OK I came back after 25 years last March

[LOUVIT]

I practiced. I learned the game and equipment changed. I adjusted to it. I joined a senior afternoon league and with my mindset I wasn't ready for it. Yes I do have some issues, I couldn't be cooped up for 3-4 hours with people that are there to socialize instead of bowl. I quit the league, no hard feelings. Now I seem to be loosing interest in it at all. Dam I was brought up bowling action and worked in the house when I was young. Everyday I say ok tomorrow I'll go throw a few games, then I say why? I'm battling depression, anxiety etc. I thought bowling would be my release and a reason to get out of my house.......

Talk me into going back, I have 2 new balls, new shoes, had a coach etc.

[foreverincamo]

Find a different league. Go back to a coach. Try some low-dollar sweeper tournaments. Practice more. Get even more coaching. Buy a third ball. Get a three-ball tote. Try a singles league. Bowl against people half your age. DON'T QUIT!!

[RobLV1]

Just look at the bright side. I bowl in a senior "almost scratch" league where most of the bowlers approach it like they're bowling the U.S. Open each week. That drives me nuts! I bowled yesterday with my best friend who just turned 50 so it was his first time in a senior league. He was absolutely astounded at how seriously they take it, demanding a two-lane courtesy that usually turns into three. Keep in mind that my friend is a former USBC All-Events Champion and was, at one time, the PBA Western Regional Rookie of the Year. This guy can bowl, and yet he's doing it for fun and the opportunity to bowl with me, and to socialize. The point of this is that bowling can be whatever we want it to be. Don't quit just because it's not perfect... as a senior, our goal should be to have fun at whatever we do; it beats the hell out of the alternative!

[J Anderson]

I practiced. I learned the game and equipment changed. I adjusted to it. I joined a senior afternoon league and with my mindset I wasn't ready for it. Yes I do have some issues, I couldn't be cooped up for 3-4 hours with people that are there to socialize instead of bowl. I quit the league, no hard feelings. Now I seem to be loosing interest in it at all. Dam I was brought up bowling action and worked in the house when I was young. Everyday I say ok tomorrow I'll go throw a few games, then I say why? I'm battling depression, anxiety etc. I thought bowling would be my release and a reason to get out of my house.......

Talk me into going back, I have 2 new balls, new shoes, had a coach etc.

Sounds like you could use a bowling partner. Idealy, it would be some one local who would meet you at the alley and either practice with you or bowl a few games in friendly competition with you. Next best would be some one who will hold you accountable when you say that you're going to go bowling.

Another suggestion that is supposed to help in dealing with depression is to get involved in volunteer service. There should be a variety of opportunities to serve so you may be able to find one that is a match for your talents and temperment.

[JasonNJ]

I think you need to ask yourself why you bowl? Do you bowl because you just love the sport or did you love the action part of it? If it was for the action, then find yourself a more competitive league and stoke that competitive spirit. Or if you just love to bowl then try to remember that.

Also for any type of depression, I think the focus is always too much on what you don't have than appreciating what you do have. Try to enjoy that you are still physically able to bowl and have the means to bowl and that things could be much worse if you didn't have either.

[got_a_300]

Lou, what they all said ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Do not give up just because of some of the other bowlers are
not taking it too seriously and just want to drink and socialize
just find yourself a more serious league maybe a money league
to join and get back to that competitive spirit again.

I know what you are going through I just went through it several
times on the fall league. I thought about quitting several times
because of one of my teammates, he was always off talking to
someone and we'd have to go find him when it was his turn or he
would just come in drunk or he'd get too drunk to bowl every week.

Now this summer I've got a team that takes it more seriously but
not so serious that it takes the fun out of it but at least we're not
having to stand around waiting on our bowler to show up.

[fordman1]

Get in to see a Doctor immediately. It sounds like you are suffering from depression. Don't wait do it today.....
It is not a bowling problem...

[djp1080]

Lou, Sounds like you've been through a lot regarding bowling as a senior player as have I. After my wife's encouragement I checked out the local lanes senior league that meets early on Wednesdays. Didn't know a soul and have made friends. Started out with my scores in the 160's with my brand new reactive resin ball which I didn't know what to do with. After a few months of this I put my mind into getting better and attempt to learn the new game like you apparently did.
Actually I realized that I never thought of bowling like I do now. I put my engineering hat back on and did some serious considerations about the lanes, the ball and myself. I even went to a coach like you did, too. My experience with coaches in years past were not good at all. My attitude has changed dramatically.
So far, so good. I'm going to stick with the senior league as this was where I started back into the sport. I've graduated to one of the best average bowlers in that league which doesn't say much.
If I can encourage others to do better, that's what I do. Helping others is likely what we're here for.
If you're battling depression and all that, that's something I don't have much experience with. Some of my relatives have dealt with it and it can get pretty darn serious if not taken care of.
Like you I've bought new balls, bags and shoes. I have all kinds of tape that I've learned how to use to protect my fingers and thumb. I know the local pro shop owner very well and he takes good care of me. I've made pretty drastic changes in the layout of my grip to allow my arthritic finger tips continue to handle the release fairly well. I look forward to each outing.
Perhaps that's all you need is to change your attitude somehow and get to a place where you're looking forward to the next outing.
Another alley holds a 9-pin no tap tourney for seniors every now and then. I even won it a couple of times! Yippee! Looking forward to the next one!
Good luck Lou. Get out there and bowl my friend...

