The numbers are more red than is fair...but it's based on 2 weeks ago when I had a pretty solid night. Hard to score when you're only striking 25%. First game I tried a couple different balls...neither worked well...so I went with the Loaded Revolver...but that wasn't really working either. And mentally I think I was trying too hard...bowling against two really good, young bowlers...just got in my head.

Aslan

04-26-2016, 03:49 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

600 Series: 258 (clean)-196-146

Game 1 everything was working.

Game 2 wasn't as bad as the score indicates. Two missed single-pin spares and then a Big 4 split in the 10th.

Then things went South. Lost my strike line...lost my balance...still struggled with single-pin spares...and a couple untimely splits added to the horrid outcome.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.31 pins
Strikes: 59% (1 7-bagger, 2 turkeys, 1 double, and 4 singles)
Spares: 46% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 7-pin (3x)
Also left a single 4-pin, 5-pin, 6-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (2/5)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-6-7 split (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 200.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 215.33.

Pretty happy with the first game. Obviously a bit disappointed in the series. 3 missed single 7-pins...just couldn't seem to hit that pin. :( Game 3 I tried a new progression where I switched to a polished Lethal Revolver...but that didn't work very well so I switched to the Loaded Revolver for the final couple frames.

RobLV1

04-26-2016, 08:17 AM

There's that "progression" word again! Sometimes, as you move left, you need to ball up in order to get the ball back to the pocket, particularly when you have moved left of your comfort zone. Here's an exercise for you: try moving five boards left of where you think you should be playing, use the most aggressive ball you have with you, and target far down the lane (the reflections of the tops of the pins works well). Work on rolling the ball in a straight line toward that far target, making sure that you are not coming over the top to help it to hook.

vdubtx

04-26-2016, 10:38 AM

There's that "progression" word again! Sometimes, as you move left, you need to ball up in order to get the ball back to the pocket, particularly when you have moved left of your comfort zone.

And sometimes, you need to move right and get your strongest ball and hit a part of the lane right of where you have been. This exact thing happened to me this past weekend at our state tournament. Game 1 had trouble with ball hitting too light on head pin, moved myself right a few boards and ball was still not finishing. Went out to the car and pulled out my Nirvana and moved another 2-3 boards right with feet and target down lane and smashed pocket rest of the day.

RobLV1

04-26-2016, 11:33 AM

And sometimes, you need to move right and get your strongest ball and hit a part of the lane right of where you have been. This exact thing happened to me this past weekend at our state tournament. Game 1 had trouble with ball hitting too light on head pin, moved myself right a few boards and ball was still not finishing. Went out to the car and pulled out my Nirvana and moved another 2-3 boards right with feet and target down lane and smashed pocket rest of the day.

You're right, but I am very wary of saying it for the simple reason that many players who are afraid to move left will jump on it and ignore the fact that in a great majority of cases, moving right is a really bad idea for right-handed bowlers.

vdubtx

04-26-2016, 01:09 PM

You're right, but I am very wary of saying it for the simple reason that many players who are afraid to move left will jump on it and ignore the fact that in a great majority of cases, moving right is a really bad idea for right-handed bowlers.

True that it is not typical, but I always adjust to what the lane is telling me vs. a move left as is the rather typical move. As you well know, moving left isn't the cure all.

Aslan

04-26-2016, 01:57 PM

There's that "progression" word again!

What I meant in that statement was...

Lately, with a slightly higher rev rate and slower speed...I've been just starting with the Dark Encounter and balling down to the Loaded Revolver in Game 2 or 3...depending on how the lanes are breaking down. On a typical league night...that's plenty. I've been starting in the 11-14 area at the arrows...standing 18-22...usually finishing 13-16 at the arrows...standing 22-27.

Well, the problem I've been struggling with is RG. The Dark Encounter has a very low RG and the Loaded Revolver a quite RG. And the Lethal Revolver also has a quite high RG. So over the weekend...I took the polish off the Dark Encounter...just a quick little hand surface with a 2000 abralon pad...and I used a 1500 on the Lethal Revolver and then the polished (by hand) the Lethal Revolver.

My thought process was to re-align my arsenal according to RG...and use a little surface to help the Dark Encounter (weaker Columbia) while delaying the solid Brunswick cover of the Lethal Revolver. But my biggest trouble I've been having with my game is I really haven't mastered the ability to see when a ball is starting to encounter friction. And because a weak 7-pin or 10-pin can be the result of a line too far to the right OR a result of a ball that is just losing energy...it's not an exact science in terms of "Leave X, Move Y or Ball Down/Up".

So...I'm still not sure I like the idea of balling "down" to the Lethal Revolver...I'm not sure the polish job I did is going to be enough to counter the Brunswick solid cover. I used the Dark Encounter for two games and scored a 258 and 196...maybe I should have stuck with it...made some other moves or changes rather than try to change balls. :confused:

@Rob: My trouble with going to my most aggressive ball and using that inside line is I can't get the ball to come back. I don't really have a "strong" ball...I have a Lethal Revolver...but it doesn't seem to bounce off the friction...the Brunswick, solid cover seems to want to read the lanes earlier...and by the time it hits the pocket...it's out of energy. The Dark Encounter 'might' be able to make that turn....if I really get a LOT of hand into it...but with a Columbia cover and an assymetric core...my release mistakes get magnified...and with the inside line...I don't have a lot of miss room.

I miss that Melee Jab you gave me. That ball gave me a lot better look inside than any ball I've thrown. It had a pearl/polished cover that gave it a good deal of length and was really aggressive on the backend....sometimes erratic...but it was the only ball I've ever been able to really "play the breakpoint" with...and not have to worry that it would miss right of the pocket.

I've been considering replacing the Melee Jab with a Black Widow Red Legend Pearl...which I think would give me some length...but also give me the same snap I saw with the Melee Jab. On the other hand...maybe I need something really long and not as strong...like the Boost Cardinal Red Pearl...for drier conditions, shorter patterns, practice, etc... :confused:

@VDub: Usually over 3 games I don't ever get so far inside that I have to start getting 'drastic'. But I have employed the strategy you're suggesting in tournaments or longer practice sessions when I just run out of room left. But usually it's going back to 2nd/3rd arrow and throwing plastic or my weakest ball up the 5-board where there's been very little traffic. In order for me to ball "UP" and move right...I'd have to move back in the approach and add speed...which I'm trying not to do because it screws my timing up and get back into some bad habits with my footwork.

shadd

04-26-2016, 02:17 PM

...moving right is a really bad idea for right-handed bowlers.

If I hit a little light, moving right a board-ish (keeping my target the same to get to the pocket) is not a proper adjustment? I frequently move right to get the ball where I want it to end up...guess its back to the literature/theory to better understand.

Sorry for the high-jack.

Amyers

04-26-2016, 02:22 PM

I've been considering replacing the Melee Jab with a Black Widow Red Legend Pearl...which I think would give me some length...but also give me the same snap I saw with the Melee Jab. On the other hand...maybe I need something really long and not as strong...like the Boost Cardinal Red Pearl...for drier conditions, shorter patterns, practice, etc... :confused:

.

The boost in your hands even with your new lower speed higher rev delivery isn't going to do much. I like the Red Legend Pearl also with your predilections towards clearance equipment the Guru mighty $99 or if you wanted something for less oil the Reaxx Gusto is seriously a backend monster $85. I'm a big fan of the Mastermind Braniac but your looking full price there. Just some ideas.

On balling down after the 258,196 I face that question myself a lot and usually end up second guessing my decision. I can usually move farther left but to do it I really have to have confidence in what I'm throwing to come back. I've been using my Vintage Danger Zone for that here lately it's a nice feeling to know you can't really fire a ball too far right.

Amyers

04-26-2016, 06:34 PM

If I hit a little light, moving right a board-ish (keeping my target the same to get to the pocket) is not a proper adjustment? I frequently move right to get the ball where I want it to end up...guess its back to the literature/theory to better understand.

Sorry for the high-jack.

Moving your feet right while keeping your target the same actually moves your break point left. That's not what Rob is talking about but it would help address the problem of the ball burning up.

I will use a similar move to "tighten my line" if I'm playing deeper on the lanes and my line is starting to overhook sometimes

RobLV1

04-26-2016, 08:12 PM

If I hit a little light, moving right a board-ish (keeping my target the same to get to the pocket) is not a proper adjustment? I frequently move right to get the ball where I want it to end up...guess its back to the literature/theory to better understand.

Sorry for the high-jack.

Initially, if you hit a little light moving right is the correct move, however, if you start to hit light after a few frames, then your ball is probably losing energy and the move is to the left to find more oil. The exception to this is if someone on your lanes is using plastic or urethane for their strike ball creating carrydown.

shadd

04-27-2016, 08:19 AM

Initially, if you hit a little light moving right is the correct move, however, if you start to hit light after a few frames, then your ball is probably losing energy and the move is to the left to find more oil. The exception to this is if someone on your lanes is using plastic or urethane for their strike ball creating carrydown.

OK, thanks for the follow-up/clarification! That makes sense to me and is usually what I do for adjustments.

Aslan

05-03-2016, 03:29 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

471 Series: 188-138-145

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.06 pins
Strikes: 32% (2 doubles and 6 singles)
Spares: 45% picked up

Single Pin spares: 57% (4/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x)
Also left a single 4-pin, 5-pin, and 6-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 38% (5/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/2).

Average over 3 games: 157.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 167.00.

Poo.

Aslan

05-03-2016, 04:03 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

621 Series: 211 (clean)-214 (clean)-196

Game 1 I started with the Lethal Revolver...but after a weak strike in the first frame and 3 consecutive spares on decent shots....I decided to make an early change to the Loaded Revolver. Still couldn't quite hit the pocket flush...but spare shooting was excellent to keep things clean.

Game 2 my line started to wear in...but I couldn't run more than two strikes together.

Game 3 I lost the clean series in the 2nd frame on a 4-6 split...then a 4-bagger...then a missed 2-pin...and a Big 4 in the 9th...had to strike out just to salvage the 196. :(

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.15 pins
Strikes: 52% (1 4-bagger, 2 turkeys, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 80% picked up

Single Pin spares: 88% (8/9)
Most common single-pin leaves: 2-pin, 5-pin, 7-pin, and 10-pin (2x each)
Also left a single 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 207.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 211.00.

Happy with the series. Closest I've ever come to a clean series. Outperformed the other team's top bowlers in both Games 1 and 2...but they had a better Game 3. And our team is down to 2 players...and the guy averages about 101...and today couldn't break 99...kinda hard to carry that much weight on my shoulders.

But, I also can't rely on such great spare shooting...need to learn how to run strikes together.

One more week before Sweeps. I'm in good form...but not great spirits and I'm going to bowling in a place I have very little experience in (South Pointe). A lot of good bowlers in this league...taking $$$ isn't going to be easy. The 180 average will be more helpful than the 190-192 I had to take with me to Sweeps in March...but it certainly won't be a cake walk.

Aslan

05-10-2016, 01:48 AM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

591 Series: 188-180-223

Game 1 I started with the Lethal Revolver. Felt like my timing was off a bit...but I only had two opens...a 4-7-10 split in the 2nd frame and a 2-4-5-8 bucket in the 6th frame that I chopped. After a weak strike in the 9th, I switched to the Loaded Revolver.

Game 2 I also started off badly with a chopped 1-2-4-10 washout in the first frame...then a 4-6-10 split in the 4th frame...and another multi-pin 'issue' when I chopped a 2-4-5 in the 7th. Had to strike out in the 10th to salvage the 180 and avoid our female bowler on the team actually beating me...we tied.

Game 3 I suddenly found my timing...started making much better shots. The only open was a 1-2-4 in the 4th frame.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.03 pins
Strikes: 55% (3 turkeys, 3 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 57% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (4/4)
Only left a 2-pin, 7-pin, 9-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (4/10)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 197.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

The team took 3 points...our gal with the knee issue returned and bowled well. Our beginner bowler bowled better this week.

Amyers

05-10-2016, 09:13 AM

classygranny

05-10-2016, 11:56 PM

Had to strike out in the 10th to salvage the 180 and avoid our female bowler on the team actually beating me...we tied.

Must not let the females beat the little boys bowling :)

Aslan, your posts always make me laugh...or shake my head in wonderment!

Aslan

05-15-2016, 04:06 PM

Must not let the females beat the little boys bowling :)

Aslan, your posts always make me laugh...or shake my head in wonderment!

It wasn't that she was a girl...it's that she's like a 136 average bowler...who constantly taunts me saying she is going to beat me. I usually just brush that off with a typical "Yeah...that would be cool." But when she actually goes on a crazy run...I get nervous.

It's a no-win situation...if I beat her 299-99...she just goes off and does a shot and laughs and has fun. If she beats me 186-185...she'll remind me how she beat me that one time for like 6 months.

Also...I'm thinking about sleeping with her when we go to Vegas this weekend. I'm not sure. I'm trying to turn over a couple new leaves...but the two new leaves are confliciting one another. ON the one hand, she's married and I'm trying to avoid "mortal sins" from a religious standpoint. On the other hand...I've been trying to be really nice to ladies and tell them all kinds of stuff that they want to hear that makes them happy. So...I gotta wrestle with that one the next week or so.

Maybe it'll resolve itself. I'm also starting to require God to intervene...I'm kinda over the whole "free will" thing...I think God needs to step up and start removing temptations...it's not too much to ask if ya think about it. I mean, if God doesn't want me to "covet another man's wife"...then why have wives that are looking to be coveted by me? Isn't that some kind of weird game? It's kinda sick...like some kinda weird psychology experiment. I don't know...whatever.

Oh yeah...scores from last night's tournament:

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

555 Series: 136-211-208

Game 1 was poo. Just couldn't seem to get the Lethal Revolver to make the turn on that pair. Last week it was biting too much...so I polished it a bit Monday...now I couldn't get it to make the turn.

Game 2 would have been clean except for a poo shot in the 8th frame that left a 1-2-4-10 washout that I didn't even come close to converting.

Game 3 was more of the same. A 3-9-10 split in the 2nd frame and a 1-2-4-8 I couldn't convert in the 5th...but I was able to run some strikes together to salvage the 200+.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.48 pins
Strikes: 48% (1 4-bagger, 2 turkeys, 1 double, and 4 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (3/3)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x)
Only left a 4-pin, 5-pin, and 6-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 42% (6/14)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4 and 1-2-8 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/3).

Average over 3 games: 185.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Aslan

05-16-2016, 11:40 PM

Monday League: Older Brunswick synthetics.

483 Series: 177-146-160

Game 1 I couldn't seem to get the ball to get back to the pocket...no miss room.

Game 2 the Lethal Revolver was hitting light...and my spare shooting wasn't great...I switched to the Loaded Revolver midway through and things got better...too little too late.

Game 3 the line had burned up and by the time I found a new one...too little too late.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.41 pins
Strikes: 35% (3 doubles and 6 singles)
Spares: 40% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a 5-pin, 6-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 28% (4/14)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/4)

Average over 3 games: 161.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 167.00.

God I hope this was just an off night and not the beginning of the end of my hot streak 5 days before sweeps.

Aslan

05-21-2016, 01:23 AM

Pre-Sweeps Practice: South Point (Las Vegas)

527 Series: 177-181-169
Game 1 was with Dark Encounter...I applied a 1000 grit abralon by hand...Vegas lanes are notoriously longer and wider than what I usually play on so I usually scuff up the balls just a little bit. It took most of the first game, but I finally settled in on a good line...about 5 and 5 right of where I usually play. A little longer pattern...a little wider. Better hold downlane...so a miss 1-2 left won't hurt you...but a miss 1-3 boards right and it wasn't coming back. And the miss inside had to be a true "miss"...not a "pull". Pulled shots didn't hold. Game 2 was more of the same.

In Game 3, I just ran out of patience with the Dark Encounter hitting the pocket and just hitting really soft...so I switched to the Lethal Revolver and did better.

499 Series: 194-143-172
Game 1 I used the Lethal Revolver...but by the 9th and 10th frames...it just wasn't carrying. Game 2 I switched to the Loaded Revolver...but it wasn't making it back...so I switched bak to the Le. Revolver...the back to the Loaded Revolver. Game 3 I used the Loaded Revolver...but I was physically and mentally spent...and my timing and balance was just 'off'. I'm no longer used to these "marathon" practice sessions.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.73 pins
Strikes: 36% (2 4-baggers, 4 doubles, and 7 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 64% (11/17)
Most common single pin leave: 10-pin (6x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 8-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 38% (8/21)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (3x).

Splits: 0% (0/4)

Average over 6 games: 172.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 182.83.

The overall impression was that the lanes were easier than I predicted. Probably just because I've gotten better since last I bowled here. But the more important problem/issue...is a 172.67 average isn't gonna win me any money tomorrow. For that matter, even had I picked up all the single-pin spares...a 182.63 average isn't going to win me any $$. :(

This is a smaller league, smaller pot...I hesitate to say "better" bowlers...because I think there was more talent in my old Tuesday and Wednesday leagues. But this league is used to tough conditions...so I think they'' adapt more quickly. Given the size of the league and talent level...and my handicap...a 650 series might be all I need to take home some real $$. But practice seems to point to me not really getting over 600 without some luck.

Aslan

05-22-2016, 06:10 PM

Sweeps: South Point (Las Vegas)

546 Series: 213-159-174
Game 1 was with Dark Encounter...I applied a 1000 grit abralon by hand...Vegas lanes are notoriously longer and wider than what I usually play on so I usually scuff up the balls just a little bit. First 3 frames I left corner-pins...missed every single one. :mad: Finally I found my strike line and settled down...7 strikes in 7 frames to finish with a 213 which tied me for 2nd in the handicap side pot with a 240.

Game 2...couldn't seem to strike...switched to the Lethal Revolver in the 5th frame...but it was really biting hard. I scuffed it to a 1000-1500 abralon...but it was biting a bit more than I wanted it to. A split in the 5th...spare shooting was okay until a couple more missed corner leaves in the 8th and 9th...the 159 knocked me out of all 5 of the brackets I was alive in and ended any real shot at taking home any real money from sweeps.

Switched to the Loaded Revolver in frame 3 of Game 3...only two opens...two more corner-pins...but only two strikes. :mad:

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.15 pins
Strikes: 35% (1 6-bagger and 6 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 64% (11/17)
Most common single pin leave: 4-pin (6x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 8-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (2/4)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a.

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 182.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 203.33.

Statistically very similar to yesterday's practice...with the one major exception being that yesterday I left 17 single-pins over 6 games...and at sweeps I left 17 single-pins over 3 games. Only 50% on single corner-pins. The first ball average was solid...had I picked up the spares...I'd have average about 203...with a 244-168-196 or something like that.

The lanes were okay. I think I had a little too much surface given that we swept at 8PM after all the other leagues swept.

As for my first sweeps at South Point...the rooms were very nice...much nicer than The Orleans and Gold Coast. And the lanes and approaches were nicer too. Rob's buddy was running the show from the desk...and everything ran smooth. No equipment problems...and the new scoring software was great. Even the food at the snack bar was better.

The league had fun...one girl rolled a 269 scratch in Game 2...and the best female bowler in the league (the only one that averages more than I do) bowled a 300-game in Game 3. The lanes played longer and wider than what our league was used to...but many of the top average guys in this league are good enough to make adjustments and they've bowled at South Point before. Being in a league that is used to more challenging conditions helps...it doesn't lead to the disaster of bowling at the local AMF house, averaging near 190-200...then going to the Gold Coast and finding out you don't have 9-boards of miss room.

Obviously a bummer for me. Yet another trip to Vegas where I left with less money than I showed up with...but, that's not really uncommon in Vegas. And I got to see the USBC Queens a couple games...only left down about $200...mostly from playing slots when I got bored waiting for the sweeps to start. I did leave at 11:30 after our meeting wound down...and made it back to the OC in record time...3.5 hours. During daylight hours...that's rarely possible.

Now that the second league is done, I can update my "Fall/Winter Goals"....when I find the thread...

RobLV1

05-22-2016, 06:57 PM

Aslan

06-02-2016, 12:40 AM

Older Brunswick synthetics.

644 Series: 233-218-193

Finally found a team willing to take a chance on me as a sub...

Game 1 I opened in frame 1 because I didn't get any practice and guttered on the first shot. Clean the rest of the way.

Game 2 my only open was on a Big 4 split in frame 4.

Game 3 I also opened in frame 4 on a 3-9...clean the rest of the way.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.94 pins
Strikes: 48% (1 6-bagger, 1 5-bagger, 1 double, and 3 singles)
Spares: 68% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (9/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin and 10-pin (3x each).
Also left a 6-pin and 7-pin (2x).

Multiple Pin spares: 28% (2/7)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 214.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Take THAT all you haters that wouldn't take me as a sub the last 4 times I sat in the bar waiting!

Definitely was making good shots. Conditions were more favorable than Vegas...a couple shots I missed as much as 4 boards right and still got it to come back into the pocket. Only two opens and one was a split...and I picked up all single-pin spares...so I can't complain. The other two missed multi-pin spares were on 2nd shots in the 10th and both were splits.

I think I helped their team take all 4 points before even adding in any handicap. And the anchor on the team took my cell number so I guess I passed the tryout/audition. ;)

NYMIKE

06-02-2016, 01:02 AM

Congrats, 621 from a pinch hitter is big time, next time ask for drinks for your services.

Mike White

06-02-2016, 02:03 AM

bubba809

06-02-2016, 08:52 AM

Aslan

06-02-2016, 12:27 PM

I "think" they will use my league average from the league I was in on Mondays that just got over. The other possibilites are:

They make me establish for 3 weeks and then re-calculate.
They make me establish for 3 weeks starting me at an average of 175.
They use my highest book average from the most recent season (192).
They use my highest book average from the previous season (190).
They use my composite average from the previous season (174).

This league is almost over...they are still finishing up Fall/Winter and have a position round next week so I won't be able to sub....and I think that is their last week and then they start a short summer season. So, it's very possible this will be my only sub for that league. The one guy took my number though, I think for summer, because one guy on the team travels alot.

So, I 'think' my bowling helped them according to the scenarios lists...it's just a matter of how much it helped them. Even if I was establishing, the league is 90% of 215...so my scores just would have been scratch...and I think we beat them all 3 games even if I didn't get handicap.

Aslan

06-18-2016, 12:40 AM

Random Friday Practice: older Brunswick synthetics

431 Series: 156-116-159

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 7.90 pins
Strikes: 16% (1 double, and 3 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (6/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (3x)
Also left a 5-pin, 6-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 35% (7/20)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-7 split, 3-6-7-10 washout, and 3-10 baby split (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/7).

Average over 3 games: 143.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Practiced on dry lanes. Couldn't even manage to get in the 160s....because 1/3 of my leaves were splits. The only positives were the single-pin spare shooting and in the 3rd game I tried to move back and add speed...and it went pretty well. Normally speed adjustment is not something I mess with...but the timing stayed at least "okay".

Aslan

06-19-2016, 08:27 PM

Random Sunday Practice: older Brunswick synthetics

532 Series: 183-167-182

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.59 pins
Strikes: 35% (1 4-bagger, 1 double, and 6 singles)
Spares: 70% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (10/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 6-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (4/10)
Most common multi-pin leave: 6-10 (3x)

Splits: 33% (1/3).

Average over 3 games: 177.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Lesson from Mark this morning. Then I took on the mother/daughter in some post-lesson competition. Things worked well. Obviously I'm happy with the single-pin %. Not happy that I was only 1 for 3 on 6-10s though.

Aslan

06-23-2016, 02:55 AM

Did that league have you establish on the first night, or do you use a book for the first 9 games?

The value of a sub is can you do better than if they take the missing person's average less 10 pins.

If your average in that league is now 214, you have to shoot 204+ next time, or they would be better off without a sub.

It stings an extra amount that Mike is correct. I had to go into week 2 of my subbing with a 214 average.

Older Brunswick synthetics.

541 Series: 170-181-190

Game 1 was some pretty bad luck stuff. Opened on a 6-10 in the first frame by chopping the 6-pin off. Barely missed a 10-pin in the 4th frame. Then, probably first time this happened to me...opened on a 3-10 baby split by having the ball go between the 3 and 10.

Game 2 the carry issues continued. I missed a couple 7-pins...one because my thumb stuck due to this unseasonable heat wave and higher than normal humidity.

Game 3 I was clean other than a chopped 3-6-9-10 in the 7th. But the lanes were really starting to transition and I just couldn't seem to find my line targeting 13-15 at the arrows.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.91 pins
Strikes: 39% (3 doubles and 7 singles)
Spares: 66% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (6/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (5x).
Also left a single 10-pin (2x), a single 2-pin, and a single 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 66% (6/9)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 180.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 191.67.

Bowled well...but as Mike forewarned, I wasn't much use to my team with the 2nd highest average in the league. Oh well, at least I got to bowl!

Amyers

06-23-2016, 10:27 AM

[QUOTE=Aslan;144794]

541 Series: 170-181-190

Then, probably first time this happened to me...opened on a 3-10 baby split by having the ball go between the 3 and 10.

QUOTE]

You know it's going to be one of those nights when something like that happens. I've done if a few times myself

Aslan

06-30-2016, 07:43 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

535 Series: 143-221-171

The teams often wait till the last moment to grab subs...usually because they are waiting to see if someone shows up. So, no practice when you sub. :(

Game 1 was just an abortion of a game. I know that sounds overly harsh...but that should have been a clean game with the exception of the 1-2-10 washout in the 2nd frame. All the rest of the spare shots were very makeable. The Lethal Revolver just didn't seem to have a very good line.

Game 2 I switched to the Loaded Revolver...but it took a couple of shots to make the proper adjustments...but once I did...things went well. Only open was a 2-10 split in the 2nd frame.

Game 3 was more like Game 1 but I was finally able to make some single-spare leaves.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.55 pins
Strikes: 39% (1 5-bagger, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 42% picked up

Single Pin spares: 71% (5/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x).
Also left a single 5-pin, 7-pin, and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 25% (3/12)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2 and 6-10 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 178.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 182.00.

Struggled all night with finger fit. It's been fairly hot and a little humid out here...and my ring finger gets a little swollen in these conditions...ball doesn't come off as clean.

Aslan

07-02-2016, 10:40 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

539 Series: 137-209-193

Got to sub on Friday:

Game 1 I had a few missed spares and a split in the 10th.

Game 2 I started feeling better; only open was a 4-7 in the 5th which I missed by a mile.

Game 3 I just couldn't get lined up right, but my spare shooting was solid so I salvaged a 193.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.76 pins
Strikes: 33% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 65% picked up

Single Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin (5x).
Also left a single 4-pin (2x), 5-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 54% (6/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5, 3-6-10, and 6-10 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 179.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 185.67.

Better to establish as a sub with a 179 average than a 211 like I did on Wednesday. And spare shooting was improved.

Aslan

07-03-2016, 04:18 AM

Scratch Saturday Tournament:
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

866 Series: 197-180-158-166-165

Decided to do this because I've been bowling well lately and every once in awhile I like to test my mental game a bit...higher pressure environment:

Game 1 I felt good. Couldn't seem to run many strikes together...a couple opens on a split and a tough spare.
After Round 1 I was 19th out of 28. Not a great start, but I still had time to make a run.

Game 2 I actually struck quite a bit...but had 3 open frames. Missed a 10-pin in the first frame...and it rattled me mentally.
At this point, post-Round 2 I had fallen to 21st...but still hoped I could make a decent showing.

Game 3 was a spear through the heart. TWO missed single-pins, another 4-6-7 split, then a 1-7-8-9 mess in the 10th frame.
I was now 25th out of 28 and feeling like this tournament was a mistake and a waste of $50 I could have used on a hooker.

Game 4 I just couldn't carry. I fixed my spare shooting, but a 6-7-10 split in the 4th and a chopped 1-2-4-10 washout in the 9th kept me from a clean game.
I now had fallen to 27th out of 28. My only hope at this point would be a big 5th game...just to move up a little.

Game 5 I think mentally I was done. A chopped 2-5 in the 1st, a missed 7-pin in the 7th, and a 5-7 split in the 10th.
Finished in 27th out of 28.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.61 pins
Strikes: 37% (3 turkeys, a double, and 9 singles)
Spares: 54% picked up

Single Pin spares: 63% (7/11)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (6x).
Also left a single 10-pin (4x) and a single 6-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (11/22)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2 (3x)

Splits: 20% (1/5)

Average over 3 games: 173.20.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 180.80.

Okay, note to self, "You're not ready for scratch tournaments."

Aslan

07-03-2016, 04:57 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

Wasn't really in the mood to bowl again, but there were like 4 carryover strike ball pots + 2 regular pots...$1200 on the line...figured what the hell.

469 Series: 161-152-156

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.06 pins
Strikes: 25% (1 double and 6 singles)
Spares: 54% picked up

Single Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x)
Also left a 4-pin (2x) and a 5-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (6/14)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 4-7 (4x)

Splits: 0% (0/1).

Average over 3 games: 156.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 167.67.

What a poo-tastical performance that was.

The lanes were really dry with this heat wave we've been having. The place was packed and hot. I was sweating like a maniac. And before I could get a good line to the pocket...the lanes started transitioning and before I knew it I was standing left toe just outside 30 and targeting 14 at the arrows. NOT my comfort zone!

Aslan

07-16-2016, 02:09 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

558 Series: 148-213-197

Got to sub on Friday again:

Once again I struggled in the first game which is really getting irritating. But, I get no practice...no warm-up...throw my shoes on, grab my ball, and bowl. First shot was a 1-2-10 washout....so starting off with an open is always wonderful. :mad:

Game 2 wasn't great. A chopped 5-9 in the 5th and a missed 10-pin in the 8th...but I ran some strikes together and stole the point for the team.

