Problems with Speed

[Blomer]

Lately I have been having issues with my speed. How fast I am throwing the ball and how fast go on my approach. When I remember to slow it down, I do well, when I don't, I don't! Where I bowl they don't have the speed listed on the screen. Really wish it did. Think it would be helpful. Any tips on working with my speed? Keeping things slow?

[J Anderson]

In the Bronze coaching class I took with Ron Hatfield, he stated that he almost never asks people to slow the ball or thier steps down. Bowling is basically a physics problem where you have to knock down about 40 pounds of pins with a ball that can't weigh more than 16 pounds. Back in the dark ages, the only way to get a good angle to the pocket was to roll the ball relatively slow. With modern balls and the current lane conditions we can get that angle with more speed.

That said, there is something to be said for having a consistent speed for your approach, one that's not as fast as you can possibly go. Feet that are too fast can play heck with your timing and everything that implies. For some simply counting under their breath is enough to regulate the pace. Some use music, whether thinking of a song in their mind, or actually listening to one.

[vdubtx]

Blomer, I just tell myself to keep slow and smooth during my setup and approach. Wasn't taught to slow down necessarily last year when I had lesson with Susie Minshew, but keeping smooth and posting my shot were the goal.

If you aren't posting shots, that's a pretty good indication that you might be too fast or timing is off causing balance issues.

[Mike White]

In the Bronze coaching class I took with Ron Hatfield, he stated that he almost never asks people to slow the ball or thier steps down. Bowling is basically a physics problem where you have to knock down about 40 pounds of pins with a ball that can't weigh more than 16 pounds. Back in the dark ages, the only way to get a good angle to the pocket was to roll the ball relatively slow. With modern balls and the current lane conditions we can get that angle with more speed.

That said, there is something to be said for having a consistent speed for your approach, one that's not as fast as you can possibly go. Feet that are too fast can play heck with your timing and everything that implies. For some simply counting under their breath is enough to regulate the pace. Some use music, whether thinking of a song in their mind, or actually listening to one.

Set up 1000 dominoes in a line, all it takes is a little bit of force to knock over the 1st domino, and they all fall.

The ball doesn't knock down 40 pounds of pins, if it knocks down 15 pounds worth of pins properly, you get a strike.

[scottymoney]

Speed is not a bad thing. When you have slower ball speed you say you do well. So obviously ball speed is important for your ball to pick up and go through the correct stages. What I would suggest to you is to use speed as a tool. You can use that faster ball speed if you move into the friction a bit more. Likewise with slower ball speed you need to not be in the friction as much.

Something Rob told me awhile ago and has also been repeated by others I know. "House Shots you are trying to find oil, Sport shots you are trying to find friction". In both cases ball speed, axis rotation, and revs can be changed to help you attack the pattern. My suggestion would be to figure out how to attack the lanes with higher ball speed also. Use ball speed as another tool and not something you shy away from.

[J Anderson]

Set up 1000 dominoes in a line, all it takes is a little bit of force to knock over the 1st domino, and they all fall.

The ball doesn't knock down 40 pounds of pins, if it knocks down 15 pounds worth of pins properly, you get a strike.
Point taken. It does explain why I've seen a six pound ballthrown at 3 mph get a strike. Still, the only time I see pins fall like dominos is on hits that miss the head pin completely, and some pin hits the back of the 4 pin, tipping it into the 2 pin which then falls against the headpin. I know that I'm more likely to strike between 14 and 15 mph that between 12 and 13 mph.

[Aslan]

I've struggled with speed since I started bowling in 2013. I would say I'm a "speed dominant" player.

Early on Bowl1820 made quite a bit of sense when I was complaining that my ball wasn't hooking and posted some videos. Bowl (and others) made the comment that at the speed I was throwing the ball...I wasn't giving the ball and lanes time to react with one another. In other words, it really doesn't matter how strong or weak the ball is. If you throw it hard enough...it will go straight.

