Pearl,Hybrid,Solid Same Core, Coverstock And Finish comparison?

[bowl1820]

These were posted by Ron Hickland as a visual difference of Pearl,Hybrid,Solid. But I don't know what the full context was this was posted in.

So take it for what you will.

I just thought it was interesting because he mentioned Liquid & Powdered pearl and Mo had mentioned those on the Let's go bowling show.


http://s5.postimg.org/8tjvsyflz/ronhprlhybsol.jpg

Pearl Ball Same Core Coverstock And Finish

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPelFIUEp2M

[bowl1820]

Hybrid Ball Same Core Coverstock And Finish

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Aa7OlNG_x4

[bowl1820]

Solid Ball Same Core Coverstock And Finish

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYOpuJW_6Xk

[Jaescrub]

Wait what? Unless you have the same release every time like a robot then this would prove nothing right?

[RobLV1]

I've often wondered how much of the whole solid vs. pearl vs. hybrid thing is marketing hype and how much is real. It seems to me to be a big coincidence that a majority of solids come with dull covers, while a majority of pearls come polished. To see for myself, I took a Melee Cross and a Melee Jab, two balls with the same core and solid and pearl versions of the same cover material, and refinished each with the Jab finish and threw them side by side. Next, I refinished each with the Cross finish and again threw them side by side. Now I'm nowhere as consistent as a throwbot, but I couldn't see a discernible difference in ball reaction between the two balls with either finish... just sayin'!

[Amyers]

I've often wondered how much of the whole solid vs. pearl vs. hybrid thing is marketing hype and how much is real. It seems to me to be a big coincidence that a majority of solids come with dull covers, while a majority of pearls come polished. To see for myself, I took a Melee Cross and a Melee Jab, two balls with the same core and solid and pearl versions of the same cover material, and refinished each with the Jab finish and threw them side by side. Next, I refinished each with the Cross finish and again threw them side by side. Now I'm nowhere as consistent as a throwbot, but I couldn't see a discernible difference in ball reaction between the two balls with either finish... just sayin'!

You got it exactly 90% of the difference between the three cover types is actually the surface. Maybe in the past there were more difference but in modern ball manufacturing they are able to produce solids that go long and pearls that start rolling early. this whole thing of introducing every ball in pearl, hybrid, and solid is nothing but marketing hype. The only way you would need more than one is if you don't want to change the surface even then you might as well buy the older release and change the surface to match what you want and save some money.

[Jaescrub]

That or in my case I have a crux and crux pearl with very different lays outs but I did not buy the pearl.

[Aslan]

I've often wondered how much of the whole solid vs. pearl vs. hybrid thing is marketing hype and how much is real...but I couldn't see a discernible difference in ball reaction between the two balls with either finish... just sayin'!


The only way you would need more than one is if you don't want to change the surface even then you might as well buy the older release and change the surface to match what you want and save some money.

My Lethal Revolver (solid) breaks much earlier and win a much more "long arcing" way than the Loaded Revolver (pearl).

During my Encounter project, after seeing little difference due to drill layouts (which was the old argument we all had back in the Iceman era)...I changed the surface of the one, more aggressively drilled ball to 1000 abralon. I even went so far as to hit it with 500 abralon and then wet sand it with 1000 grit sandpaper. 'Maybe 2 boards overall difference in hook...it did certainly move sooner...so the surface trumps drill layout for sure...but when sanded down that much...it rarely carried well. Even at my higher speed...it was dead before it hit the pocket.

So, if the goal is to buy one ball and add surface to it...I would think the downside to that plan is the ball is less likely to carry the 10-pin or 7-pin once you get it back to the pocket.

This is why I was working on a much more comprehensive ball progression/selection system that takes into account all elements that go into ball motion:
- Cover
- Finish (although, this less so since it can be changed)
- PerfectScale (or some other non-ball manufacturer system for overall hook rating)
- RG
- Diff (although lesser importance)
- Brand (although I haven't added this one yet because it tends to go alongside and parallel to PerfectScale...so might not be worthwhile if it's already factored in)

A person could argue that one of these is more important than another...it could be an endless debate...but the bottom line is...if you just grab one of these...your favorite...you are ignoring a lot of other data that goes into that ball motion. Sure, if you are a big 'surfacing' guy like Amyers or maybe a guy that is fascinated with RG and core strength (like a RobM)...or even someone more concerned with covers (like myself)...maybe that's the number you build your system around...

...but to think you could make an arsenal out of one ball and an unlimited supply of abralon pads is just as far fetched as thinking you could but an arsenal together strictly using RG values or simply a solid, hybrid, pearl based on covers only. The ultimate result is dependent on all factors. Trying to make balls do what you what you want them to, regardless of their characteristics and specs...it's like playing lanes in the wrong spot because moving inside 2nd arrow is scary. I see this every league night, every tournament...guys do well, pattern starts to break down, their line is obviously burnt up...but they will not move off that line. They will switch balls sometimes...try to change speeds...they will do everything in their power to not move off that line.

