14# vs 15# ball

[JoeBeavis]

i have a 14# Storm Punch Out and 15# Storm Optimus.

My best games have been with the Optimus but I feel like I'm fighting with it when I swing it. With my Punch Out its easier to throw but it just seems to be the wrong ball for me. It doesn't get down the lane far enough before it breaks.

Two questions...

With today's technology is the difference between 14 and 15 pounds even relevant?

Is it possible the lack of length before the hook is an issue with pin placement on drilling pattern? I know these questions are probably hard to answer without seeing me throw the ball so I'm just looking for in general type answers.

Thanks!

[RobLV1]

For most bowlers, the difference between 14 and 15 pounds is pretty much irrelevant. With that being said, however, just about the only thing that coaches and PSO's agree on is that changing weights is a really bad idea. Pick the weight that is comfortable for you and start your arsenal using that weight. Donate the other ball to the junior program and claim it as a charitible contribution.

[LyalC52]

throw "man weight" IMO

[RobLV1]

throw "man weight" IMO

...and make sure to crack open a few brewskys while you're at it! LOL

[Mark O]

i have a 14# Storm Punch Out and 15# Storm Optimus.

My best games have been with the Optimus but I feel like I'm fighting with it when I swing it. With my Punch Out its easier to throw but it just seems to be the wrong ball for me. It doesn't get down the lane far enough before it breaks.

Two questions...

With today's technology is the difference between 14 and 15 pounds even relevant?

Is it possible the lack of length before the hook is an issue with pin placement on drilling pattern? I know these questions are probably hard to answer without seeing me throw the ball so I'm just looking for in general type answers.

Thanks!

Speaking from personal experience I think the weight you can control is the weight you should throw. For years I threw 15 lbs, felt like the ball was throwing me and not the other way around, and I averaged in the low 180s. I dropped to 14 lbs 2 seasons ago and I jumped from averaging 184 to 197 and now 200 this past season. I contribute that average jump to the fact that I now control the ball and I can repeat shots much more easily. I have teammates that throw 15lbs and 16lbs and my carry percentage is the same or better than theirs so I really don't think it makes that much of a noticeable difference. I'd place more of an emphasis on energy retention than a pound of weight. If a ball retains energy and rolls through the pins properly it's going to carry, if a ball burns up and rolls out then it's going to deflect whether it's 14lbs or 16.

If you're fighting with 15lbs and you find 14 easier to throw then I would absolutely recommend dropping to 14. It's hard to compare weights using two different balls but it sounds to me like it is more of a ball issue than a weight issue and if you threw an identically drilled Optimus at 14 lbs you'd find similar and more easily repeatable success.

[Average200someday]

Speaking from personal experience I think the weight you can control is the weight you should throw. For years I threw 15 lbs, felt like the ball was throwing me and not the other way around, and I averaged in the low 180s. I dropped to 14 lbs 2 seasons ago and I jumped from averaging 184 to 197 and now 200 this past season. I contribute that average jump to the fact that I now control the ball and I can repeat shots much more easily. I have teammates that throw 15lbs and 16lbs and my carry percentage is the same or better than theirs so I really don't think it makes that much of a noticeable difference. I'd place more of an emphasis on energy retention than a pound of weight. If a ball retains energy and rolls through the pins properly it's going to carry, if a ball burns up and rolls out then it's going to deflect whether it's 14lbs or 16.

If you're fighting with 15lbs and you find 14 easier to throw then I would absolutely recommend dropping to 14. It's hard to compare weights using two different balls but it sounds to me like it is more of a ball issue than a weight issue and if you threw an identically drilled Optimus at 14 lbs you'd find similar and more easily repeatable success.

I absolutely agree with this about control. Plus a lighter weight can reduce the chance of injuries. For me, it was a choice between 13 and 14. I'm happy I went with 13.

On the other hand, a pro shop operator described to me that each additional pound is going have the additional weight in the core of the ball and that will result in the ball driving through the pins more, more pin carry, and less ball deflection off the pins. That makes sense too. However, I prefer the control and lack of injuries.

