Amateur Bowling Tour (ABT)

[shadd]

Does anyone have experience with the ABT?

There's a tournament about an hour from me the end of January that I'm starting to think about entering.

[Aslan]

I've heard good things about the ABT; but most times I've looked at them, they've been pretty pricey to enter/participate.

[fokai73]

ABT - ANother Baggers TOur!

If you have sticks, then this tourney is for you. If you're scratch, hopefully they have a separate division for you.

I stop doing ABT years ago because of the baggers...

[Aslan]

ABT - ANother Baggers TOur!

If you have sticks, then this tourney is for you. If you're scratch, hopefully they have a separate division for you.

I stop doing ABT years ago because of the baggers...

Thats the trouble I had with the abta. It seems like it's run by a group of asians that all know each other, friends, related to each other, etc... And surprisingly...someone from that group won almost every time. The last time I participated, an asian woman that was one of the people running things won it rolling over 600 scratch with a 134 entering average. :confused: :roll eyes:

My new plan is to get good enough that the sandbaggers can't win...or start doing scratch leagues/tournaments. Handicap leagues/tournaments are great when you're in the 120-159 range and are rapidly getting better. But once you get to your "plateau"...where improvement doesn't come as quickly nor as easy...say 165-195...and you get very little handicap. Then you're vulnerable in TWO ways:

1) The handicap bowlers behind you are getting more pins but improving at a faster rate.
2) The scratch bowlers 200+ because even on a bad night they can beat you.

It's like the fantasy football betting sites and in my opinion roll tech...when you start getting money involved and making deposits...based on somewhat fictional results...you have a system ripe for abuse. Handicap is similar. It's based on the concept that everyone tries their best and makes competition fair. When someone doesn't try their best...they can manipulate the system.

[fokai73]

I'm related to many of these Asians who bag. In fact, any Non Asian who hangs out with Asians who bag, more than likely are bagging too lol.

Since moving to California and bowling, I've been asked many times to Drop my average.
I admit, one year I was @ 220 then dropped ten sticks before the season ended. I was asked to do so to make the cap for next years team. Though no money was involved, I later felt that I was cheating myself for missing all those easy spares. Karma hit back, that next year.... I struggled with corner pins all year and pretty much stayed at 208-211 the next two years. I learned to be a bad spare shooter I guess...

[shadd]

...they've been pretty pricey to enter/participate.

I thought the same thing...close to $100 for a tournament if I remember correctly. There is a fair amount of prize $$$, I guess. Might try and find something different locally to get my feet wet

[Aslan]

I thought the same thing...close to $100 for a tournament if I remember correctly. There is a fair amount of prize $$$, I guess. Might try and find something different locally to get my feet wet

ABT Nationals the price tag was closer to $1000 when you add everything up. There are smaller tournaments regionally...but like the abta...it's questionable who is running the show and how much sandbagging is taking place.

It's sad, because a robust handicap/amateur tournament series would be great for the sport and get the more interested bowlers into a competitive/sport mindset...sport becomes more popular, etc... But when you start to see the massive abuse of the handicap system in some of these tournaments...it's not even worth it.

If it was up to me, I'd have the ABT and abta and TNBA investigated by the IRS. Do a quick audit, let the USBC get involved, and start removing some of these bad actors. And more can be done locally as well...like former winners having to bowl scratch...requiring a minimum amount of sanctioned league participation to be eligible, maybe even require sanctioned league participation in more than one center.

I don't really "get it" myself. I can't see how cheating and stealing people's money is something to be proud of...yet in each bowler's digest newspaper...there's a big picture of the winners of that month's tournament...mostly asian...and they are all smiling like their proud. Proud of what? It's like mugging an elderly person and then posing next to them with a big smile on your face and their wallet in your hand. You're not a great bowler...you're a petty theif. : /

[Timmyb]

ABT Nationals the price tag was closer to $1000 when you add everything up. There are smaller tournaments regionally...but like the abta...it's questionable who is running the show and how much sandbagging is taking place.

It's sad, because a robust handicap/amateur tournament series would be great for the sport and get the more interested bowlers into a competitive/sport mindset...sport becomes more popular, etc... But when you start to see the massive abuse of the handicap system in some of these tournaments...it's not even worth it.

If it was up to me, I'd have the ABT and abta and TNBA investigated by the IRS. Do a quick audit, let the USBC get involved, and start removing some of these bad actors. And more can be done locally as well...like former winners having to bowl scratch...requiring a minimum amount of sanctioned league participation to be eligible, maybe even require sanctioned league participation in more than one center.

I don't really "get it" myself. I can't see how cheating and stealing people's money is something to be proud of...yet in each bowler's digest newspaper...there's a big picture of the winners of that month's tournament...mostly asian...and they are all smiling like their proud. Proud of what? It's like mugging an elderly person and then posing next to them with a big smile on your face and their wallet in your hand. You're not a great bowler...you're a petty theif. : /


Good to see nothing ever changes. These "tournaments" were just as crooked 20-25 years ago when I used to try them out. Just going by different names now. Sad to see that they have a "Milwaukee" region, or whatever they call it.