The ideal arsenal would be:
Cover Stock: Solid > Hybrid > Pearl
RG: Lower > mid-range > higher
Differential: Higher > Medium > Lower
Surface: matte/sanded/500-1000 abralon > 1000-2000 abralon > 2000+ abralon/polished
PerfectScale (or equivalent scale): High # > Medium # > Lower #

The problem is, you're unlikely to find 3 balls that can fit in those exact ranges. And that's where you have to compromise a little bit. Maybe you're throwing a Hybrid first versus a solid...but the solid has a higher RG and lower PerfectScale. And surfacing is great to try and help fill holes.

For example, I have a Track300A I plan to use as my "dry/last in progression" ball in my next arsenal. I want to use the Rotogrip Defiant Edge as my "first ball out of the bag" and I don't really have a good option to fit in between those. I have an Ebonite Innovate and an Ebonite Warning Sign...both at that weight (16lbs) and I'd love to actually use them....but they just don't fit well as a ball down option from the Defiant Edge. So, I am strongly considering unretiring the 900Global Bullet Train. I figure it's got a strong hybrid cover....and a very high PerfectScale rating...but it's RG is a good fit and maybe I can surface it to 2500-3000...get myself a personal ball spinner...and keep that baby polished...and 'maybe' it'll work as a #2 ball in the progression. If not, no biggie...I'll use it as the first ball out of my bag or maybe even do the unthinkable and buy a modern ball to fit in that space and re-retire the Bullet Train.

So, I'm not opposed to using surface to make balls fit where I need them...but it's significantly easier and cheaper if I can find balls that fit well in a progression that require minimum maintenance. Cleaning, ball dehydrating, etc... and maybe after 250 games...a resurfacing. But doing more frequent surface maintenance than that is just too much work to force a square peg in a round hole. Better options probably exist.

[Amyers]

My Lethal Revolver (solid) breaks much earlier and win a much more "long arcing" way than the Loaded Revolver (pearl).

During my Encounter project, after seeing little difference due to drill layouts (which was the old argument we all had back in the Iceman era)...I changed the surface of the one, more aggressively drilled ball to 1000 abralon. I even went so far as to hit it with 500 abralon and then wet sand it with 1000 grit sandpaper. 'Maybe 2 boards overall difference in hook...it did certainly move sooner...so the surface trumps drill layout for sure...but when sanded down that much...it rarely carried well. Even at my higher speed...it was dead before it hit the pocket.

So, if the goal is to buy one ball and add surface to it...I would think the downside to that plan is the ball is less likely to carry the 10-pin or 7-pin once you get it back to the pocket.

This is why I was working on a much more comprehensive ball progression/selection system that takes into account all elements that go into ball motion:
- Cover
- Finish (although, this less so since it can be changed)
- PerfectScale (or some other non-ball manufacturer system for overall hook rating)
- RG
- Diff (although lesser importance)
- Brand (although I haven't added this one yet because it tends to go alongside and parallel to PerfectScale...so might not be worthwhile if it's already factored in)

A person could argue that one of these is more important than another...it could be an endless debate...but the bottom line is...if you just grab one of these...your favorite...you are ignoring a lot of other data that goes into that ball motion. Sure, if you are a big 'surfacing' guy like Amyers or maybe a guy that is fascinated with RG and core strength (like a RobM)...or even someone more concerned with covers (like myself)...maybe that's the number you build your system around...

...but to think you could make an arsenal out of one ball and an unlimited supply of abralon pads is just as far fetched as thinking you could but an arsenal together strictly using RG values or simply a solid, hybrid, pearl based on covers only. The ultimate result is dependent on all factors. Trying to make balls do what you what you want them to, regardless of their characteristics and specs...it's like playing lanes in the wrong spot because moving inside 2nd arrow is scary. I see this every league night, every tournament...guys do well, pattern starts to break down, their line is obviously burnt up...but they will not move off that line. They will switch balls sometimes...try to change speeds...they will do everything in their power to not move off that line.

The ideal arsenal would be:
Cover Stock: Solid > Hybrid > Pearl
RG: Lower > mid-range > higher
Differential: Higher > Medium > Lower
Surface: matte/sanded/500-1000 abralon > 1000-2000 abralon > 2000+ abralon/polished
PerfectScale (or equivalent scale): High # > Medium # > Lower #

The problem is, you're unlikely to find 3 balls that can fit in those exact ranges. And that's where you have to compromise a little bit. Maybe you're throwing a Hybrid first versus a solid...but the solid has a higher RG and lower PerfectScale. And surfacing is great to try and help fill holes.