[LyalC52]

...and make sure to crack open a few brewskys while you're at it! LOL

I'd party with Norm Duke any day

[classygranny]

When I decreased form 15# to 14#, I saw little difference in lack of carry. Quite the opposite, as I saw more carry because I was more accurate, and I had a bit more ball speed. Coach says the ball speed I gained more than offset the difference in weight of ball, but he is opposed to dropping to 13#, as he says you will see more difference from 14# to 13# or lower. Encouraging me to do whatever is necessary (working out) in order to maintain being comfortable with 14#.

[bubba809]

14# = winning

[John Anderson]

I think going one pound lighter is generally better if you are unsure that you will be able to throw the heavier weight. When I first began bowling, I started with an 8lb ball. That was perfect for me at the time since I was still a kid under 100lbs. I moved up to a 12lb ball with a fingertip grip and it was pretty heavy for me at first. A few months later once I had grown quite a bit more, I was actually able to control the ball well and increased my average quite a bit. Now that I am going to be a college student, I'm thinking of buying a 14lb or 15lb ball for club sports use. I think I'm leaning towards the 14lb ball just so I can get more speed on it which should provide more momentum than a slower 15lb ball. It should also give me greater control, which is far more important.

For those who haven't ever heard the 10% rule, it states that you should bowl with a ball no more than 10% of your body weight. Granted, this is not at all a perfect rule and leaves out many factors, but it's a good guideline. I think that if you are under 160lbs, you probably shouldn't be throwing a 16lb ball unless you are really short and muscular.

[RobLV1]

I think going one pound lighter is generally better if you are unsure that you will be able to throw the heavier weight. When I first began bowling, I started with an 8lb ball. That was perfect for me at the time since I was still a kid under 100lbs. I moved up to a 12lb ball with a fingertip grip and it was pretty heavy for me at first. A few months later once I had grown quite a bit more, I was actually able to control the ball well and increased my average quite a bit. Now that I am going to be a college student, I'm thinking of buying a 14lb or 15lb ball for club sports use. I think I'm leaning towards the 14lb ball just so I can get more speed on it which should provide more momentum than a slower 15lb ball. It should also give me greater control, which is far more important.

For those who haven't ever heard the 10% rule, it states that you should bowl with a ball no more than 10% of your body weight. Granted, this is not at all a perfect rule and leaves out many factors, but it's a good guideline. I think that if you are under 160lbs, you probably shouldn't be throwing a 16lb ball unless you are really short and muscular.

The 10% "rule" is for children who are not fully mature physically to keep them from injuring themselves. It doesn't apply to adults. Norm Duke throws 16 lb., and he weighs about 140 soaking wet!

I bowled with a guy last week who went to 14 lb to get more ball speed. It didn't work. Most bowlers who are unable to get the ball speed that they want have timing that is so far off that it prevents them from attaining a free armswing which is the key to ball speed. Before you decide on a ball weight, I suggest you invest in a lesson with a qualified coach and see if you can increase your ball speed without sacrificing ball weight.

[HowDoIHookAgain]

Everyone has been answering your first question and not the second xD. But I'll give an answer for the first, and then the second. There really is no difference between 14 and 15 pounds today. The make of the balls is becoming so perfect and everything, that you could probably use 14 pounds against 16 and yield similar results. If you are struggling with the 15 pound ball, then I would switch to the 14 pound ball just because your shots will be more consistent, and you won't risk the chance of a possible injury.