[Tony]

Get in to see a Doctor immediately. It sounds like you are suffering from depression. Don't wait do it today.....
It is not a bowling problem...

If you think you might be suffering from depression, you need to get it checked out, if you aren't being treated get into see your Dr. If you are being treated you still need to see the Dr if symptoms are not improving.
If it's nothing that's great, but remember there are treatments available you don't have to suffer....
There will always be some annoying characters that you'll run into either bowling or whatever you do, get the tools you need to help prevent them from getting to you....
it's not worth it, we're bowling for fun, stress relief and to get out and see friends.....take care of yourself !

[LOUVIT]

Ok too many great answers to quote you all. as far as taking care of the depression it is also anxiety and stress, I am actually on Social security disability for this. I worked on Wall ST. for almost 30 years now I can't read well really concentrate on something as simple as a loan form..

I would love a steady bowling partner, Monday, Tues mornings it's a buck a game at my house and Thurs afternoon also. The only one I bowl is my coach and I can't afford to pay him, he does bowl with me if I ask but I feel guilty because he still teaches me and I am not paying him.. (BTW he is Tampabaybob)on here. I also know my pso who happens to be Tom Dourghty.

I started driving a few mornings for Uber to get me out of the house and I enjoy it because I can stop and go home anytime I want to, on the league I felt confined, I had to be there until it was over and we for some reason were always the last ones out. Like someone said had to search for people. It only takes one issue to put me in an anxious mood for the day, I got so annoyed I actually told her to get to the approach and bowl.

This thread has given me some motivation, hopefully I will go Monday morning and hook up with someone I know and try to make it weekly. Lot's of the seniors bowl on Monday's but I do not want to get in a group just yet again.

I for sure need practice I quit the league averaging 154...lol, Yet I can shoot from 130 to 230 in the same set.

I am also now 100lbs overweight and have copd. So me bowling is like running...lol

[J Anderson]

Hey Lou, did you get out to bowl yesterday, and if so how did it go?


p.s. We will hold you accountable for what you say you're going to do;)

[Aslan]

You just need to find the right fit.

There are folks that go absolutely nuts if people around them take the game too seriously...and then there are people more like me...that only have fun bowling when we're bowling well.

There are seniors that just bowl to get them out of their houses for a few hours, and seniors that still are holding out hope for a PBA60 run. There's nothing wrong with either mindset...you just have to find a league/crowd that is the right fit.

I suggest establishing specific goals. You don't need a league or a bunch of people in order to get to the next level. You just need to know your weaknesses and set targets to improve. Then, develop a strategy of how you're going to do that.

[LOUVIT]

Hey Lou, did you get out to bowl yesterday, and if so how did it go?


p.s. We will hold you accountable for what you say you're going to do;)


Ashamed to say no, I passed the house a few times this week and just blew it off.....I am having some personal issues that are taking over my mind...

[Aslan]

.....I am having some personal issues that are taking over my mind...

Who is she?

I've found that nothing cures problems with broads better than 3-6 games of bowling.

[LOUVIT]

Who is she?

I've found that nothing cures problems with broads better than 3-6 games of bowling.


LOL, no not woman troubles, once I find out their name I run.....haha...married 31 years and she walked. Done with relationships. My issues are like most...financial, not ashamed to say it either, I was a well to do man a few years ago and sickness and family dried me out. Now I'm on SSD which is not enough.. What really sucks is that it's like 2-3k I need to catch up and I can't even get a loan for that.

[Aslan]

My issues are like most...financial...

Oh, that's easier then. Just don't pay them. Pretend you're a business. You think Trump International would think twice about declaring bankruptcy and writing off the debt? Hell no. The Prez even brags about it.

