Plugged Balls

[drlawsoniii]

Am I the only one that having to plug a ball even if it's done for free is irritating? I dont like throwing plugged equipment at all let alone new stuff that has had to be plugged.

[bowl1820]

Am I the only one that having to plug a ball even if it's done for free is irritating? I dont like throwing plugged equipment at all let alone new stuff that has had to be plugged.

It use to bother me years ago, it was like getting a dent in a new car and having to have it fixed. You just don't look at it the same way after that.

Now if I have it do to make it work or fit better than it did before, I don't care.

If it's to fix something that shouldn't have been broke in the first place, that's a little irritating but I live with it.

[bubba809]

Has there been any proven evidence that plugging a ball and having it redrilled will decrease the ball's performance in any way?

[RobLV1]

Has there been any proven evidence that plugging a ball and having it redrilled will decrease the ball's performance in any way?

Yes. In an article in BTM, the author supplied evidence that plugging does not change a balls performance at all, as long as the original holes did not penetrate the core.

[bowl1820]

as long as the original holes did not penetrate the core.
You might need to go back and reread the article, I have it right here and it doesn't say that.


Has there been any proven evidence that plugging a ball and having it redrilled will decrease the ball's performance in any way?


Yes. In an article in BTM, the author supplied evidence that plugging does not change a balls performance at all,

For those interested the BTM article is called "The Effect of Plugging and Redrilling on Bowling Ball Mass Properties" by Bill Sempsrott

Bill Sempsrott:


While I certainly didn’t do a 100% exhaustive study in this article, I attempted to at least cover a fairly wide spectrum of scenarios. In the real world, ball cores come in a wide variety of shapes, bowler gripping holes come in a wide variety of sizes, and countless layout and balance hole combinations exist.

It is likely possible that someone could dream up some crazy scenario in which the impact of plugging and redrilling is much more significant than in these examples.

That said, the results presented above do point in one clear direction: in most cases, bowlers and pro shop operators really shouldn’t be too concerned with how they may be affecting the mass properties of their bowling balls when they plug and redrill them.



Here's the most extreme example he had (15 plugs):

In this example the changes in values were fairly minor and only resulted in a 1 inch difference in hook compared to the ball with just 3 holes.
https://s5.postimg.org/din1iwps7/plugging_extreme.jpg


The biggest concern a lot have is if the plugs wind up in their track, do to the different material used for the plug affecting the the ball. But even that isn't considered a major concern to worry about.

[RobLV1]

You're right, however logic says that a hole drilled into the core will change the numbers to some degree, however minor. Personally, I'm a great fan of logic.

[Amyers]

You're right, however logic says that a hole drilled into the core will change the numbers to some degree, however minor. Personally, I'm a great fan of logic.

I'm using 2 plugged balls right now. I didn't own either before so I can't say how much it effected performance. Both balls still do their job but I'd prefer not to have the plugs. I think it's more important in larger cored balls and balls with asymmetric cores. If you plug a Rhino I doubt it makes any difference at all not much core to drill into. You plug a Strom Fight you can guarantee your drilling into the core. I don't believe holes drilled into the core and filled can be exactly the same after filling. If they are then we really need to quit paying attention to core design.

[bowl1820]

You're right, however logic says that a hole drilled into the core will change the numbers to some degree, however minor. Personally, I'm a great fan of logic.

Yes, which that was not in question.

Every example he showed had holes going into the core and which changed the numbers to some degree, however minor and that those changes had a negligible impact on ball motion to a point where it was meaningless.


that plugging does not change a balls performance at all, as long as the original holes did not penetrate the core.

But here your just inferring this from the article, While I don't disagree with it.

It can give wrong impression to someone who hasn't read the article.

Example:

Reader:
"Wow I was just going to get my ball plugged for whatever reason, but I just read that plugging does not change a balls performance at all, But only as long as the original holes did not penetrate the core.

I just looked all 3 of my holes went right into the core! That means if I get it plugged it will change the the performance!! I don't want that!!"

Something worded more like this would have been better IMO.

"Yes. In an article in BTM, the author supplied evidence that plugging does not change a balls performance at all, even if the holes penetrated the core."

I can also see someone reading that and going to the proshop to get a ball drilled, going in and telling the PSO to make sure not to drill into the core because they might want to get it plugged later.

While not drilling into the core is not impossible, it's highly unlikely in most cases.