Game 3 I had another missed 10-pin and another washout; this time a 1-2-4-6-10...but salvaged a 197.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.50 pins
Strikes: 47% (2 4-baggers, 1 turkey, and 5 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a single 2-pin (2x) and 3-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 58% (7/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (2x)

Splits: N/A

Average over 3 games: 186.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 193.33.

Not happy with how I started out and not happy with my single-pin spare shooting...but this team took all 4 points...which I think made the talented team we faced rather angry. This team was the same one I subbed for last time and they have an open slot...so I think I have an open invitation to join them going forward. And, there was a single lady on the team...that I gave my phone number to with the instructions that she can call me if they need a sub OR FOR ANY NON-BOWLING REASON (wink wink)...so maybe this leads to an Aslan Score of the LADY kind...we'll see.

The other team...I bowl with all 3 of the guys on Saturday night in the weekly color-pin tournament. They definitely aren't the BEST of the Saturday bowlers...but they have skills. I thought we'd have little chance of beating them but we absolutely clobbered em. One of the guys left without even saying anything or shaking hands. They knew who I was and probably weren't happy they'd have to face me "out of the blue" like that. But really; I only stole Game 2 by striking out in the 9th and 10th. They'd have lost the other 3 points regardless. They just didn't bowl that well.

Aslan

07-16-2016, 06:44 PM

ABT Tournament:
Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

526 Series: 184-140-202

Game 1 I had trouble holding the pocket. I think I was little amped up in Game 1 and was probably firing it harder than usual.

Same problems in Game 2...missing right...then trying to move right...get too much hand in it....miss left. I may have switched balls too early...we only had two guys per pair...and I switched expecting transition...and I just don't think there was enough traffic to make the lanes transition as usual.

Game 3 I think I finally calmed down, got my speed down...still had a little trouble holding pocket...couldn't do more than double a couple times...but was a 4-6 split away from a clean game.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.31 pins
Strikes: 37% (3 doubles and 6 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (5/5)
Most common single-pin leave: 2-pin and 10-pin (2x each).
Also left a single 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (7/14)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4-10 washout and 4-6 split (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 175.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Entered with a 188 average...which was generous given most tournaments would have me enter at 191. I think in the next tournament, the average gets reduced or something. But I got paired up with a kid that was noticeably better than me and had the same handicap plus about 7-10 pins of "bonus" pins which I guess you get for not making the cut in previous tournaments.

I ended up +1...which obviously won't make the cut...but I can't say I was totally outclassed.

Not sure why I couldn't find my line. I think I was just amped up and throwing too hard...trying too hard...trying to "force" the ball to do what I wanted it to do. My strike % was about normal for me. My spare shooting was actually solid...the only "make-able" multi-pin spare I missed was a 2-5 which for some damn reason I almost always chop the 5 off. But the rest of those multi-pin splits were washouts and splits.

Aslan

07-17-2016, 07:33 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

Wasn't really in the mood to bowl again, after this morning's sub-par performance, but there were 11 strike ball pots so I had a shot at getting my money back from this morning.

465 Series: 166-139-160

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 7.88 pins
Strikes: 37% (2 doubles and 8 singles)
Spares: 45% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (3/4)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (2x)
Also left a 4-pin and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 37% (6/16)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-9-10, full rack, 6-10, and 3-10 baby split (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/4).

Average over 3 games: 155.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 159.00.

Wow. Two straight Saturday tournaments < 500. :mad:

Something was off today. Two first ball gutters. Multi-pin spares left and right. I couldn't seem to hold the pocket. My timing felt below average most of the time. Not sure what bad habit I've picked up...but I got a lesson Wednesday and I need to work on fixing whatever has gone wrong. And...19 weeks in a row...still haven't had my ticket called for anything...spin the wheel, 50/50, and strike balls...guess I just ain't "lucky".

Aslan

07-22-2016, 08:15 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

549 Series: 180-197-172

Got asked to sub on Wednesday:

Game was more struggling with consistency. Seemed like any miss of more than two boards would either not carry or go through the nose. But, at least I got to warm-up a little so I didn't have that first bad game as I've had recently.

Game 2 was almost clean...chopped a 3-6-10 in the 5th by chopping JUST the 6-pin off. I've never done that before.

Game 3 I was still struggling with consistency...but started making better shots. The bad news was my thumb was so swollen...that I missed a 10-pin by almost sending my ball into the ceiling. I finally had to try a house ball in the 6th when shooting at a 6-10...that didn't work. Then on a 4-7 in the 7th...I tried to use my strike ball with a flattened wrist...and that didn't work either.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.67 pins
Strikes: 42% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 7 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (3/4)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (2x).
Also left a single 5-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 57% (8/14)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 183.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 186.00.

Well...guess this hot weather or maybe me putting on extra weight or maybe just some medication related bloating...or a combination of the 3...finally bit me in the arse. I moved up to my biggest VISE insert in my strike balls...took out all the tape in the spare ball...but I still coudldn't get my thumb all the way in the ball. I shoulda just switched to a 3-6-9 or 4-8-12 and hooked into the spares. But, gotta go...need to see if a team needs a sub tonight...and need to get my thumb-hole widened a bit beforehand.

Aslan

07-22-2016, 10:49 PM

Friday Night Practice: older Brunswick synthetics

595 Series: 175-201-219 (clean)

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.88 pins
Strikes: 44% (6 doubles and 3 singles)
Spares: 82% picked up

Single Pin spares: 87% (7/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin and 7-pin (2x each)
Never left a single 1-pin, 6-pin, and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/1).

Average over 3 games: 198.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 202.33.

Mainly practiced out of anger for not being picked up tonight. I guess I wanted to prove the people wrong that decided to pass and take their -30 pin penalty. But, also wanted to practice because I had severe thumb issues on Wednesday, got the thumb hole on my spare ball widened, and wanted to see if the thumb issues were resolved. And...the answer is, "pretty much". I was back to using my usual size VISE insert...and even put some tape in the thumb hole on the spare ball...so I don't why I was so bloated on Wednesday...must have been the fact that I hadn't really eaten that day...maybe I was retaining water or something.

But, with the heat...it was only 98 today...but with 38-55% humidity...so it felt hotter than 98....I was still having some thumb issues. Mainly sweating and having trouble keeping the VISE thumb tape on my thumb. But...much better than Wednesday.

So..the takeaway is...this sub business is for the birds. It's just a popularity contest...and 95% of the teams are too stupid to do simple math...because unless you're talking about a 208 average bowler who was absent...I'd have definitely helped a team tonight. So...*#&$ em.

My old Tuesday team at my old home center wants be to bowl with them again because a guy quit the team rather suddenly. It'll take some time to get used to those conditions again...but at least it'll be a weekly thing rather than a daily popularity contest.

Amyers

07-23-2016, 08:54 AM

Mike White

07-23-2016, 11:36 AM

Only in So. Cal. is 38-55% humidity considered humid. Try 92 with 90% sometime lol

I'm pretty sure Nevada, Arizona, and maybe New Mexico would consider 38-55% humid as well.

I suppose next you're going to say -30 degrees is cold.

All us So Cal people could say is... oh, ok, I'll take your word for it.

P.S. I lived in Florida (back when Hurricane Andrew came along)... I know a thing or two about 90+ temp and 90+ humidity.

Unless you live on flat land (rare for West Virginia) you've got plenty of trees around you for shade.

classygranny

07-23-2016, 12:21 PM

I'm pretty sure Nevada, Arizona, and maybe New Mexico would consider 38-55% humid as well.

Yep, in Phoenix/Scottsdale, it is currently 9am - 97 degrees - 28% humidity - and it feels awful. (Reminds me of being on the Gulf of Mexico in mid-summer-only hotter). Yesterday morning was the same for me as Aslan's Wednesday night. It's such a difference than what we are use to, it really reaks havoc on your bowling - and lane conditions! Although, only a high of 114 expected for today.

Aslan

07-24-2016, 03:48 PM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

492 Series: 177-161-154

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 7.91 pins
Strikes: 25% (3 doubles and 2 singles)
Spares: 60% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (3/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin and 9-pin (2x each)
Also left a 2-pin and 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 64% (11/17)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/3).

Average over 3 games: 164.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 174.33.

No sense doing a game-by-game recap. The stats tell the story rather well...inability to strike and abysmal single-pin spare shooting. The only thing worth mentioning is that in Game 3 I had all 3 of the splits including one in the 10th....so the 154 really wasn't 'quite' that bad.

And the struggles on Saturday night continue. The weather didn't help...had to take all my thumb tape out of my spare ball and it was still sticking a bit. Had to again use my largest VISE insert...plus I had to wear the VISE thumb tape to keep my thumb from sticking. :mad:

But, it wasn't all weather. The weather screwed up my single-pin spare shooting...but it had less effect on my strike shots. My timing was just messed up...same as last week.

Aslan

07-27-2016, 03:41 AM

Monday Pre-Lesson Practice: easy THS

704 Series: 159-189-156-200

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.80 pins
Strikes: 43% (1 5-bagger, 1 turkey, 1 double and 8 singles)
Spares: 47% picked up

Single Pin spares: 71% (5/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x)
Also left a single 4-pin, 5-pin, 6-pin, and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 37% (6/16)
Most common multi-pin leave: 4-7 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/6).

Average over 3 games: 176.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 181.75.

Got to the lesson early so I decided to get some practice in and figure the strike line out since I haven't bowled there in 2-3 months. Nothing too noteable, a lot of trouble shooting spares. And a lot of ugly spares since these lanes are a bit wider (THS) than my usual center, but a much drier backend...so I struck a lot on shots that missed right...but went through the nose or hit left of the head-pin when I missed left or pulled it.

Aslan

07-27-2016, 04:47 AM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

My Tuesday league team from my old house/center lost a player and needed someone to fill out their roster so they asked me.

550 Series: 150-192-208

Game 1 I had a few tough multi-pin spares...so a rather lackluster start. But, we won the game.

Game 2 I was doing well...only open was a 4-9 split in the 5th...but mostly spares.

Midway through Game 2 I switched from the Lethal to the Loaded Revolver...and I really started to feel comfortable...also I switched to a bigger VISE insert and I think that mentally allowed me to relax. But, another solid game; the only open was on a terrible attempt to convert a 10-pin in the 8th.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.70 pins
Strikes: 36% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (6/9)
Most common single-pin leaves: 10-pin (2x).
Also left a 3-pin, 4-pin, 6-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 60% (6/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a.

Splits: 50% (1/2)

Average over 3 games: 183.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 191.33.

The team took 3 out of 4 points. This house is tougher...I have to play a much tighter line. Started feeling more comfortable in Game 3. The thumb difficulties continue...had to put away the spare ball early on in Game 3 because it was starting to stick...even with my VISE thumb tape on. But, hooked into the 7-pin with no problem.

I got to start this league with my old 162 average from that house last season. So, that was helpful. Not sure if I keep it for next week or have to use my 183 from today...but it's still better than having to establish or use my 190-192 average.

Aslan

07-28-2016, 03:14 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

508 Series: 158-165-185

Got asked to sub again on Wednesday...and am still anxious to work on the stuff I learned in my lesson on Monday.

Just miserable spare shooting in Game 1.

I settled down in Game 2 and switched my insert out for the largest size...still having thumb stick issues with this heat wave. Switched from the Lethal to Loaded Revolver midway through Game 2.

Game 3 started with Big 4 in frame 1...but from then on I stayed clean until the 9th frame when my thumb finally swelled enough that my spare ball got stuck on the shot....looks like I'll have to ask the pro shop guy to widen it a little bit more.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.66 pins
Strikes: 40% (2 turkeys, 1 double, and 6 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a single 2-pin, 3-pin, 4-pin (2x), and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 41% (5/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 169.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 178.67.

Still battling the heat...the lanes are transitioning faster...gotta play more inside than I'm used to...even though it was nice to leave single-pins instead of so many multiple-pin spares...it still adds up to just having trouble holding the pocket and poor carry. I was surprised the strike rate was even that high. It was frustrating for two reasons...first...many of those single-pin leaves...were great shots. And not quite as frustrating, but to be honest; many of those strikes were really, really weak.

But hey....I got to play...helped the last place team take 3 points (or at least didn't cost them enough to lose any)...lowered my average 4 pins...and if I can sub 3 more times...I'll have 21 games in.

Aslan

07-30-2016, 03:25 AM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

484 Series: 133-178-173

Got to sub on Friday again:

Once again, I get brought in after the teams have already started and then need to "catch up"...no practice, no warm-up...nothing. Over the first 9 frames I left a 4-6-10 split, a 3-6-9-10, a 1-2-4-10 washout, and a 1-5-7. In the 10th frame I left a 10-pin...and OF COURSE missed it.

Game 2 I only had two opens; a weird 1-2-7-9 in the 2nd frame and a 3-10 baby split in the 7th frame. But just couldn't seem to get dialed in nor carry.

Game 3 was similar to Game 1; 4 open frames including a missed 3-pin, a 4-9 split, a 1-2-4-8-10, and another 1-2-4-10 washout. The only reason the score is 40 pins higher is I was able to run some strikes together.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.30 pins
Strikes: 30% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 3 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 71% (5/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin (3x).
Also left a single 3-pin, 7-pin, and a pair of 10-pins.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (6/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4-10 washout (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 161.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 168.57.

Glad I got some practice in...but obviously I'm not happy with the performance. Still working on an altered approach that I learned on Monday...and I still had "thumb difficulties" with this friggin weather.

Aslan

08-03-2016, 02:37 PM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

Second night filling in on my old Tuesday team. Now they are down 2 people because one guy is getting divorced from his girlfriend (or something like that) so he has given up bowling...with like 6 weeks left in the summer season.

493 Series: 166-174-153

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.50 pins
Strikes: 17% (2 doubles and 2 singles)
Spares: 68% picked up

Single Pin spares: 69% (9/13)
Most common single-pin leaves: 6-pin (5x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 66% (8/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 5-7 split (3x).

Splits: 50% (2/4)

Average over 3 games: 164.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 177.33.

No need for a game-by-game summary. The stats tell the story. I could just never find the strike line. This center plays SO different than my Wednesday/Friday/Saturday center. It plays wider...it seems to have a drier outside and a drier break point. Meanwhile, my usual center plays much narrower...but isn't very 'dry' on the outside or at the breakpoint. So, on Wednesday/Friday/Saturday...I stand about 23-24...aim in the 12-14 area...if my timing is good...I do okay. But on Tuesdays...I can't play inside of 10 or I miss right of the headpin. If I get too close to the 6-board...the ball loses energy and starts the roll phase about 20ft too soon.

So, at this point...my options appear to be:
1) Find out more details about the patterns so I'm not just guessing.
2) Get input from the experts on how to attack this different pattern (once I figure out the pattern details).
3) I might need to increase my speed to get the ball to get further down the lane before it starts to hook.
4) I might need to move inside and improve my axis tilt/rotation.
5) I might need to go and get a much weaker ball than I am using...something that won't react too early.

Only positive is I left a 5-7 split 3x and actually picked it up twice...and my strike rate wasn't 'great'...but it was okay given I had to spend SO much time and effort shooting spares.

Amyers

08-03-2016, 02:49 PM

Aslan

08-04-2016, 06:33 PM

Aslan from what your describing I doubt the pattern is much flatter it's actually longer which is what's causing you problems. When you have longer patterns balls that spin up faster or have more surface are generally the answer. Have you tried playing the Lethal up the 10-12 area?

Thats a possibility. It 'could' be that the AMF center and my Tuesday center simply have more volume in the middle, delaying the hook and roll motion...then, as the ball encounters friction, it has more energy stored up to make a more distinct move...which to the naked eye looks like a ball hitting a drier area

The only counter to that belief is that I'd expect to see a more angular backend...but not necessarily have to move right much. I'm finding in the Tuesday center...I have to make about a 3 board move right with my eyes and about 5 boards with my feet (also right). So if it's saving up a ton of energy and then releasing more of it at the breakpoint or when it experiences a lower volume oil area...why it is it forcing me 3 boards outside?

All I know is what used to work and what isn't working now. I used to be 160s-190s average throwing 2mph faster, between 5-10 boards (just outside the track). The downside, is that approach style let to me being a 150s-180s bowler at the house nearest me. I am now a 170s-190s bowler at the house nearest to me by losing 2mph and playing closer to 15 than outside 10....but as I try to play in my old Tuesday center...I'm a 150s-180s bowler there. UGHH!!

Oh well. On the bright side, if I know I'm gonna continue to play in both houses...I know that before drilling my next arsenal (1-2 months from now). I usually drill a new arsenal every September.

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

The team I subbed for last week on Wednesday needed me again. In practice I felt good so I decided to enter a few brackets and the sidepot.

603 Series: 207-170-226 (clean)

Got asked to sub again on Wednesday...and am still anxious to work on the stuff I learned in my lesson on Monday.

Game 1 I started off with 5 strikes in 6 frames...then the wheels came off. Picked up another 5-7 (3rd in two nights) in the 10th to save my 200+ game.

Game 2 only had 3 opens...but switching between the Lethal Revolver on the left lane and Loaded Revolver on the right lane...just couldn't get my strike line back. Fortunately, the other team pooed the bed and my team bowled out of their minds (besides me) and we took a second point...this made a grouchy old man on the other team very upset. I've met a LOT of old bowling curmudgeons in my day...and hope to become one someday...but WOW! This guy takes the cake. When I got a split in the 10th frame of the first game...he actually mumbled something like "serves ya right." And that wasn't "jokingly".

Game 3 I stayed with the Loaded Revolver to finish things out. I was still alive in one bracket and early on couldn't seem to strike...I think maybe the alcohol was kicking in...but I put a 4-bagger together to salvage a decent score and win my money back (from sidepots and brackets and sub-fee).

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.97 pins
Strikes: 43% (2 4-baggers, 1 double, and 4 singles)
Spares: 76% picked up

Single Pin spares: 88% (8/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 33% (1/3)

Average over 3 games: 201.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 204.33.

I felt good. No thumb issues. I was dressed more casually...just a t-shirt and gym shorts...so I was comfortable. Probably could have used a weaker ball than the loaded revolver to carry even better. I was hitting pretty heavy...which is why I left a 9-pin and no 8-pins.

The other team wasn't very happy though. They had a grouchy guy on their team that looks to be about ready to give up bowling to find something else to aggravate him. At the end of the night, he made it a point to tell me, "Ya know....you couldn't have done this 10 years ago! There used to be rules that the subs had to be within a certain range of the person they are subbing for. This is bull ***t!"...he then left.

Now, was there ever a rule? Probably. Would it have affected me? Probably not. I came into that night averaging 185 and was subbing for a guy that averaged 165. I mean, in Game 2 I bowled 15 pins under my average...and out of 3 games...I only had the highest game once. Two of their better, older, lower average bowlers beat me scratch AND got more handicap.

And here's the REAL reason...I call BS. I sit in that bar at least twice a week...waiting to sub for anyone that wants me. Most nights, teams bowl with a vacancy, take a 10-point hit per game...and lose $5 from their prize fund. THAT team...never asked me to sub for them. If a guy didn't show, they'd be one of the last teams to ask for a sub. Yet, despite having plenty of opportunity to get a sub...these teams also love to whine when other teams actually use a sub against them. I could see a valid arguement if it's a competitive league and during a crucial run at the end of the season, some team brings in a sub every week to take 1st place. I get that. But I subbed for a team in 2nd to last place...last week, this week, and next week.

Amyers

08-04-2016, 09:11 PM

First off nice set. Second the longer oil gives the ball less distance to hook over so you have to move right. The ball will hook more on a 40ft pattern than it will on a 45ft.

Aslan

08-06-2016, 03:13 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

522 Series: 183-178-161

Got to sub on Friday again. Was looking forward to it given my 600+ series Wednesday. I also finally used MWhite's ball spinner that he gave me (thanks again!) and both revolvers were looking like new (not counting various scratches and gouges).

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.58 pins
Strikes: 39% (1 turkey, 1 double, and 8 singles)
Spares: 65% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (3/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x).
Also left a single 6-pin and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 71% (10/14)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4 and 6-10 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 174.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 185.67.

No need for a game-by-game breakdown...all 3 games were a couple open frames and a hodge podge of marks. The stats were generally better and more in line with what I'm capable of...but I couldn't run the strikes together and you just can't be successful with poor corner-pin spare shooting. Maybe I can work in some low-ball sometime this coming week.

I may play with the surface a little on the Lethal Revolver...maybe (now that I have the ball spinner) I'll try the Dark Encounter next week...it's been awhile since I used it on those lanes. I just think the polished Le. Revolver is going too long to start...but I know if I put much surface on it...it's gonna go left too soon. Maybe if instead use the lower RG Dark Encounter...with a polished finish...maybe that gives me a better look (1st ball out of the bag) and I can use the Le. Revolver with some surface and no polish on Tuesday nights.

But, helped the team I subbed for take all 4 points...and the opposing team asked me to sub for them next week...so I'll try to get them those 4 points back next Friday!!

Aslan

08-10-2016, 03:31 PM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

The league voted that I could participate at sweeps despite ending up 3 games shy of 21 before Sweeps/Vegas. So, now...even a bad night like tonight can have the 'bright side' that it's going to help me win $$ in Vegas.

440 Series: 130-162-148

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.53 pins
Strikes: 34% (1 double and 9 singles)
Spares: 28% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a single 3-pin, 6-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 15% (2/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-10 and 5-6-10 split (2x each).

Splits: 0% (0/7)

Average over 3 games: 146.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 154.00.

Wow. My most abysmal outing in a long time and NOT what I needed going into a weekend where I'll be doing the ABT.

My main problem tonight was I was "playing" with the surfaces using my new ball spinner...and I think I overdid it a bit on the Lethal Revolver...and I tried to switch to the Dark Encounter...which I put a nice 1500-2000 abralon surface on...and that ball hooked SO early....that it entered the roll phase about 2/3 of the way down the lane. Still can't seem to figure out low RG equipment. So, we'll work on the surfaces today to get them ready for Wednesday and Friday at my regular house...and then I'll have to decide what I want to do with the Lethal Revolver. I think I'm gonna polish both balls...and put the Dark Encounter back in the #1 slot of the arsenal. That ball just hooks WAY too soon on THS. I have to talk about it with my coach at the next lesson this afternoon.

Other than that, spare shooting was rotten for the 2nd straight outing...I forgot I was going to get some spare shooting practice in pre-league...I'll have to remember for next time.

vdubtx

08-10-2016, 03:51 PM

My main problem tonight was I was "playing" with the surfaces using my new ball spinner...and I think I overdid it a bit on the Lethal Revolver...and I tried to switch to the Dark Encounter...which I put a nice 1500-2000 abralon surface on.

Well, was it 1500 or 2000? There is a difference in terms of reaction.

Aslan

08-11-2016, 04:46 PM

Well, was it 1500 or 2000? There is a difference in terms of reaction.

Unless you always use a fresh pad...you can get a 1500ish surface from a worn 1000 abralon pad. I don't think they even make a 1500 abralon pad. They make a 1500 SiaAir pad...but I've never seen 1500 abralon. So, I used a really worn 1000 pad.

Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

The team I subbed for last week on Wednesday needed me again.

571 Series: 158-212-201

Had me lesson at 4:00PM in Fullerton...and these last couple lessons the coach is really trying to get me lower and working on a lot of physical stuff...both the last two lessons my body ended up sore afterwards. I was pretty tired, but already told a guy I'd sub for him...so I was locked in.

Game 1 I chopped a 1-2-4-8 washout, then 2 straight 5-7 splits. This is the second week in a row I've had this problem of leaving 5-7s. Frustrating. Then another open on a chopped bucket in the 7th. I didn't cause the team to lose (thanks to the other team bowling out of their minds)...but I certainly put them at risk.

Game 2 I did well, the only open was a 4-9 split in the 7th.

Game 3 I did really well...just missed a couple single-pins...so, I might try VDub's method of targeting the pins on Friday league.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.97 pins <exactly the same as last week>
Strikes: 42% (2 turkeys, 3 doubles, and 3 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (6/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x).
Also left a single 9-pin (2x) and a single 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (5/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 4-7 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 190.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 198.33.

I felt good. No thumb issues.

I put a coat of polish on the Dark Encounter...over the top of that 1500ish sanding...and that worked better than when I just left the ball unpolished. I finished things up with the Lethal Revolver in Game 3 and it also was working much better with the coat of polish over the wet sanded surface I put on it. I think I'm gonna resurface the Lethal Revolver because that experimental sanding job I did on it didn't work well.

Well, at least I got my 21 games in. So I'll have at least one league worth of average to get booked. Granted, it's at 188 now...which doesn't do me too many favors...but at least it's a legitimate 188 versus the 190/192 averages at the ultra-easy AMF house.

Aslan

08-13-2016, 10:12 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

Got asked to sub by the team I bowled against last week...which is kind've a compliment.

589 Series: 184-246-159

Game 1 I only had two opens...a 6-7-10 split in the 1st frame and a chopped 3-6 in the 7th frame...but that was enough to keep me out of the 200s.

Game 2 I opened AGAIN in the 1st frame with a 6-7-10 split! :mad: Then I rattled off an 8-bagger before opening in the 10th on a single 10-pin. :rolleyes: But, 8 strikes in a row certainly turned some heads on the nearby lanes.

Game 3 I struck 3 out of 5 times...the other lane was a poo-parade. A 4-6 split in the opening frame (3rd leadoff split) didn't help...but missing a 4-7in the 5th and a 6-10 in the 8th were what did me in.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.72 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 8-bagger, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (2/3)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (2x).
Also left a single 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 45% (5/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 6-7-10 split (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 196.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 200.33.

It was a long shot that I roll my first 700-series or even best my 689...I mean, the 184 to start kinda put the nail in those coffins. But I was really, really ON...and that 246 was looking like almost a lock to be a 269+ game...but that evil little 10-pin. Ugh!!

Aslan

08-14-2016, 02:46 AM

ABT Tournament:
Older Brunswick synthetics: heavy oil

This weekend the ABT tournament was free entry for members so since I paid for a membership, I figured I'd take advantage...even if it was in Southern California's hernia known as Rancho Cucamonga.

674 Series: 194-256 (clean)-224

Game 1 was spare shooting...should have been a 214. At this point I figured I wasn't "out of it", but I needed a couple really strong games. Starting in the 9th frame I X, X, X, 9 and was starting to figure out the pattern. I was 6 and 6 right of my usual starting place, with my strongest ball, and was moving my target closer vertically....pretty much every trick in the book to gave that ball time to hook despite what appeared to be a fairly long pattern. I also had trouble with sticking (shoes) a bit...which doesn't surprise me given it was at a Brunswick Zone Kiddie Birthday Palooza center.

Game 2 was strong...ties for 5th on my top 5 scores ever. Clean...mostly solid strikes. Despite the low RG of the Dark Encounter...that pattern was not allowing for much movement. Some people seemed to have some idea of the pattern ahead of time because the veteran guys looked like they had some sanded equipment. I had just de-oiled and used the MWhite ball spinner to give it a once over with the 2000 abralon pad, then polish. I thought about leaving it sanded...not polishing it...but I didn't think the pattern would be much different than a THS. So, my line was really tight...I had to lay it down about midway between the dots and arrows...within 2 boards each direction...without muscling...and it seemed to go straight down and then make a slight move into the pocket...almost a straight ball watching it.

I was pretty pumped up after the game, because I struck out in the 10th...which I've not been doing much lately...and everything felt good.

Going into Game 3, I somehow added things wrong in my head...and thought if I got a 200+ game, I would have my first 700-series. I think I counted the 50 pins of handicap so I thought I needed a 200 game for 700 when I actually needed another 250+ game. The first 2 frames, I missed back-to-back corner-pin spares, then a double and a couple spares and a 6-bagger to strike out for (what I thought was) a 724...but it turned out to be a 674...my 4th highest series.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.47 pins
Strikes: 63% (1 6-bagger, 1 5-bagger, 2 turkeys, 2 doubles and 2 singles)
Spares: 66% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 6-pin and 10-pin (2x each).
Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 3-pin, nor 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 100% (4/4)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: n/a

Average over 3 games: 224.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 239.00.

I decided to stay and bowl the final squad but resisted the urge to take my new found game and get in brackets and sidepots. I asked around and most tournaments the guys said the cut line was around +120...and that may +149 would 'probably' guarantee me a spot in the finals tomorrow. So, it was free, I figured the only thing bad that could happen is suddenly bowling terrible or injuring myself....TO BE CONTINUED....

Aslan

08-14-2016, 03:02 AM

ABT Tournament: Squad 2
Older Brunswick synthetics: medium-heavy oil

474 Series: 170-130-157

Game 1 I was doing fine...just trying to figure out how these lanes were playing...made my spares, just not much carry and bad shots. I switched to the Lethal Revolver in the 10th frame. Figured I could still have a good series...just had to get back in that groove.

Game 2 the physical game and mental game were under assault. I was sweating...a LOT. This bowling alley was in a parking lot, in the middle of dust and we're still stuck in this stupid heat wave. My thumb was starting to stick. Finally I got it figured out in the strike ball...then it was happening in the spare ball...then the VISE insert was too big and I dropped the ball...just horrible. And 5 beautiful, pocket hits that left either a 7-pin or a 10-pin.