Now for the second question. It's really not common for a lack of hook to be because of pin placement. There are normally 3 things that will affect the hook of your ball:
1. The oil pattern that is on the lanes (also includes how much/little oil is on the pattern)
2. The makeup of your ball. This includes where your ball is drilled, what kind of ball it is, the core used, etc.
3. Your approach, timing, swing, release, and all of that good stuff that's all you

I did some research on the Optimus and Punch Out as well. According to bowlingball.com, the Punch Out has a Perfect Scale (hook rating 1-300, where 1 is no hook potential and 300 is insane hook potential) of 175.5. The Optimus, however, has a Perfect Scale of 212.7. I would say the difference between the hook of your balls would have to be that right there. The Optimus is clearly the more aggressive ball. If you feel that you are not getting the hook you want to get with the Punch Out, then I suggest two possible solutions.
1. If you have the money, buy a 14# Optimus so you get the best of both worlds
2. If you are tight on cash, then I would try working with the Punch Out and seeing if you could possibly change anything with your lines/foot placement to make the ball better suited for your style

This is coming from a kid, so don't take my advice to heart and drop $150-215 on an Optimus, but this is what I think. Hope I helped ;)

[John Anderson]

I bowled with a guy last week who went to 14 lb to get more ball speed. It didn't work. Most bowlers who are unable to get the ball speed that they want have timing that is so far off that it prevents them from attaining a free armswing which is the key to ball speed. Before you decide on a ball weight, I suggest you invest in a lesson with a qualified coach and see if you can increase your ball speed without sacrificing ball weight.

I think you make an excellent point that technique can be far more important than just raw strength. I haven't really considered that there are pros who throw 16lb balls all the time and are about the same size I am. I don't know that I will be investing in coaching just yet, but I will have a good chat with my local pro shop guy that I've bought all my equipment from and have been very happy with the results. Thank you for the advice.

[RobLV1]

Everyone has been answering your first question and not the second xD. But I'll give an answer for the first, and then the second. There really is no difference between 14 and 15 pounds today. The make of the balls is becoming so perfect and everything, that you could probably use 14 pounds against 16 and yield similar results. If you are struggling with the 15 pound ball, then I would switch to the 14 pound ball just because your shots will be more consistent, and you won't risk the chance of a possible injury.

Now for the second question. It's really not common for a lack of hook to be because of pin placement. There are normally 3 things that will affect the hook of your ball:
1. The oil pattern that is on the lanes (also includes how much/little oil is on the pattern)
2. The makeup of your ball. This includes where your ball is drilled, what kind of ball it is, the core used, etc.
3. Your approach, timing, swing, release, and all of that good stuff that's all you

I did some research on the Optimus and Punch Out as well. According to bowlingball.com, the Punch Out has a Perfect Scale (hook rating 1-300, where 1 is no hook potential and 300 is insane hook potential) of 175.5. The Optimus, however, has a Perfect Scale of 212.7. I would say the difference between the hook of your balls would have to be that right there. The Optimus is clearly the more aggressive ball. If you feel that you are not getting the hook you want to get with the Punch Out, then I suggest two possible solutions.
1. If you have the money, buy a 14# Optimus so you get the best of both worlds
2. If you are tight on cash, then I would try working with the Punch Out and seeing if you could possibly change anything with your lines/foot placement to make the ball better suited for your style

This is coming from a kid, so don't take my advice to heart and drop $150-215 on an Optimus, but this is what I think. Hope I helped ;)

I hate to shatter your delusion, but if you gauge the amount of hook by the angle of the change of direction, then the only thing that determines how much a ball hooks is the release of the bowler. If you gauge the amount of hook by the number of boards covered, then the ball that hooks the most is the one that hooks the soonest. The problem is that when a ball hooks sooner, it rolls sooner, and then rolls out sooner. IMHO, the perfect scale is a load of crap made for bowlers who don't want to take the time to really learn about modern bowling balls.

[HowDoIHookAgain]

I hate to shatter your delusion, but if you gauge the amount of hook by the angle of the change of direction, then the only thing that determines how much a ball hooks is the release of the bowler. If you gauge the amount of hook by the number of boards covered, then the ball that hooks the most is the one that hooks the soonest. The problem is that when a ball hooks sooner, it rolls sooner, and then rolls out sooner. IMHO, the perfect scale is a load of crap made for bowlers who don't want to take the time to really learn about modern bowling balls.