[drlawsoniii]

I'm using 2 plugged balls right now. I didn't own either before so I can't say how much it effected performance. Both balls still do their job but I'd prefer not to have the plugs. I think it's more important in larger cored balls and balls with asymmetric cores. If you plug a Rhino I doubt it makes any difference at all not much core to drill into. You plug a Strom Fight you can guarantee your drilling into the core. I don't believe holes drilled into the core and filled can be exactly the same after filling. If they are then we really need to quit paying attention to core design.

I'm just frustrated, a bowling ball can cost well over $200 and for someone who is supposed to know what they're doing, to not even check my track, pap, or axis tilt before drilling a new ball, especially when I told him the other ball I was replacing with this new one was rolling over the thumb is just irritating. But he said to trust him, and foolishly I did. I know that part is on me. I know it's not feasible for them to replace a ball entirely when they screw up, but that would be the ultimate customer service.

[Amyers]

I'm just frustrated, a bowling ball can cost well over $200 and for someone who is supposed to know what they're doing, to not even check my track, pap, or axis tilt before drilling a new ball, especially when I told him the other ball I was replacing with this new one was rolling over the thumb is just irritating. But he said to trust him, and foolishly I did. I know that part is on me. I know it's not feasible for them to replace a ball entirely when they screw up, but that would be the ultimate customer service.

Well he may fix it like that but I can tell you it would be the last ball he drilled for me.

[bowl1820]

I don't believe holes drilled into the core and filled can be exactly the same after filling. If they are then we really need to quit paying attention to core design.

In Bill's article he used Vise CS Hybrid plug, which he said is about the same density as the coverstock, slightly more than the filler and less than the core material (of course that would depend on just which material was used).

So no it's not exactly the same, But just guessing I'd say the extra density of the plug as compared to the removed filler. Probably helps make up for some of that lost core density (when considered with the plug in the core) its just up higher than where it was in the core if you follow.

Most of the time when someone plugs a ball they are probably changing layouts and I think ultimately that will change the performance more than the minor changes made to the core by the plugs.

And if your just plugging to adjust the grip pitches, span etc. thats even more meaningless, because the holes stay in basically the same spots.

[Amyers]

In Bill's article he used Vise CS Hybrid plug, which he said is about the same density as the coverstock, slightly more than the filler and less than the core material (of course that would depend on just which material was used).

So no it's not exactly the same, But just guessing I'd say the extra density of the plug as compared to the removed filler. Probably helps make up for some of that lost core density (when considered with the plug in the core) its just up higher than where it was in the core if you follow.

Most of the time when someone plugs a ball they are probably changing layouts and I think ultimately that will change the performance more than the minor changes made to the core by the plugs.

And if your just plugging to adjust the grip pitches, span etc. thats even more meaningless, because the holes stay in basically the same spots.

I agree I worry more about it with weight holes or putting the filled holes in the track than anything. If I'm doing it because of my need it's fine. In Dr's case here where the shop made a mistake I'd be pissy about it.

[drlawsoniii]

I agree I worry more about it with weight holes or putting the filled holes in the track than anything. If I'm doing it because of my need it's fine. In Dr's case here where the shop made a mistake I'd be pissy about it.

That there is the issue, the ball has the pin directly over the bridge. I suspect that moving the pin over to the right is going to put those plugs right in my track since I have a high track anyway.

[bowl1820]

That there is the issue, the ball has the pin directly over the bridge. I suspect that moving the pin over to the right is going to put those plugs right in my track since I have a high track anyway.

If your a right hander the track is left of the holes, moving the pin right won't put them in the track because the plugs will follow the pin right.

example:
https://s5.postimg.org/mrp7t0yo7/plug_shift.jpg

[drlawsoniii]

Ok you're right I was thinking the holes moved in the opposite direction as the pin my bad.

[drlawsoniii]

PSO's resolution was to drill a small hole to the right of my thumb. He said it should draw track off my thumb, but it tracked exactly where it had before.

[bowl1820]

Somethings to note:

Lack of axis tilt can cause a ball to track high, You might try adding more wrist cock (not cup) to help lower your track off of the thumb.

Also staying in the thumb too long can cause it to track very close to the thumb.

[drlawsoniii]

What's the difference between cocked and cupped? I feel like I keep mine cupped.

[bowl1820]

What's the difference between cocked and cupped? I feel like I keep mine cupped.

This is wrist cock:
https://s5.postimg.org/vb8lqs70n/Wristcock_vs_tilt.jpg