Game 3 I switched to the Loaded Revolver, but at that point I was already mentally out in the parking lot...wasn't quite as bad as the score indicates...but a couple splits and a couple chopped spares...and there it is.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.03 pins
Strikes: 25% (2 doubles and 4 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin (3x).
Also left a single 10-pin (2x) and a single 2-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 43% (7/16)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 152.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 158.33.

Well...at least I didn't get injured. My confidence is now shot...but at least I made the cut. I finished ahead of a Under 20 State Youth Champion and a pro staffer...and I was probably one of at most a handful of bowlers there that didn't have at least one sanctioned 300-game. I felt out of place given most of these guys had their names on the back of their jerseys.

So...if I can get up and traffic isn't terrible...I'll bowl a few games to get the kinks out...see what the pattern looks like...then my first ever "Finals" in a tournament. I finished 9th among 18.

ytlas

08-14-2016, 10:52 AM

Good luck today

I see the ABT is going to be at your home house in a month.

Amyers

08-14-2016, 01:46 PM

Goof luck Aslan stay out of your head and throw good balls

Aslan

08-15-2016, 01:45 AM

:mad:

POO.

75 minute drive, practice seemed to go okay, but the approaches were sticky...which is common in all the Brunswick houses I've been to lately...not to mention it's still brutally hot out here so that doesn't help. It was single-game elimination format so if I didn't make the top 14 of 26...I was done...no first game slumping allowed.

When we started, one of the tournament officials said to watch the scoring machine because it was giving them trouble in the AM squad. I struck, then came in light and opened on a 1-2-5-8, then struck again. In the 4th frame I left a rare single 1-pin and picked it up but the score thing messed up so the guy changed it. I struck again...third strike in a row on the left lane. I picked up a 6-9-10 in the 6th with my spare ball and then picked up a 4-7 in the 7th. I figured I could strike out and maybe have an outside shot at making the first cut...but I threw a gutter on the next ball because I went up a VISE insert and the ball just slid off. I had a couple more spares and picked them up.

The tournament guys were picking up the scoring papers and wrote down the wrong number then corrected it. But I noticed it said 144 instead of 154. I figured I must have fat fingered it in Pinpal so I had them expand the scoring to show all 10 frames...by the time they figured it out...the score was already turned in. It turned out the scoring machine didn't give me credit for picking up the 6-9-10 in the 6th. At that point they said there wasn't anything they could do about it...and I figured no sense in arguing since I wasn't making any cut...I doubt it it'll matter much in terms of payout.

So, about 1.5 hours in traffic home...and I'm back to being a 170s-180s bowler.

I need to get lower. I'm starting to see why I'm having so much trouble getting good ball motion...consistently. If I can't find a way to get lower...I'm coming too far behind or on top of the ball. If I can stay under the ball by staying low...it naturally is behind the ball. If I don't get low or I raise up... = weak release. Granted I figured that out when I struck on the last shot of the game. Oh well.

NewToBowling

08-15-2016, 09:47 AM

People in Southern CA have no idea what brutally hot is, but it's all relative I guess :)

Nice shooting though. Hopefully you keep it up.

Amyers

08-15-2016, 09:59 AM

Aslan

08-17-2016, 06:00 PM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

491 Series: 135-173-183

Game 1 was 3 splits and only 1 strike. Spare shooting could have been better...but even had I picked up the make-able ones, I'd have only come away with a 156.

Game 2 I only had two opens...a 4-6-7 split in the 2nd...and a 7-pin in the 6th. But, despite 4 strikes...just couldn't run anything together.

Game 3 I started off hot, but a missed 4-pin in the 6th then a another missed 7-pin in the 8th...I think I was mentally spent.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.75 pins
Strikes: 31% (1 turkey and 7 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 60% (6/10)
Most common single-pin leaves: 7-pin (4x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 6-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 45% (5/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a

Splits: 25% (1/4)

Average over 3 games: 163.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 176.33.

Not sure what this pattern is and I keep forgetting to ask. It almost seems to be playing shorter...kinda like what Amyers described. I was all around the headpin tonight...but it seemed like I couldn't create any angle...and on the few shots I did (create angle)...the ball didn't seem to have any energy in the pocket. I could see a shorter pattern...that might be the problem.

I tried to move my target in halfway between the arrows and dots...to try to give it more time to read the lanes...but maybe thats the opposite of what I should be doing...maybe I should move that target out further...use a little loft...channel my inner Mika...and give that ball less time to read the lanes and lose energy? Or maybe I fiddle with my speed...use a faster speed/longer approach at that house....which I'm terrified of doing as it'll probably mess up my timing.

The polishing appears to be a must though...maybe even more so going forward. If the pattern IS short and I'm losing energy...I don't need to surface the balls...I need to polish them all or just use the Loaded Revolver or something.

I also have the fear that by the time I get this figured out...it'll be just in time for sweeps...and literally the entire league of 200+ people are going to hate my guts if I stroll into Vegas with a 165 average and drop a 670 series on them...they are NOT going to be happy.

Aslan

08-18-2016, 02:57 AM

Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

544 Series: 163-208-173

Game 1 I couldn't seem to carry...a couple opens...decent spare shooting.

Game 2 I opened on a washout in the 2nd and a 6-7 split in the 6th...but I ran enough strikes together to salvage a 200+ game.

Game 3 I just made bad shots...but I got lucky a couple times and then struck out in the 10th to salvage the 173.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.71 pins
Strikes: 42% (2 turkeys, 2 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 68% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (7/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin, 9-pin, and 10-pin (2x each).
Also left a single 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (6/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5-8 bucket (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 181.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Me and another sub helped the team stomp their opponents and take all 4 points. Makes up for the 3-4 points I cost them when I subbed against them.

Still messing with the ball spinner MWhite gave me...and I just don't think this house's shot works well with anything that isn't polished. The Dark Encounter at 2000 abralon (not polished) was hitting like a wet noodle. The Lethal Revolver (360 then 500 Abralon then polished) in late Game 1 and early Game 2 was just not working...finally I had to get out the Loaded Revolver that is just OOB polished and did well.

RobLV1

08-18-2016, 06:26 AM

Aslan

08-18-2016, 03:22 PM

From my own experience, polished balls seem to work a whole lot better in the hot weather. Now that you have your own spinner, don't be afraid to polish up some balls for the next month or so, and put surface back on when the weather cools down.

Yeah. That's what I'm thinking. Anybody have experience using a ball spinner and how to PROPERLY sand/polish bowling balls? And yes, I know SOME of you do. Because I'm not sure if I'm doing the polishing/sanding correctly.

For sanding...I'm just spinning it, applying pressure, then flipping the ball over and repeating. But I'm not sure how long I should sand each time...is there a standard way to flip the ball around?

For polishing...I've always applied a generous coat of resin polish....let it dry to a white film...then hand polished it with a cotton cloth. Now that I have the spinner, I polish it the same way...then put it on the spinner to remove the polish with the cloth.

bowl1820

08-18-2016, 03:40 PM

Take a look at my bowlers grit chart, it has several charts showing grit combos and sanding times. Plus a chart to show the 6 sides of a bowling ball.

Bowling Grit Chart:
http://home.earthlink.net/~litefrozen/downloads/bowling_grit_chart_v2.pdf

The important thing on a spinner is not to lean on (apply excessive pressure to) your abrasives let them do the work of cutting.

With polishes (or cleaners) don't use more than is needed. A lot of bottles say Use generous amount or use liberally, that just makes you waste it.

JasonNJ

08-18-2016, 03:54 PM

Yeah. That's what I'm thinking. Anybody have experience using a ball spinner and how to PROPERLY sand/polish bowling balls? And yes, I know SOME of you do. Because I'm not sure if I'm doing the polishing/sanding correctly.

For sanding...I'm just spinning it, applying pressure, then flipping the ball over and repeating. But I'm not sure how long I should sand each time...is there a standard way to flip the ball around?

For polishing...I've always applied a generous coat of resin polish....let it dry to a white film...then hand polished it with a cotton cloth. Now that I have the spinner, I polish it the same way...then put it on the spinner to remove the polish with the cloth.

You can usually email your ball manufacturer and they'll tell you how to resurface your ball. Storm used to have a resurfacing guide on their website but with their website redesign, my link to is gone.

bowl1820

08-18-2016, 04:12 PM

You can usually email your ball manufacturer and they'll tell you how to resurface your ball. Storm used to have a resurfacing guide on their website but with their website redesign, my link to is gone.

Here's the one thats on the storm site at the moment

http://www.stormbowling.com/medias/Resurfacing_Guide_2012.pdf

There was a newer one than that, but the recent ones are basically the same just styled different.

Amyers

08-18-2016, 08:16 PM

I learned using bowls charts I have them printed out and pasted on the wall where the washtub is that I use the spinner in

NewToBowling

08-19-2016, 01:02 PM

Mike not be such a bad guy if he gave you a free ball spinner

Aslan

08-24-2016, 06:27 PM

Mike not be such a bad guy if he gave you a free ball spinner

No Ice...he's like most Mikes...he's a far cooler guy when you get to know him.

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

529 Series: 160-162-207

As the scores hint to, Games 1 and 2 were almost identical. 2 splits and an open...in Game 1 it was 2-4-10 split in the 4th, a 1-2-4-10 washout in the 6th...then a 5-7 split in the 10th. The right lane was NOT my friend! In Game 2, it was a 4-7-10 in the 3rd, a 4-6 split in the 4th, and a chopped 6-10 in the 6th. Each game I think I scattered a few strikes about. Game 1 I tried the Dark Encounter...but it seemed to either go through nose (and leave me with a split) or miss right and leave me a washout.

Game 3 I switched to the Loaded Revolver....which is the only ball I have in my arsenal that I haven't screwed up on the ball spinner. Had a 3-10 baby split in the 3rd that I couldn't convert...but just as many strikes as Game 1 and 2 combined and I even ran a few of them together.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.62 pins
Strikes: 37% (1 turkey and 9 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (6/6)
Most common single-pin leaves: 2-pin and 10-pin (2x).
Also left a single 5-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 46% (6/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/5)

Average over 3 games: 176.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a

What's funny (in an aggravating way)...is that last week had I picked up all my single-pin spares....my average would have been 176.33. So, essentially, the only stat to pay any attention to is that this week I picked up 100% of my spares....last week only 60%. Every other stat is not only close to last week....but meaningless. Hey....13/13 on single-pin spares in the last 2 outings...maybe I can put together an epic run like Norm Duke...go 3 years never missing one. Probably not though.

Our team would have swept this team...but our anchor was home sick with food poisoning and our team is already down a bowler...so -20 pins per game...we won the first game by like 8-9 pins, they won the 3rd game by 21-24 pins, and we won the 3rd game by 8-9 pins...and I think we lost total points by just 5 pins. This team was very nice though...I like it when the other team makes a point to shake everyone's hand at the end of the match...too many teams have given up on that, IMO.

I'm still a fish out of water on this pattern...so I need to fine tune my equipment. I just can't seem to find a breakpoint...or maybe too much surface is leading to the weak hits...not sure??? Sweeps at South Pointe in Vegas in a couple weekends. I get there early...so I'll get some practice in...this is an important sweeps for me because:

A) I'm entering with about a 165-170 average. Last sweeps I entered with an average in the 160s...I finished 4th or 6th and it was the only sweeps where my winnings almost covered my trip. That was at the Orleans...where I had bowled about 35 games. This'll be at South Point...where I only have about 10 games in.

B) Currently I don't really have a "job" per se. At least not in the usual sense. I have taken on some hobbies as projects...but Mudpuppy Cliff Notes version....any free Vegas money that doesn't involve an STD, selling hair or blood, pawning something, or an Oceans Eleven style crime...would be welcomed at this point.

So yeah...if I can time things just right...where I've adjusted to a tougher pattern...yet my average hasn't recovered...I at least got a 'shot' at some serious dough. And if I get serious dough...I need to not blow it all at the craps table before I leave Vegas. But, one thing at a time.

Amyers

08-25-2016, 09:11 AM

Game 3 I switched to the Loaded Revolver....which is the only ball I have in my arsenal that I haven't screwed up on the ball spinner. Had a 3-10 baby split in the 3rd that I couldn't convert...but just as many strikes as Game 1 and 2 combined and I even ran a few of them together.

.

So what's the problem with the balls on the spinner? Maybe we can help.

Aslan

09-02-2016, 05:49 AM

So what's the problem with the balls on the spinner? Maybe we can help.

Just the same ole issue with surface manipulation. Seems like on a THS in the summer...there's really no point to anything but a polished ball.

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

538 Series: 164-173-201

Like last week, Games 1 and 2 I just couldn't find my line...and the spare shooting was sub-par.

I struck almost as much in Game 3 as the first 2 games combined. But a missed 4-pin in the 2nd frame and a 4-6 split in the 9th frame kept the score down.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.82 pins
Strikes: 39% (1 4-bagger, 2 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 5-pin (3x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 7-pin, 8-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 54% (6/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 179.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 193.00.

Still struggling to find my line at that house. One more week, then sweeps. And next season the team has two new bowlers so I'll be the 6th man...probably'll never get my line figured out there.

RobLV1

09-02-2016, 05:55 AM

Join the club! Polish in the summer. Surface in the winter. The entire southwest is a desert, after all!

Aslan

09-02-2016, 06:07 AM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

576 Series: 196-212-168

Game 1 I couldn't seem to carry...a couple opens...decent spare shooting...finally started striking to salvage a decent game.

Game 2, only open was on a chopped 3-6-10 in the 4th.

Game 3 I lost my line...and missed my first single-pin in the 10th.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.72 pins
Strikes: 43% (2 4-baggers, 1 double, and 4 singles)
Spares: 66% picked up

Single Pin spares: 80% (4/5)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x).
Also left a single 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 61% (8/13)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5-8 bucket (2x)

Splits: 50% (1/2)

Average over 3 games: 192.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 196.00.

Then there's nights like these where I start to feel like I'm on the 'verge' of something.

Aslan

09-07-2016, 04:07 AM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, tougher house pattern

535 Series: 146-212(clean)-177

Game 1 I was baby split, single 4-pin, and a chopped 1-2-8-10 away from an All-Spare game. The Dark Encounter and Lethal Revolver were just losing way too much energy on what was playing like a rather dry pattern.

Game 2 I was a couple frames away from a Dutch 200...but a couple doubles helped push the clean game over 200.

Game 3 the lanes started to transition and I probably needed to ball down to a weaker/longer ball...but the Loaded Revolver was as weak as I had. Had a turkey, but also had 3 straight opens...so that led to the 177.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.35 pins
Strikes: 29% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 3 singles)
Spares: 68% picked up

Single Pin spares: 57% (4/7)
Most common single-pin leaves: 4-pin and 10-pin (2x each).
Also left a single 2-pin, 3-pin, and 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 73% (11/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 178.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 186.00.

Took all 3 games and total points...and since it was position week...we at WORST...finished the league 2nd to last in the standings (30 teams). Since it was position week, we got $13 each for our efforts. Going into sweeps with a 170 average...so if I can just figure out South Point...I got a real chance to score some $$$.

I've only bowled 7 games at South Pointe...average in the mid 170s with a 40% strike rate and very below average spare shooting. I'll need better spare shooting to have a decent shot.

Aslan

09-08-2016, 08:28 PM

Pre-Sweeps Practice: South Point (Las Vegas)

Normally, I'd come to Vegas on Thursday, practice in the AM and PM on Friday, then Sweep on Saturday, then leave Saturday night. But, I got a stupid time share voucher that was about to expire...so I came out yesterday...and am trying to get some work done...before a teammate (female) flies in later tonight. Once she gets here...any chance of getting any work done or practice in is out the window. Normally I wouldn't care...but I'm not too "into" this gal...and I'd really rather be home in Cali writing than spending 4 days in the desert surrounded by hookers, sadness, and desperation...which pretty much sums up the majority of Vegas.

But...I came all this way...I have a 170 average going into sweeps...so I have a real shot at cashing...so I gotta put the practice in. However, given that I won't get my usual 12-24 games in the Friday before...I needed to make this practice count.

Warm-up/Practice: 181

698 Series: 219-202-277 (clean)

Had a little trouble early on trying to get lined up just right...and made a couple bad shots...but I can't complain about a 219. I asked my coach about surfacing for South Point/Sweeps and she recommended sanding the Dark Encounter to 2000 abralon (no polish). And to surface the Lethal Revolver to 500 abralon, then polish. But, I couldn't find my 2000 pads...so I surfaced the Dark Encounter to 1500 SiaAir (no polish).

Game 2, I switched to the Lethal Revolver midway through...but it seemed like every slight miss or slight inconsistency with my approach/release...and the Le. Revolver would hit weak. I actually used a 360 Abralon, then 500, then resin polish...so it has quite a bit of surface on it, all be it under the polish.

Game 3 was my 2nd best game I've ever rolled. 2-3 of the strikes were questionable...(spills, light hits, etc...)...but for the most part, I was dialed in standing with my left toe on 14-15, targeting 6-7 midway between the dots and the arrows. I ended up making a 1:2 move left later in the Game...and had to fine tune my mental game when the pinsetter broke down after the 9th frame...but obviously I'm happy with my 2nd highest ever non-sanctioned game and my highest non-sanctioned series...and I managed to get a clean game as well.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.04 pins
Strikes: 64% (2 4-baggers, 4 doubles, and 7 singles)
Spares: 62% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single pin leave: 7-pin (3x)
Also left a single 10-pin (2x) and a single 2-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 60% (6/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5-8 bucket (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 6 games: 219.75.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 222.25.

First off, lets make sure we calm our expectations. Like my only perfect game (non-sanctioned)...this was on lanes that had a morning league bowl on them (not fresh conditions)...it was ONE lane...not a pair. And this isn't the first time I've had a really good game or two in Vegas. If I average 158-174 Saturday...today will be even more irritating than it is encouraging.

Second, DESPITE the score, I wasn't perfect...still room for improvement. I was rolling the ball better, above average accuracy, and was getting under the ball more. BUT...my forward spine tilt was off...I continue to bob up and down in my approach...and I was playing 5-7 with my strongest ball...up and in...on a non-fresh pattern; that doesn't leave me much room for error tomorrow if we have fresh conditions. And my spare shooting was below average...which wasn't a HUGE problem...when you strike 65% of the time. But, it WILL be if I struggle to strike on Saturday.

ON PAPER...with a 170 average (9 pins lower than in my Friday league (sub), 18 pins below my Wednesday league (sub), and 20-22 pins below book)...rolling a 650-700 series scratch would almost COMPLETELY GUARANTEE that I (for the first time ever) leave Vegas with more money than I came with. We're talking probably in the $1200-$1400 range...or about 3x more than the most I've EVER won bowling.

BUT...for you lovers of DRAMA DRAMA DRAMA...and I wish Ice was still around for this potential poo-storm....but some interesting notes going into this Sweeps:

1) I entered this league with a 164 average, 28 pins below my book. The "reason" for this...I think....is the league secretary used my last league average in that league...from the Fall 2014/2015 league (164) and NOT the following Summer 2015 league where I averaged 173.

2) I entered this league to replace a bowler on my old team who had unexpectedly quit. They were down two bowlers...so I agreed to fill in for the last 6 weeks (18 games....this is important....see below).

3) I asked the League Secretary if I could go to Vegas with the team and she said, that per the rules...I needed 21 games before Vegas and I would only have 18 if I bowled every one of the last 6 weeks. She called a meeting of all the team captains...to see if they would agree to let me bowl at Sweeps...despite not having 21 games. Since I had bowled in this league previously...AND...they saw my average in the 160s...a name they didn't recognize as a high roller in the area...and figured I wasn't a threat...they unanimously approved letting me go.

As almost any experienced bowler can see by reading the above...given a 698 practice series...coming in with a 170 average (I raised it 1-pin per week bowling)...getting coaching twice-a-month for the past year...from two of the best coaches in the World...finishing 2nd place in two straight PBA50 Pro-Ams...and recently making the cashing round in only my second ABT tournament...there is a HIGH liklihood that not only will I bowl a 650 handicap series even if I bowl badly...but there as an almost CERTAINTY...that I am about to become the biggest sandbagging story in recent memory. If I do what I feel like I'm about to do...EVERY bowler in this league...will HATE me. HATE me. Granted, I'm only gonna be a sub for my current team next season...but still.

Aslan

09-08-2016, 09:01 PM

Oh...I forgot to add this regarding Game 3....the only non-strike of the game was a 7 / on a 3-6-10 leave when I pulled the shot (badly).

Blacksox1

09-08-2016, 11:36 PM

698 Series: 219-202-277 (clean). Good job! :)

COMPLETELY GUARANTEE that I (for the first time ever) leave Vegas with more money than I came with. We're talking probably in the $1200-$1400 range...or about 3x more than the most I've EVER won bowling.

Positive thinking, I like it! :)

there as an almost CERTAINTY...that I am about to become the biggest sandbagging story in recent memory. If I do what I feel like I'm about to do...EVERY bowler in this league...will HATE me. HATE me

If they do hate you, it means that you are doing things well. You could be the Notre Dame of bowling ! ! ! :D

2handedsniper

09-09-2016, 02:38 AM

is the 698 with or without ABT handicap

ytlas

09-09-2016, 08:54 AM

IMO if you buy into doubles with half the league, then shoot a big set, it will look like you were sandbagging. If you aren't in with many people they could write it off to getting hot at the right time.

Amyers

09-09-2016, 09:08 AM

Regardless congratulations on a nice set good luck

fortheloveofbowling

09-09-2016, 09:47 AM

Nice set with the 698 Aslan.

mc_runner

09-09-2016, 04:37 PM

Nice series!

Aslan

09-10-2016, 08:51 PM

is the 698 with or without ABT handicap

No ABT handicap in pre-sweeps practicing..that was a legitimate scratch 698.

Thanks all. I could have added another HUGE positive...but I didn't find out till today. Of the 7 high-average bowlers (200+) in this league (it's a lower than average scoring house in Orange County)...the BEST and most talented (without question) bowler...sandbagging his way to another huge $$$ sweeps with a 211 (tied for 2nd best average to a 219)...adding ANOTHER perfect game to his resume this season...

...well, that guy got in a car accident and fractured/broke his wrist 1-2 weeks ago...so there really were only 6 legitimate "high-average" bowlers to beat...and they were the least talented of the 7.

So...I've been positive thinking the POO out of it...trying to just stay confident, stay positive, stay optimistic...I didn't do any marathon practices...didn't even bring my ball dehydrator with me to Vegas. I figured the trip has cost me about $670 total...paid another $55 to get in brackets...so if I just could manage to win about $750...I figure my trip was paid for.

...TO BE CONTINUED.... (I forgot to copy the Pinpal text)

Aslan

09-10-2016, 09:27 PM

Sweeps: South Point (Las Vegas)

538 Series: 165-182-191
Game 1 I made some good shots...but struggled early with footing issues...a bit stickier than where I practiced. Once I missed a single 7-pin in the 3rd frame followed by a 2-10 split in the 4th frame...I was definitely going to miss the single 10-pin in frame 6...and I did.

I thought, maybe, true to form, I would struggle out of the gates when I'm amped up...before I settled down. I guess I was hoping that slow start would be a 180-185 game...not a game that is 5 pins below my average. Not to mention, the extra money I put in brackets was just about worthless when you struggle out of the gate like that.

I started out targeting 6-7 and standing left toe on 14. But there must have been either more oil left on the lanes...or maybe it was too dry/dirty on the outside causing the ball to lose energy...I tried adjusting right...but playing the 1-5 boards are NOT my forte. I switched to the Lethal Revolver in the 5th frame of Game 1...earlier than I normally would...but I was banking on the issue being the ball losing energy (vs the lanes too oily)...and I needed to start striking given that I was in the hole after 4 frames AND strugglin with corner pins.

Game 2 wasn't a whole lot better. I actually had 3 opens, same as Game 1, but struck out from the 9th to salvage the higher score.

Game 3 I felt more relaxed, and got some confidence back. I couldn't seem to run any strikes together, but I kept things clean until the 10th, when I left a 1-5-8-9 and chopped it...costing my a 200-game AND a clean game...AND probably some $$$.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.94 pins
Strikes: 45% (1 4-bagger, a double, and 9 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common single pin leaves: 7-pin and 10-pin (2x each)
Never left a single 3-pin, 5-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 44% (4/9)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4-10 and 2-4-5 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 179.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 185.33.

Single-pin spare shooting wasn't as bad as I thought. Once it psyched me out early...I recovered and made the rest of them. Just couldn't quite carry nor run anything together to compete.

And it's too bad...because of the 6 high average (200+) bowlers...only 1 of them really had a good series. The same-ole-bowlers didn't win the big money this year. Some of them bowled a good game...but the big winners this year were a couple women bowlers that just had series' of their lives...a 187 bowler that really only bowls well at that one house and always poos the bed in Vegas...this time he didn't....a 176 and a 178 bowler. So it was nice to see new blood doing well rather than same ole/same ole.

I only won $102...spent $60...so I came away up $42 from bowling...which means I'm only out about $570 on the trip thus far. Dinner tonight...gas tomorrow...probably end up costing $650-$700 total. Disappointing...for sure...given the opportunities this sweeps presented...but, I didn't bowl "horribly". I'll be changing out the arsenal the end of this month...maybe I'll get another 6-24 games out of them before then.

Aslan

09-17-2016, 06:54 PM

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

587 Series: 190-202 (clean)-195

A weird chopped 1-3-6-8 in the 2nd frame of Game 1....clean the rest of the way until a missed single 4-pin in the 3rd frame of Game 3...but only 8 strikes (2 doubles) in that time period. Fortunately I put a 5-bagger together in Game 3 before opening in the 9th on a chopped 1-2-4-10.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.79 pins
Strikes: 42% (1 5-bagger, 2 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 68% picked up

Single Pin spares: 81% (9/11)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 5-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (4/8)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2 (2x)

Splits: n/a

Average over 3 games: 195.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 200.00.

This was a weird sub situation because I was subbing for a team that was missing their two 'bowlers'...so I was bowling with two bowlers that had about 100 averages....one of whom said she was battling pneumonia. :eek: And they were up against the 1st place team...that rarely lost in 12 weeks.

So, I figured my 'job' was to bowl my best...and just allow the other two players the chance to get a point here and there. I would have felt 'weird' ( I don't want to say 'bad') if I just came in there and stole 3-4 points from the 1st place team...just subbing. I've already had two instances where the opposing team wasn't too happy that I subbed against them...taking 3-4 points, with two 100-average bowlers, when the 1st place team had only lost 9.5 points in 12 weeks...seems a bit 'shady'...even for me.

First game I think I was using WAY too much ball with the Dark Encounter at 1500 with no polish. But, I was hitting right/light...still hard as a real beginner/novice bowler to see when a ball is losing energy versus when it's "not making the turn". I also tend to come "out of the gate firing hot"...which is why I have rough first games sometimes...too much energy, excitement, nerves...nothing hurting or aching yet...so that doesn't help either.

In game 2, I tried the Lethal Revolver (500 abralon/polished)...but I think RobM was right in this case...I think with the weather the southwest has been enduring...using anything less than a polished pearl...is gonna be tough. I threw 9 of 14 strikes once I finally moved to the Loaded Revolver (OOB/polished).

Very similar to the last time I subbed on Friday (589 series)...ONE game where I can run some strikes together...but this series was much more consistent and the spare shooting much improved....and I did my job...we took of 1 of 3 points...I had the highest scratch series of the 7 bowlers..but the other team was all-male (4-person teams) and in Game 3 they had about 848 scratch...about 1150 team handicap series...which I think beat both the high team handicap game AND high team handicap series thus far for the season. I guess they didn't like that the/our team took Game 2.

Aslan

09-22-2016, 05:49 AM

Wednesday Practice: older Brunswick synthetics; thinner pattern

621 Series: 169-256-196

First game wasn't so bad; only opens were a few splits.

Game 2 was obviously strong. The two asian girls next to me were pretty impressed. Only open was a missed 2-pin...barely.

Game 3 was 1 frame away from a clean game...a friggin misfire.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.91 pins
Strikes: 55% (1 6-bagger, 1 turkey, 3 doubles and 4 singles)
Spares: 61% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (2/3)
Left a single 2-pin, 5-pin, 5-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 60% (6/10)
Most common multi-pin leave: 2-4-5 (2x)

Splits: 25% (1/4).

Average over 3 games: 207.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 210.00.

Sometimes, when I walk over to sub and don't get picked up...I like to roll a series just to taunt them and show them what 'they' "could have had". 1 out of four times I look awesome, 1 out of 4 times I look horrible, and half the time it's mixed.

I didn't bother with the non-polished Dark Encounter. And after about 4 frames...I switched to the Loaded Revolver. Even then, I had to add some loft to my shot because the lane was just playing really narrow.

The old guy on the nearest team was watching me..and making a face that he wished his low average teammate hadn't shown so I could have subbed for them again.

Worked on a lot of physical stuff (approach, release, etc...) in my last 2 lessons and in that timeframe: I'm averaging 188.10 (over 41 games). It's a weird time where I feel like stuff is finally coming together...but it's nowhere near perfect.

I'm at about 570 games on this arsenal...planned on switching it out at 600...probably gonna have a new arsenal selected and drilled up near the end of the month. Not 100% sure which options I'm going with...but I'm leaning towards an interesting experiment where I drill up the:

- Radical Reaxx Pearl
- RotoGrip Defiant Edge
- Ebonite Innovate

All 3 have identical "specs" with the only exceptions being differential and PerfectScale scores. It's not completely narrowing down to just one variable (which would be ideal)...but this comparison takes cover stock material (all pearls), core symmetry (all asym.), and RG (all 2.49) out of the equation.

So, I'll be relying on one of 4 things to turn this "experiment" into an arsenal that will actually have any value beyond academics:
(in order of least likely to do anything to most likely to do something)

4) Drilling Layouts
I haven't had much luck with changing drill layouts and seeing much of a difference. I think drilling layouts are more for folks that have a really good shot and release and mechanics...and just need a slight bump one way or the other. But, without a really consistent release....I'm not sure how much drilling comes into play.

3) Differential
If you believe in the power of SPECS...then this is your only hope. All specs identical...except differential. The Reaxx Pearl has a 0.054, the Defiant Edge has a 0.052, and the Innovate 0.041. That may seem like a small thing...but 0.054 to 0.041 is a huge range in terms of differential. If these balls all do EXACTLY the same thing...then differential really means virtually nothing. I'm not ready to say that yet.

2) Manufacturer Differences
The more knowledgeable bowling ball folks seem to all agree that some manufacturers make balls that roll sooner (on average) than other manufacturers. These "folks" may disagree on that order a bit...but you'd be surprised how close their interpretations are. Radical is on top of the list (in terms of hooking soonest). Ebonite is either last (hooks latest)...or very close to last. Rotogrip...is somewhere in the middle. Thats a near perfect spread. If there is ANYTHING to bowling ball manufacturers having slight differences in terms of when a ball hooks...I should see a difference.

1) PerfectScale (bowlingball.com's tool)
I KNOW...I'm like one of maybe 5 people that think there's value in this scale. I know it's not perfect...I know it's just numbers...it's a tool...not a system...I get all that. But thus far...I'd go out on a limb and say that PrefectScale has been a better predictor of ball strength or ball path....than anything...EXCEPT for maybe RG.

The jury is still out on RG. I think using RG can be a good spec-based way to put an arsenal together...I agree with Rob on that...I'm just not sure how one would apply and use RG when the other variables aren't constant...including manufacturer.

But using my calculations...this arsenal (#3) should be stronger (overall) than Arsenal #2....actually maybe much stronger than Arsenal #2. The Reax Pearl will likely be the strongest ball I've ever thrown...and the Defiant Edge...somewhere in the top 3-6. The Innovate is much weaker...but perhaps will give me a better look/option when the lanes are playing the way they have been.

I'm not 100% confident about the low RGs though. I've not had good luck with lower RG EBI balls. But, optimistically...the Melee Jab was lower RG and to date, that was the ball I've thrown the best.

JJKinGA

09-22-2016, 10:55 AM

Bowling This Month's length rating is very accurate (it is a measured value on a controlled lane surface), Total hook is a relative judgement. They rank out like:
Radical Reax Pearl - 13 & 52 (Length & Hook)
RotoGrip Defiant Edge - 14 & 50
Ebonite Innovate - 16 & 48
that's probably around the just noticeable difference between early to middle and a bit more distinction between middle and late.

Amyers

09-22-2016, 11:06 AM

All 3 have identical "specs" with the only exceptions being differential and PerfectScale scores. It's not completely narrowing down to just one variable (which would be ideal)...but this comparison takes cover stock material (all pearls), core symmetry (all asym.), and RG (all 2.49) out of the equation.

The covers maybe the same type pearl in this case which in my opinion means absolutely nothing in modern bowling but all of them are different formulations from different manufacturers it's like saying I bought three of the same car just because they all are green.

Technically the Ebonite Innovate is not asymmetrical at all other than in the sense that all balls are asymmetrical. The asymmetrical listings for your cores are Defiant Edge .17, Reax Pearl .13, and the Innovate is .08 which is not truly an asymmetrical core as only balls with a mass bias greater than .10 are required to be marketed as asymmetrical. As you can also see all your balls have different amounts of asymmetry so it's hardly a constant.

You are correct that that rg's are a constant in this case but do not think that means all of these balls will have a similar length and break point as the surface on each of these balls are different also.

We've discussed this before and your still seeing similarities where they don't exists. If you start with a hypothesis and a means to test it but the conditions you expect to be fixed are variable it really tells you nothing and will cause you to make poor conclusions.

4) Drilling Layouts
I haven't had much luck with changing drill layouts and seeing much of a difference. I think drilling layouts are more for folks that have a really good shot and release and mechanics...and just need a slight bump one way or the other. But, without a really consistent release....I'm not sure how much drilling comes into play.

I agree with this somewhat you can enhance or take away a bit from a ball with a drilling but you can't make a tomato into a potato just from drilling it somewhat differently and those differences are best seen in those with a consistent release and the ability to throw repeatable shots. I do believe you can screw up a perfectly good ball by mismatching the drilling to what the bowler intends or how it matches with his style.

3) Differential
If you believe in the power of SPECS...then this is your only hope. All specs identical...except differential. The Reaxx Pearl has a 0.054, the Defiant Edge has a 0.052, and the Innovate 0.041. That may seem like a small thing...but 0.054 to 0.041 is a huge range in terms of differential. If these balls all do EXACTLY the same thing...then differential really means virtually nothing. I'm not ready to say that yet.

First this isn't your only hope as there are a myriad of differences between these balls besides the differential if they all roll the same or don't it won't be because of the differential. I'm personally not a believer in differential making a large difference in balls. Differential controls the flare of the bowling ball as long as the ball flares enough to expose fresh surface to the lane it really doesn't matter if those rings are .25 of inch apart or .75 of an inch fresh ball is fresh ball. I've had a few low dif balls and they hook just as much as my higher dif balls and honestly the only difference I've seen is I have it in my head that I carry somewhat better with the higher differential equipment but that could just be a matchup thing or just in my head.

2) Manufacturer Differences
The more knowledgeable bowling ball folks seem to all agree that some manufacturers make balls that roll sooner (on average) than other manufacturers. These "folks" may disagree on that order a bit...but you'd be surprised how close their interpretations are. Radical is on top of the list (in terms of hooking soonest). Ebonite is either last (hooks latest)...or very close to last. Rotogrip...is somewhere in the middle. Thats a near perfect spread. If there is ANYTHING to bowling ball manufacturers having slight differences in terms of when a ball hooks...I should see a difference.

There is some truth in this but probably not in the way your thinking. It's not that all Brunswick/Radical family balls hook earlier than Roto/Storm it's just that they react differently to oil. I completely agree with Rob's idea that somewhat Brunswick family of balls tend to start to hook earlier when they encounter less oil than Roto/Storm balls. That tends to make Brunswick balls appear to have somewhat less backend motion (there can still be a lot) to a comparable Roto/Storm ball. If the ball is designed to have longer length it will still be longer the roll hook phase is just a little different.

1) PerfectScale (bowlingball.com's tool)
I KNOW...I'm like one of maybe 5 people that think there's value in this scale. I know it's not perfect...I know it's just numbers...it's a tool...not a system...I get all that. But thus far...I'd go out on a limb and say that PrefectScale has been a better predictor of ball strength or ball path....than anything...EXCEPT for maybe RG.

The jury is still out on RG. I think using RG can be a good spec-based way to put an arsenal together...I agree with Rob on that...I'm just not sure how one would apply and use RG when the other variables aren't constant...including manufacturer.

But using my calculations...this arsenal (#3) should be stronger (overall) than Arsenal #2....actually maybe much stronger than Arsenal #2. The Reax Pearl will likely be the strongest ball I've ever thrown...and the Defiant Edge...somewhere in the top 3-6. The Innovate is much weaker...but perhaps will give me a better look/option when the lanes are playing the way they have been.

I'm not 100% confident about the low RGs though. I've not had good luck with lower RG EBI balls. But, optimistically...the Melee Jab was lower RG and to date, that was the ball I've thrown the best.

As far as perfect scale goes I'm not a fan. I much prefer Laneside reviews or BTM's stats but if you have no other idea than I guess it's better than nothing. Rg. has it place but it's not the end all of arsenal development either. You have to look at everything surface, rg, core characteristics, and manufacturer to try and determine how a ball will fit. I'm not sure really that this lineup is particularly stronger than your previous line up it maybe longer with more backend than your previous lineup.

The Reax pearl is not the strongest ball you've thrown in either overall hook or backend. The 900 Global Bullet Train was overall stronger than any of the balls here most likely and as far as backend goes the Defiant Edge will have more backend motion than the Reax.

The Reax has the most surface and probably the strongest or close to strongest cover with the Defiant Edge of your balls. It will be the strongest ball overall. The Defiant Edge will be the next strongest and have the most backend due to the lower surface and manufacture it will also cover the most backend boards. The Innovate I really don't have much of an idea on I'm not a fan of this era of Ebonite balls the best thing I can say of it is hopefully it will suffice when you need something less and I guess at the least it'll take games off your other arsenal for practice.

I would strongly suggest a length drilling for the Reax. There was a reason why Radical replaced the Original Reax with the Version 2 so quickly. The Reax had a tendency to hook earlier and roll out from what people expected from a pearl the surface on that ball is much more aggressive than what you think at 500/4000. That surface may take more care than your typical pearl too. Good luck

Aslan

09-22-2016, 05:45 PM

Aslan

09-22-2016, 06:31 PM

We've discussed this before and your still seeing similarities where they don't exists. If you start with a hypothesis and a means to test it but the conditions you expect to be fixed are variable it really tells you nothing and will cause you to make poor conclusions.
Give me an example.

First this isn't your only hope as there are a myriad of differences between these balls besides the differential if they all roll the same or don't it won't be because of the differential. I'm personally not a believer in differential making a large difference in balls.
I find it curious that you feel there is a myriad of differences between the 3 balls...yet other than differential and manufacturer...there are either no differences or differences very minor. And I agree, I don't think differential is going to really separate these 3 balls on it's own...but I may be wrong.

I'm not sure really that this lineup is particularly stronger than your previous line up it maybe longer with more backend than your previous lineup.
I think thats absolutely a possibility. Given similar RGs, I would expect similar length with slightly varying backend motions. And that's fine. I'm not getting my PBA card anytime soon....I don't need 8 bowling balls so I can mix and match depending on the animal pattern I'm bowling on. I just need an arsenal that won't run out of energy and hit like a nerf ball and make me shoot 7-pins and 10-pins all night.

The Reax pearl is not the strongest ball you've thrown in either overall hook or backend. The 900 Global Bullet Train was overall stronger than any of the balls here most likely and as far as backend goes the Defiant Edge will have more backend motion than the Reax.
Again, possible. PerfectScale ranks the Reaxx Pearl 224.8 and the Bullet Train 222.8...so essentially the same. And I'm hopeful about the Defiant Edge...just a bit gun shy after the Asylum.

The Reax has the most surface and probably the strongest or close to strongest cover with the Defiant Edge of your balls. It will be the strongest ball overall. The Defiant Edge will be the next strongest and have the most backend due to the lower surface and manufacture it will also cover the most backend boards. The Innovate I really don't have much of an idea on I'm not a fan of this era of Ebonite balls the best thing I can say of it is hopefully it will suffice when you need something less and I guess at the least it'll take games off your other arsenal for practice.
I'd agree with this assessment.

I would strongly suggest a length drilling for the Reax. There was a reason why Radical replaced the Original Reax with the Version 2 so quickly. The Reax had a tendency to hook earlier and roll out from what people expected from a pearl the surface on that ball is much more aggressive than what you think at 500/4000. That surface may take more care than your typical pearl too. Good luck
IF this is what I go with and the coach doesn't disuade me...it should be interesting.

On the local THSs...I've had a good deal of success with both the Melee Jab and Loaded Revolver. That leads me to believe that with my current release and houses I bowl at...and my current speed...a ball from a "sooner hooking" brand, with an RG of 2.48-2.50, and a polished/pearl cover/surface...with a symmetric core...thats probably what I should look for. BUT...there are some things that make me nervous:

A) I'm using two balls that don't have a great track record. The Reaxx line was overall a 'bust' and the Innovate, like you elluded to, is from an era of Ebonite that doesn't have a great track record of success. If there's truth to the theory that certain bowling balls are just so BAD...that nobody can really bowl well with them...then I may be in trouble.

B) Three assymmetric cores means I must have a consistent release. I tried assymetric cores in the Encounters in Arsenal #1...and the Dark Encounter in Arsenal #2. I struggled throwing these balls compared to more symmetric cores...it just seemed like there was less "forgiveness" if you made a release error.

C) I'm a bit cautious on the Innovate. It should be (PerfectScale) the weakest ball I've thrown since the Slingshot and Frantic. However...the specs on the Innovate are completely different than the Frantic and Slingshot. It's a weird habit, and why I think EBI balls of that era aren't as good as they should be...where they try to make a ball with a low RG, then put a really weak core and weak cover on it...and it ends up being a ball that doesn't go long enough...or goes too long. And as my release is improving...I find that I need more and more balls on the LOWER end of the movement spectrum...not higher end. If I had a Hyper Cell or Nirvanna...I can't imagine ever seeing conditions where I could realistically use them. I've been looking at the Hamer Rebel, 900Global Cardinal Boost, and the Brunswick Vintage Danger Zone.

D) 16lbs is back! I have to be more diligent about wearing by forearm brace...the extra pound could aggravate my tennis elbow. I have to be patient as I transition....my rev rate WILL go down a tad...thats okay. Hopefully, once I get adjusted, the 16lb arsenal will help take care of some of the 8-pin and 8-10 leaves

Amyers

09-22-2016, 08:38 PM

Quote Originally Posted by Amyers View Post

We've discussed this before and your still seeing similarities where they don't exists. If you start with a hypothesis and a means to test it but the conditions you expect to be fixed are variable it really tells you nothing and will cause you to make poor conclusions.

Give me an example.

you listed that all three balls had identical specs but the specs aren't really identical at all.

1. All three balls have different amounts of asymmetry as I listed earlier and the Innovate isn't even truly asymmetric at .08 it should be considered symmetrical.
2. All three balls have a different surface. 500/4000 (not even polished as you said all three were in your last post) for the Reax, 1500 polished for the Defiant Edge, and 2000+ polish on the Innovate.
3. All three balls have different cover stocks. They may be pearl in nature but they are not anywhere close in strength or performance nor were they intended to be.

There is a lot more to looking at how a ball performs than looking at an Rg. listing and seeing what type of cover it has.

Amyers

09-22-2016, 08:54 PM

I'm using two balls that don't have a great track record. The Reaxx line was overall a 'bust' and the Innovate, like you elluded to, is from an era of Ebonite that doesn't have a great track record of success. If there's truth to the theory that certain bowling balls are just so BAD...that nobody can really bowl well with them...then I may be in trouble.

I wouldn't worry too much on the Reax the core is good and I think the main issue with the ball is it looks shiny it says it's a pearl but there is more surface than it looks like there with that 500/4000 surface. The main change with the Version 2 was that it added a polished cover to give more separation between it and the original Reax. with a length drilling an your style I think it may make you a very good piece. The Innovate I can't help you with. I've never seen one roll and yeah I don't like the ebonite of that vintage much but for the third ball in your bag it should be fine.

I've been looking at the Hamer Rebel, 900Global Cardinal Boost, and the Brunswick Vintage Danger Zone.

You realize the boost is way less ball than the other two on your list don't you? I really like what I've seen from the Rebel I'm still thinking seriously of buying one for my daughter who trends towards Hammer equipment. The Brunswick VDZ doesn't get nearly enough run in my opinion as a great ball but it is. I tend to tire of balls and change over to another being may favorite. I've had mine almost a year now and it's still my favorite ball to throw. Just for me the perfect amount of midlane read with a really nice backend. The Cardinal Boost is a light oil ball and work ok if the lanes are fried nothing bad but nothing special about it.

Aslan

10-01-2016, 10:43 AM

@Amyers:
The problem with the critique of the scientific-based arsenal selection by saying there are too many variables and you'd need to get it to "just one variable" is practically speaking impossible. So, then what do we do? Bowling is an aggravating sport because when you try to seek a "right answer", nearly every bowler looks at your effort and says, "fooey! You just need to (insert something from their 30 years of bowling background)."

So, concerning this dilemma...how does one put together a 3-ball, 4-ball, or 5-ball arsenal of varying ball manufacturers, various time periods of manufacture (technology), assymetry, varying RGs and differentials, varying coverstock materials, and various surfaces?? Here's where that ole timer bowler pops his head in and says, "Fooey!! I always throw a dark colored ball on Thursdays....and a red ball on Saturdays...and I only throw AMF equipment."

No, the science is NOT perfect. Yes, true scientific analysis would require isolating one variable at a time. But, thats PRACTICALLY SPEAKING...impossible. THEORETICALLY...possible. But, lets say I wanted to analyze ONLY differential of these three balls. I'd have to ask Storm and EBI to change the cores in their 4-year old, retired balls...AND they'd have to all agree to use a common cover....identical surfaceing....and the resin formulations would need to be identical. Given Ebonite never returned my call when I tried to get assistance with a roller bag that broke within 2-3 weeks of purchase...and I have yet to hear back from Brunswick concerning their part in the Motiv scandal and/or comments on the matter...I doubt Rotogrip, Radical, and Ebonite would jump at the opportunity to spend thousands of dollars to help me nail down subtle differences in differentials.

Friday Practice: older Brunswick synthetics; thinner pattern

539 Series: 172-180-187

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.70 pins
Strikes: 36% (2 doubles and 8 singles)
Spares: 76% picked up

Single Pin spares: 80% (8/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x)
Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 5-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 72% (8/11)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-8 (2x)

Splits: 50% (1/2).

Average over 3 games: 179.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 187.67.

Had a lesson on Thursday and left the new arsenal there to be drilled...but there was some delay...so I have to improvise in the meantime. Since my best 15lb ball is in the shop (used to show hand dimensions, get an IT sized, etc...), I would either have to use the Lethal Revolver and hope that I could still have carry in Games 2 and 3 (very unlikely)....or I could start my transition back to 16lbs...and use a retired ball from my "bowling ball rack of destiny"...which I chose to do. The specs on the C300 Encounters are very close to the Brunswick Loaded Revolver so I decided to use those. No spare ball...my 16lb spare ball is getting re-drilled and getting a slug inserted.

Since I hadn't thrown the old Encounters in some time, hadn't thrown 16lb equipment in awhile, and needed to get used to the very different thumb pitch...I decided to practice during the day to make sure the Encounter option was viable. And the spare shooting was above average...so I figured it wasn't a necessity to have a spare ball for league last night. I have a Hammer Blue Urethane in my trunk that is 16lbs that I guess I could have used...but I forgot about that until just now.

Aslan

10-01-2016, 11:01 AM

Friday League Night (subbing)
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

526 Series: 199-176-151

Game 1 I couldn't seem to strike until the 9th frame...but only one open in the 3rd frame when I chopped a left side bucket.

Starting in the 4th frame of Game 2, I was striking fine on the left side...but didn't strike on the left side until the 9th frame. Two opens in the 2nd and 3rd frames didn't help. The same woes continued in Game 3...struck on the left lane every frame except the 9th. No strikes on the right lane. Four opens in Game 3...two related to my new spare ball situation. Harder to clip those corner pins when the lanes have transitioned so much.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.73 pins
Strikes: 42% (1 4-bagger, 1 double, and 8 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (6/8)
Most common single-pin leaves: 2-pin, 6-pin, and 10-pin (2x each).
Also left a single 4-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 54% (6/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a (1x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 175.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 183.33.

Helped the team I bowled with get the first point...and didn't hurt em bad enough not to get the 3rd point...so I figure I did my job.

Had to get new finger inserts in both balls....my fingers are fatter than early 2015 apparently. Missed the 10-pin twice trying to pick it up with a strike ball. I might bring the Hammer Blue urethane with me Tuesday when I sub and use it as my spare ball. But, that ball isn't even drilled for my hand...so...that could lead to more problems than it solves.

The Encounters worked well today. Not ideal...and I still don't like them...but I did notice that they are moving a LOT better now (with my improved skills) than they did in 2014-2015. Gonna have to get used to 16lbs though. Not sure if it was just the added weight or me doing a practice and league night on the same day...after 5 games of lesson on Thursday...but I'm sore more so than usual.

Amyers

10-03-2016, 12:29 PM

@Amyers:
The problem with the critique of the scientific-based arsenal selection by saying there are too many variables and you'd need to get it to "just one variable" is practically speaking impossible. So, then what do we do? Bowling is an aggravating sport because when you try to seek a "right answer", nearly every bowler looks at your effort and says, "fooey! You just need to (insert something from their 30 years of bowling background)."

So, concerning this dilemma...how does one put together a 3-ball, 4-ball, or 5-ball arsenal of varying ball manufacturers, various time periods of manufacture (technology), assymetry, varying RGs and differentials, varying coverstock materials, and various surfaces?? Here's where that ole timer bowler pops his head in and says, "Fooey!! I always throw a dark colored ball on Thursdays....and a red ball on Saturdays...and I only throw AMF equipment."

No, the science is NOT perfect. Yes, true scientific analysis would require isolating one variable at a time. But, thats PRACTICALLY SPEAKING...impossible. THEORETICALLY...possible. But, lets say I wanted to analyze ONLY differential of these three balls. I'd have to ask Storm and EBI to change the cores in their 4-year old, retired balls...AND they'd have to all agree to use a common cover....identical surfaceing....and the resin formulations would need to be identical. Given Ebonite never returned my call when I tried to get assistance with a roller bag that broke within 2-3 weeks of purchase...and I have yet to hear back from Brunswick concerning their part in the Motiv scandal and/or comments on the matter...I doubt Rotogrip, Radical, and Ebonite would jump at the opportunity to spend thousands of dollars to help me nail down subtle differences in differentials.

Your exactly right the odds of ever only having one variable are about zero unless you go buy a crate of the same ball. Which is why it's necessary to take your time and understand the actual differences between the balls. Where I took issue with your post was you referred to the surface being a constant but they weren't not even close the cores you called the same just because the Rg. was similar but one of them isn't even asymmetrical more/less the fact that they have different levels a asymmetry. You listed the covers as the same but obviously all three covers were from different manufacturers with different intents of their use.

I don't have an issue with generalities If you have three balls with similar Rg. (=-.1) and differential similar that are all intended to be heavy oil balls and similar surfaces that's comparable. You've got three completely different balls with different intents in their design that just happen to have a similar Rg. At least from what I got from your earlier posts was you were expecting to be able to derive something (not sure what) from how these balls played because their were so many similarities where they didn't really exists. At best you've got an orange, a grapefruit, and a pear I guess they are all fruit but that and the fact that they all have a peel is the end of the similarities. The plus side is I think this honestly a better arsenal than you've had in the past. I'm not sure you've ever had an arsenal with an obvious ball that you should start with on medium conditions and an obvious ball to play longer with as they break down and then something that should be milder but still long like you've got now.

Aslan

10-05-2016, 04:12 AM

Your exactly right the odds of ever only having one variable are about zero unless you go buy a crate of the same ball. Which is why it's necessary to take your time and understand the actual differences between the balls. Where I took issue with your post was you referred to the surface being a constant but they weren't not even close the cores you called the same just because the Rg. was similar but one of them isn't even asymmetrical more/less the fact that they have different levels a asymmetry. You listed the covers as the same but obviously all three covers were from different manufacturers with different intents of their use.

I don't have an issue with generalities If you have three balls with similar Rg. (=-.1) and differential similar that are all intended to be heavy oil balls and similar surfaces that's comparable. You've got three completely different balls with different intents in their design that just happen to have a similar Rg. At least from what I got from your earlier posts was you were expecting to be able to derive something (not sure what) from how these balls played because their were so many similarities where they didn't really exists. At best you've got an orange, a grapefruit, and a pear I guess they are all fruit but that and the fact that they all have a peel is the end of the similarities. The plus side is I think this honestly a better arsenal than you've had in the past. I'm not sure you've ever had an arsenal with an obvious ball that you should start with on medium conditions and an obvious ball to play longer with as they break down and then something that should be milder but still long like you've got now.

Amyers...God love ya...you're like listening to the politics on the news....lots of criticisms...short on solutions. Even if...even IF...my analysis of bowling ball design and differences between balls is at best 10% accurate/informative/correct....it's still 10% better than just about anything else anyone else has done. Granted....thats because pretty much NOBODY does it. There are piles and piles (much like poo in many ways) of analysis of this ball or that ball or this other ball. But rarely do we see 3rd party analysis. And 3rd party analysis is essential given the ball manufacturers have shown a perpensity to at MOST flat out commit fraud (Motiv)...or in the LEAST...pretty much blow smoke up the *** of the bowling community trying to convince them that this next new ball is soooooooooooooo technologically superior to their release from 6 months ago....that you should spend $220 + $55 drilling so you can finally get that 800 series. All lies....all sales nonsense...with manipulated videos...no actual fact-based explanation why ball A is better than ball B.

So...enter a few video folks that claim to be more impartial than the bowling ball companies (not a high bar by any means)...enter things like PerfectScale that most bowlers are trained to dismiss as nonsense....and a few other online publications that at have at least tried to address arsenal construction or what the nitty gritty spec numbers mean. But too few and too far between...and none of them actually solve any problems. PerfectScale seems to be fairly accurate in overall hook measurement. Unfortunately, it is rather useless at actually putting together an arsenal, at least partially because it doesn't adequately tell the story of ball motion. As Bowl1820's (or VDub's...I forget) signature says...it's not how much the ball hooks so much as when. PerfectScale doesn't really even address sooner versus later...and thats a key concept in arsenal construction (I think). Rob had an interesting article on the use of RGs to assemble an arsenal. It was a very informative article and he may be right...RG may in fact be the best method (if you have to settle on just one).

I want to come up with a way to use multiple bowling ball variables to come up with a system that identifies which balls would be best suited for:

- 1st out of the bag, heavier conditions
- 2nd out of the bag, go-to ball on a typical THS
- 3rd ball out of the bag, good for practice and drier conditions, ball down option for ball #2 when lanes transition

You are absolutely right Amyers....THAT is not a very easy thing to create...which is probably in part why nobody has ever done it. But if you are creating an arsenal...especially the newer bowlers...and are not loyal to one brand or are bowling on a budget...something like that could be very valuable and helpful. It can't be perfect...too many variables...and at the end of the day skill and your physical game trump ball specs any day of the week. But...just because it's imperfect...doesn't make it rediculous any more than is any method any current bowler uses for arsenal selection...most of which can be summed up in, "I bought this one....then that one...and then this other one. I use this one on Thursdays, that one on Fridays...and this one every once in awhile."

Aslan

10-05-2016, 04:55 AM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, low-moderate oil THS

575 Series: 202 (clean)-165-208 (clean)

Still using the Encounters; I pick up my new arsenal tomorrow afternoon. I used the less aggressively drilled/OOB polished version the whole night as the balls both seemed to lose a lot of energy going down the lane.

Game 1 was mostly solid spare shooting...which is ironic given I'm using my strike ball as my spare ball presently.

Game 2 the spare shooting was just too much...only struck twice...opened twice (both on mistakes made trying to use the strike ball as my spare ball).

Game 3 I struck 6 times, but only managed to double once.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.82 pins
Strikes: 36% (2 doubles, and 8 singles)
Spares: 85% picked up

Single Pin spares: 80% (8/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x).
Also left a single 6-pin (2x), 7-pin (2x), and a 2-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 90% (9/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-8 and 4-7 (2x each)

Splits: 100% (1/1)

Average over 3 games: 191.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 195.67.

First week subbing as 6th man on my old Tuesday team. Helped them take 3 out of 4 despite our anchor being out (that was who I was subbing for). The Encounters did an adequate job as fill-ins while I await Arsenal #3 to get drilled.

ONE MORE CLEAN GAME...and I'll have 100 in my career!!

manke

10-05-2016, 09:35 AM

Amyers

10-05-2016, 10:35 AM

Amyers...God love ya...you're like listening to the politics on the news....lots of criticisms...short on solutions. Even if...even IF...my analysis of bowling ball design and differences between balls is at best 10% accurate/informative/correct....it's still 10% better than just about anything else anyone else has done. Granted....thats because pretty much NOBODY does it. There are piles and piles (much like poo in many ways) of analysis of this ball or that ball or this other ball. But rarely do we see 3rd party analysis. And 3rd party analysis is essential given the ball manufacturers have shown a perpensity to at MOST flat out commit fraud (Motiv)...or in the LEAST...pretty much blow smoke up the *** of the bowling community trying to convince them that this next new ball is soooooooooooooo technologically superior to their release from 6 months ago....that you should spend $220 + $55 drilling so you can finally get that 800 series. All lies....all sales nonsense...with manipulated videos...no actual fact-based explanation why ball A is better than ball B.

So...enter a few video folks that claim to be more impartial than the bowling ball companies (not a high bar by any means)...enter things like PerfectScale that most bowlers are trained to dismiss as nonsense....and a few other online publications that at have at least tried to address arsenal construction or what the nitty gritty spec numbers mean. But too few and too far between...and none of them actually solve any problems. PerfectScale seems to be fairly accurate in overall hook measurement. Unfortunately, it is rather useless at actually putting together an arsenal, at least partially because it doesn't adequately tell the story of ball motion. As Bowl1820's (or VDub's...I forget) signature says...it's not how much the ball hooks so much as when. PerfectScale doesn't really even address sooner versus later...and thats a key concept in arsenal construction (I think). Rob had an interesting article on the use of RGs to assemble an arsenal. It was a very informative article and he may be right...RG may in fact be the best method (if you have to settle on just one).