The perfect scale is just a method of determining possible hook potential. Yes, I do understand that it can be a little misleading, but it's like every other statistic, like ERA/WHIP in baseball, or free point throws made in basketball. It's all just a number. But we can use that number to get a better idea of what kind of ball would be best for us. Again, I'm just a kid, so this perfect scale is just a scale for me to use until I can better understand the make of cores and all of that good stuff with the modern day bowling ball.

[RobLV1]

The perfect scale is just a method of determining possible hook potential. Yes, I do understand that it can be a little misleading, but it's like every other statistic, like ERA/WHIP in baseball, or free point throws made in basketball. It's all just a number. But we can use that number to get a better idea of what kind of ball would be best for us. Again, I'm just a kid, so this perfect scale is just a scale for me to use until I can better understand the make of cores and all of that good stuff with the modern day bowling ball.

I understand that you are just learning, but your statement that the perfect scale is just a method for determining possible hook potential tells me that you are missing the whole concept of angle of change of direction vs. how soon a ball begins to hook. Once you can accept that, you will see that the only thing that really determines hook potential is the release of the bowler. Once you understand that, then you will see that every ball has the same amount of hook potential with the differences being when the ball begins to hook. You might want to check out my website, www.modern-bowling.com. There are several articles in the Bowling Ball section that may help you to better understand.

[NewToBowling]

Ok someone explain this to me then on hook potential or when a ball begins to hook.

Same lane, same oil, same bowler, same release. Same starting position, same target, etc.

Trying to hit the 7 pin.

Using a Cyclone vs Bad Intentions. Bad Intentions is going to hook sooner and probably end up in the gutter if the Cyclone ball hit the 7 pin (same position, same target)

Guess just a question of semantics on hook potential vs hooking early/late. One would say Bad Intentions has a higher hook potential thus a higher perfect scale???

[Amyers]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but both balls will hook pretty much the same amount of boards on the same condition if everything is equal the bad intentions is no more likely to end up in the gutter than the cyclone. Now what could easily happen is if you throw the bad intentions down the first arrow (no oil) it burns up and you don't get the change of direction you are looking for and miss or if you throw the cyclone down the middle (heavier oil) it skids and never moves and you miss. The only real difference here is flare potential the BI should flare more than a cyclone thus giving it the opportunity to hook more but Rob has stated that he doesn't believe flare potential matters to average bowlers (I'm not disagreeing I think I agree from what I see just not sure why). What I would like to know is when it starts to matter? Is it a certain rev rate that it takes to start to see a difference or is it just such a small difference it masked by the miss area of the average bowler?

I'm really thinking the entire idea of hook potential is a misnomer. What really determines hook potential is the bowlers rev rate, ball speed, axis tilt, axis rotation, lane conditions, and line played. You can buy the most aggressive ball on the market if you don't have much turn on the ball it isn't going to hook. You have to many revs vs. your ball speed your going to struggle keeping even the mildest reactive on the lanes. See Aslan little turn aggressive ball still doesn't hook much. See Mike White super aggressive revs struggles to use reactive balls.

[RobLV1]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but both balls will hook pretty much the same amount of boards on the same condition if everything is equal the bad intentions is no more likely to end up in the gutter than the cyclone. Now what could easily happen is if you throw the bad intentions down the first arrow (no oil) it burns up and you don't get the change of direction you are looking for and miss or if you throw the cyclone down the middle (heavier oil) it skids and never moves and you miss. The only real difference here is flare potential the BI should flare more than a cyclone thus giving it the opportunity to hook more but Rob has stated that he doesn't believe flare potential matters to average bowlers (I'm not disagreeing I think I agree from what I see just not sure why). What I would like to know is when it starts to matter? Is it a certain rev rate that it takes to start to see a difference or is it just such a small difference it masked by the miss area of the average bowler?

I'm really thinking the entire idea of hook potential is a misnomer. What really determines hook potential is the bowlers rev rate, ball speed, axis tilt, axis rotation, lane conditions, and line played. You can buy the most aggressive ball on the market if you don't have much turn on the ball it isn't going to hook. You have to many revs vs. your ball speed your going to struggle keeping even the mildest reactive on the lanes. See Aslan little turn aggressive ball still doesn't hook much. See Mike White super aggressive revs struggles to use reactive balls.