Unless it's taxes. I got HAMMERED with taxes this year...which seems odd given I haven't worked since July 2016. It turns out, the smart financial decision was to become homeless rather than cash out my retirement...as crazy as that sounds. :confused: Unfortunately...I need more in the 10k-40k range than 3k...so I'll have un-temporarily retire soon. :(

[LOUVIT]

Oh, that's easier then. Just don't pay them. Pretend you're a business. You think Trump International would think twice about declaring bankruptcy and writing off the debt? Hell no. The Prez even brags about it.

Unless it's taxes. I got HAMMERED with taxes this year...which seems odd given I haven't worked since July 2016. It turns out, the smart financial decision was to become homeless rather than cash out my retirement...as crazy as that sounds. :confused: Unfortunately...I need more in the 10k-40k range than 3k...so I'll have un-temporarily retire soon. :(


this is my Condo HOA fees, I own the Condo but haven't been able to pay the monthly fees. They can actually foreclose for that even though I own the shi!. You state 10-40k that would pay off everything I owe, I am just looking to catch up and be even with the HOA right now. 1500 would actually 1k would stop proceedings... anyone here a bad credit lender I don't give a crap about interest rate. I just need a small loan! I started driving for uber and making a little money P/T so I have no problems paying it back, but I need the 1500 in a lump sum.

[LOUVIT]

I pass the alley daily and miss it but I know my mind is not there until I straighten out my financial mess...... Donations too.....lol J/K

[Aslan]

I think the problem is:

1) It seems like if you own the condo...being behind in association fees shouldn't allow them to foreclose on the property. If it is...then, there's reason number #6000 why you should never join a housing or neighborhood association. But there MUST be something you get for owning the condo. Even if they kick you out...you still should receive the value of the condo. Why not get a mortage on the condo? If it's paid off...get a small (10% of the value) mortage on the condo...pay the HOA fees...make monthly payments on the mortage...you're all set! These days, mortage interest rates are extremely low...and they don't care about credit...especially when you have collateral (the condo).

2) The first difficulty with a "loan" is that you have no income. Driving for Uber is like, one step up from selling Herbalife or Avon. You'd need a more secure job with more guaranteed income.

3) The second difficulty with the "loan" is the "I'd pay it back" statement related to being behind in your HOA payments and having bad credit. It sounds like, due to probably legitimate reasons, your recent experience is to actually NOT pay back money.

So, you are essentially a person with virtually no guaranteed income and a poor history of paying debts. Thats going to make an unsecured loan almost impossible.

Even if you found someone willing of taking the chance...just to get you a "fresh start"...what is the long term plan? I use to have homeless people begging for money every time I stepped out my door. And people give them money (I did sometimes). Why? Is $2 going to put them on the right track? If they get that $2 from me...and lets say another $300 that entire week...is that going to "solve" their problem? The answer is an almost certain (99.99999%) "NO". They will buy a pack of cigs, maybe get a decent meal, maybe a bottle of hooch, probably some heroin or meth...and then we're back to square #1 next week.

My situation is more complicated because it involves the IRS. And, unlike YOUR situation...the IRS rarely forgives and almost never forgets. Hopefully the federal IRS agrees to my settlement offer...that gets me down to $10,000. It's a low interest rate...so I can just make payments, no bigee.

My bigger challenge is to find a job and/or make some progress towards getting a book published...some type of "income". Moving to Iowa will allow me about 5 months...of living of my savings before it runs out. Probably more like 3-4. But, not a lot of good jobs in my field in this area. I may end up having to get some laborer type job...just to get some money coming in. BUT...it's hard for me to get a lower level job...because they don't like to hire guys that are overqualified. Or, I have to start digging the credit card debt hole with eventual bankruptcy in mind...but thats a messy road I'd very much like to avoid.

Doesn't it suck that there are people who are essentially multi-millionaires...that could probably solve BOTH our problems and not even notice the money left their accounts? The difference between 10 million and 9,950,000 is like a weekend in Vegas to a multi-millionaire.

[LOUVIT]

I think the problem is:

1) It seems like if you own the condo...being behind in association fees shouldn't allow them to foreclose on the property. If it is...then, there's reason number #6000 why you should never join a housing or neighborhood association. But there MUST be something you get for owning the condo. Even if they kick you out...you still should receive the value of the condo. Why not get a mortage on the condo? If it's paid off...get a small (10% of the value) mortage on the condo...pay the HOA fees...make monthly payments on the mortage...you're all set! These days, mortage interest rates are extremely low...and they don't care about credit...especially when you have collateral (the condo).

2) The first difficulty with a "loan" is that you have no income. Driving for Uber is like, one step up from selling Herbalife or Avon. You'd need a more secure job with more guaranteed income.

3) The second difficulty with the "loan" is the "I'd pay it back" statement related to being behind in your HOA payments and having bad credit. It sounds like, due to probably legitimate reasons, your recent experience is to actually NOT pay back money.