For example, I have a Track300A I plan to use as my "dry/last in progression" ball in my next arsenal. I want to use the Rotogrip Defiant Edge as my "first ball out of the bag" and I don't really have a good option to fit in between those. I have an Ebonite Innovate and an Ebonite Warning Sign...both at that weight (16lbs) and I'd love to actually use them....but they just don't fit well as a ball down option from the Defiant Edge. So, I am strongly considering unretiring the 900Global Bullet Train. I figure it's got a strong hybrid cover....and a very high PerfectScale rating...but it's RG is a good fit and maybe I can surface it to 2500-3000...get myself a personal ball spinner...and keep that baby polished...and 'maybe' it'll work as a #2 ball in the progression. If not, no biggie...I'll use it as the first ball out of my bag or maybe even do the unthinkable and buy a modern ball to fit in that space and re-retire the Bullet Train.

So, I'm not opposed to using surface to make balls fit where I need them...but it's significantly easier and cheaper if I can find balls that fit well in a progression that require minimum maintenance. Cleaning, ball dehydrating, etc... and maybe after 250 games...a resurfacing. But doing more frequent surface maintenance than that is just too much work to force a square peg in a round hole. Better options probably exist.

I think you missed the point your lethal and loaded don't have the same surface well they might be closer now since you refuse to surface anything lol :D now if you put the same surface on them how much difference would you see probably not much.

I wouldn't want three of the same ball with different surfaces either really but I'd rather have that than three different balls with the same surface.

I actually agree with most of this until the last paragraph. You should at the very least resurface the ball after dehydrating it. If you want to polish the bullet train put 1000 plus polish 3000 plush polish at your speed you might as well throw plastic. I

[Aslan]

I actually agree with most of this until the last paragraph. You should at the very least resurface the ball after dehydrating it. If you want to polish the bullet train put 1000 plus polish 3000 plush polish at your speed you might as well throw plastic. I

My speed is down by a factor of 2mph. I'm actually having a reverse problem right now. At the lower speed...if I get too much "fingers" into the ball...the shot tears left like killdeer running from a lawn mower. I'm actually starting out playing the track...and by Game 3 I'm left of center by a fair amount. Unheard of at my old speed. At my old speed I had to start out up the 5-9 boards and hope and pray it made it back to the pocket...because playing the 1-4 boards like Jess Stayrook makes me so nervous I spend each shot intentionally pulling the shot to avoid the gutter. I don't know how those late 70s/early 80s guys were able to play that 1-2 board as well as they did...that's a heckuva tough shot.

[RobLV1]

Aslan: I'm not obsessed with cores, I just use the low RG as a starting point in setting up my arsenal. I also use pretty much the same layout on everything to take that component out of the equation. Here's how my arsenal is set up. I use a system that is a lot like the way Roto Grip classifies their bowling balls, though I don't like the HP designation (Hook Potential) for obvious reasons.

Level I - Low RG balls with Asymmetric cores: Nirvana, Mastermind Intellect, Mastermind Scholar
Level II - Slightly higher RG balls with Asymmetric or Symmetric cores: Mastermind Einstein, Melee Jab
Level III - Mid-Range RG balls with Symmetric cores: Meanstreak Brawler, Radical Ridiculous
Level IV - Higer RG balls with Symmetric cores: LT 48, Soulmate

I make my selection for each bowling outing based on the surfaces that work at a particular center, the particular pair of lanes on which I'm bowling, and the weather. For instance, when I bowl at Red Rock at night, where a 25' head run is put out and the rest of the lane is "you get what you get," I will take one Level one ball (shiny), usually the Scholar, one level three ball, and both Level four balls. At the same house during the day, I'll take one level on ball, one level two ball, one level three ball, and one level four ball. The one common factor is that all four will be shiny, because balls with surface rarely work for me there.

My point is that the surface should never be the determining factor in selecting a bowling ball because it is so easily changed. If you understand the cores and take the layouts out of the equation, fine tuning an arsenal is very easy.

[Amyers]

My speed is down by a factor of 2mph. I'm actually having a reverse problem right now. At the lower speed...if I get too much "fingers" into the ball...the shot tears left like killdeer running from a lawn mower. I'm actually starting out playing the track...and by Game 3 I'm left of center by a fair amount. Unheard of at my old speed. At my old speed I had to start out up the 5-9 boards and hope and pray it made it back to the pocket...because playing the 1-4 boards like Jess Stayrook makes me so nervous I spend each shot intentionally pulling the shot to avoid the gutter. I don't know how those late 70s/early 80s guys were able to play that 1-2 board as well as they did...that's a heckuva tough shot.

Haaaaaa aslan with too much hand. Man I wish I could see that. I believe I told you so is in order. So I told you so. Now Time to learn balance grass hopper. Let me know if you figure it out I'm closer but not there yet.