Great discussion! So much of what we believe about bowling balls comes from the pre-modern era, and is no longer true. Let's look at the concept that more flare equates to more hook. Before the eighties and Mark Roth turning the bejesus out of the ball, the best bowlers had the tightest tracks. The really great bowlers of the sixties and early seventies had an oil track that was about as wide as a pencil. When Roth started turning the ball, we started to see the flare rings that are now commonplace with modern bowling balls. Back then, bowlers figured out that more flare equated to more fresh ball surface coming into contact with the lane with the result being more friction. Now, after the introduction of modern balls with cores, every ball flares to some degree. Think about this: if there is 1/4" between the flare rings, or 1/2" between the flare rings, or 1" between the flare rings, is there more ball surface coming into contact with the lane? The only difference is the length of the bow-tie which is so small as to be irrelevant in the discussion. The real reason that the amount of flare is important is not that more flare hooks more, but that more flare indicates a faster transition of the axis from the PAP of the bowler to the PSA of the bowling ball. In other words, the amount of flare is important in determining the shape of the reaction, not how much the ball hooks.

[Ishkabibble]

So all balls have the same hook potential just a difference of how quickly they read the lanes?
Let’s assume both balls have the same core and drilled the same just 2 different cover stocks.
Ball A goes over the arrows at board 20 out to board 8 starts to break at 40 feet and goes back to the pocket at 17.5.
Ball B using the same target having a less aggressive cover stock and slides more going past ball A’s break point and goes 43 feet before it starts to break and misses the pocket. If the pins were back 3 feet further would it hit the pocket? Being as the ball is sliding longer it will travel out to the 7 or even 6 board. Would it need maybe 4 extra feet to recover and hit pocket? Or is the ball never going to get there?

[vdubtx]

Think this is relevant to where this discussion went... Reading a lane from front to back vs. side to side.


http://www.usbcbowlingacademy.com/video/strong-vs-weak-bowling-balls-006856/

[Amyers]

Great discussion! So much of what we believe about bowling balls comes from the pre-modern era, and is no longer true. Let's look at the concept that more flare equates to more hook. Before the eighties and Mark Roth turning the bejesus out of the ball, the best bowlers had the tightest tracks. The really great bowlers of the sixties and early seventies had an oil track that was about as wide as a pencil. When Roth started turning the ball, we started to see the flare rings that are now commonplace with modern bowling balls. Back then, bowlers figured out that more flare equated to more fresh ball surface coming into contact with the lane with the result being more friction. Now, after the introduction of modern balls with cores, every ball flares to some degree. Think about this: if there is 1/4" between the flare rings, or 1/2" between the flare rings, or 1" between the flare rings, is there more ball surface coming into contact with the lane? The only difference is the length of the bow-tie which is so small as to be irrelevant in the discussion. The real reason that the amount of flare is important is not that more flare hooks more, but that more flare indicates a faster transition of the axis from the PAP of the bowler to the PSA of the bowling ball. In other words, the amount of flare is important in determining the shape of the reaction, not how much the ball hooks.

This is different than anything I have ever read on this subject flare potential has always been linked to the amount of hook in everything else I have seen. So basically a low differential will cause a ball to transition slower probably making the ball more skid flip (subject to other factors such as cover strength, rg, and surface). and a higher differential will transition quicker causing earlier hook? makes sense what you said clean ball surface is clean ball surface regardless of space between the rings.

[bowl1820]

I hate to shatter your delusion, but if you gauge the amount of hook by the angle of the change of direction, then the only thing that determines how much a ball hooks is the release of the bowler.



If you gauge the amount of hook by the number of boards covered, then the ball that hooks the most is the one that hooks the soonest.

I don't exactly agree with that, just because a ball "hooks" sooner doesn't necessarily mean it covers more boards.