So, you are essentially a person with virtually no guaranteed income and a poor history of paying debts. Thats going to make an unsecured loan almost impossible.

Even if you found someone willing of taking the chance...just to get you a "fresh start"...what is the long term plan? I use to have homeless people begging for money every time I stepped out my door. And people give them money (I did sometimes). Why? Is $2 going to put them on the right track? If they get that $2 from me...and lets say another $300 that entire week...is that going to "solve" their problem? The answer is an almost certain (99.99999%) "NO". They will buy a pack of cigs, maybe get a decent meal, maybe a bottle of hooch, probably some heroin or meth...and then we're back to square #1 next week.

My situation is more complicated because it involves the IRS. And, unlike YOUR situation...the IRS rarely forgives and almost never forgets. Hopefully the federal IRS agrees to my settlement offer...that gets me down to $10,000. It's a low interest rate...so I can just make payments, no bigee.

My bigger challenge is to find a job and/or make some progress towards getting a book published...some type of "income". Moving to Iowa will allow me about 5 months...of living of my savings before it runs out. Probably more like 3-4. But, not a lot of good jobs in my field in this area. I may end up having to get some laborer type job...just to get some money coming in. BUT...it's hard for me to get a lower level job...because they don't like to hire guys that are overqualified. Or, I have to start digging the credit card debt hole with eventual bankruptcy in mind...but thats a messy road I'd very much like to avoid.

Doesn't it suck that there are people who are essentially multi-millionaires...that could probably solve BOTH our problems and not even notice the money left their accounts? The difference between 10 million and 9,950,000 is like a weekend in Vegas to a multi-millionaire.

I do have a steady Social security income. Uber just gets me some spare cash and as of today July 1 they have changed insurance laws so I can't even do that until it is straightened out. Problem is that I have a private loan with an attorney and he used the condo as colleratel. Also this community is not FHA approved. I have been approved for many loans until they hear that. With my credit I do not qualify for a conventional loan even with 40,000+ clear equity. I have tried every equity loan company on the net. I even tried reverse mortgages...still a no go. If the Condo assoc. don't foreclose the attorney may. I had a good credit score and cash in the back until my mom got very ill and I took care of her for 2 years and then had to bury her. I also lost it for a while and suffer from anxiety and depression. This is not my idea of retirement. How can they not give you an equity loan on something I own....I only need 3k to catch up and then I can go back to making all my monthly payments on time. $40k equity loan would make me totally debt free. Right now I am concentration on the 3k so I can catch up and up my credit score. Then I could get a low rate equity loan and maybe live a bit. Sorry for venting.

As far as not paying my bills.... Here is a part of my credit report.
100%
0 Late Payments
You have a stellar payment history!
A 100% on-time payment history is a good sign for lenders that you can reliably make payments.

KARMA PRO TIP

Keep it up! Even one late payment could hurt your credit health, so stay

[classygranny]

If you were to find a loan for the $3K, how much could you afford to repay per month? Most places wouldn't want to take a small loan over a long period of time, so the payment amount on a short period of time could be an issue as well.

[LOUVIT]

If you were to find a loan for the $3K, how much could you afford to repay per month? Most places wouldn't want to take a small loan over a long period of time, so the payment amount on a short period of time could be an issue as well.

Yes I understand that, I can make the payments because I wouldn't have to pay extra on my HOA and Attorney loan and pay off my whole 1000 credit card balance. One of the main things on my credit report is that I am utilizing too much of my available credit card balance. I only have 3 cards with 300.00 limits but they go by percentage not $ amount. So if I pay off my 1000 cc balances and catch up on other things I can make maybe 300.00 payments a month for a while. I can't even get a short term high interest loan. I've tried everything. I need to get rid of the 1k cc debt and and pay my condo assoc and I should be able to get a real equity loan. The cos and attorney late stuff is not on my credit report as you seen I have a 100% perfect pay record on the things that are reported...OH, I do have 1 $500.00 item in collection which I would make a deal with them on

[Aslan]

Yeah man...it doesn't sound right.

It sort of depends on how much you owe the lawyer and how much the condo is worth. Condos, unless they are in very specific regions, are usually not great investments. But, if you own it, foreclosure isn't an easy process. I doubt your condo association wants to spend the insane amount of money necessary to foreclose...which is probably FAR more than the 3k you owe them. Same with the lawyer. So, that may be the saving grace.

Also, Bankruptcy is always an option. It sounds bad...it hurts your credit for awhile...but like I said...it's something companies do all the time without thinking twice. And, it's very effective...and usually you keep your property; including the condo. If things get too desperate financially...save up $1k for the bankruptcy lawyer and just wipe the slate clean. You'll keep the condo and your car...but you'll still have to make payments on the car if it's not paid off. It's probably the best option for a person in your situation.

