Do you get worse or better as the night progresses?

[JaMau24]

I think I get worse as the night goes on, and that's primarily because the oil pattern breaking down. I expect most of the responses to be that, but I'm sure there are some people who actually do better as the night goes on because they get loose or something. Of course, there might be some people who get worse because of attitude issues, or maybe because of alcoholic beverages as well. ;)


This is my average for each game so far on my Thursday league...

Game 1: 243.92
Game 2: 241.67
Game 3: 221.42


That's crazy to see a 20 pin drop in my opinion, but I think it's more because I'm doing so well the first two games, rather than doing so poorly the last game, if that makes sense. And as I explained, it's gotta be because the pattern breaking down as well.

So what is it for you? Worse or better as the night goes on?

[austin]

If you are averaging 700 a week I wouldn't be too concerned myself.

[Hampe]

Just went back and looked at my stats from the last 2 seasons, and there isn't really any kind of pattern at all. For example my averages per game this season are 209, 196, 213....the first 5 weeks of the season I got progressively better (190, 200, 225) but then the last 3 weeks the first game was the best by far (240, 189, 194).

It seems like generally my second game is the worst, which makes sense to me since I usually start off great, make my first adjustments too late (usually the end of the 1st/start of the 2nd game), and then after I'm conscious of making adjustments start to make them on time for the rest of the evening. But all that said, last season my averages were 167, 178, 172....so It could just be random.

The other league I play in is 4 game series and it seems to get a little better as the night goes on, but not by much (171, 176, 182, 178). I don't have stats from last year and this is only based on 6 series, so I guess basically I don't really get much better or worse as the night goes on in either league.

[vdubtx]

Jason,

In my Tuesday league in a house that has a lighter concentration of oil (have to ask them about the length as well), I average 244.25 game 1, 212.25 game 2, and 205.50 game 3. 220 total through 36 games.

On my Thursday league, I average 227.42 game 1, 227.75 game 2, and 235 game 3. 230 total through 36 games.

One other thing I do notice between the 2 houses is my 10 pin pickups are 10% points higher in my Tuesday house at 94% vs. 84% on Thursday nights. Not much other explanation other than it's in my head I suppose.

[J Anderson]

So what is it for you? Worse or better as the night goes on?

It would appear that I get better as the night goes on.

Last years game by game averages:
Sport: 169, 170, 172, 171 Righty
House: 162, 165, 174 Lefty

This year:
Sport: 169, 175, 174, 176 Righty
House: 185, 183, 196 Righty

Like Hampe, it looks like I have a little dip dealing with transition the second game on the house shot. Of course second game is when I start going through the pay envelopes, recording who has paid so I can make change for the teams that pay late, so it might not really be the lanes, but a temporary lapse in focus.

[dnhoffman]

Rock stars around here...

[MICHAEL]

since I don't keep track of scores with an app, and I don't keep records of all my games long hand, I can't say?

I do know that my first 300 in April was the second game, and the last one was the first game. And that series went: 300 first game, 216, and then 264. In the middle game that night I had a carry problem the seemed to work itself out in the third game. I did move back about a foot in that middle game to change the angle, and it seemed to work in the third game with the first 8 frames being strikes......

I need to do that bowling app,,, and start keeping records... Would be fun to know all the statistics it keeps!!

Jason your bowling GREAT!!! Last night you almost did the 800 again.... just a few bad fricken breaks... GREAT Bowling!!

[vdubtx]

If your league uploads to LeagueSecretary.com you can see some of your stats there too.

[Aslan]

I used to get progressvely better as the night went on...then I realized there were two more important factors than time:

1) How good I'm doing.
2) How much I'm drinking.

If I drink too heavily...by game 3 I'm not concentrating at all on bowling and am usually firmly entrenched in "how can I pick up that chick" mode. But even more than that...it really depends on how well I'm doing. If I'm having a good night...I usually can keep having a good night. If I'm having a bad night...I continue to have a bad night. My game is more "mental" than I choose to accept.