Here's from a post I made before:

Most of the time when people say "Hook" what they are referring to is backend, that dramatic angle change.

Now You have:
Frontend Boards Covered (FBC): This is the number of boards crossed from the laydown point to the breakpoint.

Backend Boards Covered (BBC): This is the total number of boards crossed from the breakpoint to the entry board at the pocket.

Total Boards Covered (TBC): This is the total number of boards crossed from the time the ball contacts the lane until it enters the pocket.

Here's a simple example:
The illustration is not remotely to scale and so the ball paths are slightly distorted and would look different on a actual lane.
http://s5.postimg.org/3ry5g09zb/lane_diagram_tbc.jpg

Which hooked more?

Most would say the Red ball "Hooked" more because they see it make that dramatic angle change, It went long and snapped hard. But both balls (Red & Black) have covered the same amount of boards, The main difference was just where the ball made the change in direction "hooked". The Red ball hooked later than the Black one.



IMHO, the perfect scale is a load of crap made for bowlers who don't want to take the time to really learn about modern bowling balls.

As for the "Perfect Scale" one of the main problems with it is, that part of the calculation is based on the manufactures hook scale. But the manufactures hook scales vary from manufacture to manufacture because they don't use the same standard.

Which can throw off the ratings and you'll have things like balls that are rated the same, but react totally different in use or rated totally different but react almost just alike when drilled.

But on the other hand if your pretty new and don't know squat. It's better than nothing and is a quick way to get a idea of how some balls might compare, it would at least give you a starting point when talking to the PSO.


As for "bowlers who don't want to take the time to really learn about modern bowling balls." I don't think just because someone uses the Perfect Scale as a guide. Doesn't mean they don't want to take the time to learn, it could just be their new and that's a place to start. Until they find out what they need to learn about.

[Amyers]

So all balls have the same hook potential just a difference of how quickly they read the lanes?
Let’s assume both balls have the same core and drilled the same just 2 different cover stocks.
Ball A goes over the arrows at board 20 out to board 8 starts to break at 40 feet and goes back to the pocket at 17.5.
Ball B using the same target having a less aggressive cover stock and slides more going past ball A’s break point and goes 43 feet before it starts to break and misses the pocket. If the pins were back 3 feet further would it hit the pocket? Being as the ball is sliding longer it will travel out to the 7 or even 6 board. Would it need maybe 4 extra feet to recover and hit pocket? Or is the ball never going to get there?

Too may possibilities to really answer that question. It would depend on the angle the ball is traveling at and whether the ball was still hooking or just rolling at that point. As long as there was enough change of direction to get the ball to head towards the pocket it would reach that point at some time but at what distance would require you to know too many variables.

[Amyers]

I don't exactly agree with that, just because a ball "hooks" sooner doesn't necessarily mean it covers more boards.

Here's from a post I made before:

Most of the time when people say "Hook" what they are referring to is backend, that dramatic angle change.

Now You have:
Frontend Boards Covered (FBC): This is the number of boards crossed from the laydown point to the breakpoint.

Backend Boards Covered (BBC): This is the total number of boards crossed from the breakpoint to the entry board at the pocket.

Total Boards Covered (TBC): This is the total number of boards crossed from the time the ball contacts the lane until it enters the pocket.

Here's a simple example:
The illustration is not remotely to scale and so the ball paths are slightly distorted and would look different on a actual lane.
http://s5.postimg.org/3ry5g09zb/lane_diagram_tbc.jpg

Which hooked more?

Most would say the Red ball "Hooked" more because they see it make that dramatic angle change, It went long and snapped hard. But both balls (Red & Black) have covered the same amount of boards, The main difference was just where the ball made the change in direction "hooked". The Red ball hooked later than the Black one.




As for the "Perfect Scale" one of the main problems with it is, that part of the calculation is based on the manufactures hook scale. But the manufactures hook scales vary from manufacture to manufacture because they don't use the same standard.

Which can throw off the ratings and you'll have things like balls that are rated the same, but react totally different in use or rated totally different but react almost just alike when drilled.