I don't understand "credit"...I think it's just the bank's way of trying to force you to pay them. To be honest, I filed for bankruptcy and within weeks I was getting credit card applications. My credit is pretty good...despite having a $182 unpaid bill with my former cell phone carrier. Every so often a debt collector calls about it and gives me the sob story about my "credit", blah, blah, blah.

Two things every person dealing with a debt collector should know:
1) If you're dealing with a debt collector...your credit is already hurt by the fact that a payment was late and sent to collection. Paying it off won't change that. NOT paying it off...will barely make it worse.
2) NEVER pay a debt collector. By law, you don't owe them money. You owe the company that sold them the debt money...and only the company you owe...can legally collect the debt. The company you owe has already decided you aren't going to pay them...they sold their interest in the debt to another company...and the debt collector has no legal right to it. Thats why debt collectors never sue for the debt...only the original debtor can sue.

If you owe me $3000 and aren't paying me...and I sell classygranny the $3k debt for $50...you legally owe $0. Classygranny will harass you, try to make deals for less than the original debt, etc... As long as she collects at least $51, she has made money on the deal. But...your credit will still be hurt...I will write the debt off on my taxes (minus the $50 I got)...and if classygranny can't get back her $50...she can right that off on her taxes.

[classygranny]

Be very careful with HOA dues in bankruptcy. Usually only the dues up to the time of filing are possibly discharged, but not for the time between when you file and when it's finalized. Also, they are sometimes not dischargable as they may appear as a lien. Very confusing, read up on this if you decide to go that route.

Just talked to a friend of mine and she suggest you check out the following...
SoFi - sofi.com
Guide to Lenders - guidetolenders.com
Bad Credit Loans - badcreditloans.com

[Aslan]

Be very careful with HOA dues in bankruptcy. Usually only the dues up to the time of filing are possibly discharged, but not for the time between when you file and when it's finalized. Also, they are sometimes not dischargable as they may appear as a lien. Very confusing, read up on this if you decide to go that route.

The issue with the HOA dues is...if you OWN a condo...lets say it's worth $50k. Let's say you owe $2k in HOA dues. If the HOA forecloses...and the condo sells for $45k....the HOA can only get $2k. They can't get the entire amount. I don't know a ton about HOAs...but it seems like they can only get what they're owed (plus fees, etc...)

The "problem" is...if it does go to forecloseure, they're going to probably tack on attorney and filing fees...and with a condo...unless it's a luxury condo in some resort area...it's not going to be worth very much...so when you add in attorney stuff...they could end up getting almost the entire amount.

The bankruptcy option won't likely discharge the HOA fees if they're on the lien...but it would discharge the credit card debt for sure...and possibly the attorney debt...unless THAT is on the lien. If the HOA fees and the attorney fees are on the lien...that might make it more difficult...and depending on the value of the condo...might just be more beneficial to just let it go.

I dunno. A $3k loan could be really expensive. Mortage interest rates are really low...but other consumer loans....especially non-collateral loans are expensive. I had a friend that was selling a nice BMW...and I coulda got a great deal on it, low miles, she took great care of it, etc... I could only find ONE lendor that would give me a loan on an older car...and they wanted something crazy like 20% down and a 26% interest rate. Thats pretty damn greedy when you consider the banks are borrowing money at record low interest rates < 5%. Ended up getting a new car....0% interest rate, 0 down. :confused: In terms of collateral...I think the new car I bought is worth less than the BMW I was going to buy. Oh well. Now I got a car I can talk on the phone hands free through the radio...so thats cool.

[LOUVIT]

Condo is worth about 65k I owe the lawyer 35k and about 1200 in hoa fees. I was paying the lawyer 350.00 a month I am now behind like 2 and 1/2 months with him. I e mailed him trying to work something out, he is not a nice guy. No response yet

[Aslan]

Condo is worth about 65k I owe the lawyer 35k and about 1200 in hoa fees. I was paying the lawyer 350.00 a month I am now behind like 2 and 1/2 months with him. I e mailed him trying to work something out, he is not a nice guy. No response yet

Yeah...lawyers aren't easy to work with.

I paid a lawyer about $1500+ to take care of my divorce...that was in early 2015...and I've yet to receive anything from the courts that says I'm divorced. Every time I contact him, he tells me it's in process. I know at least 3 people that started and finished their divorces during the time I've been "in process". :confused:

[LOUVIT]

Yeah...lawyers aren't easy to work with.