I also watched a male and female senior bowl. And I watched as these bowlers threw the ball in the 6mph to 11mph range and they physically couldn't keep the ball from hooking TOO MUCH. That's when I further realized the power of "speed" and how speed is simply part of the triangle that is bowling. Like the "fire triangle"...the bowling triangle has 3 sides and all are needed to make a perfect shot: friction, speed/momentum/force, rotation/rpms.

Think of all 3 of those things as worth 10 points. You can take points from one and give to the other...but the sum always stays the same. The trick is balancing out the equation. For example:

- Lanes are dry = too much friction
Choices? Increase speed or decrease RPMs

- Lanes are too slick = not enough friction
Choices? Lower speed or increase RPMs

- My RPMs are too low
Choices? More friction (playing a drier part of the pattern) or lower speed

- My RPMs are too high (going Brooklyn or through the nose)
Choices? Less friction (moving left to find oil) or increased speed

Now Rob and all the ball reps will say this over-simplifies it because it doesn't take into account ball dynamics. And they are right...as an arsenal bowler, I'd greatly prefer to switch balls than switch speeds. But I'd prefer to slightly change my RPMs or my line (friction) before I make a ball change.

For me, speed is the hardest thing to change because of two primary reasons:
1) Speed affects timing. If you start messing with your speed, you have to be able to compensate with your timing. And messing with your timing could be far more detrimental than changing other things.
2) Much of the "speed" is in the feet. That means you're not just slowing down...you're taking smaller steps or longer/slower steps...it's just changing too much at once.

SO, as a speed dominant player (14-21mph)...I've spent the last 2 years trying to get the basics (timing, stance, approach, etc...) down and am now fixing my release. The trick to throwing at higher speeds is to balance the speed out with a stronger ball and/or more RPMs.

Like YOU...I find that when I throw slower (closer to 15mph)...I tend to do better. When I'm "firing hot" (usually right out of the gate when I'm fresh)...I'm in the 17-19mph range and I'm hitting weak. 2-4-5s, 1-2s, 8-10s, flat 10s, flat 7s. The only advice I can give you...which has helped me quite a bit...is you have to try NOT TO TRY. That sounds stupid...and it's actually counter-intuitive...but as someone who has played many sports...usually the harder you try...the better you do. Bowling is more about consistency and form.

So, the next time you practice...just try to bowl a game where you are intentionally not trying to throw the ball. Keep your footwork the same...but no muscling or "trying". That may solve the problem. Or, maybe it doesn't and you need to try an earlier laydown point. Or maybe a stronger ball.

The GOOD NEWS is....our problem is actually a GREAT problem to have. Most bowlers as they age, they lose the ability to throw a ball in the 15-21mph range. They end up moving further and further inside trying to stay in the pocket...using weaker and weaker equipment...and they end up handicapped by lesser carry. It's why we have a PBA50. The key is getting your ball dynamics and rev rate to match your speed...and that will likely take you time to develop a better release.

[Mike White]

Point taken. It does explain why I've seen a six pound ballthrown at 3 mph get a strike. Still, the only time I see pins fall like dominos is on hits that miss the head pin completely, and some pin hits the back of the 4 pin, tipping it into the 2 pin which then falls against the headpin. I know that I'm more likely to strike between 14 and 15 mph that between 12 and 13 mph.

You've seen them fall like dominos frequently, it's just that you have an overly limited definition of what you call like dominos.

Instead of the energy hitting the 4 pin forward into the 2, and then the head pin, include in your definition of like dominos when the 1 hits the 2, which hits the 4, which hits the 7 pin.


Dictionary (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fall+like+dominoes)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpRrVgThoy8

[billf]

Very good points until I read this


For me, speed is the hardest thing to change because of two primary reasons:
1) Speed affects timing. If you start messing with your speed, you have to be able to compensate with your timing. And messing with your timing could be far more detrimental than changing other things.
2) Much of the "speed" is in the feet. That means you're not just slowing down...you're taking smaller steps or longer/slower steps...it's just changing too much at once.

