Sticking in thumb....

[LOUVIT]

I have a large thumb hole and a 1/4 back pitch yet I still seem to get my thumb stuck and pull or overturn the ball....Any advice?

[ytlas]

Usually the case would be either "knuckling" the thumb in the hole or incorrect lateral thumbhole pitch

[LOUVIT]

Usually the case would be either "knuckling" the thumb in the hole or incorrect lateral thumbhole pitch


I do knuckle it, I always did. I'll have to try not to and see if I can break the habit. just feels like I'll lose the ball if I don't no matter what size the hole is. When I have a ball drilled I have it done to the correct size and I end up going back and having them make it larger. I am always wiping my hands or using the rosin bag because my hand seems to get sticky and sweat during bowling. I put a dab of baby powder on my thumb yesterday and i dropped the ball before the foul line. Is there anything for the thumb that will make for a smooth release yet not too slippery like baby powder?

[Amyers]

I do knuckle it, I always did. I'll have to try not to and see if I can break the habit. just feels like I'll lose the ball if I don't no matter what size the hole is. When I have a ball drilled I have it done to the correct size and I end up going back and having them make it larger. I am always wiping my hands or using the rosin bag because my hand seems to get sticky and sweat during bowling. I put a dab of baby powder on my thumb yesterday and i dropped the ball before the foul line. Is there anything for the thumb that will make for a smooth release yet not too slippery like baby powder?

You mentioned earlier you've had this ball for 25 years have you recently had the grip checked? You can not hold onto a bowling ball correctly unless the fit is right. For properly adjusting thumb fit leave the powder, rosin, or any of the other crap you see people use out of it. That's why they make tape.

[bowl1820]

Yes, knuckling could be the problem.

With making the hole bigger and reverse pitch, you're probably having a hard time holding on to the ball. So you could be knuckling trying to hold on to it and that doesn't let your thumb come out clean.

Your thumb should be straight and lay flat in the hole.

[Amyers]

If you want to quit knuckling the ball first you have to understand my first post the thumb has to fit correctly. Second realize the change is going to take a while. You've been throwing that way for years your not going to change over night. What worked for me was putting a piece of the textured white tape in the thumb hole where the nail side of the thumb is and using the tape that you stick on your thumb (use one of the more textured ones). Concentrate on keeping the thumb nail touching the thumb hole add tape until you can swing the ball this way without it coming off just as your standing there swinging your arm back if you feel the ball slide add another piece to the pad side of the thumb hole until it doesn't slip. This will be uncomfortable, feel weird, and it will mess your game up for a while. If your a hard head like me it make take weeks or even months of practicing this for it to be comfortable some of the people who have tried this get it in as little as a week. If it sticks you know you grabbed it.

Once you have mastered this you can remove the tape from the nail side of the hole and even start to add a little pressure with the back of the thumb but never the pad. You can throw some good games knuckling the ball. I know because I did but you will never develop a consistent release and really be a good bowler until you quit. If I feel myself starting to do this I still go back and put the tape on the nail side of thumb again.

[LOUVIT]

You mentioned earlier you've had this ball for 25 years have you recently had the grip checked? You can not hold onto a bowling ball correctly unless the fit is right. For properly adjusting thumb fit leave the powder, rosin, or any of the other crap you see people use out of it. That's why they make tape.

no,lol... This is my first and second new ball in 25 years....I have a Track Heat and a Storm Phaze. this is more about the way I hold the ball I guess. trying to figure out why I pull the ball a lot. i would think it has to do with my thumb issue. I tried a zero thumb pitch on the Phaze and couldn't get out of it at all even with a huge hole. yesterday I had it plugged and re done to the proper size and with 1/4 back pitch. It felt so much better the first game and then it seemed to start sticking. I was about to have it made larger and decided not to yet. What besides baby powder can I use on my thumb or in the ball to help get a smoother release off my thumb. I don't want to put another huge thumb hole in this ball and use 4 pieces of medical tape in it. I'm starting to think I am gripping to tight and knuckling it. Hard habit to break!

Also would this be a major cause of pulling the ball?

