Can you teach me the proper release?

[greyhound rick]

Hello everyone,

First off, thanks to all for giving me some great input here on BowlingBoards.com. You folks are GREAT!!

Id like to get your thoughts on the release in that i think i need to start from square one and make sure i understand some things that im confused about.

Ive noticed a lot of really good bowlers have what i would call "side roll" when the ball is going down the lane. It looks to me like the ball is rolling forward, but also turning counter clockwise as if it wants to roll to the left. I know im not saying anything that eveyone doesnt already know, but im just trying to share my thought process so i can ask a question properly! :)

OK........now, when i shoot the 10 pin, i throw a straight ball. I take the ball back and release it with my palm open and driving straight up towards the ceiling. My thumb is at 3 oclock and my palm is heading straight up.

The ball rolls fairly straight, the track is about 1" from my thumbhole and i usually have pretty good control.

Now, when i shoot my stike ball everything changes!! My track goes so low that it looks like there is a tiny circle at the bottom of the ball and my ball rolls early, then goes straight and has no hitting power at all. Thats why i shoot 160 and cant get better i guess!!

Logic would tell me that the proper release is somewhere in between my straight ball and my spinner but much closer to the straight ball. Does this seem correct?

I feel like with my stirke ball that i am only turning my hand slightly but i must not be as to get such a horribly low track. (Its really amazing how low it is. Honestly, it looks like a little circle at the bottom of the ball!:eek:).

So, im guessing that the proper way to get out of this mess is to try this:

Go to the lane and try throwing what i call my "straight ball" into the pocket. Once i can do that, then i should try to turn my fingers ever so slightly in order to get just a touch of side spin but not too much. Just a tad. To do this i will take the ball straight back with my hand underneath it, keep it underneath until the very last second when i get my thumb out and turn my fingers just a tiny bit.

Does this sound correct?

If i do this and my track goes WAY down again am i just turning it too much? Maybe my problem is that i dont realize how little you have to turn the ball with your fingers? Is it just a very slight amount that you can hardly feel and notice?

One more question. I have experimented with placing my hand on the ball and holding it in the same position as i would like it at the release. Whether that be a full suitcase position or what i call "semi-suticase" in which my hand is at a 45 degree angle half way between a full suitcase and my hand being totally underneath.

When i do this i try not to rotate anything at all and just swing the ball back and through. This seems to work ok, but im not sure if this is a good way to get the revolutions i would like to get.

Anyway, im sorry to ramble on so much but i wanted to expain my situation and wanted you all to know how much i appreciate your input and help. Id like to be a 180-200 bowler but im stuck at 160 with an ugly strike ball. I can throw a nice looking straight ball at the 10 pin but thats about it!

My best to all and thank you for allowing me to be here with you!

take care and hope to hear from you soon,

rick

[Strike Domination]

So, your track is literally on the opposite side of the ball from the fingers/thumb? In general I think a low track comes from turning the wrist early and/or not having a strong enough wrist position. If your track is as low as it sounds, you might be turning early and you might have you thumb on top of the ball at the same time you're releasing. This is just speculation.

That said, you shouldn't really think about turning your fingers. Having the fingers behind and under the ball should at least provide moderate axis rotation(what you call "side turn") on its own. The fingers under the ball means the fingers are under an imaginery line horizontally through the center of the ball(from straight behind). I think the way you create more side rotation is to position your hand so that the fingers are more on the left side of the ball going into the release(for a right hander, this is called working the inside of the ball). I think about pointing with the index finger or putting the ball's weight on the pad of the index finger. The rotation of the fingers around the ball should happen naturally, more or less.

JAnderson from this site likes to have people think of a thumb position(I believe) going into the release and during the follow through. For example, from behind the bowler, the thumb pointing at 12 oclock going into the release and the thumb pointing at 10 oclock in the follow through would provide some side rotation. Thumb pointing at 9 oclock in follow through would be more side rotation. I believe that's how it works. Personally I'm not good at that, I prefer to let the hand do what it wants to do, or I lean more towards staying behind the ball. I'm never rotating all the way to 3 with my fingers, most likely the furthest I would go is about 4/5. The starting position basically dicatates the side rotation for me.

Hope this gives you some helpful information.

[Iceman]

I totally agree above - the low track is early release or thumb pointing too much - I being a stroker let my fingers (or try) to get the fwd roll my thumb comes out a little earlier than normal, which gives me my inconsistent release points - (working so hard on this now) - but more than not - speed and follow through get through it.

My tracks are high 1-2" from fingers and just slightly left of thumb (right handed) - a great practice tip:

Releasing - find a 10 - 15 ft hallway or space in house, carpet or paneling (if hardwood floors) and a bunch of pillows. Roll the ball from 1 knee to the pillows on the carpet or paneling board (only to keep floor safe) into the pillows. I've been doing this for last 2 weeks 30 mins a day to only work on release point and rolling the ball to stay behind it. I've noticed the difference but the thing to have to realize here - when bowling, since your down on 1 knee, you have to get down on the shot to properly release what you've been practicing. I've seen some ppl do 1 step with this practice - which to me seems more appropriate but with the configuration of my house and basement, I have limited space so I build a 2x10 lane wall with 18ft of space on paneling board into 3 ft of pillows my wife sewed together. I've done the 1 step a few times - but at night when I practice, I have to keep noise down, so I do it on 1 knee. It's helping....