Proper speed control is being able to vary speed by no more than two miles per hour, preferably in 1/2 mph increments. This is done simoly by changing foot speed and height of the ball in the set up. When done correctly the lowered ball will now create less swing time and time up with the faster feet. Conversely a higher ball in the stance will increase swing time and time up with the slower foot speed. Now obviously the difference between a novice's speed control and an advanced player is night and day.

[billf]

Set up 1000 dominoes in a line, all it takes is a little bit of force to knock over the 1st domino, and they all fall.

The ball doesn't knock down 40 pounds of pins, if it knocks down 15 pounds worth of pins properly, you get a strike.

Although John's analogy left you an open door studies have shown, which Ron Hatfield shows when giving the classes, that with all other factors being the same, speed is the leading contributor to carry. This is looking for maximum carry irregardless of how the pins are hit while you are looking for the perfect hit. Truth is, when the headpin comes off the side wall and takes out the ten pin it wasn't a perfect shot but the ball speed allowed for it to happen (and some luck).

[Aslan]

that with all other factors being the same, speed is the leading contributor to carry.

Not to mention, what is the average ball speed on the Tour (PBA)? 20mph?

If speed led to LESS carry...we'd see a lot slower shots on the Tour.

Remember, whether it's 2-handed, thumbless, backwards, underhand, lofting, spinning/helicopter release, etc...etc...etc... If they aren't overwhelmingly doing it on the Tour...where people are trying to make a living at bowling...ODDS ARE it's not better. The folks on the tour are always looking for that "edge"...that can separate them from the rest of the talented field...so if there's a little "secret strategy" that you think you've 'discovered'...odds are it's already been tried, tested, and found wanting. Otherwise...they'd be doing it. And the same goes for speeds. The non-PBA50/WPBA bowlers on the national tour use almost every inch of that approach to get as much speed as they can.

So, should Blomer embrace the speed and maybe even fire it FASTER!?? No. Not unless he has the rev rate to control it. Which, most amateurs do not....including me.

My point was, we can't change our feet without messing up timing. Sure, over time it'd be GREAT if we developed 3 different speeds to use, 3 different lines to play, and 3 different releases. But for most amateurs...especially at my and Blomer's level...messing with speed will mess up your timing. And once that's screwed up...none of the rest really matters. I simply would suggest making sure that the only speed is coming from the footwork and force of gravity (swing). If he's "muscling" the swing....that could account for about 2mph...maybe 4mph. And that will likely be all he needs to get in time and back into the pocket. AND...it's a good solution because it solves 3 problems at once: timing, ball speed too high, and muscling.

Granted, my advice hinges on:
1) His problem being TOO MUCH speed.
2) He's muscling his swing.

And without a video to watch, those are but guesses.

[billf]

Not to mention, what is the average ball speed on the Tour (PBA)? 20mph?


Granted, my advice hinges on:
1) His problem being TOO MUCH speed.
2) He's muscling his swing.

And without a video to watch, those are but guesses.


The biggest issue is ball speed is measured at release. So when we hear on TV that so and so just let one rip at 25 MPH, like Tommy Jones has been known to do, reality is a lot different at the pins. Most centers have the cameras set down lane beyond 40', where the speed is the slowest. Not to mention those can be very inaccurate. Studies have shown release speed of 18-21MPH to be ideal. How fast is too fast? When it consistently has a negative impact on accuracy.
Your guesses are probably accurate. Most amatuer, modern era bowlers, have some muscling of the swing.
http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s413/billf99/BallSpeedvsRevRate_zps4791105c.jpg (http://s1050.photobucket.com/user/billf99/media/BallSpeedvsRevRate_zps4791105c.jpg.html)

As you can see even modest rev rate players need speed. Ball selection and layouts are pivotal for anyone that is not balanced.