[Amyers]

no,lol... This is my first and second new ball in 25 years....I have a Track Heat and a Storm Phaze. this is more about the way I hold the ball I guess. trying to figure out why I pull the ball a lot. i would think it has to do with my thumb issue. I tried a zero thumb pitch on the Phaze and couldn't get out of it at all even with a huge hole. yesterday I had it plugged and re done to the proper size and with 1/4 back pitch. It felt so much better the first game and then it seemed to start sticking. I was about to have it made larger and decided not to yet. What besides baby powder can I use on my thumb or in the ball to help get a smoother release off my thumb. I don't want to put another huge thumb hole in this ball and use 4 pieces of medical tape in it. I'm starting to think I am gripping to tight and knuckling it. Hard habit to break!

Also would this be a major cause of pulling the ball?

Oh ok I get it on the ball now. Maybe but late timing can cause that too and is probably the more likely culprit to pulling. I don't like using anything on my thumb as I believe all of it comes off of your thumb and draws moisture which eventually causes sticking. Try a piece of the thumb tape that goes on your thumb which will probably cause the ball to come off earlier then add white textured tape until it doesn't slip anymore that stuff has helped me use a much tighter hole which allow much less knuckling and still get the ball off. My pro shop gave me some samples to try until I figure out what texture I liked best.

[LOUVIT]

Oh ok I get it on the ball now. Maybe but late timing can cause that too and is probably the more likely culprit to pulling. I don't like using anything on my thumb as I believe all of it comes off of your thumb and draws moisture which eventually causes sticking. Try a piece of the thumb tape that goes on your thumb which will probably cause the ball to come off earlier then add white textured tape until it doesn't slip anymore that stuff has helped me use a much tighter hole which allow much less knuckling and still get the ball off. My pro shop gave me some samples to try until I figure out what texture I liked best.

thumb tape that goes on your thumb? never knew about this. what's it called?

[JasonNJ]

Too me it sounds like the thumb hole is too big. You said yourself, no matter what size thumb hole, you feel like your going to lose it. You should be able to hold the ball with minimal grip pressure, once you squeeze, it's almost impossible to have your thumb release clean. There is a saying, "You can't out coach a bad fit".

And to answer your other question, it could definitely be a reason you are pulling the ball, using a lot of grip pressure tenses your whole arm which is most likely preventing you from having a nice relaxed arm swing.

[fordman1]

I have been using a thing called a thumb pillow for 15 years. It is a sponge thing like about a 1/4 inch thick. It goes in the back of the thumb. You can also put black thumb tape behind it to make it snugger and it will come out easier for replacement. I have it as tight as possible and with the slickness of the pillow you will never stick. I have to screw my thumb in it is so tight. Never drop the ball or stick. They are called Shur something I can't remember of the top of my head.

[LOUVIT]

Too me it sounds like the thumb hole is too big. You said yourself, no matter what size thumb hole, you feel like your going to lose it. You should be able to hold the ball with minimal grip pressure, once you squeeze, it's almost impossible to have your thumb release clean. There is a saying, "You can't out coach a bad fit".

And to answer your other question, it could definitely be a reason you are pulling the ball, using a lot of grip pressure tenses your whole arm which is most likely preventing you from having a nice relaxed arm swing.


after I had the pitch put in yesterday the hole is sized correctly. I didn't go for the bigger hole this time. It was a larger hole before. I may just have to get used to the right size hole and learn not to squeeze since the hole is not sized. the first game after the re drill with pitch was a 190+ with a triple and a double which is pretty good for me. second and third game just got lower and lower as my hand sweated and stuck again. I refuse to have this hole made larger this time I need something to make my thumb come out after it sweats and sticks. I think I am not relaxing my hand

[Amyers]

thumb tape that goes on your thumb? never knew about this. what's it called?

Vise Hada tape is what I use. Turbo and Genesis make it too. Ask your proshop about it they'll know what your talking about.

[Amyers]

after I had the pitch put in yesterday the hole is sized correctly. I didn't go for the bigger hole this time. It was a larger hole before. I may just have to get used to the right size hole and learn not to squeeze since the hole is not sized. the first game after the re drill with pitch was a 190+ with a triple and a double which is pretty good for me. second and third game just got lower and lower as my hand sweated and stuck again. I refuse to have this hole made larger this time I need something to make my thumb come out after it sweats and sticks. I think I am not relaxing my hand

I know what your dealing with I had that problem for years. Do you get a lot of calluses or blistering on your thumb?