But on the other hand if your pretty new and don't know squat. It's better than nothing and is a quick way to get a idea of how some balls might compare, it would at least give you a starting point when talking to the PSO.


As for "bowlers who don't want to take the time to really learn about modern bowling balls." I don't think just because someone uses the Perfect Scale as a guide. Doesn't mean they don't want to take the time to learn, it could just be their new and that's a place to start. Until they find out what they need to learn about.

I agree with you on bowlers perception of hook in your illustration. The real problem with the "perfect scale" and newer bowlers or just bowlers who don't bother to learn about bowling balls is said bowler looks at his ball sees it rated at "175" wants to play deeper on the lane goes out and buys hook monster bowling ball rated "250" then expects to be able to stand on 40 play over the 4th arrow and doesn't understand why his ball never makes it back to the pocket.

His rev rate, ball speed and other stats determine how deep he can play not the "strength" of the ball. Now the higher perfect scale rated ball may handle the oil over the middle slightly better but it's not really going to make the ball hook any farther.

[RobLV1]

I agree with you on bowlers perception of hook in your illustration. The real problem with the "perfect scale" and newer bowlers or just bowlers who don't bother to learn about bowling balls is said bowler looks at his ball sees it rated at "175" wants to play deeper on the lane goes out and buys hook monster bowling ball rated "250" then expects to be able to stand on 40 play over the 4th arrow and doesn't understand why his ball never makes it back to the pocket.

His rev rate, ball speed and other stats determine how deep he can play not the "strength" of the ball. Now the higher perfect scale rated ball may handle the oil over the middle slightly better but it's not really going to make the ball hook any farther.

Again, it comes down to the difficulties inherent in any bowling discussion based on the knowledge and experience of the participants. As an example, your reference to a bowler who buys a hook monster based on the perfect scale and wants to play deeper on the lane assumes that the said bowler even understands that you CAN play on parts of the lane other than the second arrow. It also assumes that the said bowler does not believe that a ball that hooks more will result in more strikes for some magic reason.

[ChuckR]

We are opening up the old issue of Mental vs Physical. When I start to make a line change, usually left, I have to mentally TRUST that the same delivery will work.
I have to believe that I CAN throw the same delivery that wasn't working and only change the line. It is so common to change the line and the delivery which results in the same problem as before, NO STRIKES.

[Mike White]

The perfect scale is just a method of determining possible hook potential. Yes, I do understand that it can be a little misleading, but it's like every other statistic, like ERA/WHIP in baseball, or free point throws made in basketball. It's all just a number. But we can use that number to get a better idea of what kind of ball would be best for us. Again, I'm just a kid, so this perfect scale is just a scale for me to use until I can better understand the make of cores and all of that good stuff with the modern day bowling ball.

The perfect scale (bowlingball.com) is wrong for the 3 balls I have.

1) White Dot perfect scale 5.0
2) Mix perfect scale 100.9
3) Scout perfect scale 82.0

In reality, the White Dot, and the Mix are very close, with the Mix hooking a bit more to give better carry.
The Scout will jump left off the dry area, so frequently it is unusable on a house condition for me.

All three of these balls have pancake weight blocks, so the main difference in them is the coverstock, which I pretty much leave alone.

[dougb]

When I decreased form 15# to 14#, I saw little difference in lack of carry. Quite the opposite, as I saw more carry because I was more accurate, and I had a bit more ball speed. Coach says the ball speed I gained more than offset the difference in weight of ball, but he is opposed to dropping to 13#, as he says you will see more difference from 14# to 13# or lower. Encouraging me to do whatever is necessary (working out) in order to maintain being comfortable with 14#.

This was exactly my experience. I started out bowling with 14s, went up to 15s, and recently dropped back down as an experiment. I just finished selling off my 15s and am about to pull the trigger on a new 4-ball arsenal.

I saw no difference in carry. In fact, maybe a slight increase as my speed is much more consistent now. Most important, I am not tired after 3-4 games and my spare game has improved for that reason alone.