Ball Speed Discussion

[Aslan]

I noticed something last night. On Wednesdays they have those scoring systems where it tells you your approximate ball speed. I realize they aren't very accurate...and yes, you can talk about ball speed at the release versus at the pins, etc...

...but what I noticed was, of the players...5 people per team...the speeds looked like this:

Lead bowlers: 11-14mph and 9mph
2nd bowlers: 7.5mph and 10.5mph
3rd bowlers: 7.5mph and 7-10.5mph
4th bowlers: 10-13mph and 9.5-14.5mph
Anchors: 9-13mph and 16-17.75mph

And that's what I noticed...my speed (in bold)...well above everyone elses. When I hit the pocket...the pins tend to really get a lot of action...but I have a greater tendency than the rest to miss right and leave washouts or multi-pin left side leaves.

Now...I PERSONALLY don't feel like I'm throwing it very hard. I also don't feel like I'm very fast on the approach and getting a ton of speed from my legs. And my speed is DOWN from when I started and it was in the 19-19.75 range. But all through my development, I've had people tell me "you don't need any more speed...you have enough". Lots of coaches have tried to "slow me down" on that approach in an attempt to actually let the ball and lane have more time to interact. Last night, more than one person on the other team asked me if I was throwing a 10lb spare ball because they claimed it was being "fired" so fast....to which they were amazed to find out I was throwing 16lbs.

Currently, I'm working on actually speeding up my feet...but it's not to get more ball speed...it's an attempt by my coach to correct my crazy big first step, my tendency to pause during the approach, and to get me to have a bigger final step and lower final step...as well as to get me to slide rather than plant at the line.

So, what is your ball speed? What are your thoughts on ideal ball speed? Can you change your ball speeds to match up with lane conditions? Is my speed too high?

Watching the pros, they seem to be around 19mph...but it seems that is mostly generated by their feet/legs and they use ALL of the approach...AND they have a rev rate that can still get the ball to move a great deal at that speed. But most non-pros I see trying to throw at that speed (including myself circa 2013)...it does NOT look good.

[mc_runner]

I'm 16.5 mph, generally, at the deck. My normal house doesn't have a monitor, so I don't see it all the time. I think speed is relative - as long as it matches up to your revs, you can throw a solid shot. If you're Sean Rash or Belmo and have 600 revs, you can throw it 21 mph and hook it right in. Most of us aren't :P

[John Anderson]

According to house monitors, I'm around 15-16mph most of the time. I think I'm around a decent range, but more would be better if I could remain accurate while increasing speed. I can easily slow down my speed. Speeding up? I can't really do that unless I'm spare shooting.

[Amyers]

I have the opposite problem my speed is stuck between 11.5 and 12.5 at the pins. Kind of embarrassing when your 11 year old daughter throws the ball faster than I do. Wife has more ball speed than I do too.I know my PSO tries to get beginner bowlers (mostly younger men) to get thier ball speed between 13-16 mph to give it a chance to move. Usually to the guys who try to throw it through the pins.

[ChuckR]

I noticed something last night. On Wednesdays they have those scoring systems where it tells you your approximate ball speed. I realize they aren't very accurate...and yes, you can talk about ball speed at the release versus at the pins, etc...

...but what I noticed was, of the players...5 people per team...the speeds looked like this:

Lead bowlers: 11-14mph and 9mph
2nd bowlers: 7.5mph and 10.5mph
3rd bowlers: 7.5mph and 7-10.5mph
4th bowlers: 10-13mph and 9.5-14.5mph
Anchors: 9-13mph and 16-17.75mph

And that's what I noticed...my speed (in bold)...well above everyone elses. When I hit the pocket...the pins tend to really get a lot of action...but I have a greater tendency than the rest to miss right and leave washouts or multi-pin left side leaves.

Now...I PERSONALLY don't feel like I'm throwing it very hard. I also don't feel like I'm very fast on the approach and getting a ton of speed from my legs. And my speed is DOWN from when I started and it was in the 19-19.75 range. But all through my development, I've had people tell me "you don't need any more speed...you have enough". Lots of coaches have tried to "slow me down" on that approach in an attempt to actually let the ball and lane have more time to interact. Last night, more than one person on the other team asked me if I was throwing a 10lb spare ball because they claimed it was being "fired" so fast....to which they were amazed to find out I was throwing 16lbs.

Currently, I'm working on actually speeding up my feet...but it's not to get more ball speed...it's an attempt by my coach to correct my crazy big first step, my tendency to pause during the approach, and to get me to have a bigger final step and lower final step...as well as to get me to slide rather than plant at the line.

So, what is your ball speed? What are your thoughts on ideal ball speed? Can you change your ball speeds to match up with lane conditions? Is my speed too high?