[e-tank]

usually game 1 i bowl good

then game 2 i get into a slump

game 3 i get my stuff together and bowl good again

sometimes its the other way around, sometimes all 3 games are about even but above is an avg night

[JaMau24]

All very interesting... Some better, some worse, others just kind of consistent. I can understand how in a sport league, you're scores could and maybe would get better as the night goes on and the lanes break down, thus creating an easier line for yourself.


and yeah Mike, you should get yourself a bowling app!


and VDub that is strange how you convert the 10 pins better on a different night. Is it at a different alley? If it is, maybe the approaches are better for you.

[sprocket]

I bowl better as the night goes on but that isn't always reflected in the third game score. Physically I am throwing better shots but I need to stay ahead of the transition better than I do. If there was a fourth game, my fourth game would be the best.

[vdubtx]

and VDub that is strange how you convert the 10 pins better on a different night. Is it at a different alley? If it is, maybe the approaches are better for you.

Yes, different center. Could very well be the approaches.

[MICHAEL]

I think I get worse as the night goes on, and that's primarily because the oil pattern breaking down. I expect most of the responses to be that, but I'm sure there are some people who actually do better as the night goes on because they get loose or something. Of course, there might be some people who get worse because of attitude issues, or maybe because of alcoholic beverages as well. ;)


This is my average for each game so far on my Thursday league...

Game 1: 243.92
Game 2: 241.67
Game 3: 221.42


That's crazy to see a 20 pin drop in my opinion, but I think it's more because I'm doing so well the first two games, rather than doing so poorly the last game, if that makes sense. And as I explained, it's gotta be because the pattern breaking down as well.

So what is it for you? Worse or better as the night goes on?

Yes, its crazy Jason,,,, WE FEEL YOUR FRICKEN PAIN,,,, how do you sleep at night,,, 244, 242, and then sink to a 221!
I do know a good shrink if you need help dealing with THE PAIN!!

[MICHAEL]

All very interesting... Some better, some worse, others just kind of consistent. I can understand how in a sport league, you're scores could and maybe would get better as the night goes on and the lanes break down, thus creating an easier line for yourself.


and yeah Mike, you should get yourself a bowling app!


and VDub that is strange how you convert the 10 pins better on a different night. Is it at a different alley? If it is, maybe the approaches are better for you.

I do have a bowling app, (I almost forgot)! Its on my kindlefire. I just get all caught up in the game and don't take the time to put my reading glasses on and punch them small Icons!! It must be a generational thing! (:) Believe me I tried it for a while but forgot to inter results, ect.. ect... I will pull it out and give it a try again Sunday!! As God AS my Witness! I am so Focused on bowling, (while bowling), that a kindlefire and entering data, just doesn't Fire Me Up!!

[JaMau24]

Yes, its crazy Jason,,,, WE FEEL YOUR FRICKEN PAIN,,,, how do you sleep at night,,, 244, 242, and then sink to a 221!
I do know a good shrink if you need help dealing with THE PAIN!!

Hey I'm not complaining! I just found it interesting is all :P

[MICHAEL]

Hey I'm not complaining! I just found it interesting is all :P

back at you :p!! We should all feel your PAIN!!

[J Anderson]

Just bragging, last night went 171, 214, 247.

[dnhoffman]

Nice bowling!

[dnhoffman]

Oh, and here's my SUPER line from last night....

234, 138 (season low!), 216

FML

[Aslan]

Oh, and here's my SUPER line from last night....

234, 138 (season low!), 216

FML

Did you switch balls and start using a spare ball to get back to the 216? :rolleyes:

But seriously, I've had games like that. I threw a 108 in practice Monday. Usually it's just one of those games where you seem to get split after split after split. I mean…I don't care if you're a PRO bowler…splits are splits.

[J Anderson]

Nice bowling!


Oh, and here's my SUPER line from last night....

234, 138 (season low!), 216

FML

Thanks.
Nice comeback in the third game!

[J Anderson]

Did you switch balls and start using a spare ball to get back to the 216? :rolleyes:

But seriously, I've had games like that. I threw a 108 in practice Monday. Usually it's just one of those games where you seem to get split after split after split. I mean…I don't care if you're a PRO bowler…splits are splits.

