Shopping time - Long and angular ball wanted

[John Anderson]

If you happened to be shopping for a new ball (and I'm sure most of you are always window shopping), what would your recommend for something that goes long and has a moderate to/or very angular shape.

My current thought is the mastermind scholar. So, that will be my benchmark to compare to for the moment, but I'm definitely not dead set on it.

[Amyers]

First off the Mastermind Scholar is a great ball. My brother in law just got one and is shooting light out with it.

A few other to consider:

If I wanted something cheaper: Brunswick Foreta Exile or DV8 Ruckus Schinzo both of these can be had for $80 to $90 right now and both will give you that go long flip you're looking at I would say both are longer and more angular than the Scholar

If I wanted something towards the more aggressive side: The Motiv Primal Rage and Primal Rage Remix have more cover strength than the scholar and may handle a little more oil than the scholar

If I wanted something different than everyone else has: The Seismic Venator Pearl has the go long flip and you won't see many others on the rack

If I wanted to stay symmetrical but still get a flip: The Storm Skyrocket and the Rotogrip Hysteria will offer nice length and some flip and maybe easier to handle than the asymmetrical cores in the balls offered above

Lastly I'm a fan of Rotogrip balls so don't forget the Hyper Cell Skid and you may want to see what gets released tomorrow from Storm and Roto.

[John Anderson]

First off the Mastermind Scholar is a great ball. My brother in law just got one and is shooting light out with it.
- snip -
Lastly I'm a fan of Rotogrip balls so don't forget the Hyper Cell Skid and you may want to see what gets released tomorrow from Storm and Roto.

Thank you for all the suggestions. I'll have to go watch some videos and do my research on all those. I am definitely going to wait and see what Storm and Roto put out as well.

[RobLV1]

Using Brunswick balls exclusively myself, I would highly recommend the Melee Jab. It's a pearl like the Scholar, but it has a slightly higher rg and a symmetrical core. The Scholar is a great ball when you can use it, but overall I find myself throwing the Jab more than any other ball right now.

[John Anderson]

Using Brunswick balls exclusively myself, I would highly recommend the Melee Jab. It's a pearl like the Scholar, but it has a slightly higher rg and a symmetrical core. The Scholar is a great ball when you can use it, but overall I find myself throwing the Jab more than any other ball right now.

Just wondering, why do you stop using the scholar? Is it too strong? Does it not handle carried down oil well? Just too hard to predict? Something else?

Melee Jab looks really cool and appears to have a kind of similar reaction to my old ebonite bash.

[RobLV1]

Just wondering, why do you stop using the scholar? Is it too strong? Does it not handle carried down oil well? Just too hard to predict? Something else?

Melee Jab looks really cool and appears to have a kind of similar reaction to my old ebonite bash.

The Scholar has a low RG of 2.48 and is very aggressive. When it become too aggressive for the lane conditions, I start leaving weak tens. That's when it's done. BTW, unless some of the bowlers on your pair are using plastic balls for strikes, carry down no longer exists. When you see the ball hooking less, it's not because of carry down, it's because too much friction is robbing the ball of it's power. I often use the Jab for an entire three or four game set, just migrating left as needed. Last night in a league where only 25' of head oil is applied before league, I was able to shoot 227-191-236 with the Jab. I moved a total of 8 and 4 left during the entire night.

[John Anderson]

The Scholar has a low RG of 2.48 and is very aggressive. When it become too aggressive for the lane conditions, I start leaving weak tens. That's when it's done. BTW, unless some of the bowlers on your pair are using plastic balls for strikes, carry down no longer exists. When you see the ball hooking less, it's not because of carry down, it's because too much friction is robbing the ball of it's power. I often use the Jab for an entire three or four game set, just migrating left as needed. Last night in a league where only 25' of head oil is applied before league, I was able to shoot 227-191-236 with the Jab. I moved a total of 8 and 4 left during the entire night.

Thank you for the info. I shall do some asking around to see whether others think that the lane conditions will be too broken down or not. I suppose I didn't really understand that too much friction would be an issue.

[RobLV1]

Thank you for the info. I shall do some asking around to see whether others think that the lane conditions will be too broken down or not. I suppose I didn't really understand that too much friction would be an issue.

I guarantee you that if you are bowling with a majority of bowlers who are using reactive resin balls, that too much friction is an issue. If it's a little bit, it's weak ten pins. If it's an occasional pocket 8-10 it's a lot. Regardless... it's there. You just need to start being aware of it.

[Amyers]

John what are you using now?

[Bowlenheimer]

Scholar was on my list of 3 balls I was looking at with the hyper cell skid and crux pearl, I ended up.goijg with the crux but I have the option to,switch within the month and ai thin nk I may go with the skid. but those were the 3 ai was loooking at for backend.

[Mike White]

Thank you for the info. I shall do some asking around to see whether others think that the lane conditions will be too broken down or not. I suppose I didn't really understand that too much friction would be an issue.

You need to keep your eyes open because the ball not hooking enough could be either too much friction, or too little friction. By watching the way the ball is rotating will tell you which the issue is.

4 things happen ( for about 99.9% of the bowlers ) when a ball senses friction.

1) the ball loses forward speed.
2) the ball increases rev rate.
3) the ball changes direction.
4) the ball loses axis of rotation.

The ideal ( on todays walled up lanes ) shot is to have the ball exit the oil up against the wall of oil, with enough axis of rotation remaining so by the time the ball goes into the roll phase, the axis of rotation is pointing at the flush pocket.

If the ball encounters too much friction, the ball may still exit up against the wall of oil, but not enough axis of rotation, resulting in a light (weak) hit.