I paid a lawyer about $1500+ to take care of my divorce...that was in early 2015...and I've yet to receive anything from the courts that says I'm divorced. Every time I contact him, he tells me it's in process. I know at least 3 people that started and finished their divorces during the time I've been "in process". :confused:


I am not working with a lawyer, He lends money to people like me privately. He gave me sort of an equity loan. Yet on records I still own the unit outright. He did do some paperwork using the unit as collateral but I'm not sure how it works... I borrowed 35k from him I pay 350. a month for 5 years and still owe him 35k. Yea not to smart on my part coming from the financial world. But I needed the cash for family emergency and could not qualify for a conventional equity loan. All I want is my 1800 in credit cards paid off and my 1 500. item in collection and my back hoa fees paid off and my credit score will rocket up and I will qualify for a real equity loan or a reverse mtg. This is not where I wanted to be at 62 years old.

[Aslan]

I am not working with a lawyer, He lends money to people like me privately. He gave me sort of an equity loan. Yet on records I still own the unit outright. He did do some paperwork using the unit as collateral but I'm not sure how it works... I borrowed 35k from him I pay 350. a month for 5 years and still owe him 35k.

Yeah....thats a problem. I bought a house in Michigan back in the early 2000s and paid $107,000 for the house worth about $97,000. After about 5-6 years of $775/month payments, I still owed $99,000 and the house was worth $27,500. Had to spend a LOT of time working with the bank to get rid of that liability and finally did via a "deed in liu of foreclosure".


All I want is my 1800 in credit cards paid off and my 1 500. item in collection and my back hoa fees paid off and my credit score will rocket up and I will qualify for a real equity loan or a reverse mtg. This is not where I wanted to be at 62 years old.
I don't think credit moves that quickly. It's far more likely you'd pay those off, then fall behind again, then be worse off than you are now.

I still think a talk with a bankruptcy lawyer is your best bet. At 62, you need a fresh start...not a "band-aid" that gets you to a larger overall debt. But, that's my opinion...a bankruptcy lawyer will be able to give you a real assessment.

[LOUVIT]

Yeah....thats a problem. I bought a house in Michigan back in the early 2000s and paid $107,000 for the house worth about $97,000. After about 5-6 years of $775/month payments, I still owed $99,000 and the house was worth $27,500. Had to spend a LOT of time working with the bank to get rid of that liability and finally did via a "deed in liu of foreclosure".


I don't think credit moves that quickly. It's far more likely you'd pay those off, then fall behind again, then be worse off than you are now.

I still think a talk with a bankruptcy lawyer is your best bet. At 62, you need a fresh start...not a "band-aid" that gets you to a larger overall debt. But, that's my opinion...a bankruptcy lawyer will be able to give you a real assessment.

I looked into bankruptcy years ago when I first lost my job and house. The lawyer said the debt does not go away it's just paid in a different matter. I was going through a lot of stuff back then that is still affecting me and I didn't understand what the hell he was talking about. I recovered from that situation but this one I can't seem to get a grip on. I don't know how it would work with the people I owe. They are really not creditors they are a condo assoc and a attorney. If I paid off my lousy 1800. worth of cc debt and a small 1500. loan my credit would show it very fast. Like I showed my only issue is cc utilization and 1 item in collection. My score is 630 or so now I need like a 660 to qualify for a real equity loan or reverse mtg..


I am starting to feel stupid for discussing all the stuff here, I do appreciate the help. This thread started as I am not in the mood to bowl....Well I guess you know why now....

[Aslan]

I looked into bankruptcy years ago when I first lost my job and house. The lawyer said the debt does not go away it's just paid in a different matter... I don't know how it would work with the people I owe. They are really not creditors they are a condo assoc and a attorney.

Actually, it depends on the type of bankruptcy. Chapter 7 or Chapter 11. Chapter 11 is generally what you would do if you were a small business and could pay off the debts...ya just need time to "reorganize". Thats why most corporations go through Chapter 11...so they can renegotiate debts, organize things, and then sort of "reset".

Chapter 7 is what indivduals usually do. And, whoever you talk to was incorrect (I think). It's true that your debts don't just get "erased"...DEPENDING on the type of debt. For example, certain types of debt like child support (I think) and tax liability...cannot be discharged. So, you'd still owe that....which is why bankruptcy isn't really a good option for me...a person with primarily only tax debt. Almost ALL other debts can be discharged via Chapter 7.

Now...does that mean you automatically get off scot-free? Not necessarily. You essentially have all of your creditors get a notice that you're bankrupt...and they can choose to accept that or challenge it during a bankruptcy hearing in court. It is HIGHLY unlikely that they could argue you still owe them money. Essentially, the only time they can argue that they should get paid...is if you've done something obviously with the intent of stealing their money.