The more I get into trying to understand this game the more I realize that there are almost no undeserved splits. With few exceptions they are the result of either poorly thrown balls or not staying ahead of the oil transition. I used to think that all those 5-7 and 5-10 splits that I left ( especially when our league moved from Broadriver Lanes to Circle Lanes )were just bad luck, Now I understand that anytime I hit my mark and the 5 pin is left up I need to adjust.

[Aslan]

The more I get into trying to understand this game the more I realize that there are almost no undeserved splits.

Agreed…but that can be said for any leave. If you hit the pocket perfectly, they all fall down. If you don't; they don't.

I think the "luck" factors in with splits because if you leave a 5-pin, or a 6-10, or a 7-pin, or a 10-pin…an above average bowler still has a shot at 11 pins. But if you have a 7-10 or a 4-7-10 or a 4-7-6-10…your 20 pins quickly becomes 8-9. You may have hit the headpin straight on…which is actually LESS of a miss than going Brooklyn…yet the Brooklyn gets a strike or leaves an easy spare…and the center hit leaves an impossible split.

I think splits are the big equalizer (other than handicap) because if you're up against a guy who is on a TERROR….and he gets a split…now you got a "shot" because you know he's going to open. If it wasn't for splits…the good bowlers would rarely NOT have a clean game.

[MICHAEL]

Agreed…but that can be said for any leave. If you hit the pocket perfectly, they all fall down. If you don't; they don't.

I think the "luck" factors in with splits because if you leave a 5-pin, or a 6-10, or a 7-pin, or a 10-pin…an above average bowler still has a shot at 11 pins. But if you have a 7-10 or a 4-7-10 or a 4-7-6-10…your 20 pins quickly becomes 8-9. You may have hit the headpin straight on…which is actually LESS of a miss than going Brooklyn…yet the Brooklyn gets a strike or leaves an easy spare…and the center hit leaves an impossible split.

I think splits are the big equalizer (other than handicap) because if you're up against a guy who is on a TERROR….and he gets a split…now you got a "shot" because you know he's going to open. If it wasn't for splits…the good bowlers would rarely NOT have a clean game.

:confused: WHAT did you just say!!! OVER!! you wear me out!!

[dnhoffman]

The better you actually get at bowling, the less you'll blame luck.

You'll learn to recognize the patterns of your leaves and why they occurred. It rarely happens now that I get a leave/split that I can't immediately tell you why it happened. My team mates with a bit less experience might say "oh you got robbed!" But I almost immediately tell them "nope, the ball just high/low/too angular/too straight/etc."

Really there's very little luck to it after a certain point, you learn what you assumed was luck in either direction actually had a mechanic behind it.

Then sometimes really weird stiff happens.... But it's DEFINITELY the exception and not the norm.

[sprocket]

I think a solid 8 could be considered bad luck but not much else. That being said I think there is plenty of luck in bowling but it is almost all GOOD. Crumbling the bucket, carrying a very high hit, missing the head pin and striking, very light hits carrying, etc. Those are all examples of GOOD luck. Anyone who complains about bad luck ought to complain equally as much about good luck or else they shouldn't gripe at all.

[circlecity]

I don't believe in good luck, bad luck, Karma, and unicorns. Everything happens for a reason.

[Aslan]

:confused: WHAT did you just say!!! OVER!! you wear me out!!

I said I agree with JAnderson (and others)…any leave is a result of how the ball hits the pins…so it's not luck based.

[sprocket]

I don't believe in good luck, bad luck, Karma, and unicorns. Everything happens for a reason.

Here's how I would define good luck: Good luck is when there is a situation with a high degree of randomness and things work out in your favor. An example would be being caught outside in a severe wind storm and there is metal, wood and plenty of other stuff flying around, all kinds of stuff is being damaged, yet you don't get hit and get to safety. Everything happens for a reason but the flying objects are extremely random and almost impossible to predict. The odds were you were going to get hit, yet you didn't. I say that is good luck.

To relate that to bowling, solid pocket hits aren't very random and the interaction of the pins is fairly predictable. There is really very little luck good or bad involved because of the lack of randomness. Maybe the solid 8 is an exception because the ball has to interact with the five pin in just the right way to cause it and you might have several seemingly identical hits yet ONE leaves the solid 8, because of a MINUTE change in how the five pin interacted with the ball.