Watching the pros, they seem to be around 19mph...but it seems that is mostly generated by their feet/legs and they use ALL of the approach...AND they have a rev rate that can still get the ball to move a great deal at that speed. But most non-pros I see trying to throw at that speed (including myself circa 2013)...it does NOT look good.

I am also working on my feet. I have the same tendency to pause as I drop the ball. This with NOT using my left arm to open my shoulders causes pulled shots. I hope you are able to make corrections.

[Aslan]

I am also working on my feet. I have the same tendency to pause as I drop the ball. This with NOT using my left arm to open my shoulders causes pulled shots. I hope you are able to make corrections.

Yeah Chuck, the problem is that early on I tended to run and jump as I approached the foul line. So coaches worked on getting me to move closer to the foul line and slow down. That worked…but I developed a tendency to pause after the 1st and/or 3rd step (of 4). We're now trying to get rid of that pause and make the approach smoother because I'm having severe timing issues….believed to be related to that pause/start/stop. And in the process…hoping to develop a few other "good tendencies" like shortening a long/akward 1st step, learning to slide, and being lower at the foul line.

The problem is, as my steps get smaller and more fluid…and my approach longer (to compensate for a longer, sliding last step)…it's increasing my ball speed and I just don't have the revs/release to get it back.

[Mike White]

Yeah Chuck, the problem is that early on I tended to run and jump as I approached the foul line.


Don't forget that mutant first crossover step.

1st, you lifted your right foot up to about mid shin on your left leg,
your heel of your right foot moved about 5-6 boards left of your left foot,
while the toes on your right foot were pointed at about 45 degrees right of straight.

While that foot was in the air, it looked like you had a broken leg.

[Stormed1]

Depending on what ball I am throwing my speed ranges from 12.65 to 13.23. Dull balls are usually closer to the 12.6 side of things as they slow down quicker than a shiny ball

[Aslan]

Don't forget that mutant first crossover step.

1st, you lifted your right foot up to about mid shin on your left leg,
your heel of your right foot moved about 5-6 boards left of your left foot,
while the toes on your right foot were pointed at about 45 degrees right of straight.

While that foot was in the air, it looked like you had a broken leg.

We're currently trying to fix that. But it's not easy. It's just something I've always, always done...and when I try to mess with it too much...my timing goes to ****. But...I HAVE been working on it. Next time you see me bowl I think you'll notice that it's gone or at LEAST it's not nearly as severe.

I'd post an update video...but my laptop is virtually full in terms of memory and that damn video editing takes up so much space.

[Mike White]

We're currently trying to fix that. But it's not easy. It's just something I've always, always done...and when I try to mess with it too much...my timing goes to ****. But...I HAVE been working on it. Next time you see me bowl I think you'll notice that it's gone or at LEAST it's not nearly as severe.

I'd post an update video...but my laptop is virtually full in terms of memory and that damn video editing takes up so much space.

Back stuff up onto Data DVD's, Thats 4.7 gig per DVD of free space.

Now if it really is that your memory is full (not disk space) then you need more memory (it's cheap) or to kill off some unused services.

[vdubtx]

Ball speed for me is from 16-16.5 mostly. When lanes get dry, I get up to about 17.

[Aslan]

Back stuff up onto Data DVD's, Thats 4.7 gig per DVD of free space.

Now if it really is that your memory is full (not disk space) then you need more memory (it's cheap) or to kill off some unused services.

A guy I bowl with is an IT guy and he seems to think it would be easy to add some internal memory. I back things up to a big 1T hard drive, it's more the actual computer's memory or something. Like you said, I just need to clean a bunch of junk off of it...stuff I don't ever really use. I hate to put too much money into it because it's probably due to be replaced by the end of next year. But yeah, I'll probably try to just add some memory to it and see what happens.

Part of it is the iMovie software. It essentially downloads the footage into iMovie...so you end up with the footage on your computer twice while you work with it to create another file (the movie itself). So for whatever footage you want to work with, you need 3x the memory of the size of the footage. I got it down to 2x by quickly moving the original footage to a flash drive, then deleting it from the hard drive...then downloading it from the flash drive to iMovie. But that only worked for smaller amounts of footage.

I love the convenience of the laptop...can take it upstairs, downstairs, on the patio...whatever. But I miss the power of the desktop. And now that I've switched to MAC computers...ughh...replacing them is NOT cheap. Apple wants a pretty penny for that little shiny Apple sticker you get with each computer purchase.

[John Anderson]

Edit: Whoops fixing this real quick.

Aslan, I think that your IT bowling friend is referring to RAM. This would make video editing a bit faster since the computer has more fast access memory to work with. A bit hard to explain without being too technical, but know that video editors are using 16gb, 32gb, or 64gb of ram in a typical setup now. You probably only have 4gb or less if your computer is due for replacement soon.