For example, if you KNOW you're going to declare bankruptcy...and you go on a shopping spree before filing...the credit card company will try to get that shopping spree money or what you bought with it. Even in the most obvious of cases....this is really difficult for credit card companies to do. I heard a case once where a kid went to casinos in Vegas and took out like $8,000 in cash, then declared bankruptcy. The credit card company got nothing...because the cash was spent on gambling...thus there was nothing they could sieze and the person had no money.

There are also limits on what a creditor can sieze. They can't sieze your retirement or social security income. And unless you have some items of real value...they generally can't sieze your assets. Like, they can't come in and start taking your lounge chair, dresser, bowling balls, and your bowling shirts. On the other hand, if you have a rare car collection, stacks of cash, or some gold coins...they can sometimes sieze those.

And yes, the HOA and lawyer ARE "creditors", by definition. Anyone you "owe", is a "creditor".

Where your case is "complicated" is how the collateral is specified. The HOA obviously is going to use the condo as collateral...but they can't take more than you owe. So, lets say the condo is worth $75k and can be sold for $64k...and you owe the HOA $2k + court costs of $2k = $4k. They would take $4k in the sale and YOU would get $60k. They can't take more than you owe them.

The same is true for the lawyer. If the condo is listed as collateral...and you owe him $30k +$6k in his court costs/fees...then he takes $36k from the sale of the condo (minus the $4k to the HOA) and you're left with $14k from the sale. The credit card company would get $0 because the condo wasn't collateral on their line of credit to you.

I know you don't want to lose the condo...but at this point, it may be the best option...because you can take the remainder from the sale, get back on your feet, and just rent a decent apartment. You'd have bad credit from the bankruptcy...but no debt at all. And, if the lawyer doesn't have a great claim to the condo...you may end up with almost all of the value of the condo in your pocket (minus the HOA fees).

I'm a bit hesitant on your current plan of some small loan that can fix some minor issues. Sure, getting caught up with the HOA and credit cards is a good start...but you have relatively little income coming in...and all it would take is a couple bad months where the car breaks down or you have to get a root canal...and suddenly you're back in the hole...except the hole would now involve another creditor. The plan hinges on some magic credit score that gets you qualified for a mortgage...that can get you out of debt. What happens if the credit score doesn't jump up or the mortgage company decides you need a higher score?

As bad as your situation is...I'd prefer it to mine. I have ZERO income...no social security eligibility...no retirement...and my only "debt" is with the IRS. So, for me, bankruptcy is completely off the table and I have no condo that I can mortgage or sell. The good news is I think 2/3 of the IRS debt can be negotiated away. And...my credit is strong and I have a significant credit line to work with...but I'd prefer not to add on any debt now that I'm (until the tax issue) essentially debt free.

[drlawsoniii]

what does the yellow banner on the icon for this thread mean?

[LOUVIT]

Actually, it depends on the type of bankruptcy. Chapter 7 or Chapter 11. Chapter 11 is generally what you would do if you were a small business and could pay off the debts...ya just need time to "reorganize". Thats why most corporations go through Chapter 11...so they can renegotiate debts, organize things, and then sort of "reset".

Chapter 7 is what indivduals usually do. And, whoever you talk to was incorrect (I think). It's true that your debts don't just get "erased"...DEPENDING on the type of debt. For example, certain types of debt like child support (I think) and tax liability...cannot be discharged. So, you'd still owe that....which is why bankruptcy isn't really a good option for me...a person with primarily only tax debt. Almost ALL other debts can be discharged via Chapter 7.

Now...does that mean you automatically get off scot-free? Not necessarily. You essentially have all of your creditors get a notice that you're bankrupt...and they can choose to accept that or challenge it during a bankruptcy hearing in court. It is HIGHLY unlikely that they could argue you still owe them money. Essentially, the only time they can argue that they should get paid...is if you've done something obviously with the intent of stealing their money.

For example, if you KNOW you're going to declare bankruptcy...and you go on a shopping spree before filing...the credit card company will try to get that shopping spree money or what you bought with it. Even in the most obvious of cases....this is really difficult for credit card companies to do. I heard a case once where a kid went to casinos in Vegas and took out like $8,000 in cash, then declared bankruptcy. The credit card company got nothing...because the cash was spent on gambling...thus there was nothing they could sieze and the person had no money.

There are also limits on what a creditor can sieze. They can't sieze your retirement or social security income. And unless you have some items of real value...they generally can't sieze your assets. Like, they can't come in and start taking your lounge chair, dresser, bowling balls, and your bowling shirts. On the other hand, if you have a rare car collection, stacks of cash, or some gold coins...they can sometimes sieze those.