Now, once you get to light hits the randomness of the ways the pins interact with each other increases dramatically. Some of those hits are high carrying hits but others are not, and if a good deal of those lower percentage hits are still carrying it is at least partially due to random chance and not design. It's like rolling a six on a dice six times in a row. That is random chance, not design, and like I said, I call random chance that works out in your favor, GOOD LUCK!

[Aslan]

What I don't understand is how some solid headpin hits (right down the middle) lead to strikes and some lead to splits. I watched a couple newbies hit square on the front of the headpin and get strikes tonight…yet I swear…if my ball so much as strayed ever so slightly to the left…split. :mad:

[dnhoffman]

That's the good luck... While the bad is rare, the good is not.

[Hammer]

I think that some people get strikes on nose hits is because of ball weight and ball speed. My wife and I are on a league team together. I have seen her throw her 10# rubber ball at 9 to 10mph and hit the nose square and get a strike. The reason is that the ball hits slow and deflects into other pins while the others are falling over slowly like drunks which gives it a good chance to get all of them down. If it was a heavier ball with more speed then you are in trouble. As far as getting better or worse as the night goes on I can go anyway on a night. I have started bad in the first game and got better in the second and third. On other nights I have started out hot in the first two and bombed in the third. So for me it can go in any direction. Sometimes all three games suck on a night.

[Aslan]

Usually I get better…but last night I got worse. If I get worse it's usually because I'm having trouble getting the ball to do what I want…and I just can't get it figured out.

[Hammer]

Tonight I started out hot. First game was a 225, second was a 194 and the third was a 150. My line broke down with my Raw Hammer Anger ball after the second game. Decided to use my Blue Hammer to see if I could start striking again but no luck. Still ended up with a 569 scratch series.

[TCJ]

This year I've tended to have my best game first and then the others drop some, but they aren't necessarily bad. I believe the cause is that I can bowl outside with my urethane the first game, but then I need to move inside and find some oil. That forces me to switch to a stronger ball and swing out slightly which I'm a little less consistent at doing, thus lower scores.

[sprocket]

Last night I insisted on using a ball the first game that I had bowled 289 with in practice the day before. Big mistake; 5 splits, 156. I switched balls and shot 241, 222. I was high on the pair. They didn't play particularly easy last night. Never, ever fall in love with a ball. I was an idiot.

[dnhoffman]

Last night I insisted on using a ball the first game that I had bowled 289 with in practice the day before. Big mistake; 5 splits, 156. I switched balls and shot 241, 222. I was high on the pair. They didn't play particularly easy last night. Never, ever fall in love with a ball. I was an idiot.

I absolutely HATE this.

I'll pull out a ball that's been shelved a while and take it to practice, and hit like a tornado all day with it, bring to league the next night full of confidence and just crap the bed with it... makes no sense to me, or may I'm just trying to hard with it - who knows.

[Hampe]

Last night I insisted on using a ball the first game that I had bowled 289 with in practice the day before. Big mistake; 5 splits, 156. I switched balls and shot 241, 222. I was high on the pair. They didn't play particularly easy last night. Never, ever fall in love with a ball. I was an idiot.This also happens to me too sometimes, not just with balls but also with certain lines I want to play. Either I'll be playing a ball or line in a center that has always worked great in the past but for whatever reason isn't working that night, but I get too stubborn to switch. Of course, the times when I DO just trust my instinct and switch, it usually works out fine :). Just something that comes with experience I guess.

[MICHAEL]

Example,,, when I bowled that 300 a while back, I did it my first game, then had a 216,,, carry was the problem that game a number of 10pins,,, then the last game a 264! So in that case, it was the middle game that had the lull!

I can honestly say their is no pattern in regards to better or worse as the night progresses.... it's totally unique, and every Fricken outing is a new adventure into the who knows! LOL

[tr33frog]

Just looked at the sheet, it appears that my average so far per game this season 13 weeks in:
1st Game: 205 (Best Game twice)
2nd Game: 217 (Best Game six times)
3rd Game: 207 (Best Game five times)

[circlecity]

My average 13 weeks in so far.

1st Game: 204
2nd Game: 203
3rd Game: 203

[dnhoffman]

Looks like you're pretty darn consistent!