[SAbowler]

Vise Hada tape is what I use. Turbo and Genesis make it too. Ask your proshop about it they'll know what your talking about.

This is what I use as well. I like the blue tape best, but I also occasionally use the thicker red tape too.

[JasonNJ]

I agree with using the Hada tape. Once I've started using it, I can't bowl without it now.

[djp1080]

I've had issues with knuckling which caused plenty of problems with my thumb. Tried all kinds of things. Without the aid of various tapes I was doomed. The first thing that led me to a solution was the protective tape (i.e., Hada tape from Vise), but there are several others that work just as well. I started with the precut stuff. Then moved to the full roll which you can cut to your needs. Today I use a length that not only covers the back of my thumb, but the pad side, too.
I could see that I was still grabbing at the ball as there were wear markings on the tape, but at least I wasn't having problems getting out of the ball any more. So the next step was to see about changing the thumb hole pitch to see if my hand would relax some. Went from reverse pitch to zero which was better. Tried two more moves to a forward pitch and I think it's at 3/8" forward now. No more wear marks on the tape to be seen. Success.
Went further though. Today I make up a tiered tape layer for the front of my thumb hole to fill in the gap at the bottom of my thumb. It's described on Joe Slowinski's website. I make the layers go from 2 to 4 to 6 to 8 and fit it down deep into the hole using 1" white tape. Placing it in such a way that only the bottom portion of my thumb touches feels it. Then I lay one piece of black 1" tape over the top to simulate more of the smooth feel of the thumb slug. That way the white tape doesn't pick up any sweat or dirt from my thumb. It makes the thumb hole feel like it's custom fit. I can hardly move my thumb at all in there is the result. No more knuckling!
Good luck!

[LOUVIT]

I know what your dealing with I had that problem for years. Do you get a lot of calluses or blistering on your thumb?

I was getting a callus on the crease of my thumb where it connects to my hand. I had my span shortened 1/4" and that problem dissapered.

To all others that posted I have to look for that tape I guess, but doesn't all that stuff on your hand make the hole too small? Do you need to enlarge the hole to fit the tape in?

[fokai73]

The thumb feel and fit can be very tricky. Having the right pitches like mentioned is not as easy as some may think. Bevel is an important part of the fit and many over or under do it. I know bowlers who don't know how to place tape in their thumb hole and use non bowling tape - some make it work, but if they can repeat the same tape placement every single time which allows them proper TIMING, more power to them. Many use bowlers tape and never replace it too. The use of tape is an art on its own. (I use magic carpet tape in the rear and white tape in the front.)

When I returned to the game over a decade ago, I had bad release mechanics - I didn't know. I went with a thumb fit and feel that allowed me to get out of the ball (the wrong way). To me, I thought that's how it should be. Also, My tape placement was all over the place. Over the years learning from friends who were/are in the industry I've been bowling with a very snug thumb with forward and left pitches. The ball can stay on my hand with my hand/arm TOTALLY relaxed on my side leg and the ball wouldn't drop unless I turn my palms forward (release position) and the ball falls on its own. If a person holds the ball on their side and they have to grip it to keep it from falling, an adjustment may need to be done with their grip. But IMO, any reverse pitch a bowlers has in their thumb hole, they will grip it. Gripping anywhere in the swing, it's hard to repeat shots. In a house shot setting, mistakes are hidden, but mistakes make themselves known on difficult patterns. Likewise. if bowlers are bowling on THS and don't have a big goal, don't over think it. Just have fun. But if improvement is ones goal, it takes time and effort to get the release mechanics sound, but having a bad fit is just going to prolong that improvement. (There are those above average bowlers who have reverse pitches who make it work, but they are no Joe bowler.... unless they just bowl house patterns and are big fish in a small pond lol.