And yes, the HOA and lawyer ARE "creditors", by definition. Anyone you "owe", is a "creditor".

Where your case is "complicated" is how the collateral is specified. The HOA obviously is going to use the condo as collateral...but they can't take more than you owe. So, lets say the condo is worth $75k and can be sold for $64k...and you owe the HOA $2k + court costs of $2k = $4k. They would take $4k in the sale and YOU would get $60k. They can't take more than you owe them.

The same is true for the lawyer. If the condo is listed as collateral...and you owe him $30k +$6k in his court costs/fees...then he takes $36k from the sale of the condo (minus the $4k to the HOA) and you're left with $14k from the sale. The credit card company would get $0 because the condo wasn't collateral on their line of credit to you.

I know you don't want to lose the condo...but at this point, it may be the best option...because you can take the remainder from the sale, get back on your feet, and just rent a decent apartment. You'd have bad credit from the bankruptcy...but no debt at all. And, if the lawyer doesn't have a great claim to the condo...you may end up with almost all of the value of the condo in your pocket (minus the HOA fees).

I'm a bit hesitant on your current plan of some small loan that can fix some minor issues. Sure, getting caught up with the HOA and credit cards is a good start...but you have relatively little income coming in...and all it would take is a couple bad months where the car breaks down or you have to get a root canal...and suddenly you're back in the hole...except the hole would now involve another creditor. The plan hinges on some magic credit score that gets you qualified for a mortgage...that can get you out of debt. What happens if the credit score doesn't jump up or the mortgage company decides you need a higher score?

As bad as your situation is...I'd prefer it to mine. I have ZERO income...no social security eligibility...no retirement...and my only "debt" is with the IRS. So, for me, bankruptcy is completely off the table and I have no condo that I can mortgage or sell. The good news is I think 2/3 of the IRS debt can be negotiated away. And...my credit is strong and I have a significant credit line to work with...but I'd prefer not to add on any debt now that I'm (until the tax issue) essentially debt free.


Thank you... That was full of information...Now...

As far as selling the condo and renting...NO. Rent's here are at least 900. a month. When I am caught up here, I pay 250. a month fees and that's it. Of course utilities also elec and cable only. As far as luxury assets I now remember I told the lawyer at the time that I also own a 93 z/28 Camaro but that is an old car that me and my son were working on. He said the courts would want to see it anyway. Well I can't let them see it, the video will explain that. I have given the car to my son and grandson he has not titled it in his name yet and the courts want to see any assets you have given away in the past year, I guess so you can't hide stuff., I know it's just a car but I have my blood sweat and tears and $$$ in it over 15 years I own it. That car will never leave the family. That was a promise I made.

This will explain it's not just a 25 year old camaro

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/louvit/media/Z28/1214dh8.mp4.html?sort=3&o=46

http://smg.photobucket.com/user/louvit/media/Z28/home004.mp4.html?sort=3&o=42

[classygranny]

Personally, I don't think bankruptcy is the best option for you. You seem to have learned from some of your past mistakes and as long as you don't keep making those and digging the hole deeper, you should be able to find away around this situation.

So, if I understand correctly, you want to pay off $1500 in credit cards and collection debt; $1800 in past due HOA fees, and then as soon as the credit score goes up, you want to borrow against the equity in the condo, to pay the $35K to the attorney loan. In the meantime, you feel you can meet your monthly obligations and pay $350 towards a short term loan. Do you have anything??? that could be used as collateral for a short term loan? A current vehicle-not the Camaro? Anything?

Did I get all this correct?

[LOUVIT]

Personally, I don't think bankruptcy is the best option for you. You seem to have learned from some of your past mistakes and as long as you don't keep making those and digging the hole deeper, you should be able to find away around this situation.

So, if I understand correctly, you want to pay off $1500 in credit cards and collection debt; $1800 in past due HOA fees, and then as soon as the credit score goes up, you want to borrow against the equity in the condo, to pay the $35K to the attorney loan. In the meantime, you feel you can meet your monthly obligations and pay $350 towards a short term loan. Do you have anything??? that could be used as collateral for a short term loan? A current vehicle-not the Camaro? Anything?

Did I get all this correct?

you are correct. No I have nothing of value. As I may have said I was approved for up to a 70% equity loan until they see the association is not FHA approved. And I need my credit score maybe 40 points higher to get a conventional loan. If I could get a 3000. short term loan it would be short term because as soon as my credit cards are zero and my collection is off my record I will have the 40 points. Then I could go to lending tree or somewhere and get a quick equity loan and pay off EVERYONE. I would like to do a reverse mtg and owe nothing. My kids are doing well and they don't need this place when I go even though they would still get cash out of it.

You're classy and smart....:rolleyes: