Coaching/Lessons Dilemma

[Aslan]

So I go into the pro shop at the local lanes. I was trying to get an idea on pricing for a new ball. It turned out even thought the ball was $10-$15 more in the pro shop...I could get it drilled for free. So I bought it from the pro shop and had it drilled and the pro running the shop said as part of the buying experience; he'd help me get started switching from conventional to finger-tip.

So, he gave me about 40 minutes of instruction all in all..not only on the new grip, but also on my game. The next week I was bowling in that alley, he saw me and came over and gave me about 25 minutes of instruction. I tried to pay him but he wasn't interested. The following week, I took a work buddy...asked him to give us both lessons. He did...spent a good 25 minutes with us. Afterwards, he wouldn't take my money and said, "Next time". So, for the last 2-3 weeks...didn't see him much. And when I did, it felt like maybe he was avoiding me or maybe I kinda tried to avoid him...I dunnoh.

So, last time he helped us, I tried to insist he take money for it and he said it was okay and that since I bought a ball from him...it's not a big deal. Well...I sorta wanted to get another ball or two, to play with or as replacements for my ball next season. But when I went to him to talk about it...he said, "No...don't get another ball. Get good with that one first." But....the ball I'd like to get is the Brunswick Slingshot and it's retired. It's still available and I can get decent prices on it online...but if I wait till next year...who knows? But if I buy it online...and ask him to drill it, I feel like I "betrayed" him or something because not only did he advise NOT to get another ball (and I did anyways)...but I bought it from somewhere else after he gave me all that free lesson time. Same problem if I have it drilled elsewhere.

And it's not just that...there are some things he's given me advice on...that I've incorporated into my game...some things I have not. And I feel "bad" when he comes over to watch me and I'm not doing EXACTLY what he told me to do.

Long story...but the short of it is...even though it's awesome getting free instruction from a certified coach...and I'm HUGELY generous for it...him not accepting payment for it is kinda problematic. When he DOES come over and help me and my buddy...for free...he doesn't really give us a full undivided attention lesson. And my buddy really, really needs a full official lesson...because he is just really struggling. But I can't go to a coach thats giving me his time for free and "complain" that he's not giving us his undivided attention. Ya know?

So it sucks. Even though, in other ways...its awesome. But what REALLY sucks...is my work buddy really wants to start bowling an maybe join a league with me next year...but if he doesn't improve his game...he probably will just say "screw it". And I've "tried" to help...but I'm not good enough nor knowledgeable enough to help him.

[e-tank]

-Is there a particular reason it has to be a slingshot? You could always look into an entry level ball from another manufacturer or look into the strike king by brunswick

-Hes your pro shop guy not your dad so you can buy all the balls you want but i happen to agree with your pro shop on this one

-Id just hire a coach for your friend that will give him undivided attention

[DLP]

Was going to ask the same question as e-tank. But I probably already know the answer :)

Why a Slingshot? Because it's the ball you know you want. NO if's, and's, or but's about it. There is something "about that ball".
I know what is popular in the Pro shop right now in my neck of the woods is the Strike King. I've seen more of them on the lanes then I care to shake a stick at.

But back to the whys? ... You are probably like me. I have a Storm Fringe (retired). I know eventually I am going to move up in weight. What do I want? A Fringe.
Not what Storm say's is the replacement for the Fringe (the Freakin' Frantic) but the Fringe!

Without driving yourself crazy, I'd ask the Pro Shop guy what he's recommend as far as a ball. I know I do all of the time and we both have agreed on what my next ball will be (it's NOT a Fringe) when I decide to make the shift up in weight.


Check your area for coaching (I think you can enter your zip code at bowl.com to find a coach).
I've not got three different people I rely on for advice. One is just someone who helps out (who isn't certified), one is a level 1, and the other is a Bronze.

Also - depending on your area - GoBowling.com is running a "Learn to Bowl" (4 lessons - once a week in the month of October) at select bowling centers across the country. It might be a place to start as well.