[LOUVIT]

The thumb feel and fit can be very tricky. Having the right pitches like mentioned is not as easy as some may think. Bevel is an important part of the fit and many over or under do it. I know bowlers who don't know how to place tape in their thumb hole and use non bowling tape - some make it work, but if they can repeat the same tape placement every single time which allows them proper TIMING, more power to them. Many use bowlers tape and never replace it too. The use of tape is an art on its own. (I use magic carpet tape in the rear and white tape in the front.)

When I returned to the game over a decade ago, I had bad release mechanics - I didn't know. I went with a thumb fit and feel that allowed me to get out of the ball (the wrong way). To me, I thought that's how it should be. Also, My tape placement was all over the place. Over the years learning from friends who were/are in the industry I've been bowling with a very snug thumb with forward and left pitches. The ball can stay on my hand with my hand/arm TOTALLY relaxed on my side leg and the ball wouldn't drop unless I turn my palms forward (release position) and the ball falls on its own. If a person holds the ball on their side and they have to grip it to keep it from falling, an adjustment may need to be done with their grip. But IMO, any reverse pitch a bowlers has in their thumb hole, they will grip it. Gripping anywhere in the swing, it's hard to repeat shots. In a house shot setting, mistakes are hidden, but mistakes make themselves known on difficult patterns. Likewise. if bowlers are bowling on THS and don't have a big goal, don't over think it. Just have fun. But if improvement is ones goal, it takes time and effort to get the release mechanics sound, but having a bad fit is just going to prolong that improvement. (There are those above average bowlers who have reverse pitches who make it work, but they are no Joe bowler.... unless they just bowl house patterns and are big fish in a small pond lol.


wow this hits the spot. I'll have to read it again to grasp it. As far as Joe Bowler and the fun game..I'm inbetween. 25 to 40 years ago I averaged 195+ and shot a lot of action. I am in it again for fun and excersise but once you were good you hate to average 150 or so. This game has come so far in the last 25 years it makes me nuts. I can shoot 230 and 130 in the same 3 game set. That bothers the hell out of me. i have just learned the reverse pitch now I'm hearing left and right pitch...I also thought my release was correct but my old ball wouldn't hook on the new surfaces. then I got a coach..Tampabaybob... and he gave me the correct release and my ball flies, but with this my thumb seems to stick like I said. I know the release is ok cause I blow 5 pins and the ball moves a lot.

[Amyers]

I was getting a callus on the crease of my thumb where it connects to my hand. I had my span shortened 1/4" and that problem dissapered.

To all others that posted I have to look for that tape I guess, but doesn't all that stuff on your hand make the hole too small? Do you need to enlarge the hole to fit the tape in?

Tape in the ball yes it does. The tape on your thumb actually removes friction if my and others that I know experiences are anything to go by and you will probably have to add additional tape to the thumb hole to keep the ball on. Seems strange but I eventually went from 1 piece of white in the back to 3 in the back and one in the front to sometimes in the winter months I have as many as 5 pieces in now. My thumb does change with the weather and I do have to adjust my tape some. I always try to make sure I get to the alley early and always slide my thumb in and out of the ball a few times before practice even starts to make sure I have the right feel.

[Amyers]

The thumb feel and fit can be very tricky. Having the right pitches like mentioned is not as easy as some may think. Bevel is an important part of the fit and many over or under do it. I know bowlers who don't know how to place tape in their thumb hole and use non bowling tape - some make it work, but if they can repeat the same tape placement every single time which allows them proper TIMING, more power to them. Many use bowlers tape and never replace it too. The use of tape is an art on its own. (I use magic carpet tape in the rear and white tape in the front.)

When I returned to the game over a decade ago, I had bad release mechanics - I didn't know. I went with a thumb fit and feel that allowed me to get out of the ball (the wrong way). To me, I thought that's how it should be. Also, My tape placement was all over the place. Over the years learning from friends who were/are in the industry I've been bowling with a very snug thumb with forward and left pitches. The ball can stay on my hand with my hand/arm TOTALLY relaxed on my side leg and the ball wouldn't drop unless I turn my palms forward (release position) and the ball falls on its own. If a person holds the ball on their side and they have to grip it to keep it from falling, an adjustment may need to be done with their grip. But IMO, any reverse pitch a bowlers has in their thumb hole, they will grip it. Gripping anywhere in the swing, it's hard to repeat shots. In a house shot setting, mistakes are hidden, but mistakes make themselves known on difficult patterns. Likewise. if bowlers are bowling on THS and don't have a big goal, don't over think it. Just have fun. But if improvement is ones goal, it takes time and effort to get the release mechanics sound, but having a bad fit is just going to prolong that improvement. (There are those above average bowlers who have reverse pitches who make it work, but they are no Joe bowler.... unless they just bowl house patterns and are big fish in a small pond lol.

This is good stuff. Everyone on this site should read this post. Not sure that I would lump all bowlers into the forward pitch camp (I think I am 0 at the moment) but good info.

[LOUVIT]

This is good stuff. Everyone on this site should read this post. Not sure that I would lump all bowlers into the forward pitch camp (I think I am 0 at the moment) but good info.


I agree about the forward pitch, as I said I just had my zero converted to back yesterday. I would not consider a forward pitch right now for ME. I think with a lot of work on my part and more reading I will get out of the ball and stop pulling it!:mad:

[fokai73]

This is good stuff. Everyone on this site should read this post. Not sure that I would lump all bowlers into the forward pitch camp (I think I am 0 at the moment) but good info.

Forward pitch isn't for all or solves all, that's for sure. Proper release and proper timing is the ultimate goal that we should strive for.

[JasonNJ]

I was getting a callus on the crease of my thumb where it connects to my hand. I had my span shortened 1/4" and that problem dissapered.

To all others that posted I have to look for that tape I guess, but doesn't all that stuff on your hand make the hole too small? Do you need to enlarge the hole to fit the tape in?

That is why I like using Blue Tape. Makes the thumb fit snug but its very slick so there is actually less friction with the tape than with your bare skin.

[djp1080]

To all others that posted I have to look for that tape I guess, but doesn't all that stuff on your hand make the hole too small? Do you need to enlarge the hole to fit the tape in?
About protective tape most of the them are stretchable and I was surprised from the start that they didn't seem to affect the size of the hole. The tape fits on the thumb. Regarding the black and white tape, these do effect the size of the hole but not to the point that you should have to enlarge the hole to fit it in. Get the width of the black and white tape that fits the width of your thumb. Get enough in there so that the crease of your thumb grabs hole on the downswing just above the crease. Your thumb should slide in and out of the hole easily. I like it when I can feel the tip of my thumb touch the tape on the front of the hole.

[fokai73]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzKaKz1odbo

Using Tape is all about personal preference. Protective tape down to thumb tape, everyone uses tape differently. It's how you install it in the thumb hole or on the thumb that is important for consistent release, fit, and/or feel.

http://www.bowl4fun.com/magiccarpet/magiccarpet.htm

[djp1080]

Since we're going crazy on taping and thumb holes, here's a link to Part 1 of taping methods and, of course, there's a Part 2 as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9e7mH5t7YE
They even get into tiered taping in this one... :)

[classygranny]

after I had the pitch put in yesterday the hole is sized correctly. I didn't go for the bigger hole this time. It was a larger hole before. I may just have to get used to the right size hole and learn not to squeeze since the hole is not sized. the first game after the re drill with pitch was a 190+ with a triple and a double which is pretty good for me. second and third game just got lower and lower as my hand sweated and stuck again. I refuse to have this hole made larger this time I need something to make my thumb come out after it sweats and sticks. I think I am not relaxing my hand

Louvit...since you made it through one game, and since you say your hand sweats - perhaps you have some thumb swelling going on and it is sticking because of that. Also, if you sweat and stick alot (we do because of the heat here in Phoenix) then try to wash your hands between games and start with fresh skin rather than sweaty skin. I have to do this quite frequently. In fact, new people on our leagues usually think I am really, really fast on my trips to the ladies room - until they realize I'm only washing my hands (:>

[bowl1820]

If you have a problem with sweating hands. They actually have antiperspirant for hands, some proshops carry it.

There's Master "Control Grip" , Kegel "No Sweat" and there's "Dry Grip" for golfers and some spray on Right guard should work also (Just matter of how long it lasts). Put it on a little while before bowling after you've washed & dried your hands first.

[billf]

To all others that posted I have to look for that tape I guess, but doesn't all that stuff on your hand make the hole too small? Do you need to enlarge the hole to fit the tape in?

They are designed so that if you pull tight the hole won't have to be enlarged.
I use Turbo red protection tape on the entire thumb and my size was done without the tape.

The previous post about the tiered taping Joe Slowinskki has made somewhat famous works great but does take some time finding the correct combination when first starting with it. Joe also has a whole series of drilling a tiered thumb slug but I've yet to find a shop that does them.

[LOUVIT]

So I lightly sanded my thumb plug with up and down strokes and wow no more sticking. I also stopped bending at the waist so much and stood more upright and so far I am not pulling the ball half as much as I was. I was bending a lot at the waist since I really cannot bend my knees on release.

[Tony]

They are designed so that if you pull tight the hole won't have to be enlarged.
I use Turbo red protection tape on the entire thumb and my size was done without the tape.

The previous post about the tiered taping Joe Slowinskki has made somewhat famous works great but does take some time finding the correct combination when first starting with it. Joe also has a whole series of drilling a tiered thumb slug but I've yet to find a shop that does them.

Would the tiered thumb slug sometimes be called a tapered thumb slug or are those two different things ? One of the local drillers to me does the tapered hole and it seems to really make a difference for me.

[fordman1]

google Turbo Shur Cushion give them a try Like Mikey said "Try it you'll like it" No more sticking in the ball and no more dropping. Just back it up with black thumb tape and make it as tight as possible.

[Amyers]

So I lightly sanded my thumb plug with up and down strokes and wow no more sticking. I also stopped bending at the waist so much and stood more upright and so far I am not pulling the ball half as much as I was. I was bending a lot at the waist since I really cannot bend my knees on release.

Glad to hear that helped. When it comes to thumb issues there isn't much I haven't tried. Some people's thumbs are just more sensitive to things than others.

[Mike White]

google Turbo Shur Cushion give them a try Like Mikey said "Try it you'll like it" No more sticking in the ball and no more dropping. Just back it up with black thumb tape and make it as tight as possible.

Thats not what Mikey said.....
Mikey didn't have any lines in that commercial.
His two brothers did all of the onscreen talking.

[billf]

Would the tiered thumb slug sometimes be called a tapered thumb slug or are those two different things ? One of the local drillers to me does the tapered hole and it seems to really make a difference for me.


I'm not sure. The tiered thumb is only on the pad side. It sounds like a tapered thumb would be all the way around.

[bowl1820]

I'm not sure. The tiered thumb is only on the pad side. It sounds like a tapered thumb would be all the way around.

There's a:
Tapered Thumb Hole- That's pretty old and was a lot of work to make one.

Then came the easier method, the Tapered Thumb insert. My ex-brother in-law used a tapered insert for a time until he went to the insert with the nub in it.

Might take a look at one of Duke Hardings old posts here:
http://www.bowlingboards.com/threads/585-The-Perfect-Fit-(Part-3-Final)?p=1730#post1730

The part about thumbholes and bevel

Then you have Slowinski's TOP'S "Tiered Oval Process" which is more of a custom fit tapered oval hole.(kind of similar to what Duke had with his customized a tapered insert.)

These tapered holes were smooth and went around the hole front and back, not just pad side.

Next is Slowinski's Tiered Taping which is basically pieces of tape, stacked like stair steps. To hold your thumb straight, like what the plastic "Thumbs Up" does.

This was just on the pad side of the thumb.

(Note: these will add a slight amount of reverse pitch, so you might have to compensate when drilling a hole and using one)

[okfoz]

When my thumb starts sticking, I will look in my thumb hole to see if it is shiny, I have had lane oil has gotten in the hole, just the oils from my thumb has clogged up the surface or the hole itself has become polished from use. I will take some fine sandpaper (IE 1500 or 2000) and quickly sand the thumb hole surface, not enough to change the size, but enough to just get the shine out. Sometimes This fixes my problem.

Granted, over time the hole will get bigger because I am using sandpaper, but it works, and I find it more reliable than using easy slide.

John