[Mike White]

A guy I bowl with is an IT guy and he seems to think it would be easy to add some internal memory. I back things up to a big 1T hard drive, it's more the actual computer's memory or something. Like you said, I just need to clean a bunch of junk off of it...stuff I don't ever really use. I hate to put too much money into it because it's probably due to be replaced by the end of next year. But yeah, I'll probably try to just add some memory to it and see what happens.

Part of it is the iMovie software. It essentially downloads the footage into iMovie...so you end up with the footage on your computer twice while you work with it to create another file (the movie itself). So for whatever footage you want to work with, you need 3x the memory of the size of the footage. I got it down to 2x by quickly moving the original footage to a flash drive, then deleting it from the hard drive...then downloading it from the flash drive to iMovie. But that only worked for smaller amounts of footage.

I love the convenience of the laptop...can take it upstairs, downstairs, on the patio...whatever. But I miss the power of the desktop. And now that I've switched to MAC computers...ughh...replacing them is NOT cheap. Apple wants a pretty penny for that little shiny Apple sticker you get with each computer purchase.

Build a Hackintosh (http://lifehacker.com/the-always-up-to-date-guide-to-building-a-hackintosh-o-5841604)

[Aslan]

On those scoring system that sorta tell you your speed...is that the speed of each shot? Or a rolling average?

If it's each shot...has anyone ever recorded their speed after each shot to see what the variance is shot to shot?

I might do that tonight...see what my +/- is from shot to shot.

[bowl1820]

On those scoring system that sorta tell you your speed...is that the speed of each shot? Or a rolling average?

If it's each shot...has anyone ever recorded their speed after each shot to see what the variance is shot to shot?

I might do that tonight...see what my +/- is from shot to shot.

It's each shot, no running average.


There's some apps that will do it.

I use Bowling Ball Speed Free. But you need someone to run it while you bowl. (Or you can video yourself and then do it while watching. It's pretty accurate too.)
http://s5.postimg.org/ral6gfll3/ballspeed.jpg

[dougb]

It's each shot, no running average.


There's some apps that will do it.

I use Bowling Ball Speed Free. But you need someone to run it while you bowl. (Or you can video yourself and then do it while watching. It's pretty accurate too.)
http://s5.postimg.org/ral6gfll3/ballspeed.jpg

I had no idea this app exists. Thank you!

[Aslan]

Like when I used to keep track of pocket percentage....last night I forgot to do the experiment. Plus I was having a horrible night and was frustrated so it wasn't a good night for it.

But that's cool that theres an app for it. Not everyone bowls in houses with scoring systems that track it. And even the ones that do tend to be fairly "off" from time to time.

[John Anderson]

Like when I used to keep track of pocket percentage....last night I forgot to do the experiment. Plus I was having a horrible night and was frustrated so it wasn't a good night for it.

But that's cool that theres an app for it. Not everyone bowls in houses with scoring systems that track it. And even the ones that do tend to be fairly "off" from time to time.

I think fairly off is an understatement for some houses. More like, you'd be better just eye balling it and taking your best guess. I've seen some super slow balls read upwards of 12mph. I mean we are talking over 10 seconds to get down the lane and just barely get pin fall to happen. Mind you, the place this was at had above ground ball returns and single rail ball racks with rockers. It still has tube tvs as well.

[Aslan]

I can usually tell when a speed reader is "off" because if I see a speed < 14mph...I never throw that slow. And if I see a speed over 19mph...also must be "off". I'd have to try REALLY hard to throw a ball that slow or that fast....it wouldn't be my usual, natural throw.

[bowl1820]

The measuring devices on the lanes are notorious for being off.

The best way to use them, is for seeing when your speed varies not how many mph your rolling. Knowing if your speed is falling off while bowling a league/tourney is more important information at the time than knowing if your rolling at 12mph or 19mph.

[Aslan]

I tried to keep track of it during bowling and and the speed ranged from the low 14s and low 17s. Most of the differences frame to frame were slight but I think the biggest difference frame to frame was 1.92mph. Is there an acceptable range of ball speed differences shot to shot? I'm sure the goal would be 0mph…but what differences do the pros see? Anyone know?

[Mike White]

I tried to keep track of it during bowling and and the speed ranged from the low 14s and low 17s. Most of the differences frame to frame were slight but I think the biggest difference frame to frame was 1.92mph. Is there an acceptable range of ball speed differences shot to shot? I'm sure the goal would be 0mph…but what differences do the pros see? Anyone know?

A ball thrown mainly on the dry portion of the lane is going to show a speed much lower than a ball tugged into the oil.

That is when you actually release the ball at the same speed.

Likewise most spare shots will read faster because you're shooting cross lane, which includes the center of the lane where the oil is.