I want to come up with a way to use multiple bowling ball variables to come up with a system that identifies which balls would be best suited for:

- 1st out of the bag, heavier conditions
- 2nd out of the bag, go-to ball on a typical THS
- 3rd ball out of the bag, good for practice and drier conditions, ball down option for ball #2 when lanes transition

You are absolutely right Amyers....THAT is not a very easy thing to create...which is probably in part why nobody has ever done it. But if you are creating an arsenal...especially the newer bowlers...and are not loyal to one brand or are bowling on a budget...something like that could be very valuable and helpful. It can't be perfect...too many variables...and at the end of the day skill and your physical game trump ball specs any day of the week. But...just because it's imperfect...doesn't make it rediculous any more than is any method any current bowler uses for arsenal selection...most of which can be summed up in, "I bought this one....then that one...and then this other one. I use this one on Thursdays, that one on Fridays...and this one every once in awhile."

I think we actually agree on this lol. My original point has been that this is a better arsenal than you think anyways. So if I'm right you win not a bad proposition.

Arsenal building is tough especially to the average mid level bowler that pays as much attention to his beer and the girl in the skirt 2 lanes over as he does to how peoples balls react to the lanes. It's also part of the reason why I've switched to using mostly one manufacturer of balls. It's hard enough to make knowledgeable choices between 20 balls versus 100 and I can at least find manufacturer data to help me decide between balls in the current lineup.

First thing you have to figure out is what you need. Where in the lineup is this ball going to fit. There are so many variables between peoples styles and the lanes they bowl on to make a sure fire system that fits everyone extremely difficult but for myself here's what I look at in order of importance.
1. Surface (do I want a ball to go longer or start earlier, handle more oil or less) with my low speed anything under 3k is going to be early roll out only buy it if I'm looking for a sport shot ball.
2. RG (mostly the same as one and they work in tandem) If I'm buying mid Rg. equipment it needs less surface for my style. I avoid low Rg. equipment it most instances if I do it has to be polished.
3. Cover strength/ Manufacturers intent. I've learned with my style I generally don't need heavy oil balls especially on a THS and tend more towards mid line to lower line equipment.
4. Differential/Asymmetry/Insert Gimmick of the week here. Differential at my level I can't see a big effect on other than most of the very low differential balls I've owned haven't carried well for me (could just be bad luck but have had three of them and all of them have been that way) Asymmetry does matter but most highly asymmetrical balls tent to fit in categories that don't fit my game the few I've tried have been ok. Gimmicks I honestly don't care and refuse to buy balls because of gimmicks I really don't believe carbon fiber makes a better core or the lack of filler in the new Quantum's make them significantly better these are just the two being shoved down are throats at the moment.

My belief is if you pay attention to all three of the above and watch how they interact together you can build at least a fair lineup. The biggest trick is to make sure that your looking at all three and not become fixated on anyone portion to the exclusion of the others. Ignoring any of the three will result in mistakes.

Aslan

10-08-2016, 03:21 AM

I think we actually agree on this lol.
True

It's also part of the reason why I've switched to using mostly one manufacturer of balls. It's hard enough to make knowledgeable choices between 20 balls versus 100 and I can at least find manufacturer data to help me decide between balls in the current lineup.
The downside to that, is your options are now limited. Not only in terms of what may or may not work for you...but now you're at the mercy of that brand's pricing.

...you have to figure out is what you need.
1. Surface (do I want a ball to go longer or start earlier, handle more oil or less) with my low speed anything under 3k is going to be early roll out only buy it if I'm looking for a sport shot ball.
I can't say surface is completely useless...and I have it as a variable in my system...but I struggle with using surface for arsenal selection as surface can be easily manipulated. It's like buying a car based on how good the floor mats look. What's the point? For $75 you can get whichever floor mats you want. Buying a ball because it's a 2000 abralon finish makes no sense...because it can be changed to a 500 abralon surface for $15.

2. RG (mostly the same as one and they work in tandem) If I'm buying mid Rg. equipment it needs less surface for my style. I avoid low Rg. equipment it most instances if I do it has to be polished.
3. Cover strength/ Manufacturers intent. I've learned with my style I generally don't need heavy oil balls especially on a THS and tend more towards mid line to lower line equipment.
Agreed. It's rediculous to see people buying Hyper Cells and Locks and Nirvannas...when they're playing on a low oil volume, thin, THS pattern...which most everyone plays on. Sure, if you go to Vegas a lot and/or bowl tournaments...especially USBC or PBA...then absolutely you need an expanded arsenal with stronger equipment. But I've thrown 11 different balls over the past 3 years...and only one of them (900Global Bullet Train) was what I'd consider a "strong" ball. And if I put together a Top 10 List for my bowling balls...The Bullet Train would slide in at #8.

Now, I throw differently than you so I like a ball with a lower RG...and I let the pearl cover/polished cover provide the length. I've had very, very little success with the opposite strategy of surfacing the POO out of the ball to try to make a higher RG ball turn earlier.

4. ...Asymmetry...
I've had most success with symmetric cores...but, in fairness, I think assymetric cores amplify release issues. So, if you're "still learning"...I don't think anyone should buy an assymetric core ball. Like you've (and others) said...once the ball is drilled...it becomes assymetric....I'm just saying the more assymetric that ball is...the less room you have for error regarding your release.

I recently moved the Columbia300 Encounter from last place in my Top 10 to 9th place...simply because I unretired the two Encounters recently (waiting for my arsenal to get drilled up and to get used to throwing man weight again)...and I threw them much better than I did in 2014. I would hope so!! With all the time and money I've spent trying to improve...it'd be a bummer to still average in the low 160s with those balls.

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

Got my new arsenal about 45 minutes before the league started bowling...figured I'd sub and start to get a feel for the new arsenal...

516 Series: 215-151-150

Game 1 I was doing very well throwing the Reax Pearl. I wasn't sure if it'd be too much ball for a narrow THS...but with 2:1 move inside my normal starting point and it worked great. But these lanes are older and transition quickly...and in the 10th frame the ball hit weak, left a 10-pin, and I missed it to screw up my bid for clean game #100.

Game 2 I balled down to the Ebonite Innovate. Couldn't figure out the left lane...struck 3 times on the right lane...was all over the place on the left lane. I left a 1-2-10 washout then a single 2-pin...made a 2:1 move right...went through the nose and left a 4-6-10 split. Made a 2:1 move back to the left...and left a 2-8. Moved back 2:1 right and left a 4-pin in the 10th (and missed it). #*^%! Took me that entire game to find a line that would work on that stupid left lane.

Struck in the first frame after finally figuring out where the line was on that lane...but then I left a 2-10 split on the right lane followed by a 5-pin...figured the lanes were telling me that it's time to go with something that goes a bit longer. Besides, it gave me a chance to FINALLY throw the Defiant Edge...which I've had in the closet of destiny for like 3 years. But, it took me 5 frames, mainly due to a couple horrible shots, to finally get lined up...but too little too late.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.77 pins
Strikes: 35% (1 4-bagger, 1 double, and 5 singles)
Spares: 55% picked up

Single Pin spares: 70% (7/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin (5x).
Also left a single 10-pin (2x), 2-pin, 5-pin, and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (4/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-8 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 172.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 183.33.

Embarrassing showing and inexcusable as a sub. Entering with a 192 average doesn't help...but I can't be too hard on myself given it was the first time I threw those balls.

Aslan

10-08-2016, 03:54 AM

Aslan how can you develope a first second third out of your bag when the conditions are always changing. You bowl against different people that use different lines every week. Don't forget that each set of lanes are different too. So a person should never be i have to use this ball first this one second.

There's two lines of thinking on this:

1) Use a "benchmark ball".
2) Use a progression.

Even with choice #1, you need a progression to determine which ball is the "benchmark ball" (it should be the middle of the progression).

To go to the lanes and simply lick your finger, put it in the air, and say, "yup...today it's gonna be the Storm Reign of Fire" isn't a repeatable system. Yes, if you bowl the same center every single week...like myself, you will likely find that you don't need to start with "Ball #1" each night...because you know ball #1 is generally going to be too strong. You may start with ball #2.

The more practice time you have, the better educated decision you can make. But when you have 10 minutes of practice and 4-5 bowlers on each lane...you'll have to be almost perfect on your shots (no warm up misses) and already lined up in order to realistically try out more than one ball...or maybe three balls total. There's just no time to use visual observation to pick the best ball out of a 4-6 ball arsenal. You have to have some type of knowledge of the conditions and some idea how your arsenal is constructed.

It also depends on how you view an arsenal. Some view an arsenal as just a random collection of balls...and the more they have...the more options they have. That's great if you get a 1-2 hour warm-up practice session like the PBA folks. But you have 10 minutes. It's true that the more balls you own...the higher the liklihood you'll use one that performs well...but it's still a small percentage chance given that you realistically are only bringing 1-12 balls (out of 80 current models and thousands of retired balls).

So, using a progression allows you to go from the ball that hooks the soonest to the ball that hooks the latest. As the lanes transition, you ball down to the next ball in the progression. If you've bowled at that house a lot...you have an advantage...because you not only have a good idea about the line...but probably know what ball to start with. But if you don't have a "progression"...how do you know what ball to pick next? Most bowlers just grab one that they like, or that is newer, or any number of 'wrong' reasons to switch and select a different ball. And without a progression, you rely on a mix of luck and 'gut feeling' to make that choice. I believe that with a proper progression...you can eliminate much of the guesswork out of ball change choices. You'll require less practice time to figure out which ball to start with/use. And as the lanes transition...you will still have options. What I mean by the last sentence...is you don't want to be throwing a Storm Ride and having it lose energy and hit weak....then switch to a Brunswick Nirvanna. If the Ride is hitting weak and losing energy...there's a 0.0001% chance the Nirvanna will make it down the lane without losing energy.

However, even with a progression...it's still very difficult to tell the difference between not being perfectly lined up, having a variation in your release, or having a ball lose energy and hit weak. So, it's not 'perfect'...and you'll likely need a pro of some kind to assist. Your pro shop operator also is essential because they need to know that progression in order to ensure they drill the balls in a way that fits them into those slots. My two strongest balls are drilled pin up to give them a counter-balance their strong specs....and make sure they don't roll out or lose energy too soon. The weaker ball is drilled pin down, to make sure it'll still make a strong move to the pocket despite it's weaker specs.

Lets say your arsenal is:

Storm Mix, Storm Lock, Storm Tropical Breeze. You could set up this progression one of two ways:

#1 Lock, #2 Tropical Breeze, #3 Mix

or

#1 Tropical Breeze (drilled/surfaced to hook sooner), #2 Mix, #3 Lock (maybe drilled to hook a bit later)

No matter which option you choose...the bottom line is...if you start with the Mix...and the lanes transition...and your only other two ball options are stronger...you are essentially screwed. If the Mix is going through the nose...so will the Tropical Breeze. If the lanes are too dry for the Mix...they'll be far too dry for the Lock. Thats all there is to a progression...it just keeps you from starting with something that gives you no options come game #3. It's quite frustrating watching a fellow bowler leaving 10-pin after 10-pin because his ball is losing energy and hitting weak...so they switch from a Hyper Cell Skid to a sanded hyper cell. I've made that mistake. I argue with Amyers all the time about the dangers of messing with surface. If the Skid was burning up and it's polished and designed to go long and snap...why in the World would you switch to a sanded version of that ball designed to hook sooner? It's not the line thats the problem...it's the transition.

And (I'll use the anti-Norm Duke spare shooting arguement), Pros use progressions. Almost every single pro has their arsenal lined up in a way that they know if they start with Ball X...when the lanes transition, they switch to Ball Y....then Ball Z. If they start with Ball Y, they will switch to Ball Z, then ?... The ball manufacturers even MAKE THE BALLS in 3-ball progressions (solid, hybrid, pearl). They take the same cores and wrap them in different covers to provide you with an instant progression (should you buy all 3-4 of their "line").

Amyers

10-10-2016, 10:22 AM

True

The downside to that, is your options are now limited. Not only in terms of what may or may not work for you...but now you're at the mercy of that brand's pricing.

There is some truth to that and if I really thought I needed something they didn't make I would still look outside of those lines but most of the manufacturers have multiple lines under roof (DV8, Radical, Brunswick for example) if I can't find something that fits the bill it must be a pretty specific slot. Pricing to me seems pretty stable across the different companies and I really don't sweat an extra $20 on something I'm going to use for a year or so.

I can't say surface is completely useless...and I have it as a variable in my system...but I struggle with using surface for arsenal selection as surface can be easily manipulated. It's like buying a car based on how good the floor mats look. What's the point? For $75 you can get whichever floor mats you want. Buying a ball because it's a 2000 abralon finish makes no sense...because it can be changed to a 500 abralon surface for $15

I really don't look at it this way when I'm looking at surface I'm not trying to change the overall characteristics of the ball. If I need that I'm usually going to just pick out a different ball myself most of the time. I don't really get too hyped up on a particular ball So I try to pick things that will fit generally what I'm looking for but if that ball comes with 2k on it I'll change it to 3k in a heart beat if that's what it needs but I generally don't purchase high end pearls with a high rg and sand them to try and make it different. I have polished high end sanded balls for people that wanted that ball in a pearl with good results.

Now, I throw differently than you so I like a ball with a lower RG...and I let the pearl cover/polished cover provide the length. I've had very, very little success with the opposite strategy of surfacing the POO out of the ball to try to make a higher RG ball turn earlier

Very true me and you have very different styles and ways of attacking the lanes I think if we blended our strengths we would be a heck of a bowler

I've had most success with symmetric cores...but, in fairness, I think assymetric cores amplify release issues. So, if you're "still learning"...I don't think anyone should buy an assymetric core ball. Like you've (and others) said...once the ball is drilled...it becomes assymetric....I'm just saying the more assymetric that ball is...the less room you have for error regarding your release

I don't know if I agree with this or not and I haven't thrown enough asymmetric equipment to judge it well not because I'm afraid of it just that they tend to be more aggressive and I rarely need that. My one foray with that has been the Storm Virtual Gravity Pearl I've thrown multiple 250+ games with it but finding the right condition for it's hard for me It requires a firm dry spot to hook off of but enough oil that I can control it which is rare to find.

Amyers

10-10-2016, 12:00 PM

There's two lines of thinking on this:

(it should be the middle of the progression).

It really doesn't have to be the middle ball benchmark is simply the ball you can read the lanes with best

To go to the lanes and simply lick your finger, put it in the air, and say, "yup...today it's gonna be the Storm Reign of Fire" isn't a repeatable system. Yes, if you bowl the same center every single week...

Correct sticking your finger in the air isn't repeatable but neither is I started with ball 2 last week so I'll start with ball 2 tonight. Different lanes in the same house play differently and if your centers are anything like mine the lane machines don't always put the pattern down extactly the same from week to week. You face different competition each week also which effects your progression you can't simply say it's time to change so I'm going to ball 3 every night. Some nights it maybe ball up to 1 and move inside the next night you need to go to three.

The more practice time you have, the better educated decision you can make. There's just no time to use visual observation to pick the best ball out of a 4-6 ball arsenal. You have to have some type of knowledge of the conditions and some idea how your arsenal is constructed.

Exactly most nights you can't throw every ball you have in 10 minutes especially if your like me and the first 2 balls are just to make sure the body still works. I may take 5 balls with me but I don't really have to throw any of the other 4 if I can get 2-3 shots with my benchmark. I usually start with my Mastermind also my strongest ball but not because of that I know exactly how that ball works and where to move with each of my balls to get it to the pocket so if I can't throw another ball I can get any of them from the bag make my move and start off the game and be highly comfortable the balls going into the pocket. That's not ideal I'd prefer to throw it once to fine tune but rarely am I going to miss the 1-3.

As I mentioned earlier my first set is to get loose the second set if the mastermind goes slightly high I know I can go 2-1 left and be there or I can get the Danger Zone (the danger zone is a little longer and slightly less) stay in the same spot and strike. If it goes Brooklyn I get the Fanatic (lot longer and again slightly less than the VDZ) maybe move 2-1 left just to make sure that I don't put it through the face always adjust so that way I'd rather be light than through the head pin. If it really jumps early then 2-1 left and the Rhino comes out. An arsenal isn't about testing out every ball to see what works it's about throwing a couple of balls with one and being able to go over and get the correct ball from your bag.

It also depends on how you view an arsenal. Some view an arsenal as just a random collection of balls...and the more they have...the more options they have. That's great if you get a 1-2 hour warm-up practice session like the PBA folks. But you have 10 minutes. It's true that the more balls you own...

I see bowlers who do this too and most of them suck.

PBA bowlers don't necessarily use their balls in a particular order their ball coaches help them pick the ball that will allow them to play the portion of the lane that offers the best opportunity to score. I think if you look at their arsenals and watch which balls they throw it will be very rare to watch a telecast where they move systematically from ball x to ball y to ball z. It simply doesn't work that way on league night and decidedly doesn't work that way on tour. I've spent way to much time talking to WPBA and Senior PBA bowlers to believe that for one second.

So, using a progression allows you to go from the ball that hooks the soonest to the ball that hooks the latest. As the lanes transition, you ball down to the next ball in the progression. but probably know what ball to start with. But if you don't have a "progression"...how do you know what ball to pick next? is you don't want to be throwing a Storm Ride and having it lose energy and hit weak....then switch to a Brunswick Nirvanna. If the Ride is hitting weak and losing energy...there's a 0.0001% chance the Nirvanna will make it down the lane without losing energy.

Here where the progression system can let you down. It doesn't really account for how the lanes are set up or how you and your opponents are breaking them down. if you have opponents playing inside of you (in your case I'm sure that happens frequently) and you attempt to move in and ball down your often trading to an even lower oil spot. in an instance like this balling up and moving even farther left may be the best choice or attempting to ball down even farther and stay where your at rarely is bowling as simple as 1+2=3 often you just end up with fish.

The problem with your example is it can work. Say a bowler like you on a house shot with a little oil outside and a puddle in the middle your A game is playing straighter. So I very well might decide my best chance is to start with the Ride playing outside and once that line is dried up ball up to the Absolute and move way inside even though its my B game playing that way.

Your pro shop operator also is essential because they need to know that progression in order to ensure they drill the balls in a way that fits them into those slots. My two strongest balls are drilled pin up to give them a counter-balance their strong specs....and make sure they don't roll out or lose energy too soon. The weaker ball is drilled pin down, to make sure it'll still make a strong move to the pocket despite it's weaker specs.

A pin up drilling does not "counter balance" anything a pin up drill honestly doesn't tell you a whole lot because there are other factors involved dual angle is a much better way of describing the layout of the ball because it tells you all the factors involved with drilling but in general Pin up balls tend towards go farther down the lane and rolling later than a pin up drilling will.

Lets say your arsenal is:

Storm Mix, Storm Lock, Storm Tropical Breeze. You could set up this progression one of two ways:

#1 Lock, #2 Tropical Breeze, #3 Mix

or

#1 Tropical Breeze (drilled/surfaced to hook sooner), #2 Mix, #3 Lock (maybe drilled to hook a bit later)

No matter which option you choose...the bottom line is...if you start with the Mix...and the lanes transition...and your only other two ball options are stronger...you are essentially screwed. If the lanes are too dry for the Mix...they'll be far too dry for the Lock. Thats all there is to a progression...it just keeps you from starting with something that gives you no options come game #3. I If the Skid was burning up and it's polished and designed to go long and snap...why in the World would you switch to a sanded version of that ball designed to hook sooner? It's not the line thats the problem...it's the transition.

This might be true if you consign yourself to a fixed spot on the lane but you are not. You've got to quit thinking of the lanes as a 3 board box. The problem in either of your examples is not the ball being used but where they are trying to play said ball. If you consign yourself to playing up ten only and start with the Skid and try and stay in the same spot and throw the Hyper Cell that's not going to work. You move your feet and target left and straighten the line up it very well could be very effective playing with the Hyper Cell after the Skid.

And (I'll use the anti-Norm Duke spare shooting arguement), Pros use progressions. Almost every single pro has their arsenal lined up in a way that they know if they start with Ball X...when the lanes transition, they switch to Ball Y....then Ball Z. If they start with Ball Y, they will switch to Ball Z, then ?... The ball manufacturers even MAKE THE BALLS in 3-ball progressions (solid, hybrid, pearl). They take the same cores and wrap them in different covers to provide you with an instant progression (should you buy all 3-4 of their "line").

Oh Lord where to start with this mess. The Pro's may come in with an idea of how they would like to adjust from ball to ball but that infrequently plays out that way. Pro's always watch where the others on the lanes are playing and how they are scoring from those break points. I can tell you for certain that if they had a few power players on the set before them or if they had down and in players on the set where they play on the lanes and with which balls are going to change it's not going to be x,y,z.

The fact that the ball manufacturers make everything in three form's now is simply marketing and I'm sure the manufacturers would love for us all to be dumb enough to buy them all I've never seen a single person suggest building and arsenal from different variations of the same ball. The only real differences between those balls are the surfaces they come on them anyway. I did see someone post about buying three of the same ball and putting different surfaces on them but in my opinion that would be a really bad way to build an arsenal.

I don't have access to touring PBA pros often but my PSO drills for 3 PWBA bowlers and 4 PBA Senior bowlers. My coach is one of the Senior's I bowl leagues against 2 of the PWBA league Women and one of them is good friends with my wife and we have lunch together every other Wednesday if she's in town I bowl against 3 of the other seniors in leagues so I get a chance to talk with them a lot. The X,Y,Z argument your trying to make is a bad idea at least 50% of the time in league and you wouldn't win much on the tour that way either

Aslan

10-14-2016, 10:02 AM

All of your responses, while mostly, technically correct...are not realistic to average bowlers. See below:

Different lanes in the same house play differently and if your centers are anything like mine the lane machines don't always put the pattern down extactly the same from week to week. You face different competition each week also which effects your progression you can't simply say it's time to change so I'm going to ball 3 every night. Some nights it maybe ball up to 1 and move inside the next night you need to go to three.

Wrong. For MOST centers....in MOST environments...not counting Vegas where there is a massively high user volume on a regular basis...or lanes built on hills where one side plays noticeably different than the other...but MOST centers....the differences you're talking about are so minor and miniscule...that to base ANYTHING off of them (including arsenal usage/progression) is rediculous. This isn't the final 5 of a PBA National event. Most of your competition on league night is (or should be) throwing very basic shots up the track. Some are women throwing plastic balls up the middle, maybe a lefty, a couple elderly guys with old equipment up the track...there's no 'strategy' to avoid them messing up your shot. League bowlers aren't good enough to intentionally "mess with your shot" nor are you/we good enough to focus our efforts on messing with their shot (or focusing on ANYTHING other than bowling well).

More later...

PBA bowlers don't necessarily use their balls in a particular order
Yes, they do.

their ball coaches help them pick the ball that will allow them to play the portion of the lane that offers the best opportunity to score. I think if you look at their arsenals and watch which balls they throw it will be very rare to watch a telecast where they move systematically from ball x to ball y to ball z. It simply doesn't work that way on league night and decidedly doesn't work that way on tour. I've spent way to much time talking to WPBA and Senior PBA bowlers to believe that for one second.

The key word there is "necessarily"...which allows you to then say all the rest of that stuff and still be "technically" correct....while also being dead wrong. I don't know who you're talking to or what event you watched....but I can guarantee...GUARANTEE...that every single pro bowler who is using "Ball X" knows EXACTLY what "Ball Y" and "Ball Z" are....and know EXACTLY what they need to see to switch balls. That is actually one of the greatest differences between amateurs and pros...they can see that ball move in all 3 phases and out the back of the pin deck...and know EXACTLY what they need to do next....or at least...at LEAST...have 1-3 options. Absolutely ZERO professional bowlers...show up with 8 random bowling balls drilled to fit their hand and rely on their minimum wage earning ball reps to just "pick one" based on the ball rep's opinion(s). Ball reps make recommendations, they watch how the competitors are bowling, they can scout the lanes before the pro moves to that pair, etc... But if they recommend a ball change...thats always a "discussion"...not an "instruction".

The problem with your example is it can work.
Uh...yeah....thats the point of it.

This might be true if you consign yourself to a fixed spot on the lane but you are not. You've got to quit thinking of the lanes as a 3 board box. The problem in either of your examples is not the ball being used but where they are trying to play said ball. If you consign yourself to playing up ten only and start with the Skid and try and stay in the same spot and throw the Hyper Cell that's not going to work. You move your feet and target left and straighten the line up it very well could be very effective playing with the Hyper Cell after the Skid.
Again...as I stated above...your concept in THEORY works great....but in REALITY...having 3 distinct lines that you can play and 3 distinct speeds and 3 distinct release variations....all of these are ADVANCED concepts that most pros understand and utilize frequently. PROS. There is only ONE person on this site...that I could see having 3 lines and 3 speeds....and maybe two releases...and thats VDub. Everyone that screams "foul!"...before screaming and whining...write down your:

- 3 distinct lines; examples (Target 10, Stand center), (Target 5, stand 17), (Target 16, stand 23)
- 3 distinct speeds; example (far back in the approach 7-step approach, stand normal, 4-step approach, stand in front of dots, 3-step approach)
- 3 distinct release; examples (90 degrees, 45 degrees, 15 degrees)

If you can't, don't worry...not even every pro can.

You're talking about moving a 6:6 inside with a stronger ball to stay left of two league bowlers? You're going to play a line/style that you KNOW...is your "B-Game"....and just let them play their "A-Games"?? WHY?? OWN THAT LINE!! MAKE THEM MOVE. It's YOUR line too!!

The ONLY thing that happens when you get a rare night where 3-4 bowlers are on the same line....with newer, reactive equipment...is the lanes transition FASTER (not more). I LOVE when this happens!! Because I know...KNOW...that while they may tie me or even beat me in physical ability...once the lanes start to transition...and I follow my progression and know to move and what to look for to move...I'll be a half step ahead of them ALL NIGHT. They will throw the same shots over and over and get split after split....because they don't know what transition is...they didn't take the time to notice all the bowlers on their line, and they don't what to do if they can't stand in ONE place throwing at ONE target. But...to give perspective (which is lacking in your response)...this scenario happens to me, maybe ONCE a league season. This isn't a sport shot league or a travel league or an ABT tournament. MOST league bowlers are horrible bowlers and are just there to have fun. Trying to "outsmart" them by playing my "B Game" is likely just gonna make me bowl worse.

O I did see someone post about buying three of the same ball and putting different surfaces on them but in my opinion that would be a really bad way to build an arsenal.
Not my first choice...but there's technical merit to that approach.

I don't have access to touring PBA pros often but my PSO drills for 3 PWBA bowlers and 4 PBA Senior bowlers. My coach is one of the Senior's I bowl leagues against 2 of the PWBA league Women and one of them is good friends with my wife and we have lunch together every other Wednesday if she's in town I bowl against 3 of the other seniors in leagues so I get a chance to talk with them a lot. The X,Y,Z argument your trying to make is a bad idea at least 50% of the time in league and you wouldn't win much on the tour that way either
Great! Then you can clear this up!

Ask them, at the next ladies tea that you're invited to, "Excuse me ma'am...when you go to a bowling event...

- "...do you take a certain set of bowling balls with you....or do you just show up and they give you whatever they have in the truck?"
- "...and instead of 2 hours of practice...you get 10 minutes...would you start with your ball that hooks the soonest and see if it stays right of the headpin, then throw it and see if it hits right AND carries, possibly ball DOWN to an option that goes longer if said first ball is losing energy? OR...do you just have some hodge-podge gut instinct sort of thing where ya kinda know what each ball does?"
- "...if you're striking and carrying....at what point do you move, switch balls, or go to entire different line. More precisely, if you start out with the front 7...then notice your opponent is now bowling on your line...would you conisder grabbing your strongest ball and bowling 2-handed? Or maybe you throw em a curveball and start throwing urethane on top of that line...settle for 5-6 opens...just to push oil all over their line?"

- "...and lastly, concerning all the previous questions...how good would I have to be...where focusing my efforts on having 2-3 distinct lines and employing strategies to mess with my opponents line(s) is the best use of my time?"

Aslan

10-14-2016, 10:27 AM

Very true me and you have very different styles and ways of attacking the lanes I think if we blended our strengths we would be a heck of a bowler
..and...a very, very active user of bowlingboards.com...

Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

605 Series: 224-183-198

Spare shooting trouble early, but the Reax Pearl was striking like a maniac; finished 8 of my last 9 shots with strikes.

Learned my lesson from last week and kept using the Reax Pearl for most of Game 2, but a weak strike in Frame 6 and a flat 10 in frame 7 caused me to break out the Innovate. But, the missed 10-pin in the 7th and barely chopped baby split in the 8th ruined my bid for clean game #100.

Started out with the front 4...and the ball movement was so strong that one of the opponents asked what ball it was and is probably going to ask the local pro shop if he could buy one (good luck...they stopped making this ball 2-3 years ago...but I figured I'd keep that to myself). But, definitely impressed with the ball movement with the Innovate. The assymetry wasn't as forgiving...and I had to make good shots...but if I threw a relaxed, good shot...and came within two boards of my target on either side...the Innovate was responding. In the 6th frame, after coming in light and leaving the 2-4-5...I decided to switch to the Defiant Edge...but didn't have immediate success...jury still out on Rotogrip...

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.94 pins
Strikes: 54% (1 7-bagger, 1 4-bagger, 1 double, and 5 singles)
Spares: 57% picked up

Single Pin spares: 33% (1/3)
All 10-pins.

Multiple Pin spares: 63% (7/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 3-6 and 6-9-10 (2x each)

Splits: 33% (1/3)

Average over 3 games: 201.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 209.00.

Glad to help out the team I subbed for versus last week when I couldn't do much to help at all.

The 16lb balls are powering through the pins...and my shoulder isn't as sore this week as it was after the initial switch back to 16 from 15.