[Bunny]

Mark Baker and Barry Asher give a clinic at Fountain Bowl on Saturdays from 12-2 for $10. You'll get a few tips from one of the top bowling coaches (and PBA League team manager) as well as a Hall of Fame bowler. All for 10 bucks! You cannot beat that! You can only take two or three tips at one time anyway.

Mark also gives private lessons at various centers. He records the lesson. I think it's 70 bucks. So worth it! One private lesson with Mark then tune-ups for 10 bucks each Saturday, you will get better!!

Pro bowler Missy Parkins gives private lessons for $50 an hour. She's out of Tustin Lanes and Saddleback Lanes.

We are lucky to have some damn fine coaches in our area. I'd love to do The Barnes/Baker clinic ($400) or Camp Bakes ($1,000. Plus, you get three ebonite balls picked for you and custom drilled too!)

Just dreamin' for now! :rolleyes:

[e-tank]

Oh what? Is the clinic hands on experience or is it more just sitting and listening to them lecture for 2 hours?

[Bunny]

Oh what? Is the clinic hands on experience or is it more just sitting and listening to them lecture for 2 hours?

The Saturday clinic format is you bowl continuously with other bowlers while Mark and Barry work their way from one end to the other and back. We used 14 lanes yesterday. Mark wasn't there. He may not be back until October.

I got some good tips from Barry and I was very pleased with his reaction to my form. I think it makes coaches happy when they don't have to keep telling you the same thing over and over. I've improved quite a bit since he saw me bowl last. :)

So you get to bowl for two hours and you get tips from two great bowlers for $10. It's a no brainer!!

[e-tank]

yea definitely! I think fountain is 90 min away from me so thats not bad

[Aslan]

The Saturday clinic format is you bowl continuously with other bowlers while Mark and Barry work their way from one end to the other and back. We used 14 lanes yesterday. Mark wasn't there. He may not be back until October.

I got some good tips from Barry and I was very pleased with his reaction to my form. I think it makes coaches happy when they don't have to keep telling you the same thing over and over. I've improved quite a bit since he saw me bowl last. :)

So you get to bowl for two hours and you get tips from two great bowlers for $10. It's a no brainer!!

Well, I know what I'm doing on Saturdays from now on!

[Aslan]

Why a Slingshot? Because it's the ball you know you want. NO if's, and's, or but's about it. There is something "about that ball".
I know what is popular in the Pro shop right now in my neck of the woods is the Strike King. I've seen more of them on the lanes then I care to shake a stick at.


Usually, when I pick my "next ball"...it's a short list of balls and it's primarily based on bowling ball.com's Perfect Score system. My current ball is a 189.5.

For my second ball, I wanted something more around a 150-160. The ball I WANT, is a Hammer Big Block Diesel...but that ball has been long sinced retired. Two Hammer balls that are "close", are the Hammer Nail and Hammer Spike...but Hammer balls tend to be over-priced AND...I'd rather not go "below" the 152.3 of the Big Block Diesel. That means....the 2 acceptable alternatives are:

- Brunswick Slingshot
- Track 300A

The 300A is also on my wish list, but is FAR more expensive than the Slingshot. And since the Slingshot is retired recently...and considered a more entry-level ball...there are some decent "deals" on it.

So...next logical question now that said mystery is solved..."Why do you want something in that perfect score range?"

Well, I do plan to eventually graduate to a higher end/bigger hook kinda ball. And I did recently purchase a ball with a 211.3 perfect score...just because I wanted to try a Hammer product...a bigger hook style ball...and I got a really good deal on it. But for right now...I want to have a ball that is a little tamer...something to really allow me to work on my game without having to worry about a massive backend or reaction to lane conditions. And the advantage of having a ball with a lower Perfect Scale rating...it'll make a good spare ball when I'm done with it.

The Slingshot is a great ball for me....because it's straight...and I'm a stroker...I like a straight ball. It'll leave me spares...hopefully not too many splits...but it'll allow me to work on my game without going completely absurd and throwing plastic/urethane. It'll move a bit on the backend...according to what I saw online...but will be able to handle medium-dry conditions.

The Slingshot seems like a good fit, it'll make a good back-up/spare ball once it soaks up some resin (Iceman said he used it as a spare ball...and I DEFINITELY want to emulate him!!). AND...it's CHEAP...because it's retired. The Strike King is $20 more and it essentially is the same ball as I have right now...maybe slightly less reaction.

I'm not "married" to the idea...I just think if I can get one cheap...and won't have a shot to get one later that is undrilled and new...why not get one now? It's a littlle under $60....if I find one closer to $50...why "not" pull the trigger?

And to answer the last question...the pro shop guy suggested a Tropical Breeze or a FreakNFrantic...but I kinda had my mind set on the Frantic unless he knew of a reason NOT to get it. I liked what I read on the coverstock/core combination for the Frantic.

[vdubtx]

I would listen to the Pro and not get another ball yet. Get good and understand what your ball can do on the lanes completely before venturing into another one. Get your fundamentals in line and then get the balls to add to your game. Too many balls that do different things on the lanes will only confuse things in the long run while you try to improve your total game.

That's my advice, but hey, it's your money. :cool:

[Perrin]

I personally think the slingshot is stronger than it is rated.

I have a slingshot and a DV8 Misfit and on drier lanes they are nearly indistiguishable.

once the oil volume goes up is where the difference is seen. on fresh oil the SLingshot is ~5 boards less overall hook than the Misfit. (later sharper move to the pocket)

Once the lanes dry out like I said I get within a board the same overall hook just with a different look.

depending on what you are trying to get to overall arsenal wise I would suggesst Urethane rather than resin. The reason being there is a more distint difference in reaction.(assuming you get one of the calmer more traditional urethanes not the newer ones with as much hook as low end resin)

[Aslan]

OKAY KIDS!!! RARE THING HERE!!! Hopefully you guys come here and READ THIS...even if you HATE ME...especially if you HATE ME!!!

So...I get to the alley...wasn't doing well. A 406 series. Throwing the ball everywhere...just like Sunday with Mike White.

So....my coach comes over...shows me some stuff on his tablet...and tells me to change a few things:

1) He didn't like my long "running" approach. I was ALL of the lane...heel on the edge. And what was FUNNY....I actually got AIR!!! On my third step....both feet were off the lane simultaneously!!!! I had NO IDEA I was doing that!! So....he moves me up in front of the first set of dots. He's tried this before....and I HATE IT!!! But...you guys and gals have been giving me **** (excrement) about not being a "good listener"...so I did it. I felt like a friggin old lady!!! But...I DID IT...so stop giving me crap about not listening!!

2)...he showed me my backswing. My backswing...was WAY up over my head!! I looked like Mika Koivuniemi!!! I mean...I DIDNT EVEN KNOW IT WAS THAT HIGH!!! I thought it was below shoulder height....but nope. So he wanted that lower.

Well, first 3-4 games...HATED IT!!!....but...

...but....

(this is hard for me)....but....

It friggin WORKED!!

Next series...440....next series....460...final series...498...and all 3 games were almost clean!

So...I am humbled. I have been friggin humbled!!! So...I gotta do it. It's not a conventional approach...but like my coach said, "You're a big boy...you don't need to add speed. You're throwing it plenty hard just because of your frame...speed is only making your mechanics erratic. You're taking a really good natural ability...and solid mechanics...and you're making it 8 times harder to execute consistently."

So...there goes my flashy approach!! I'm now just a fella that throws a ball out there 15 feet...but with very good accuracy. The scores would have been higher!!! But I was trying out a new plastic ball that had the tri-grip drilling....and the thumbhole was too big...but I wanted to throw it anyway. Needless to say...I missed a lot of spares just because it was a ball I never threw before...and the thumb hole being too big was messing up my release.

SO THERE!!! Am I coachable now??? Wll you guys/gals cut me some slack??! ;)