PAP measurements

[JaxBowlingGuy]

Maybe someone can help on this. The PAP is measured from grip center. That is the mid line between fingers and thumb, or the bridge between fingers on the no thumb hole.

My question is if someone that throws the ball without a thumb (but has a thumb drilled) and they had their PAP measured from grip center (fingers to thumb).. Would applying this PAP to a balls that doesn't have a thumb hole effect the layout? This assuming that you map a thumb hole (to get the mid line) but just don't drill it.

[got_a_300]

That is a very good question Storm I would have to think it wouldn't
make a big difference for the layout but I'm probably way off and wrong. LOL!!!!!

[JaxBowlingGuy]

Or to even add on to it, wouldn't the actually PAP remain the same but the measurements to get to it would change.

Let's take me for example. My pap is 4 5/8 over and 1/4 up from grip center (finger/thumb)... If measured from the fingers only wouldn't it be (roughly) 4 5/8 over and 2 1/8 down? This taking into account the difference from the center of fingers/thumb to the center of the bridge

[bowl1820]

As long as your PAP doesn't change (going from using your thumb to not using it), the layout wouldn't change.

Your just changing where you measured your grip from the PAP.

Say you map out a undrilled ball with a 70 x 4.5" x 40 layout, when you go to map out the grip next.

It doesn't matter whether you use the (finger/thumb) grip center or the (Bridge) grip center measurements you had. The finger holes will wind up in the same place and the layout won't change.

Now the grip center affects where you measure static weights from And if you don't drill a thumb hole that will have a bearing on what the drilled layout will ultimately be.

[2handedsniper]

Looking at the ball can offer good clues too. When I saw something about the pap with my eyes i did not like in November I changed and my scores have reminded more stable rather than 149 to 217, also i fatigue less

[billf]

Looking at the ball can offer good clues too. When I saw something about the pap with my eyes i did not like in November I changed and my scores have reminded more stable rather than 149 to 217, also i fatigue less

OK I will bite. How does the PAP affect fatigue?

[billf]

I've found two-habders PAPs two different ways. The first bowler had thumb hole drilled and was switching. I measured his PAP the conventional way and subtracted half the span distance to go off the finger holes for future balls. We did this several times as it was a bit of an experiment for me.

The second way I used was recently and just went by the fingers. This kid had a polyester ball with no thumb drilled that he has been using for awhile and wanted to get a reactive resin ball.

[JaxBowlingGuy]

I've found two-habders PAPs two different ways. The first bowler had thumb hole drilled and was switching. I measured his PAP the conventional way and subtracted half the span distance to go off the finger holes for future balls. We did this several times as it was a bit of an experiment for me.

If I'm reading this one right, basically you did that to skip the step on future balls of mapping the thumb hole? So when the next ball is drilled you can go down "half the span" then over to PAP from there?

[billf]

If I'm reading this one right, basically you did that to skip the step on future balls of mapping the thumb hole? So when the next ball is drilled you can go down "half the span" then over to PAP from there?

We didn't have knowledge of any other way.So yes, I measured PAP with the thumb hole which includes grip centerline. So for example his PAP was 1"^ with a span of 4". I took half his span (2") and subtracted it from the PAP making it 1"v. If my thought process was correct only the longtitude would be affected as the latitude should remain the same.

[bowl1820]

There is no need to measure half the span, P.A.P. is measured from the grip center.

For a thumbless bowler the grip center is between the fingerholes, you would just measure from there as you normally would to find the P.A.P. location.

[2handedsniper]

PAP affect fatigues by finding the best ball balance for my release

[2handedsniper]

If the ball is unbalanced I may bowl super one game but then get tired from the ball being too off center and ball badly in the following games

[JaxBowlingGuy]

Your drilling layout may very slightly effect that but your PAP won't.

[billf]

PAP affect fatigues by finding the best ball balance for my release


If the ball is unbalanced I may bowl super one game but then get tired from the ball being too off center and ball badly in the following games

Postive Axis Point is detemined by the bower's release. It's essential in ensuring the PSA is in the correct position for a particular layout to work as desired. Has zero to do with fatigue.

[2handedsniper]

ok BillF , then upload your videos of 700s on shark patterns then

[Tony]

OK I will bite. How does the PAP affect fatigue?

Perhaps he is talking about a CPAP, I know a few people that when they don't use theirs are very fatigued ....

[Tony]

ok BillF , then upload your videos of 700s on shark patterns then

What exactly does that have to do with understanding PAP ?

[2handedsniper]

At times Bill thinks he knows everything

[Amyers]

At times Bill thinks he knows everything

I've refrained from commenting much on your threads as from what I've seen on most threads is someone asking for help with a very unconventional style who doesn't want to listen to the advice they are given even when it's plausible. The PAP has absolutely nothing to do with fatigue unless your claiming that you have to maintain very high speeds to keep the ball from rolling over the finger holes. Some two handers have issues with that.

If you really want to improve your game put the 12 lbs. (unless your physically handicapped) plastic balls away watch some videos of successful two handed bowlers and try to incorporate some of their swing into yours, look into some qualified coaching, and quit looking for shortcuts that will magically fix the disadvantages you unusual style is presenting and fix the actual problem.