Downside: Bye bye 172 establishing average...hello 186 establishing average...

Amyers

10-14-2016, 01:50 PM

All of your responses, while mostly, technically correct...are not realistic to average bowlers. See below:

Wrong. For MOST centers not counting Vegas where there is a massively high user volume on a regular basis...obut MOST centers..... Most of your competition on league night is (or should be) throwing very basic shots up the track. Some are women throwing plastic balls up the middle, maybe a lefty, a couple elderly guys with old equipment up the track...there's no 'strategy' to avoid them messing up your shot. League bowlers aren't good enough to intentionally "mess with your shot" nor ).[/QUOTE]

I really don't know if it is the particular house you throw in or just the leagues you choose to bowl in but do all of the bowlers in So. Cal. suck? from what I'm reading from your posts I'll likely find better bowlers in my youth leagues. I do gravitate towards higher end leagues I don't bowl on family fun night. I do not believe there is a single bowler throwing plastic or house balls on any of my leagues currently. The lowest average on any of the three leagues is one of my teammates on Saturday's and she averages 145 because of a disability she's the lowest average of any of my leagues by almost 20 pins.

PBA bowlers don't necessarily use their balls in a particular order

Yes, they do

The key word there is "necessarily"...which allows you to then say all the rest of that stuff and still be "technically" correct....while also being dead wrong. Absolutely ZERO professional bowlers...show up with 8 random bowling balls drilled to fit their hand and rely on their minimum wage earning ball reps to just "pick one" based on the ball rep's opinion(s). Ball reps make recommendations, they watch how the competitors are bowling, they can scout the lanes before the pro moves to that pair, etc... But if they recommend a ball change...thats always a "discussion"...not an "instruction".

I never said that PBA bowlers don't know what their balls do or are not capable of watching what their balls do. I said they don't have a systematic progression in place that they automatically change their balls with. You pretty much answered the question yourself. "Ball reps make recommendations, they watch how the competitors are bowling, they can scout the lanes before the pro moves to that pair, etc... But if they recommend a ball change...thats always a "discussion"...not an "instruction" to quote you. Why does their need to be a discussion or instruction at all if you already have an order your going to use the balls in? If they have a systematic progression if they are using ball "x" shouldn't they just automatically grab ball "y"? The reason is because one they have more than 3 balls and they do know how each one rolls but there but it is not a systematic progression it's a discussion to determine which of their other balls best fills the need.

Again...as I stated above...your concept in THEORY works great....but in REALITY...having 3 distinct lines that you can play and 3 distinct speeds and 3 distinct release variations....all of these are ADVANCED concepts that most pros understand and utilize frequently. PROS. There is only ONE person on this site...that I could see having 3 lines and 3 speeds....and maybe two releases...and thats VDub. Everyone that screams "foul!"...before screaming and whining...write down your:

As usual you are over complicating things I never said one single word about changing speed or release. It's not necessary to change all of those to change target lines that's why we have different balls. With the proper balls you can easily move lines do you honestly line up and stay in the exact same spot to throw your entire arsenal? I can stand anywhere between 25 and 45 and target anywhere from 8-20 without making changes to my speed and release but if I need to change those it's not the drastic thing you make it out to be. If I want to change my speed I can I simply lower the ball and slow my steps I don't need an entirely different approach. If I want to change my release I simply adjust my pinky finger right or left it's not rocket science.

Amyers

10-14-2016, 01:50 PM

You're talking about moving a 6:6 inside with a stronger ball to stay left of two league bowlers? You're going to play a line/style that you KNOW...is your "B-Game"....and just let them play their "A-Games"?? WHY?? OWN THAT LINE!! MAKE THEM MOVE. It's YOUR line too!!

This is part of knowing your personal game you may be able to win that battle but I know my game. The person that wins this fight is the player with higher speed vary rarely is that me the line will wear out for me much sooner than it will for them. I'm much better with my B game than I am at trying to throw 16 mph.

The ONLY thing that happens when you get a rare night where 3-4 bowlers are on the same line....with newer, reactive equipment...is the lanes transition FASTER (not more). I LOVE when this happens!! Because I know...KNOW...that while they may tie me or even beat me in physical ability...once the lanes start to transition...and I follow my progression and know to move and what to look for to move...I'll be a half step ahead of them ALL NIGHT. They will throw the same shots over and over and get split after split..... But...to give perspective (which is lacking in your response)...this scenario happens to me, maybe ONCE a league season. This isn't a sport shot league or a travel league or an ABT tournament. MOST league bowlers are horrible bowlers and are just there to have fun. Trying to "outsmart" them by playing my "B Game" is likely just gonna make me bowl worse.

Actually with more people on the same line the lanes transition faster and more unless your in So. Cal. where apparently know one knows how to bowl. The reason they transition more is because the other bowlers at least in my leagues aren't idiots who are going to stand there all day throwing the same ball down the same line for split after split after split. They are going to adjust left like any other person with any sense and start braking that line down too. Which will happen all night long. Honestly this doesn't happen to me every night as I tend to play farther left then a lot of other bowlers to start but if I played out in the dirt where you do it would be an every night occurrence. I've told you this before you need to find leagues that are more along your skill level. I do occasionally bowl family trios with my daughters just so they get the opportunity to bowl more and see what your describing but it's not on my Friday night, Wednesday night or travel league.

Great! Then you can clear this up!

- "...do you take a certain set of bowling balls with you....or do you just show up and they give you whatever they have in the truck?"

Actually I have discussed this with the PWBA bowler and the Senior PBA bowler who is my coach. The PWBA usually travels with 8 and doesn't prefer to have additional balls drilled on site as she says they usually cant get the exact feel she likes often enough but will have additional balls drilled if she feels she has to have it. The Senior PBA bowler carries ten and doesn't ever really feel the need to have anything drilled onsite.

- "...and instead of 2 hours of practice...you get 10 minutes...would you start with your ball that hooks the soonest and see if it stays right of the headpin, then throw it and see if it hits right AND carries, possibly ball DOWN to an option that goes longer if said first ball is losing energy? OR...do you just have some hodge-podge gut instinct sort of thing where ya kinda know what each ball does?"

I've asked about this from both of the and it depends on one big factor the pattern they are bowling on. With their current line ups on medium patterns she generally starts off with the Melee Hook her medium ball and adjusts earlier/later for carry and stronger/weaker for where she wants to play on the lanes. On longer/heavier patterns she prefers to start with the Ultimate Nirvana currently and adjust similarly. She tends to have a lot of speed and power for a female probably in the top 2 to 3 on the WPBA tour in revs and speed. My coach is a higher ball speed lower rev more of a Norm Duke style bowler he tends to prefer stronger equipment plays way farther right even though he carries more balls than the WPBA bowler he tends to use less of them preferring to alter his delivery, speed, aiming point, and surface to using different balls at the start. Most patterns he starts with his Nirvana or Ultimate Nirvana. Lighter Medium he will start with a polished Forterra Exile. Either of them are capable of playing pretty much anywhere they need to and adjust for carry more than anything.

- "...if you're striking and carrying....at what point do you move, switch balls, or go to entire different line. More precisely, if you start out with the front 7...then notice your opponent is now bowling on your line...would you conisder grabbing your strongest ball and bowling 2-handed? Or maybe you throw em a curveball and start throwing urethane on top of that line...settle for 5-6 opens...just to push oil all over their line?"

I haven't ever asked this question this way but I can tell you either of them will stick with what works until they see something in the roll of the ball or exit point of the ball to move, change balls, or make other adjustments. Neither are going to bowl 2 handed, or switch to urethane as neither like it but if they did they wouldn't throw 5-6 opens doing it because they would know what adjustments to make to throw it in the pocket the reason they wouldn't is giving up carry. As far as moving oil I've never heard her talk about it and with her power game she doesn't have to. My coach will throw a 500 surfaced ball to the right of his line in practice to give him something to bump off of especially on heavier patterns. I will tell you this either of them if they see a player using a different break point that's carrying and their not will switch in heart beat.
In professional bowling your often changing lanes and the ability to change balls and lines and know where your going after seeing a ball rolled is paramount. You have to know exactly where to move with what

- "...and lastly, concerning all the previous questions...how good would I have to be...where focusing my efforts on having 2-3 distinct lines and employing strategies to mess with my opponents line(s) is the best use of my time?"

I'm not sure where this came from about screwing up other people's lines maybe you read something between the lines that wasn't there. I have never suggested doing that and I personally wouldn't although I don't have a problem with it. What I suggest was knowing where your competition is playing and being aware of where their lines are so that you don't adjust into and area they've previously burnt up.

Adjusting to the extremes you were talking about no that's not worth your time. Learning where each ball needs to be played on the lane in relationship to where your throwing your other balls? An arsenal is worthless without it. I can get any ball out of my bag at anytime on THS and put the first ball in the pocket with it unless I screw the shot up. I know if I've got my Fanatic out I can move 2-1 left and use the Danger Zone or 4-2 left and use the Mastermind I can move 2-2 right and throw the Rhino at any time. I may have to fine tune the line a board to fine tune the shot but it's going to hit the 1-3 pretty well. I know I can switch to less aggressive longer ball with more backend and just move two boards left with my feet if I want to play farther right to left or if I've been swinging it I can move a couple of boards right with my feet playing a flatter trajectory with a stronger ball and usually put it in there.

My issue right now is learning when to make each of the moves or ball changes to carry better and at the moment the best I can tell you it's as much as gut feeling and knowing how your equipment works as anything else. I have figured out there is a limit to how far left I can move playing a right to left line and still carry with my earlier equipment there is a limit to how straight a line I can play with my longer equipment. Unfortunately there is a line with my ball speed unless the head are flooded how far left I can get and still get it far enough right to work with my lower ball speed even less aggressive longer balls hook to early. One of these days I'm going to figure out how to get enough ball speed to play those lines.

Aslan

10-14-2016, 04:06 PM

I really don't know if it is the particular house you throw in or just the leagues you choose to bowl in but do all of the bowlers in So. Cal. suck?

Thats an interesting question. I think, if California took it's best 20 bowlers and challenged West Virginia's top 20...California would come out on top and it wouldn't even be close. THAT BEING SAID...I think you're more likely to find a higher concentration of skilled league bowlers at a non-California State...because there are less centers...so the better bowlers are spread out more.

When I was in that Sport Shot league with MWhite...there were only about 30 bowlers...95% were very skilled...but thats not a fair representation because of that league's location (Norco)and start time (8:00AM). If it were at 4:00PM on a Sunday at a center in Northern Orange County or Southern LA County...it would be able to fill a house and probably still have a waiting list. There are some travel leagues I'd like to join...but I'm not that level yet. Same thing with high $$$ leagues...I'll do the ABT if it's local or free entry...but I can't compete with Southern California's top bowlers that enter the bigger money leagues.

And thats the other thing. If I took all the players from the travel, youth, and big $$$ leagues...paired em against the travel, youth, and big $$$ leagues in the entire State of West Virginia...Southern California would have more and better bowlers. That makes someone like me....a 180s average bowler...not quite "ready" for that level.

Now, if I move to the Des Moines area as planned...then yeah, look for some of the more serious leagues, travel leagues, sport shot leagues etc... They will be more scarce than Southern California...but I won't have to beat out as many semi-pro bowlers just to get a spot.

And there's another variable, to answer your question, which is the proximity to Vegas. Nobody East of the Mississippi river can relate to bowling leagues in the Western States....because while a center East of the Mississippi may have a "Vegas League"....they are far fewer and less popular leagues....because it's pricey to fly to Las Vegas. While a league can get a good deal on a block of rooms...airfare is usually covered by the bowlers. A husband and wife would need at LEAST $800 to make that trip above and beyond what the league pays for.

In Southern California, only 4-5 hours from Vegas...nearly EVERY big, established league sweeps in Vegas. The only big league I've seen that didn't sweep in Vegas was a league that swept in Laughlin, NV instead. So, many of the bowlers in these leagues aren't "good"...they just like to bowl for recreation and have an excuse to go to Vegas twice a year.

Now, could I join smaller, non-sweeping leagues? Well, the better leagues during the day are either high average leagues where you essentially would have to get "selected" to join their team...usually sponsored by a pro shop or something like that. OR...I'd need to be about 13 years older so I could bowl with the rest of the old men.

I've looked into all these options as part of my goals for my bowling and what I would need to be competitive in some of the higher league/tourney options in this area would be:

- OC Scratch Trios League: 202 average
- Try the West Coast Bowling Tournaments: 209 average
- ABT and abta Regular Tournament Participant: 216 average
- Brunswick ($$$) League: 223 average

I do not believe there is a single bowler throwing plastic or house balls on any of my leagues currently. The lowest average on any of the three leagues is one of my teammates on Saturday's and she averages 145 because of a disability she's the lowest average of any of my leagues by almost 20 pins.
Holy Christ. Either West Virginia has tilted lanes like Missouri (Iceman)...or people just give up bowling if they can't average 140 or something. Thats astounding! How big are these leagues!??

The smallest league I bowl in has 29 teams. I counted 29 bowlers (1 per team average) that had a < 140 average. Of matter of fact, I'm supposed to sub for a team tonight where not ONE of the bowlers averages over 140. God forbid I catch fire...and/or am bowling against the team with that grouchy old dude on it...last time he got pissed when I subbed and trounced his team. He kept going on about some rule that used to exist that the sub had to be within 15 pins average of the person he/she was subbing for, etc..., etc...., etc...essentially a rule from decades ago that the league either got rid of or just never enforces...plus I WAS within 15 points of average of the person I was subbing for...so, there's that. :rolleyes:

Amyers

10-19-2016, 09:27 AM

Thats an interesting question. I think, if California took it's best 20 bowlers and challenged West Virginia's top 20...California would come out on top and it wouldn't even be close. THAT BEING SAID...I think you're more likely to find a higher concentration of skilled league bowlers at a non-California State...because there are less centers...so the better bowlers are spread out more.

This most likely is true. We have some guys that could hold their own but without a doubt you've got way more to chose from. There are 9 centers within about 80 miles of me but we don't have your traffic so I can get to the farthest ones in an hour. I know 75% of the better bowlers in the southern part of the state by first name. centers are smaller here too.

When I was in that Sport Shot league with MWhite...there were only about 30 bowlers...95% were very skilled...but thats not a fair representation because of that league's location (Norco)and start time (8:00AM). If it were at 4:00PM on a Sunday at a center in Northern Orange County or Southern LA County...it would be able to fill a house and probably still have a waiting list. There are some travel leagues I'd like to join...but I'm not that level yet. Same thing with high $$$ leagues...I'll do the ABT if it's local or free entry...but I can't compete with Southern California's top bowlers that enter the bigger money leagues.

And thats the other thing. If I took all the players from the travel, youth, and big $$$ leagues...paired em against the travel, youth, and big $$$ leagues in the entire State of West Virginia...Southern California would have more and better bowlers. That makes someone like me....a 180s average bowler...not quite "ready" for that level.

I don't doubt this much you have a much larger population. Myself I'm not the worst by far in any of the big money or travel leagues here but I'm more towards the bottom 25% if I'm honest with myself but I feel it's hard to improve if your competition is a beer swigging baboon that doesn't even understand simple lanes adjustments.

And there's another variable, to answer your question, which is the proximity to Vegas. Nobody East of the Mississippi river can relate to bowling leagues in the Western States....because while a center East of the Mississippi may have a "Vegas League"....they are far fewer and less popular leagues....because it's pricey to fly to Las Vegas. While a league can get a good deal on a block of rooms...airfare is usually covered by the bowlers. A husband and wife would need at LEAST $800 to make that trip above and beyond what the league pays for.

In Southern California, only 4-5 hours from Vegas...nearly EVERY big, established league sweeps in Vegas. The only big league I've seen that didn't sweep in Vegas was a league that swept in Laughlin, NV instead. So, many of the bowlers in these leagues aren't "good"...they just like to bowl for recreation and have an excuse to go to Vegas twice a year.

This could be it. There are no sweeper leagues and I had not even heard of the concept until I joined on here. I guess that really could draw in some bowlers who otherwise wouldn't bowl. You don't see much recreational league bowling here not saying it doesn't exists. Some guys here do drink too much but most of them are in the 160-180 class who at least know the basics, sometimes you'll have a guy bring his wife or girlfriend in on a team but usually they pick it up quick or they don't last long.

Now, could I join smaller, non-sweeping leagues? Well, the better leagues during the day are either high average leagues where you essentially would have to get "selected" to join their team...usually sponsored by a pro shop or something like that. OR...I'd need to be about 13 years older so I could bowl with the rest of the old men.

I've looked into all these options as part of my goals for my bowling and what I would need to be competitive in some of the higher league/tourney options in this area would be:

- OC Scratch Trios League: 202 average
- Try the West Coast Bowling Tournaments: 209 average
- ABT and abta Regular Tournament Participant: 216 average
- Brunswick ($$$) League: 223 average

Wow on the Brunswick league average it's hard to average much over the upper 220's here. The centers are older heck half or so of them are still wood. The lane machines are older and we still have some old school proprietors that believe there should at least be an element of skill to the game. You don't see many averaging north of 230 (especially by the end of the season) and you don't find many below 160 in most leagues.

Holy Christ. Either West Virginia has tilted lanes like Missouri (Iceman)...or people just give up bowling if they can't average 140 or something. Thats astounding! How big are these leagues!??

The smallest league I bowl in has 29 teams. I counted 29 bowlers (1 per team average) that had a < 140 average. Of matter of fact, I'm supposed to sub for a team tonight where not ONE of the bowlers averages over 140. God forbid I catch fire...and/or am bowling against the team with that grouchy old dude on it...last time he got pissed when I subbed and trounced his team. He kept going on about some rule that used to exist that the sub had to be within 15 pins average of the person he/she was subbing for, etc..., etc...., etc...essentially a rule from decades ago that the league either got rid of or just never enforces...plus I WAS within 15 points of average of the person I was subbing for...so, there's that. :rolleyes:

Our houses and leagues are smaller my largest league has 31 teams my smallest 14. Houses sizes range a bit I think there are still some 8 lane houses around here but I've never bowled at one. I have bowled at a couple that are 12, The houses I bowl my leagues at are 28 to 36 lane houses. Our bowlers mainly come from 2 places older existing bowlers and our junior leagues. So most of them already know how to bowl there are a few that start as open bowlers and get hooked but most of them get somewhat obsessed with the game and are pretty good by the time they start to bowl leagues. I don't think I've ever seen an open bowler just join a league. So usually if we have a real low average person they are either someone's spouse or just older than dirt. We do have one guy on Saturday night that averages about 115 but he's 94 and says he won't quit until he dies or averages below his age lol.

I think maybe the biggest difference here maybe the Sweeps you guys do. I could see where that would draw in people who here would be open bowlers in to a league. Would be a good idea but here in a comparable distance that would put you into sweeping in Pittsburgh, Cincinnati, or Lexington and who really wants to go there.

Aslan

10-19-2016, 02:42 PM

Playing catch-up a bit...been busy bowling and doing other stuff....haven't been as diligent about updating.

Friday League Night (subbing)
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

485 Series: 152-184-149

Game 1, same ole problem. Miss right and leave weak 1-2-8s and 1-2-4s...then make an adjustment, get more hand in the ball, now I'm going through the nose...and got some wonderful 4-6-7 and 4-6-7-9-10 splits.

Game 2 I switched to the Innovate, was actually doing quite well...so much so that one guy was quite curious about the Innovate...said he was in the market for a new ball and liked how that one moved. Didn't have the heart to tell him the ball was released 3 years ago so he's out of luck. Shoulda been a better score...but I struck 5 times...4 times on one side...just couldn't figure the other lane out. Missed a 10-pin in the 8th then got a 4-7-10 split in the 9th...and that was that.

The Innovate was doing well...so I stayed with it in Game 3...but I never ended up finding an answer to the lane I was struggling on...missed a 7-pin, chopped a 2-4-5, had a 4-6 split, and couldn't convert a baby split. Too many opens, not enough strikes...

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.45 pins
Strikes: 30% (2 doubles, and 6 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 71% (5/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a single 4-pin, 6-pin, and 7-pin (2x).

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (6/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 (4x)

Splits: 16% (1/6)

Average over 3 games: 161.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 168.67.

Failed as a sub...hurt the team I bowled with. Personal record (I think)...I don't recall ever getting 6 splits in a series.

My worst series since early August prompted me to go back Saturday night for the color-pin tournament...try and work some of these kinks out...

Aslan

10-19-2016, 08:11 PM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament:

536 Series: 179-175-182

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.58 pins
Strikes: 39% (1 turkey, 1 double, and 8 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 42% (3/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x)
Also left a 3-pin and 4-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 75% (9/12)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/1).

Average over 3 games: 178.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 192.33.

Something was just 'slightly' off. I was actually bowling very consistent...hitting the pocket well...but was just a 'shade' something... I switched from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate midway through Game 1...but just couldn't run any strikes together. And the single-pin spare shooting was abysmal...absolutely awful. One for 5 on 10-pins...that's just unacceptable.

This was on Saturday and I had a lesson Monday...mainly working on body position. I have a tendency to "pop up" as I release...which leads to a less powerful leverage position for my hand (on top of the ball versus under/behind the ball). I've been trying to get rid of that (what I call) "WRW Bounce" because I blame WR for teaching me that bad habit.

The next part of this "work"...is I have to have PROPER spine tilt. That means, not just getting to the line and bending over. Thats BAD forward spine tilt and you lose your balance and have no leverage in your legs. I need to improve GOOD spine tilt. And, surprisingly to me, once we worked on proper spine tilt...the 10-pin started to be easier to hit as did the 7-pin. Actually picked both of the off for a 1 1 frame. And we talked some "sports psychology"...some visual tricks to keep me from "being me" and missing one single-pin...then spiraling into a pit of darkness.

More later...better get in the shower if I wanna make it over in time to sub at 6PM.

Aslan

10-20-2016, 03:36 AM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, low-moderate oil THS

519 Series: 142-183-194

Game 1 was a disaster. The lanes were insanely dry.

Game 2 was also heading down the toilet...so I got a double shot of Tequila and just said "#*&@ it!" I proceeded 6 strikes and a couple spares to salvage the 183.

Game 3 I ordered another double shot and had it not been for a greek church in the 10th...I was on track for a 230 game...coulda salvaged a respectable 550 series.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.69 pins
Strikes: 46% (2 4-baggers and 7 singles)
Spares: 47% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (4/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a single 4-pin (2x) and 7-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 36% (4/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/5)

Average over 3 games: 173.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 180.33.

Helped the team take 3 or 4 of the points...despite my early struggles. Not sure if the alcohol did anything or if I just settled down...but things were much improved post-tequilla.

Aslan

10-20-2016, 04:29 AM

Wednesday Night League
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

The league had an opening so I agreed to join. So next week...I'll start bowling on an actual team.

533 Series: 175-183-196

Chopped a 6-10 in the 4th frame of Game 1 to ruin my bid for my 100th clean game. Only two strikes; carry issues. Game 2 was more of the same. Missed an 8-pin in the 3rd and then opened on a 4-pin in the 10th. Only three strikes.

Game 3 was the closest I've ever come to a Dutch 200...a 7 / in the 3rd frame...had it have been a strike...my first Dutch 200. But, I settled for finally getting the 100th clean game.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.69 pins
Strikes: 31% (1 double and 8 singles)
Spares: 80% picked up

Single Pin spares: 83% (10/12)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin (3x).
Never left a single 1-pin nor 5-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 77% (7/9)
Most common multi-pin leave: 2-4-5-8 bucket (2x)

Splits: 100% (1/1)

Average over 3 games: 177.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 185.67.

Had trouble holding my line. 3 out of 8 of the bowlers were throwing plastic balls up the middle...I think there was carrydown and it was messing with my shot a bit.

Happy to get my 100th clean game. I remember thinking a clean game was as hard to get as a 300-game early on...now it seems in reach almost every game.

Aslan

10-24-2016, 05:56 PM

Friday League Night (subbing)
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

539 Series: 184-186-169

Games 1 and 2 were the same ole same ole...lots of marks, a couple opens per game, but unable to run strikes together. Game 3 I had even worse carry...and had some single-pin spare shooting issues early.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.72 pins
Strikes: 40% (4 doubles, and 5 singles)
Spares: 63% picked up

Single Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 2-pin and 10-pin (2x).
Never left a single 3-pin, 5-pin, 6-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 63% (7/11)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 2-4-5 and 1-2-4-8 (2x each)

Splits: 0% (0/1)

Average over 3 games: 179.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 190.33.

Bowled against a team that I used to bowl against at another center. Older team, missing their best bowler..but still had a couple very good bowlers and and a couple decent female bowlers with lots of handicap. The team I was subbing for had two above average bowlers and me...but little handicap and a minus 10-pins each game for the absence. Everyone bowled well...but their one lady bowler bowled a 210 and a 190 despite a 135 average...so games 1 and 2 were a loss. In the 3rd, my 169 didn't blow it and we won at least one point. It stings...but nothing I did HURT the team...I helped them...it's just really tough to beat a team that has a 155 average bowler that averages 135 as a sub (somehow?)...or maybe she just had the series of her life...it happens.

Consistent...still gotta get some movement down lane...the revs aren't as high with 16lbs as they were with 15lbs...leaving way, way too many 2-pins, 2-4-5s, 1-2-4-8s, 1-2-4-10s, etc... Part of that is re-adjusting my starting points. I have notes for almost every lane at the center...but I need to make some small adjustments to account for the equipment change (weight).

Aslan

10-28-2016, 06:20 AM

Wednesday Night League
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

546 Series: 201-174-171

Game 1 I really felt dialed in with the Reax Pearl. But, a missed single 10-pin in the 10th kinda ruined any chance at a really good score.

Game 2 I had a few opens, but I had a couple doubles filtered in there to help prop the score up.

Game 3 I switched to the Defiant Edge (from the Innovate) on one of the lanes...but was using the Innovate on the other lane. The problem (I think) is that I may have "over done it" when I tried to de-oil the Defiant Edge...and the damn VISE IT insert was getting stuck and not going in the D. Edge. That meant before each shot, I had to use my left thumb as best I could, then really wrench on it with my right thumb...just too much aggravation.

Actually, my spare shooting improved in Game 3 and I didn't strike as much...but 3 splits including a 4-6-7 I almost picked up in the 4th frame.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.00 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 4-bagger, 3 doubles, and 6 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (6/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (5x).
Also left a single 2-pin and a single 9-pin (2x).

Multiple Pin spares: 25% (2/8)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-8 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/4)

Average over 3 games: 182.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 190.00.

Out of 4 nights bowling in this league, with my new arsenal...3 of the 4 nights...I shot a 200+ Game 1 and then two sub-200 games.

Average Game 1: 203.75
Average Game 2: 167.50
Average Game 3: 178.75

Not sure why that is...other than the theory that this house has older lanes, they transition quickly...the Reax Pearl is just too much ball once that transition happens...I either switch to the Innovate too soon...and have to spend 1-1.5 games re-adjusting my line...OR...I switch to the Innovate too late...after leaving flat 10s, 7s, 8s, 2s...and unless my spare shooting is perfect (which it rarely is)...I'm in the 151-183 range. By Game 3...I usually figure things out...either staying with the Innovate or moving to the RG Def. Edge...and the score depends not only on spare shooting...but how long it takes me to get dialed in with the Def. Edge...worst case 150-171...best case 196-198.

Can't complain. The team was impressed with my fairly average performance. We took 3 out of 4...which is good since this team is closer to the top of the standings. The waitress said nice things to me. And I managed to pay for my ball repairs, a VISE IT removal tool, and my dinner using the money I won in brackets when the guy I was up against (a 2-hander nonetheless) completely POOed the bed in Game 3. Lucked out that my 202 handicap score held up in round 2 of brackets...usually thats where I falter.

Amyers

10-28-2016, 10:25 AM

Not bad. Why are you deoiling the defiant edge all ready? IF you can find some lanes with oil on them during practice or maybe right after league if they aren't too burnt throw your Reax for a pocket hit then pick up the Defiant Edge and see what adjustment you need to put it in the pocket. Then you know I believe the adjustment From the Reax to the Edge will be more natural for you.

Aslan

10-31-2016, 04:34 AM

Why are you deoiling the defiant edge all ready?
I try to de-oil after every third use. I'm probably going to switch to an every 10 use schedule given that:
1) I left the DE in a bit too long last time and I think I messed up the thumb hole a bit.
2) The polished Pearls don't seem to absorb oil nearly as fast as sanded solids. Most places will sand the ball, then de-oil, then polish...I believe...but I've gotten very little oil out of any of the pearls I've thrown...especially the OOB and polished ones.

I believe the adjustment From the Reax to the Edge will be more natural for you.
The drop from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate is actually a fairly flawless transition. It's when I get into late 2nd game and 3rd game...when I switch to the Defiant Edge...if I switch too early...it 'flips' unpredictably and harder...kinda like my old Melee Jab. But (also like the Jab), if I wait too long to switch..my angle is usually a 2:1, 1:1, 2:2, 3:3 too far inside.

In a nutshell...I switch from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate...I strike. When I switch from the Innovate to the Defiant Edge...I either go through the nose or leave 4s or 9s...OR...I miss right and leave a 1-2-8.

Friday League Night (subbing)
Older Brunswick synthetics: low-moderate oil

654 Series: 225-267 (clean)-162

Game 1 I was a baby split away from a clean 235.

Game 2 tied my personal best sanctioned game...highest game since my 277 practicing in Vegas in September or my last league 267 from late October last year. Apparently I have one sanctioned 267 game in me, per year. Spare in the first, spare in the 10th.