[CardShark613]

How do you go about finding these tournaments? Whenever I google it, or click on any abt "tournament schedule" or "calendar" they are either blank or listing 2015 stuff....like they never get updated?? Trying to enter my first tournament but can't seem to find one

[Aslan]

How do you go about finding these tournaments? Whenever I google it, or click on any abt "tournament schedule" or "calendar" they are either blank or listing 2015 stuff....like they never get updated?? Trying to enter my first tournament but can't seem to find one

TNBA (http://tnbainc.org)

ABT (http://abtbowling.com)

abta (http://www.abta1.com): American Bowlers Tournament Association

TAT: True Amateur Tournaments (http://www.trueamateurtournaments.com)

Once your sandbagging skills are at their highest level....these would be great ideas and ya probably could make a few bucks.

[CardShark613]

Well the abt link is what I've seen and the regional section is blank. And the rest seem like specific events held at very specific places. Are there not any "not so major" events that I could find in the New England area?

[shadd]

Well the abt link is what I've seen and the regional section is blank. And the rest seem like specific events held at very specific places. Are there not any "not so major" events that I could find in the New England area?

I had the same issue with the ABT site until I clicked on my regions link and was able to get to the Facebook page, which is updated (a little infrequently but better than never) with schedules and some results. My area (1-2 hour radius) has 1-2 smaller "satellites" a month and "major" (this weekend they have an event with $3000 1st prize) tournaments every couple of months.

Good luck finding what you're looking for Shark!

[CardShark613]

Thanks, yes I'll dig a little deeper and maybe try to find the FB pages you're talking about.
My local house is hosting a small tournament in a couple weeks. I'll dip my toes in on that one and see if I do well enough to pursue some more.
My league avg is 170 right now coming from a 140 at the beginning of this league. I've really made some ground after buying my first resin ball(was tossing a 30 year old ebonite urethane all my life and not competitively until this season.) my last few weeks have all been 620+ with a few 730s In practice. I was a little tentative about entering a hdcp tourney feeling pretty confident on a good day I smoke my avg, as I don't want to look like a bagger, but it is my legitimate avg and I always try my best.

I've been told "there are many frequent tourneys in MA" but can't seem to find anything on the net. If anyone near me knows the deal, please share.

And I'll peep that FB ABT

[NewToBowling]

That's the problem. You basically have to go looking for any local tournaments. They don't advertise them at all. It's like the unicorn. Never or hardly ever seen

[mc_runner]

In New England there is The People's Tournament, which I have done OK in, in the past but it still has it's problems. There is also NEBA which is essentially a semi-pro tour (and one of my goals... get good enough to do well in that)

[Aslan]

If you think the private tournaments are bad...some regional USBC pages and association pages are so bad you don't even know if the association still exists or not.

[NewToBowling]

There is also LIGBT

[Maine Man]

Well the abt link is what I've seen and the regional section is blank. And the rest seem like specific events held at very specific places. Are there not any "not so major" events that I could find in the New England area?

CardShark,

I run a monthly scratch tournament up here in Maine called the Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament (M.I.S.T. for short). We have (7) monthly events from September to March, along with special summer scratch challenges and match play tournaments. We put out tough oil patterns, NOT house shots. If you can average 190-200 you will make money most of the time at the M.I.S.T. Here is the link to the website to get more info: www.mist.bowlingchat.net.

If you want, we have a Facebook group page where I post results, schedules, events, or any other pertinent tournament information. Just search "Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament" to be added to the group. We paid out over $20,000 in prize money last year alone, and are on pace to do it again this year. The normal cost per tournament is $60 and we average about 55-60 bowlers per month. I run scratch brackets, high game pots, and also we raffle off a high end Brunswick bowling ball each month, with the money going into the prize fund for each monthly tournament. Thank you, and I hope to see you up here!

James G.
Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament Director

[jab5325]

CardShark,

I run a monthly scratch tournament up here in Maine called the Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament (M.I.S.T. for short). We have (7) monthly events from September to March, along with special summer scratch challenges and match play tournaments. We put out tough oil patterns, NOT house shots. If you can average 190-200 you will make money most of the time at the M.I.S.T. Here is the link to the website to get more info: www.mist.bowlingchat.net.

If you want, we have a Facebook group page where I post results, schedules, events, or any other pertinent tournament information. Just search "Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament" to be added to the group. We paid out over $20,000 in prize money last year alone, and are on pace to do it again this year. The normal cost per tournament is $60 and we average about 55-60 bowlers per month. I run scratch brackets, high game pots, and also we raffle off a high end Brunswick bowling ball each month, with the money going into the prize fund for each monthly tournament. Thank you, and I hope to see you up here!

James G.
Maine Invitational Scratch Tournament Director


Sounds fun. Can you move to Pennsylvania?

[Maine Man]

Haha, maybe someday! :D