On the flip side, if the ball encounters too much oil (carry down, or playing the oil pattern wrong) the ball won't slow down much, the rev rate will stay close to the release rate, the ball won't hook much, and the real key visual, is the ball won't lose axis of rotation.

The ball that skidded too far can hit just as weak as the ball that had too little skid.

Usually the skidding ball looks better because it hits higher in the pocket, but lacks angle of entry so it deflects worse.

The ball is talking to you, all you have to do is learn to listen.

It also helps if you can post each shot so your perspective on the ball isn't changing shot to shot.

[John Anderson]

John what are you using now?

A completely worn out and beat to crap ebonite bash. I know, nothing like what I am looking for, but I am now bowling at a different center. I want something entirely different for good reason.

[John Anderson]

Scholar was on my list of 3 balls I was looking at with the hyper cell skid and crux pearl, I ended up.goijg with the crux but I have the option to,switch within the month and ai thin nk I may go with the skid. but those were the 3 ai was loooking at for backend.

Thanks for sharing. It is helpful to know what others have considered as well. Crux and Crux pearl look nice, but I am somewhat skeptical as to whether they are worth a bit more money or not. I suppose I shouldn't complain though since $20 doesn't really matter if I plan on keeping it for awhile.

[Amyers]

John my suggestion is don't put the cart before the horse. Look at something mid line first and go from there before jumping up to a asymmetrical beast. Think hyroad or melter jab or any other mid line ball that you like the look of and then decide what else you need from that point. It's easier to work from the middle than it is top down.

[John Anderson]

John my suggestion is don't put the cart before the horse. Look at something mid line first and go from there before jumping up to a asymmetrical beast. Think hyroad or melter jab or any other mid line ball that you like the look of and then decide what else you need from that point. It's easier to work from the middle than it is top down.

I appreciate the suggestion, but I'm truly looking for something strong so that I'm not playing the same line as a whole bunch of other right handed people. I want to be able to move left and still get a clean reaction. I am really looking to try and break the 200 average mark with a strong ball. I know that new equipment won't make me better as a bowler, but it will give me the ability to try playing differently.

[RobLV1]

I appreciate the suggestion, but I'm truly looking for something strong so that I'm not playing the same line as a whole bunch of other right handed people. I want to be able to move left and still get a clean reaction. I am really looking to try and break the 200 average mark with a strong ball. I know that new equipment won't make me better as a bowler, but it will give me the ability to try playing differently.

I gotta go with Amyers on this one. While moving in is a good thought, you have to remember that the pattern doesn't only break down at the arrows, it also breaks down at the end of the pattern. Consider that three bowlers are bowling on a lane. Bowler 1 is playing the second arrow, throwing out to the eight board at 45'. Bowler 2 is playing the third arrow and throwing out to the eight board at 45'. Bowler 3 is a high rev guy playing the fourth arrow out to the eight board at 45'. While everyone is playing a different line at the arrows, the end of the pattern is getting destroyed. Before you know it, the 40' pattern becomes 37' long and your aggressive monster bowling ball is hitting like a toasted marshmallow because of all the energy that's being sucked out of it by the torched back end. Going from the antique that you are currently using to an early rolling asymmetrical ball is not going to get you where you want to be. Going to a mid-range modern ball will give you a very pleasant surprise.

[vdubtx]

I am going to agree with Amyers and Rob. Stepping up to a monster ball is not the instant fix for someone's game. Stick with mid range until you get upwards of 200 and then start incorporating the monsters into the arsenal to fill a void, if you have one at that time.

[John Anderson]

I gotta go with Amyers on this one. While moving in is a good thought, you have to remember that the pattern doesn't only break down at the arrows, it also breaks down at the end of the pattern. Consider that three bowlers are bowling on a lane. Bowler 1 is playing the second arrow, throwing out to the eight board at 45'. Bowler 2 is playing the third arrow and throwing out to the eight board at 45'. Bowler 3 is a high rev guy playing the fourth arrow out to the eight board at 45'. While everyone is playing a different line at the arrows, the end of the pattern is getting destroyed. Before you know it, the 40' pattern becomes 37' long and your aggressive monster bowling ball is hitting like a toasted marshmallow because of all the energy that's being sucked out of it by the torched back end. Going from the antique that you are currently using to an early rolling asymmetrical ball is not going to get you where you want to be. Going to a mid-range modern ball will give you a very pleasant surprise.

Okay. I think you may have talked me out of it. Although, four and half years old isn't really antique unless you guys are considering any ball with more than 100 games of use old. I do appreciate all the advice you guys are giving me. Thank you all.

[RobLV1]

Okay. I think you may have talked me out of it. Although, four and half years old isn't really antique unless you guys are considering any ball with more than 100 games of use old. I do appreciate all the advice you guys are giving me. Thank you all.

Unfortunately, with modern bowling balls, anything over two years old is an antique. Technology is evolving as fast in bowling balls as it is in everything else in 2015.

[Amyers]

Actually 4 years is a while. Don't automatically think that a more agressive ball means the ability to play farther in. How far you can play inside has more to do with your ball speed/rev rate, axis tilt/rotation than the ball. If you can't get the bash to the pocket when playing inside you probably won't be able to get said "hook monster" there either, if you can and just need a little more angle to help carry it might help. Try the new storm skyrocket, Rotogrip unhinged, Brunswick melee jab they will all give you the late backend movement on normal lane conditions without adding the unpredictable nature of a asymmetrical core or the need for a super heavy oil to be able to use. If you can't get one of those to play the line you're wanting nothing else probably will either.