Game 3 wasn't as bad as the score indicates. I was clean until the 6th frame when I left a Big 4...and chopped the 10-pin off, almost picking it up. The only "unforced error" of the entire series was when I missed a 1-2 spare conversion (1/4 to 1/2 inch to the right) in the 8th frame...which rattled me a bit mentally...then a 3-7-9 split in the 9th frame. Just lost my strike line and couldn't get it back.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.06 pins
Strikes: 50% (1 8-bagger, 1 4-bagger, 1 turkey, and 1 double)
Spares: 73% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (3x).
Also left a 6-pin (1x) and 9-pin (2x).

Multiple Pin spares: 55% (5/9)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 3-6 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 218.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a.

Noticed weak hits in frames 1 and 2 of Game 3...so I switched to the Innovate...striking the next two frames...but then I just lost the line...got the Defiant Edge out for the 10th frame fill shot...but didn't need to make as many changes tonight as the team I was subbing on was bowling against a vacant team...and neither of the other guys threw up the right side...1 lefty and 1 righty/backup.

I didn't plan on doing very well...so I got in two brackets but not the strike ball or side pot. Would have easily won two side pots (and probably the strike ball had they drew my ticket during Game 2). Ended up just winning 1st place in one bracket and 2nd place in the other.

And yes, I did have to hear the moans and gripes as people looked at the bracket and saw a 304 (handicap) in Round 2.

Obviously, can't complain about that outing. Gotta figure out how to run 3 of these games together. Gotta figure out the transition. I had a legitimate shot at my first 700 series tonight...and I didn't even get close. I gotta fix that if I want to take my game to the next level.

mc_runner

10-31-2016, 08:29 AM

Nice game and nice set!

bubba809

10-31-2016, 09:30 AM

Very good shooting Aslan. Keep it up.

fortheloveofbowling

10-31-2016, 10:56 AM

Nice bowling Aslan.

Amyers

10-31-2016, 11:00 AM

654 Series: 225-267-162

Really nice set

I try to de-oil after every third use. I'm probably going to switch to an every 10 use

That's way too much.

Non polished balls I resurface ever 6-10 games or so.
Polished balls every 20-30 games. Notice this is actual games of use not every time I go bowling. From what I've been seeing your only using the edge in the third game it would only need to be resurfaced once or twice a season with that level of use more less de oiled.

I deoil after about 50-60 games and even then its mostly if I see a loss in performance.

The drop from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate is actually a fairly flawless transition. It's when I get into late 2nd game and 3rd game...when I switch to the Defiant Edge...if I switch too early...it 'flips' unpredictably and harder...kinda like my old Melee Jab. But (also like the Jab), if I wait too long to switch..my angle is usually a 2:1, 1:1, 2:2, 3:3 too far inside.

In a nutshell...I switch from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate...I strike. When I switch from the Innovate to the Defiant Edge...I either go through the nose or leave 4s or 9s...OR...I miss right and leave a 1-2-8.

The reason your feeling more comfortable switching to the Innovate is it's allowing you to play more the same line with a weaker ball but that usually doesn't hold up well for long. Also it really leaves you without a step if your going to switch to the innovate just stick with it and leave the edge out of it.

When your moving left you should be making variations of 2-1 or 3-1 moves especially with the Edge not parallel moves. Try moving 4-2 or even 6-2 when switching to the Edge trust it it'll come back as long as you don't try and make it come back. If that puts you in the pocket make 2-1 moves afterward. Then you've still got the Innovate for game 3 if needed but most nights you shouldn't. If it washes out you know you switched too early.

Aslan

11-03-2016, 12:52 AM

Nice game and nice set!

Very good shooting Aslan. Keep it up.

Nice bowling Aslan.

Really nice set

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you, and Thank you!!

That's way too much....Non polished balls I resurface ever 6-10 games or so.
Polished balls every 20-30 games...I deoil after about 50-60 games and even then its mostly if I see a loss in performance.
You may be right. Like I said, I don't get much oil out of pearls and polished balls when I DO de-oil them...meaning I'm probably doing it too soon.

The reason your feeling more comfortable switching to the Innovate is it's allowing you to play more the same line with a weaker ball but that usually doesn't hold up well for long.
Exactly...BUT...depending on who you listen to...some would say the point of a proper arsenal is exactly for that purpose...so you can play a line for 3, 6, 9, 12 games...and never have to go to your "B-Game" or God forbid "C Game".

It IS a possibility that it isn't the WEAKNESS of the Defiant Edge...causing me to make a 2:1 right when I change from the Innovate...it could be that the Defiant Edge is too strong...and I need to make a 2:2, 3:3 or something like that...maybe a 2:1 or 4:2...but essentially I need to move left and play more of an inside game..not move 2:1 right to find dry. But again, this is a VERY VERY difficult thing to determine for amateur bowlers. Am I hitting light because this isn't enough ball? Or am I hitting light because the ball used up it's energy? Fortunately I have a lesson next week so I can talk this over with a coach (or two).

585 Series: 218 (clean)-199-168

Game 1 I made a lot of great shots...and when I didn't, I picked up the spares. Only 6 pins from winning the handicap side pot.

Game 2 I had a 4-6-7 split in the first frame...then was clean until I chopped a 1-2-4 leave in the 10th frame...thus ruining my chance at another 210+ game.

Game 3 was more of the same issues I've been having recently (see below).

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.62 pins
Strikes: 46% (1 4-bagger, 4 doubles, and 3 singles)
Spares: 70% picked up

Single Pin spares: 75% (3/4)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (2x).
Also left a single 3-pin and 5-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 69% (9/13)
Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4 (3x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 195.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 197.67.

I seem to be doing better in Game 2 than I was the first four weeks...but still struggling MIGHTILY in Game 3.

Average Game 1: 206.60 (trending up)
Average Game 2: 173.80 (trending up)
Average Game 3: 176.60 (trending down)

Something to talk about in my upcoming lessons, for sure.

But, I won one card game and both brackets (despite the poo 3rd game)...missed Game 1 side pot by 6 pins...but still only did a little better than breaking even (breakdown saved for another post).

Amyers

11-03-2016, 10:10 AM

Exactly...BUT...depending on who you listen to...some would say the point of a proper arsenal is exactly for that purpose...so you can play a line for 3, 6, 9, 12 games...and never have to go to your "B-Game" or God forbid "C Game".

It IS a possibility that it isn't the WEAKNESS of the Defiant Edge...causing me to make a 2:1 right when I change from the Innovate...it could be that the Defiant Edge is too strong...and I need to make a 2:2, 3:3 or something like that...maybe a 2:1 or 4:2...but essentially I need to move left and play more of an inside game..not move 2:1 right to find dry. But again, this is a VERY VERY difficult thing to determine for amateur bowlers. Am I hitting light because this isn't enough ball? Or am I hitting light because the ball used up it's energy? Fortunately I have a lesson next week so I can talk this over with a coach (or two).

Never move right. If you need to get the ball more into the dry to get it to react move your feet 2 boards to left and keep your target the same. This forces the breakpoint of the ball farther right.

Moving 2-1,4-2,6-2 does not constitute going to your B or C game. That's a normal adjustment that any bowler should be able to seamlessly make. For me I'm comfortable targeting anywhere from 5-18 standing pretty much anywhere left of 25 that's my A game I can play there without making changes to how I line up, my approach, and my release. Playing left of 20 that's a B game because it takes physical changes in my approach to get that far left with the correct angle. Playing right of 5 with my feet right of 20 takes physical changes to my approach and release. When a good bowler refers to b and c games it's not a matter of I don't like it there it's the fact that they have to make physical changes to how they deliver the bowling ball from those areas. Moving 2-1, 4-2, 6-2, or 6-3 should not be causing you to enter those areas unless your already at the extremes of your area to begin with.

RobLV1

11-03-2016, 12:14 PM

Never move right. If you need to get the ball more into the dry to get it to react move your feet 2 boards to left and keep your target the same. This forces the breakpoint of the ball farther right.

I agree with the never move right part, but as you move your feet left, you have to move your target left, otherwise before long you will be throwing the ball directly into the gutter unless you walk to the right and that defeats the whole purpose of the move. When you move your feet left three boards and your target left two boards, change the angle of your hips and shoulders, you can effectively "open up the lane." I agree also that lateral movements do not constitute your A game, B game, etc.

Amyers

11-03-2016, 12:24 PM

I agree with the never move right part, but as you move your feet left, you have to move your target left, otherwise before long you will be throwing the ball directly into the gutter unless you walk to the right and that defeats the whole purpose of the move. When you move your feet left three boards and your target left two boards, change the angle of your hips and shoulders, you can effectively "open up the lane." I agree also that lateral movements do not constitute your A game, B game, etc.

So you believe that you change the body position to open up the lanes instead of where your at on the lanes? My coach has a different tact with that to open the shot more you make small moves with your feet. Now he doesn't suggest standing on 35 and aiming at ten or anything but to move the break point a board or two left he generally has me just adjust my feet.

RobLV1

11-03-2016, 12:46 PM

Yes, while he doesn't suggest standing on 35 and looking at ten, eventually, after several moves, that will be the end result if the eyes don't move along with the feet.

Amyers

11-03-2016, 12:56 PM

Yes, while he doesn't suggest standing on 35 and looking at ten, eventually, after several moves, that will be the end result if the eyes don't move along with the feet.

He never has suggested adjusting that way on a continual basis after a 2 board move left top open the line you would make normal Parallel moves afterward. 2-1,4-2 so that's not really an issue. If you kept moving your feet left you are correct pretty soon the balls in the gutter.

Aslan

11-03-2016, 05:33 PM

My response to both of you fine gentlemen..is, I agree...but it 'depends'.

For the purpose of this example, we'll use the extremes:

If you are standing center and throwing up the 10-board..using a sanded Brunswick Nirvanna...and you make 1-2 lateral moves...now you're standing 4 boards left and lets say targeting 12...and it leaves a flat 10-pin on each lane. You switch to a Columbia Freeze. You now leave a 2-4-5 3/4 bucket.

You have two options. Either;
A) You move right 2:1 because the Columbia Freeze is just not making that turn...and you need "drier".

B) You move 2:1 left...looking for "dry".

The question I have about this option, that I can't really understand is...why wouldn't I keep striking with my initial ball...continuing to move left...continuing to strike? I can understand lateral moves left. I can understand "balling down" and staying on/around your line. I can't understand combining lateral moves left AND balling down....UNLESS...it's a 'loss of energy issue'...in which case...the Defiant Edge that I'm balling down to...is stronger than I need that ball to be AND there's not enough carrydown to facilitate using it.

And that may very well be the case. I couldn't use the Asylum because it hooked too soon. It didn't 'fit' in my arsenal. This (Defiant Edge) is my second attempt at Rotogrip...it may be that the Rotogrip balls are just hooking too soon (and sooner than my ball driller feels they do). And/Or...this is a house that transitions quickly due to the age of the lanes. It may just be that there's really no carrydown at all...or definitely not enough...so it's hitting a drier spot than it's drilled/chosen for.

My concern is...and why I tend to choose "A"...is;
1) There is no "dry". There are varying degrees of oiled. The middle...higher volume. Outside...carrydown and lower volumes. The only way to make "dry" is for the center to strip each lane and apply oil in a shape vertically. Then clean and strip the lanes and repeat that each time. "Dry" is a myth. And if you're wrong...that 2-4-5 becomes a 1-2-3-4-5-7-8 leave on the next shot.

2) "A Games" and "B Games" and "C Games" exist. For most of us...thats track versus out and in versus opening up the lane and trusting the breakpoint. For advanced professionals...that may be varied speeds and releases or going from one # steps approach to a different # of steps. I know from thousands of games of experience...if my feet get left of 25...and/or my target gets inside of 14...I lose all margin for error. Any slight miss right or muscling of the shot...I will miss right of the head pin...maybe a washout. If I miss left...poo shoot...could leave the 2-pin, could leave the 3-pin.

Intersting stuff.

NewToBowling

11-03-2016, 05:55 PM

I assume you're bowling on THS.

To be honest on most THS there is so much forgiveness whatever ball you're using it should react pretty similar. When I miss a shot more times than not it's me that is the problem, not the ball. Either my release, drift, hand, target was off. The least of my worries is the actual ball not reacting the way it should.

Sure there are times when it is the ball reaction's fault but that sometimes also comes back to the release.

Amyers

11-04-2016, 08:45 AM

Moral of the story don't switch from a Nirvava to a Freeze.

The reason you don't just continually make lateral moves especially with a ball like the nirvana is eventually your going to start leaving corner pins the ball starts to early and the ball cant recover with enough angle to carry. Also the heads start to wear and what's an early ball anyway becomes even earlier.

There is little to no carry down and modern reactive balls aren't effected by it anyway. Also when your pushing that breakpoint right the guys causing carry down i.e. Plastic aren't out there anyway. Your not finding carry down at 7 45 foot down the lane.

Your not waiting on the oil to carry down to use the edge it's the opposite if anything. On a THS you could easily start with the edge if you wanted. There is already dry out there. With your more skid flip pieces and the edge fits into that you need a defined dry spot to bounce the ball off of. It's all about finding that spot on the land where the ball turns and is guided into the pocket.

I think when you're moving in your keeping your lines to tight. Try opening the hips and shoulders more as Rob suggest or moving a couple boards left with your feet whichever works for you and feed the ball to the dry more when you move in. Then make normal 2-1,4-2 adjustments afterwards. I think you'll see a difference

1VegasBowler

11-04-2016, 10:34 AM

The one thing to remember about the Nirvana is that it's a ball for heavy oil, and it's best to play in as much oil as you can (down the middle). It also had a big tendency to over react to friction, which is not a very good ball on a THS, especially when you compare it to the Ultimate Nirvana which has a lot more versatility.

This opinion is also shared by Rob Johnson (Lane Side Reviews) and Chuck Gardner (Chuck On The Truck) from Brunswick.

RobLV1

11-04-2016, 10:52 AM

Two misconceptions here:

1. You don't have to start with an aggressive ball and ball down. Look at it like this: on fresh oil, there is, by definition, friction on the outside, usually around the second arrow. If you start with a less aggressive ball playing the oil line, you are still going to read the friction on the outside, and you will take full advantage of the hold area to your left. Most of the bowlers in THS leagues are going to be playing the second arrow, so, once your hold starts to dry up, try making a 5 and 3 move left, and switch to a more aggressive ball. You now have enough ball to get it back from the area that you and others have already dried up, and you will not over-react to the heavier oil nearer the middle of the lane on pulled shots. Before my surgery, I started bowling pretty well, and I was approaching it like this: started with the Fanatic BTU near the oil line. Jumped left and switched to Rocketship when required. If another move was required, I jump left again and switch to the Snapback, the most aggressive ball in my bag. When it got so dried out all over the place, I switch back to the BTU or the LT 48 a play around the third arrow, going as straight as possible. Try it, you might like it.

2. Please, please stop talking about carry down. Unless you have someone throwing plastic or urethane on your pair, it doesn't exist. Adjusting for carry down will only get you in trouble.

Mike White

11-04-2016, 03:16 PM

Two misconceptions here:
2. Please, please stop talking about carry down. Unless you have someone throwing plastic or urethane on your pair, it doesn't exist. Adjusting for carry down will only get you in trouble.

Yeah don't talk about things that don't exist, except for when they do exist.

Like a resin ball drilled with a low flare layout, or a resin ball that is in need of de-oiling.

RobLV1

11-04-2016, 08:52 PM

Yeah don't talk about things that don't exist, except for when they do exist.

Like a resin ball drilled with a low flare layout, or a resin ball that is in need of de-oiling.

Human beings fight to hold on to their beliefs. Of course we could list every single thing that can possibly cause carry down today, but doing so just makes it more difficult for individuals to let go of their outdated beliefs that are irrelevant 98% of the time. Once again, Mike, I'm just trying to help. Everyday I see bowlers trying to adjust for carry down that doesn't exist and it just doesn't work a great, great majority of the time.

Mike White

11-04-2016, 09:23 PM

Human beings fight to hold on to their beliefs. Of course we could list every single thing that can possibly cause carry down today, but doing so just makes it more difficult for individuals to let go of their outdated beliefs that are irrelevant 98% of the time. Once again, Mike, I'm just trying to help. Everyday I see bowlers trying to adjust for carry down that doesn't exist and it just doesn't work a great, great majority of the time.

Is this page on Kegel (http://www.kegel.net/wpa/2016/3/14/42bjrlavlk4laa1y6p3pf0kdwuggrh) the source of your opinion about carry down?

RobLV1

11-04-2016, 10:26 PM

Is this page on Kegel (http://www.kegel.net/wpa/2016/3/14/42bjrlavlk4laa1y6p3pf0kdwuggrh) the source of your opinion about carry down?

One of many, including numerous discussions with Robert Smith after his discussions with Kegel directly.

Aslan

11-04-2016, 11:03 PM

2. Please, please stop talking about carry down. Unless you have someone throwing plastic or urethane on your pair, it doesn't exist. Adjusting for carry down will only get you in trouble.

On league night, there are generally 1-2 bowlers (about 1 per team) throwing plastic, urethane, or house balls.

You also have to factor in that, as the skill level improves, each bowler then tends to throw plastic at spares. Every time a bowler throws plastic at a 10-pin...there is going to be a tiny bit of carrydown.

I agree with Rob and his sources, that carrydown is NO WAY close to what it used to be in the urethane era. Carrydown then, was almost as important as resin balls burning up oil now. But...I can't say carrydown is no longer relevant. If we did away completely with urethane and plastic balls...then we can call it a myth. As long as 35-40% of shots are taken with plastic balls (strike and spare shots for those using only plastic and every corner-pin shot for higher average bowlers)...it may not be a dominant factor...but must be a factor.

I find the comment about starting with weakest and going stronger as I move in; interesting. The only issue is going back to the "A-Game vs B-Game" discussion. I 'may' be able to move 5:3 left and strike with the Reax Pearl...as the track dries out...but then I usually have to be perfect. Hopefully, I can learn to open up my shoulders more and have more confidence in that decision.

RobLV1

11-04-2016, 11:18 PM

On league night, there are generally 1-2 bowlers (about 1 per team) throwing plastic, urethane, or house balls.

You also have to factor in that, as the skill level improves, each bowler then tends to throw plastic at spares. Every time a bowler throws plastic at a 10-pin...there is going to be a tiny bit of carrydown.

The "streaks" of oil that we call carry down contain between 3 and 5 units of oil. Modern reactive bowling balls don't even notice anything under 8 units. Hold on to your beliefs as long as you need to, and then toss them into the trash along with your Atari 400.

Mike White

11-05-2016, 12:59 AM

The "streaks" of oil that we call carry down contain between 3 and 5 units of oil. Modern reactive bowling balls don't even notice anything under 8 units. Hold on to your beliefs as long as you need to, and then toss them into the trash along with your Atari 400.

The lanes for the testing were AMF HPL 9000 synthetic lanes.
The tests were performed with the Kegel Standard Sanction lane machine using Kegel Defense/C lane cleaner and Kegel Offence HV lane conditioner.
The lane pattern applied to the lane surface is comprised of six two to two loads oiled from the foul line to eight feet and then buffed out until forty-nine feet.
What this means is that lane conditioner is applied evenly from the second board on the left to the second board on the right for eight feet and then buffed evenly until forty-nine feet.
This means we have thirty units of lane conditioner at eight feet from the foul line, eight units of lane conditioner at thirty-two feet from the foul line, and five units at forty-seven feet which is two feet before the end of the oiling pattern.

Another statistic from the first round of tests showed only 23% of balls actually finished their hook phases in the oil pattern.

According to USBC testing, 77% of the balls tested "noticed" 5 units of oil.

6 loads of 2 to 2 is only 11 ml compared to the 23+ ml used for house conditions.

With more oil in the middle of the lane on house patterns, more oil is streaked down the lane by cross alley spare shots.

zacks

11-08-2016, 12:24 PM

2. Please, please stop talking about carry down. Unless you have someone throwing plastic or urethane on your pair, it doesn't exist. Adjusting for carry down will only get you in trouble.

First of all, interesting thread on Aslan's Scores.

But the reason for my post, I actually encountered carry down midway through my third game last night. Disrupted my bid for a 700 series. Guy on my team is somewhat new to league bowling and recently got a new bowling ball (reactive resin). He basically gave up on trying to throw a hook (within the last few weeks) and went back to the way he had been throwing prior to becoming a regular league bowler.

He throws the ball straight with zero flare. Luckily, he starts a little left of center and aims at the left side pocket, but eventually he threw enough across the headpin combined with enough right side spare shots to actually start moving oil down the lane into areas that hurt my shot. By the middle of the third game I actually had to ball back up to get the drive through the pocket without getting the ball too far outside where it would grab too much friction and dive through the nose.

I had a great look last night and the carry down wasn't a killer, just something I noticed and had to adjust for. I'm usually not thinking about carry down, but with a guy like this on my team, I'm going to need to be a little more aware of it from now on. What hurt me with the carry down is when I shot a 7-pin and watched the ball skid all the way down the lane (yes I hook at left side spares and never, well almost never, miss).

Moral of the story is that carry down exists, though it is rare, and in my case with my teammate, I just hope he keeps it left of the area I'm playing or else I need to make some adjustments.

Aslan

11-10-2016, 02:43 AM

Tuesday Night League: Fairly new synthetics, low-moderate oil THS

547 Series: 168-175-204

Games 1 and 2 were just disasters and horrible. Couldn't figure out which ball to use, couldn't find a line, couldn't carry, and couldn't pick up spares.

Game 3 was better. Another game where I was a couple shots away from a Dutch 200.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.89 pins
Strikes: 45% (3 turkeys, 3 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 43% picked up

Single Pin spares: 62% (5/8)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin and 10-pin (3x each).
Also left a single 6-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 25% (2/8)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 3-6-10 (2x)

Splits: 0% (0/2)

Average over 3 games: 182.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 193.67.

Missed my lesson Sunday...I don't know...getting real, real tired of needing 5-15 frames to figure out what the **** I'm doing.

Aslan

11-10-2016, 03:22 AM

Wednesday League Night: low-oil synthetics, older brunswick lanes

499 Series: 172-187-140

Game 1 was better than the score indicates; stuck on the approach in the 3rd frame and guttered on the strike shot. Then, after a nice 2-4-10 conversion in the foundation frame...I missed a single 10-pin in the 10th.

Game 2 I got Kangas Crewed! A pocket 4-6-7-9-10 split in the 1st frame and a pocket 2-4-10 split in the 9th. Made my average, but...that knocked me out of both of my remaining brackets.

Game 3 was, well, I have no words to describe it that will make it past Bowl1820's censorship...even on his most lenient day. I blame the Defiant Edge...which I still CANNOT figure out for the life of me. Both of my other two balls, depending on conditions, have shown to be VERY reliable options....which will surprise folks given neither the Ebonite Innovate nor Radical Reax Pearl were very warmly received by bowlers. Meanwhile, the Defiant Edge...which is a very popular model...I can't figure it out. Either this is a Melee Jab type issue where I'm using it in the wrong way...or it's like the Asylum...and it's just not matching up to my game/arsenal. Move left, I miss right. Move right, I go through the nose.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.29 pins
Strikes: 35% (1 turkey, 2 doubles, and 4 singles)
Spares: 52% picked up

Single Pin spares: 66% (6/9)
Most common single-pin leave: 10-pin (4x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 3-pin, 7-pin, nor 8-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 40% (4/10)
Most common multi-pin leave: 2-4-10 split (2x)

Splits: 25% (1/4)

Average over 3 games: 166.33.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 176.67.

Only averaging 170.50 in Game 3 of this league. Worst series I've had in awhile. It'll knock my average from the mid/upper 180s to the low 180s. I have two lessons between now and the 20th, and I guess I'm overdue.

Amyers

11-10-2016, 10:02 AM

Wednesday League Night: low-oil synthetics, older brunswick lanes

499 Series: 172-187-140

Game 2 I got Kangas Crewed! A pocket 4-6-7-9-10 split in the 1st frame and a pocket 2-4-10 split in the 9th. Made my average, but...that knocked me out of both of my remaining brackets.

I don't see how either of those are possible on a pocket hit unless your definition of pocket is much larger than mine.

the Defiant Edge...which is a very popular model...I can't figure it out. Either this is a Melee Jab type issue where I'm using it in the wrong way...or it's like the Asylum...and it's just not matching up to my game/arsenal. Move left, I miss right. Move right, I go through the nose

Make sure you work with your coach with that ball. You're trying to play the wrong angle or at the wrong time with it. It's not a bad ball your coach should be able to help you figure out how to use it. Without seeing you actually throw it it's hard to diagnose the problem.

Aslan

11-13-2016, 04:03 AM

Saturday Weekly Color-Pin Tournament: Older Brunswick Synthetics

585 Series: 195-227-163

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.97 pins
Strikes: 47% (1 5-bagger, 1 turkey, 1 double, and 6 singles)
Spares: 64% picked up

Single Pin spares: 85% (6/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 3-pin, 4-pin, 9-pin (2x each)
Also left a single 10-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (5/10)
Most common multi-pin leaves: n/a (1x each)

Splits: 0% (0/3).

Average over 3 games: 195.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 197.67.

One of the guys on the pair was supposedly some regional PBA guy or something...but he had a date that looked like a stripper and he wasn't really trying (to bowl). But, I used it as motivation and managed to make some pretty good shots. But, as has been the case since I changed arsenals, once it came time to use the Defiant Edge...problems ensued.

J Anderson

11-15-2016, 02:29 PM

First of all, interesting thread on Aslan's Scores.

But the reason for my post, I actually encountered carry down midway through my third game last night. Disrupted my bid for a 700 series. Guy on my team is somewhat new to league bowling and recently got a new bowling ball (reactive resin). He basically gave up on trying to throw a hook (within the last few weeks) and went back to the way he had been throwing prior to becoming a regular league bowler.

He throws the ball straight with zero flare. Luckily, he starts a little left of center and aims at the left side pocket, but eventually he threw enough across the headpin combined with enough right side spare shots to actually start moving oil down the lane into areas that hurt my shot. By the middle of the third game I actually had to ball back up to get the drive through the pocket without getting the ball too far outside where it would grab too much friction and dive through the nose.

I had a great look last night and the carry down wasn't a killer, just something I noticed and had to adjust for. I'm usually not thinking about carry down, but with a guy like this on my team, I'm going to need to be a little more aware of it from now on. What hurt me with the carry down is when I shot a 7-pin and watched the ball skid all the way down the lane (yes I hook at left side spares and never, well almost never, miss).

Moral of the story is that carry down exists, though it is rare, and in my case with my teammate, I just hope he keeps it left of the area I'm playing or else I need to make some adjustments.

Zacks, I sincerely doubt that your teammate was at fault for the carry down that affected your shot the third game. You have said he was starting left of center aiming at the 1-3 pocket with no hook, and that your shot was affected by the middle of the third game. From that we can assume he bowled 24 frames before the affect was noted. I would also guess that 75% of his first shots hit between the center of the 3 pin and the center of the 2 pin. These 18 shots would be pushing oil in front of the head pin and not into your line. Of the remaining 6 first balls I would guess half were wide left and the other half wide right, so only three of his first balls messed with your line While I wouldn't be surprised if he had thrown a few strikes, for the sake of argument let's say he didn't. From my observation of straight bowlers over the years, I would also guess one third of his leaves were in the 3-6-9-10 zone, one third in the 2-4-7-8 zone and the rest in the 1-2-3-5-8-9 zone. So that's another 9 balls pushing oil into your line. I doubt that's enough by itself to screw the line up. Combined with everyone else on the pair shooting right side spares I can see where you might have had a carrydown problem, but I would not blame your teammate.

2handedsniper

11-15-2016, 05:28 PM

585 is pretty good good job

Aslan

11-17-2016, 08:32 AM

Wednesday League Night: low-oil synthetics, older brunswick lanes

506 Series: 164-172-170

Game 1 was a split in the 1st frame and a split in the 10th frame...so thats wonderful.

Game 2 looked to be a "Polish 136" (strikes alternating with opens)...but then I made a couple spares...so, good times.

Game 3 I had no ability to carry...and couldn't convert a couple of the single-pin spares...so Chraphtasdic 2016.

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.64 pins
Strikes: 33% (2 doubles and 7 singles)
Spares: 60% picked up

Single Pin spares: 70% (7/10)
Most common single-pin leave: 4-pin (3x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 3-pin, 8-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (5/10)
Most common multi-pin leave: 2-4-5 (2x)

Splits: 25% (1/4)

Average over 3 games: 168.67.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 179.33.

Missed my Sunday morning lesson; rescheduled for this coming Sunday. Had a lesson yesterday and talked about the Defiant Edge. The coach watched it and agreed with me that it just wasn't doing what we thought it would do. Like the Asylum, I'm sure it's a good ball...many people have liked it and many people have had success with it...but the ball just has snap on the backend at my speed/rev rate. It's not burning out, like the Asylum was.

The Asylum was starting the hook phase way too soon. It (Asylum) wasn't strong enough on fresh...but hooked way too soon when lanes transitioned. The Defiant Edge seems to have the hook phase delayed appropriately for my game/shot...but it doesn't have any "snap".

So...the dilemma. When the Asylum got retired early...it was no big deal because the Melee Jab (and later the Loaded Revolver) both took the place of the Asylum and were already drilled, etc... This time around...I actually HAD a ball that could have served as a "skid/flip" ball at 16lbs; a DV8 Ruckus. BUT...last month I came home and found it cracked in half on my bowling ball rack. So, I spent hours upon hours trying to find the receipt...never ended up finding it...but I emailed DV8 and they said they would send me a replacement. But, since the Ruckus is no longer in stock, they offered a new DV8 Thug Life...which would have been an even MORE perfect skid/flip ball. But...before shipping it...according to the guy at DV8...they realized they were out of stock on that one as well and offered any ball in the Brunwick/DV8/Radical line. I was leaning towards a Radical Jackpot Solid...but decided to go with a 15lb Quantum Forest Green. Still don't have it...but I'm throwing 16lb right now anyways...no big deal.

So, long story long...I decided to finally pay more than $105 for a ball...and got a Hammer Scandal Pearl. I'm concerned about using a ball with a symmetric core as a "skid/flip" ball...but the rest of the specs look strong AND it's another low-RG polished Pearl...to go with the other two low-RG polished Pearls...replacing a low-RG polished Pearl...so it makes sense in terms of my current arsenal.

Tonight, I don't have it yet...still in the pro shop...so I brought over the 900Global Bullet Train just to try it out in warm-up...but it didn't feel right....so I started with the Reax Pearl. Used the Innovate in Games 2 and 3. I would have balled down sometime during Game 3...if I had a ball to "ball down" to. I thought about going and getting my Hammer Blue spare ball out of the trunk and just try to play out-and-in...especially on the lane I couldn't figure out...but I didn't want to put my sandals on, go get it, have to mess with the tape, blah, blah, blah...

Now I'm debating whether I want to bowl in the ABT event this Saturday. There's really no point to competing against those guys if I'm a 160-175 bowler carrying a high 180s average. But, then I thought about it some more...and I remembered I was using the ABT tournament as an excuse to get out of Thanksgiving dinner with a friend...and this weekend's event gets you bonus pins for Thanksgiving weekend...sooooo...I probably will bowl. Maybe the new ball will be ready by then and I can try it out.

Amyers

11-17-2016, 10:19 AM

The Asylum was starting the hook phase way too soon. It (Asylum) wasn't strong enough on fresh...but hooked way too soon when lanes transitioned. The Defiant Edge seems to have the hook phase delayed appropriately for my game/shot...but it doesn't have any "snap".

I Never liked the drill on your asylum and from what I'm hearing on the performance of this ball I'm wondering about it too. So far you have 2 complete duds out of 6-8 balls drilled I'm starting to wonder about your driller a bit. Especially when your bringing balls in and not purchasing from him if he's really taking the time to lay the balls out properly. You might go over to bowlingchat.net and talk with Eric Hartwell for a bit and get a second opinion on your layouts. If you do you need to know your ball speed, rev rate, axis tilt, and axis rotation. I'm just starting to wonder a bit.

but decided to go with a 15lb Quantum Forest Green. Still don't have it...but I'm throwing 16lb right now anyways...no big deal.

You were looking for a skid/flip ball and decided on the Green Quantum? Good ball not skid/snap

So, long story long...I decided to finally pay more than $105 for a ball...and got a Hammer Scandal Pearl. I'm concerned about using a ball with a symmetric core as a "skid/flip" ball...but the rest of the specs look strong AND it's another low-RG polished Pearl...to go with the other two low-RG polished Pearls...replacing a low-RG polished Pearl...so it makes sense in terms of my current arsenal.

Scandal pearl is a nice ball but it's not skid snap though. The Scandal pearl has a very strong cover and reads too early in the mids to be skid/snap it has a strong continuous move towards the pocket. This may be a good thing with your game. It's a motion that is comparable with your Reax pearl but just a little stronger from what I've seen. My guess would be 2-1 to 4-2 left of the Reax.

Aslan

11-18-2016, 08:55 PM

I Never liked the drill on your asylum and from what I'm hearing on the performance of this ball I'm wondering about it too. So far you have 2 complete duds out of 6-8 balls drilled I'm starting to wonder about your driller a bit. Especially when your bringing balls in and not purchasing from him if he's really taking the time to lay the balls out properly. You might go over to bowlingchat.net and talk with Eric Hartwell for a bit and get a second opinion on your layouts. If you do you need to know your ball speed, rev rate, axis tilt, and axis rotation. I'm just starting to wonder a bit.
My coach decides on the layout/balance hole. The driller just follows those directions. I'll have to look at the layout on the Defiant Edge when I get it back. I hope it's not a layout issue...because the new Scandal Pearl is getting the same layout. I don't have the Asylum anymore...gave it away...and the kid I gave it to doesn't use it...but I have pictures of the layout so I can compare.

I'm skeptical of this theory only because if said hypothesis is correct, that means a PBA pro either doesn't understand how to properly lay out a ball and/or is intentionally messing up bowling balls hoping I'll eventually buy a new one from the shop. Now, I 'have' heard that some PBA pros know a lot more about bowling ball technology than other PBA pros...I think thats a safe enough statement that even Rob and Mike would agree on it (knocking on wood). I also completely understand, given the state of bowling and how tight the margins are in bowling merchandising/sales...that a pro shop may use tactics like that to push a bowler into their higher end products...but;
1) This pro had a chance to push products for a year and a half...and only once did I do a demo ...and the pro knows I have undrilled bowling balls up the wazooo. The first question I got asked when we watched the Defiant Edge was, "What else do you have undrilled?" Now, I have 7 undrilled bowling balls and (supposedly) a new one on the way...but I only have THREE that are 16lbs...an old Ebonite Warning Sign (not skid/snap), Track 706A (skid...but not enough 'snap'), and a Track 300A (pretty much a spare ball...all skid...no snap).
2) I got a 'deal' on the new Scandal Pearl...most places online it's selling for $155-$175. Drilling costs me almost always right around $55. So thats $210-$230. If I buy it off the rack at the shop there, I think it was $214 which includes the drilling but I'd have to pay another $19 for the IT and finger inserts...so $233. I got it for $205. Definitely the most expensive ball I've ever bought. And this'll be my first time using a ball that 'just' came out. But I think I got the 'discount' because they drilled the Defiant Edge not two months ago and it didn't work out.

You were looking for a skid/flip ball and decided on the Green Quantum? Good ball not skid/snap
Sorry. No. I probably confused things by mentioning that ball...I was just trying to show that I actually HAD a skid/snap ball (DV8 Ruckus) in 16lbs...but it cracked all the way around. DV8 was going to send me a replacement Thug Life...but that was also recently retired. The Thug Life would have been an even BETTER skid/flip ball, in my opinion, than the Ruckus.

BUT...since they were out of BOTH of those...and I got to choose from all 3 brands...I just really liked the style and ball movement on the Quantum...and it's probably the most expensive ball in the 3 lines right "now"...so I'm getting the most bang for the buck in this exchange, etc... NOW...to answer your comment...I decided to get the Quantum in 15lbs because it would fit really well in the 15lb arsenal I'm putting together.

So, no, it's not a "skid/flip" ball...I didn't know that the Defiant Edge wasn't going to work out until AFTER I ordered the Quantum. Had I know BEFORE...I would have went with a different ball...probably a DV8 or more likely a Radical...and would have gotten it at 16lbs

Technically, I don't yet HAVE the replacement...which has taken far, far too long to get. It's not that I'm in a hurry...not planning on drilling it anytime soon...it's just that I was really impressed with DV8's response initially...then nothing...then "oops, that one is discontinued"...then nothing...then "sorry for the delay, pick whichever ball you'd like"...then nothing. It makes me feel like I'm the butt of some office joke at Brunswick or something. I call, they tell me they're sending a replacement and each time throw in something else...then hang up, make a fart noise, and the office erupts in laughter.

Scandal pearl is a nice ball but it's not skid snap though. The Scandal pearl has a very strong cover and reads too early in the mids to be skid/snap it has a strong continuous move towards the pocket. This may be a good thing with your game. It's a motion that is comparable with your Reax pearl but just a little stronger from what I've seen. My guess would be 2-1 to 4-2 left of the Reax.
According to the pro, thats Ebonite's best skid/flip ball on the market right now. I'm skeptical of a symmetric core skid/flip ball...but thats just me. I KNOW that drilling makes it assymetric...but it just seems like if you want an angular, slid/flip reaction...you need a high differential and corresponding a high amount of assymetry. It's like going to a zoo versus a petting zoo. Sure, a petting zoo is technically a zoo (once it's drilled)...but wouldn't a cooler more awesome zoo be better? I don't know. I'm willing to accept that I'll just never understand bowling ball dynamics. For all I know, a person at the factory sticks a dead gerbil in the middle of the ball and coats it with elk snot. I'm starting to think it's all just a hustle and every ball in the last 20 years has been the same...the ball just tends to move differently based on how big the dead gerbil is thats inside.

Close your eyes...using the P-Word. No, not that one...sickos.

In my "progression", the Scandal Pearl is just replacing the Defiant Edge. I still plan to use the pin-up Reax Pearl to start, then ball down to the pin-down Innovate. It's just that once the lanes start to really transition...and I'm now 2:4 left of where I started...maybe even 3:5 left of where I started...the Scandal Pearl 'should' be able to play that far inside...it'll just have more "pop" than what the Defiant Edge had.

Another theory would be to just go back to the Reax Pearl given the specs are so similar...but I didn't think about that at the time. This may be a good chance to compare ball motions between the Reax Pearl and Scandal Pearl...if I get motivated enough to do another movie. I think the manufacturer difference between these two balls...AND the symmetry difference...I am guessing the Scandal Pearl will work better in the #3 spot than the Reax Pearl would. I think the Reax grabs earlier and loses more energy earlier. I don't think the Scandal Pearl will grab as early. But, I may be wrong.

Aslan

11-19-2016, 07:26 PM

ABT Tournament: Squad 1, Day 1
Older Brunswick synthetics: medium oil

675 Series: 228-222-225

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 9.39 pins
Strikes: 63% (1 6-bagger, 2 5-baggers, and 5 singles)
Spares: 75% picked up

Single Pin spares: 100% (6/6)
Most common single-pin leave: 7-pin and 10-pin (2x each).
Also left a single 6-pin and 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 50% (3/6)
Most common multi-pin leave: n/a

Splits: 0% (0/3)

Average over 3 games: 225.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: n/a

If you're thinking this looks familiar...recall the last time I did an ABT tourney, back in August. I ended up qualifying for the finals by shooting a 674 series (194-256-224). And before you get too excited...recall what happened after I made the cut and bowled in the finals. Don't recall? I shot a 457 series (170-130-157). Thats important to recall as I post the scores for my next Squad. (follow-up coming soon).

Aslan

11-19-2016, 07:56 PM

ABT Tournament: Squad 2, Day 1
Older Brunswick synthetics: burnt house shot

456 Series: 151-172-133

PinPal Stats:
First Ball Average: 8.13 pins
Strikes: 29% (1 double and 7 singles)
Spares: 50% picked up

Single Pin spares: 85% (6/7)
Most common single-pin leave: 2-pin (2x).
Never left a single 1-pin, 4-pin, 8-pin, nor 9-pin.

Multiple Pin spares: 33% (5/15)
Most common multi-pin leaves: 1-2-4-10 and 5-10 split (2x each)

Splits: 40% (2/5)

Average over 3 games: 152.00.
Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 155.67.

So....yet another ABT tournament in Rancho Cucamonga (yes, thats a real city) where I bowl well enough on fresh conditions to make the cut...but then I bowl on burnt conditions and don't even bowl well enough to qualify for special Olympics tournament. Yes, thats sort of a mean analogy...but I'm giving myself a pass...because I just bowled a f&%%^ing 456 series!!! Yet another tournament where I look like the best bowler in one round...then get completely embarrassed and humiliated in the next round.

Now...this tournament actually runs for two weekends...so there will be more squads to come...and fortunately the squad 2 scores aren't my finals scores (like last time). But, they might as well be. If I can't bowl well on lanes after one squad...2-3 bowlers per game...then thinking that I'll do well in the finals next Saturday after 3 squads get done bowling...probably a long shot.

Fortunately, I have a re-scheduled lesson tomorrow morning...and if I can actually get up tomorrow morning (I had to reschedule because last Sunday I woke up an hour late)...this WILL be the focus of the lesson. As of the cut when I left (one squad was still bowling...I didn't stay because I didn't want to deal with rush hour traffic...plus I was bowling like STANK and I knew my squad 1 score was good enough to probably get me in...not to mention I plan on bowling more qualifying squads next weekend. But, I don't know what I did wrong or need to do different. This is two times in a row that I bowl one of my best series...then look like POO.

I used the Reax Pearl for all 3 games of the first squad. I fought the urge to switch to the Innovate early on, with the Defiant Edge retired and the Scandal Pearl getting drilled...I brought my Bullet Train and Encounter with me. The Bullet Train was hitting like a wet noodle...so I started with the Reax-P. Given I didn't want to use the Encounter if I didn't have to (completely different feel (non-IT) and thumb pitches) so I waited till squad #2 to ball down to the Innovate.

And yes, maybe I AM switching balls too quickly...maybe thats why I did so well in squad 1. On the flip side of that arguement; the Innovate has been my best ball in my arsenal during league play...and usually the move from the Reax to the Innovate is fairly seamless. And it wasn't the ball (I don't think). I was pulling shots...I was trying to 'make' shots...I was missing my target, etc... My shoe was sticking (stupid BrunswickZone centers)...and then when I finally gave up on the Innovate and went to the Encounter...my thumb-hole needed a bunch of tape...so I was battling the thumb fit the remainder of the last game.

My best guess as to what went wrong? It goes back to "A-Game" versus "B-Game". I was playing the 11-board in Game 1...standing just left or just right of center (20) on the approach. By the end of that squad...I was in a couple boards...a little left of center on the approach and probably around 12 at the arrows. Then, quickly into squad 2...with 5 bowlers on our pair...I was quickly standing left toe about 26 and aiming at 14....essentially 2:4 inside. Once my left toe gets out past about 24-27...thats no longer my "A-Game"...it's actually my "C-Game". My "B-Game" is to play 80s style up the 5-board and in. But, I don't have any equipment that'll let me play the B-Game line...and I still can't seem to play inside. Not to mention, in the ABT I have a 188 average...thanks to a certain POS AMF center with a super easy shot that falsely raised my average about 10 pins.

:mad: :mad:

Amyers

11-20-2016, 11:57 AM

Amyers

11-20-2016, 12:20 PM

RobLV1

11-20-2016, 02:44 PM

So I took a few minutes to look up the specs on the four bowling balls you list: Reax Pearl (2.49 rg, .054 diff), Innovate (2.49 rg, .046 diff), Defiant Edge (2.59 rg, .054 diff), Scandal Pearl (2.48 rg, .054 diff). Regardless of how you decide if a ball is weak or strong, the fact of the matter is that you've got 4 balls that are virtually identical, and they are all very aggressive. If you insist on defining your A game and B game by where you play on the outside (dry) part of the lane, you should take a look at some entry level and urethane balls that will work in the desert. The Fanatic BTU (Better than Urethane) would probably be a good choice as would the Mix or the Joy Ride.

Mike White

11-20-2016, 06:11 PM

What's happening to you here happens to a lot of bowlers. When you make a 2-1 or a 4-2 adjustment your breakpoint should stay the same. I figure yours is around 8 from your setup. I would very highly guess when your making these moves your not keeping the breakpoint. You're either walking back to the right (even a board will cause this) or your closing your hips and shoulders as you move in. Watch where your ball is when you start the night as it approaches the markers down the lane (I figure you have then newer centers there). Your ball should be in the same place at the end of the night that it is at the beginning if your only making 2-1 adjustments. I bet you money yours isn't. Fix that you fix your problem.

A 2-3 move is more effective when you want to change angles, but stay in the pocket.

Amyers

11-20-2016, 07:04 PM

Amyers

11-20-2016, 07:09 PM

A 2-3 move is more effective when you want to change angles, but stay in the pocket.

Mike moving 2-3 for a player that plays tighter lines would ma ke the problem worse wouldn't it? Moving 2-3 would move the break point 2 boards left thus tightening the lines further not opening the lane up or am I misunderstanding something?

Mike White

11-20-2016, 08:23 PM

Mike moving 2-3 for a player that plays tighter lines would ma ke the problem worse wouldn't it? Moving 2-3 would move the break point 2 boards left thus tightening the lines further not opening the lane up or am I misunderstanding something?

I think of it as eyes, feet, so by 2-3, I meant move eyes 2 left, and feet 3 left.

I'll convert to feet, eyes and explain why.

3-2 is a combination of 2-1 and 1-1.

The 2-1 move keeps the ball pointed at the same break point, and increases the angle from left to right.

That alone would make the ball miss the pocket to the right or hit too light to carry.

The additional parallel 1-1 move, would move the break point 1 left, and bring the ball back into the pocket.

RobLV1

11-21-2016, 09:56 AM

I agree with this he's still going to half to learn to open up the lanes some to be successful in bowling longer format tournaments but a weaker covered ball could help

There are two schools of thought regarding lane adjustments. I agree that learning to make lateral moves left is the ideal solution, but the fact of the matter is that many bowlers do not have the confidence, or the rev rate, to do it to the degree that is often necessary, particularly on long format tournaments. The alternative is to "ball down" as much as possible to stay in their comfort zones. To do this, bowlers have to have a real understanding of bowling balls; cores, covers, and surfaces. Many coaches take this as the ideal approach and will not even attempt to teach bowlers to make any but the most minor lateral moves. Others, like myself, approach lateral moves first, but understand that some bowlers, for whatever reason, are never going to do it effectively. For these bowlers, effective ball managements is the best, in fact, the only workable approach.

Aslan

11-21-2016, 10:45 AM

Well, I gave it alot of thought.

I think what happened is that I changed balls too soon. My thought process was this:

1) On a house shot, I usually change from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate after 0.4-1.2 games (approximate).
2) There WERE a few instances where I seemed to be hitting light.

Now, I've been trying NOT to move right. But if I move left and hit weak...and leave a flat 7-pin or 10-pin...thats usually my cue (on a good shot mind you) that I may want to switch balls. I "try" not to do it until I feel it's necessary on BOTH lanes...just because I hate alternating balls one lane to another; sometimes I will if I feel it's a necessity.

But...the Defiant Edge is in the pro shop and the Scandal Pearl wasn't drilled yet. I tried the Bullet Train in practice...but it was hitting like a wet noodle. I brought the Encounter with me "just in case"...but it was a 'last resort' type of move given the pitches are completely different with that ball and it's not drilled for my IT inserts.

I kept throwing the Reax Pearl...thinking that I probably should have switched already...but I was carrying and scoring well...so I just kept making small adjustments right or left or further out or closer in...very tiny 0.5:0.5 board moves...or aiming IN a foot or OUT a foot. Moves that small are almost more for "comfort" than anything given it's unlikely my aim is good enough to hit +/- 0.5 boards consistently.

By Squad Two, I figured I dodged a bullet! I figured I was overdue for a ball change and switched balls. In my head, it made sense...because I figured normally the Reax Pearl lasts me 0.4-1.2 games and I had bowled 3! But here's where I did the math wrong:

On League Night, there are 4-5 bowlers per team and 2 teams per pair. Given most of my leagues are 4-person and to account for the one person that always seems to need to be blinded out, we'll call it 4 per team; 8 per pair. During Squad One, I was with one other guy on each pair...we moved right each time.

So, in terms of the amount of 'traffic' per game compared to a typical league night:

After Game 1;
League: 8 bowlers Squad 1: 2 bowlers

After Game 2;
League: 16 bowlers Squad 1: 4 bowlers

After Game 3;
League: 24 bowlers Squad 1: 7 bowlers (the last pair had 3 instead of 2 bowlers to start)

So, by the time I started Squad 2, the lanes had < than 30% of the number of shots/wear/transition than at the end of league night.

So, if I switch from the Reax Pearl to the Innovate (on average) after 9/10ths of a game, 8 bowlers per game = just over 7 bowlers. In other words, at the start of Squad 2, I wasn't NEARLY as 'late to switch balls' as I thought I was. I figured I was 2 games overdue...but I was actually right around the point I'd normally make a ball change.

So, why wasn't the ball change successful? I believe it was a combination of these factors:
1) I bowl league on lanes that are very old. They play the same as any other Brunswick synthetics, but they just tend to transition faster. So, I probably worried about transition that simply didn't occur as quickly on these newer Brunswick lanes (a newer center (20 years) versus a center built 60 years ago).

2) I didn't trust my shot. When I mentioned it at my lesson, the response was, "why did you move?" And the only acceptable answer would have been, "because I left "X" or "because I moved left and hit weak", etc... I shouldn't have moved based on 'feeling it was time'...I should have moved only after seeing the need based on what my ball was doing/not doing.

3) My mental game was shot. It was a perfect storm of problems:
- I stepped in something wet and my shoe was sticking.
- Every guy on my pair in squad two was shooting 200+
- When I finally tried to switch to the Encounter...the thumb and finger holes were completely off. I needed to add a bunch of tape, it wasn't coming off my hand clean, and the new finger inserts I bought when my fingers were getting stuck...now they are too loose.
- once I started missing...it was a snowball rolling down a hill...I tried harder and harder and made it worse and worse.

By the end of the second squad, to put the math in perspective, the 6 pairs I bowled on had roughly (2+2+3, +4+4+5) 20 bowlers throwing shots on them. The second squad was quite a bit larger. On a 4-person league night...plus another 3 games (pre-bowl or make-up for both teams)...thats 24+24 = 48. And while 32 bowlers would usually cause the lanes to transition something terrible at my 60-year old center...that same transition at a much newer center might be the equivalent of 60 bowlers...I may have been able to play all 3 squads with the same ball and a couple moves left.

Aslan

11-21-2016, 11:14 AM

There are two schools of thought regarding lane adjustments. I agree that learning to make lateral moves left is the ideal solution, but the fact of the matter is that many bowlers do not have the confidence, or the rev rate, to do it to the degree that is often necessary, particularly on long format tournaments. The alternative is to "ball down" as much as possible to stay in their comfort zones. To do this, bowlers have to have a real understanding of bowling balls; cores, covers, and surfaces. Many coaches take this as the ideal approach and will not even attempt to teach bowlers to make any but the most minor lateral moves. Others, like myself, approach lateral moves first, but understand that some bowlers, for whatever reason, are never going to do it effectively. For these bowlers, effective ball managements is the best, in fact, the only workable approach.

I agree with Rob on this. I've been taking lessons from two PBA level coaches and one bases ball changes almost entirely on what "leaves" they get on a decent shot...the other almost never moves more than 2:4 left...two moves left and then a ball down/ball change.

It is very frustrating though. I bowled against a female bowler Wednesday who threw a Danger Zone up the 6-board, up and in, like back in the day when the first Danger Zone was being used. The whole damn night...up and in. She barely made any moves, any adjustments, just kept throwing that shot. And at the tournament...once the lanes broke down a little...it was like they were Dick Allen and I was Dick Ritger...except more like Dick Ritger with Vertigo. They were all spinning the ball like crazy...didn't matter where they layed it down...it bounced off that big dry area and shredded the rack.

Here I am trying to fix every little flaw in my stance, push-away, first step, approach, balance, spine tilt, hand position, knee bend, release, and follow-through...then maintaining balance and staying focused on the ball motion and where it exits the pin deck...and if I miss by 1.5 boards either way I'll leave the headpin or get a split...yet those guys were hitting the 2-board on 7-board misses and bouncing it off that dry area like a billiard ball off a rail. They have quirky approaches, poor balance, can barely bend their knees, and some were seemingly 60% spare shooters...but I'll be dammed if they didn't score a 230 to my 130. :mad:

Oh well. If I'm right and I switched too early...thats an easy fix. If I can ever get my footwork/approach/delivery fixed...maybe I can start to work on my release and staying inside the ball...and maybe even I can start opening up the lanes a bit. It'd be nice to beat those guys at their own game someday.

manke

11-21-2016, 12:07 PM

RobLV1

11-21-2016, 03:44 PM

So let me tell you a little story. A friend of mine decided to bowl in the Ron Mohr's Senior Shootout. He's a 220 average bowler on a house shot. 5 days before the tournament started he told me what ball he had decided to use on each of the three oil patterns, based on the length. He averaged about 170. The first article that I wrote for BTM nine years ago was about the dangers of preconceptions in bowling. Every time you post something, there is something about some preconception that didn't work. No surprise there!

By the way, you never addressed the fact that you are bringing four versions of the same bowling ball and trying to ball down from one aggressive ball to another and then wondering why it's not working.

Aslan

11-23-2016, 04:47 AM

Aslan you are thinking about way too much to bowl good. Your thinking about switching balls at a certain time or ifa ball leaves a week ten or were to move your line. Go back to back to having fun bowling and when you start to have fun your bowling will get better too.
I'd have fun bowling if I always bowled over a 600 series and had at least one 700 series every month.

So let me tell you a little story. A friend of mine decided to bowl in the Ron Mohr's Senior Shootout. He's a 220 average bowler on a house shot. 5 days before the tournament started he told me what ball he had decided to use on each of the three oil patterns, based on the length. He averaged about 170. The first article that I wrote for BTM nine years ago was about the dangers of preconceptions in bowling. Every time you post something, there is something about some preconception that didn't work. No surprise there!
Agreed. But as we've discussed many, many times before...void of preconceptions...there is little an average bowler can do to adequately 'prepare' for a day/evening/night of bowling. 10-15 minutes of warm-up...with even just 4 bowlers on a pair means you get maybe 3-5 shots per lane in practice. Subtract a couple shots per lane based on "warming up/getting your footing"...thats 1-3 shots per lane. No preconceptions, no plan...just 1-3 shots on each lane.

What if the ball isn't making the turn? Did you start with your strongest ball? Are you playing the right line? Hard to say...but what IS certain...is you have at MOST 2 shots per lane left to figure it out. And bowling is almost ALL about preconceptions. If you think I'M bad...what if we did a poll and asked how many bowlers bring 1-2 balls to league night, have played at the same house for 10+ years, the same line 10+ years, and keep expecting their average to increase despite never doing anything to improve it other than show up to league each week?

Manke thinks I'm over-thinking things (and he is SO not the only one...definitely NOT the only one). Many bowlers have shared Manke's criticism. Why do I need 4 bowling balls? Why do I practice? Why do I take lessons? Why do I keep track of my progress/statistics? Maybe you AND manke are correct. Maybe just keeping things simple...one ball, pick a random target based on a best guess from 1-3 practice shots...and just have fun. Maybe I can even learn how to make the ball spin really, really fast...throw a 6lb house ball thumbless. Hell, maybe I'll try 2-handed? God forbid.

By the way, you never addressed the fact that you are bringing four versions of the same bowling ball and trying to ball down from one aggressive ball to another and then wondering why it's not working.
Well, thats 'sort of' true...by design even...but not 100% accurate. This gets down to a very interesting discussion I know you've addressed on Modern Bowling and BTM...and something we've talked about here quite a bit.

On one hand...3-4 balls that are all very, very different in every way...would give you a great selection of balls to choose from...and this would probably be ideal for a person in a sport league, travel league or a tournament player.

On the other hand, > 90% of bowlers bowl almost all of their games in the same house on a THS. Having 3-4 balls that are very, very different...in this scenario...would lead to having no less than 3 balls that are completely useless.

But, in fairness, RobM is correct. My arsenal selection purposely chose 3 balls that would have very similar characteristics concerning cover material (pearls), RG (2.49), and surface (4000-polished). This was done intentionally to better isolate some of the variables I'm interested in comparing, such as;
- manufacturer differences (Radical vs. Rotogrip vs. Ebonite)
- technology differences (New Reax, Recent Defiant Edge, Older Innovate)
- Differential Differences (0.054, 0.052, 0.041)
- PerfectScale validity (224.8, 216.47, 189.9)

My first two arsenals were based on cover stock and surface preparation. These two are widely believed to be the most important factors in ball movement. However, I was intrigued by Rob's articles on using RG as a primary factor in arsenal selection so I've dabbled with RG as well. My current arsenal intentionally kept surface and RG constant (for the most part) so I could focus on those other 4 factors.

And before Amyers shows up to remind us (again) of this...YES...as a scientist....I realize the most effective way to study things (using the scientific method) is to limit the variables so that everything (except the one thing you're testing) is constant. Yet, as I've repeated numerous times...changing only one variable would be impractical given the multiple variables in bowling ball specifications. In other words, until Brunswick hires me and gives me an unlimited supply of bowling balls to work with...concessions must be made.

Thus far...even though it's still early...only 1-2 months in...I'm starting to think differential is more important than previously thought and I still stand by PerfectScale as a fairly reliable number when comparing multiple brands. Jury is still out on manufacturer differences and technology differences. The pre-mature retirement of the Defiant Edge kinda threw a monkey wrench (not the ball) into the whole experiment.

Some findings that "don't make sense" regarding the 3 arsenals and the cover and RG criterium:

Arsenal #1: The Bullet Train. This ball was a hybrid and had a 2.55 RG. Yet...the S79 cover seemed to make it hook earlier than the solids and earlier than the lower RG balls.

Arsenal #2: The Dark Encounter wasn't nearly as strong as it's specs indicated. It seemed like there was some truth to the manufacturer differences as the Lethal Revolver was noticeably more reactive than the Dark Encounter. The Melee Jab and Loaded Revolver were also very strong with good movement...both Brunswick.

Remember, I'm the one that bought two identical Encounters in order to test the effects of drilling layouts on ultimate ball movement. So...while I try to perfect my arsenal selection...I have to try and 'test' theories. But, I also want to have arsenals that are useful and can help me score well...so it's a fine line.