[greyhound rick]

Thanks Strike Domination and Iceman. I really appreciate your input!

One other thing i wanted to ask.......

Ive noticed that it seems as if my wirst is collapsing during my release in that just before my release if you were to look down from above my hand and the ball, it appears as though my wrist has bent backwards and my hand is on top of the ball, the thumb is leading and my fingers are lagging behind.

I would think that from this position that a spinner is almost inevidable as when the hand moves counter clockwise a spinning action will be imparted on the ball.

Would changing this position to leading with my fingers, a firmer wrist and keeping my hand under the ball with my thumb behind my fingers put me in a position to where i could place sideroll on the ball vs. spinning it?

I think this might be a major cause of my problem and believe that if i practice keeping my wrist firm, maybe even cupped a bit and palm up that my chances of getting a good release with a higher track would go way up.

Please let me know what you think.

thanks again,

rick

[Strike Domination]

Yes, I do that that would do the trick, or at least be a major jump in the right direction. If you think about it, with your hand on top of the ball, where will your fingers go once the thumb comes out? They will just fall straight out and apply little revs on the ball, but it should mostly be end over end. If the fingers are under the ball, they have the ability to drive through and slightly around the ball without you having to turn your hand on your own.

[Iceman]

Thanks Strike Domination and Iceman. I really appreciate your input!


Would changing this position to leading with my fingers, a firmer wrist and keeping my hand under the ball with my thumb behind my fingers put me in a position to where i could place sideroll on the ball vs. spinning it?

rick


Point made here - changing position. In most cases starting position is where most would start to find the release point. I got as far as hand to right of ball (thumb at 9:00 position) until I found where i was coming (top/side) of ball (at bottom of arm swing :when I started forcing my upswing) I worked on that for a few games, then moved thumb to 12 - and started doing it again, so I split difference and I always start at 10 - I still have nights where I get around the shots, but that is speed and/or timing issues. Later is greater in my case - and early is a flat hit. You would get tired of seeing 8-10 leaves when you hit the pocket - it was my sign.

[greyhound rick]

thanks again for the input!

Well, i rolled about 10 games last night and scored ok, but wasnt really interested in my score as much as i was trying to get more roll and less spin.

I tried several things and found that the best roll and ball reaction that i was getting was when i started with the ball set at the "45 degree" angle position (thumb at 4 oclock and fingers at 10 and 11 oclock) and trying to keep my hand in that position thoughout the shot.

I felt like my control was good, but noticed that my track was lower than it "should" be, about 4 inches below my thumb hole.

QUESTION: Is this too low of a track in order to become a decent player?

Would really like to know if you think its possible to get good results with a track that low and if you or anyone youve ever bowled with has used a track that low and still became a good player.

thanks to all!!

my best,

rick

[Iceman]

I've always been told and believe that the track placement either low or high depends on the drilling. I don't totally understand the top weight/side weight ratio but I do know they work together based on the track. I guess to maximize the weight and core of the ball, the track should be relative.

I keep my track high as my driller knows the way I roll the ball, 95% of the time put the pin over ring finger - sometimes closer to it and others farther up. I did try pin beneath ring finger for early roll, but I didn't like the look it gave me and with my improper releases at the time (gave me no room to miss and ball rolled out too much).

Saturday morning, I ran to Home Depot and purchased foam sheets, 2x6's and panel board. I setup a 22 ft long by 3ft wide "practice alley" in my basement to practice the release. The foam makes it nice to see where I lay the ball at and my target (which I drew 2 arrows 15ft - 17ft from start) to give me a proper length target. I'm doing this 30 minutes a day. Last 2 days, I can tell a difference in when the ball bounces on the foam or rolls on the foam. I can already see a groove in the foam when I roll and stay behind it. When I don't, I even put a raised foam piece at the foul line to make me get it "out" on the lane (kind of like the towel on the lane practice) When I drop the ball or come out of the side to early, I jam my fingers or ball bounces out of the practice lane. I realized once was enough as this hurt me and I hit my server rack at the other end of the room. There's a lot of money in that server rack - so I MAKE myself roll it right.

Tonight is my first night since doing this, so I'll roll for 15 minutes prior to heading to the alley and hopefully see the difference or improvement by judging the amount of "not proper roll/release shots" from last time.

[poflobo]

Saturday morning, I ran to Home Depot and purchased foam sheets, 2x6's and panel board. I setup a 22 ft long by 3ft wide "practice alley" in my basement to practice the release. The foam makes it nice to see where I lay the ball at and my target (which I drew 2 arrows 15ft - 17ft from start) to give me a proper length target. I'm doing this 30 minutes a day. Last 2 days, I can tell a difference in when the ball bounces on the foam or rolls on the foam. I can already see a groove in the foam when I roll and stay behind it. When I don't, I even put a raised foam piece at the foul line to make me get it "out" on the lane (kind of like the towel on the lane practice) When I drop the ball or come out of the side to early, I jam my fingers or ball bounces out of the practice lane. I realized once was enough as this hurt me and I hit my server rack at the other end of the room. There's a lot of money in that server rack - so I MAKE myself roll it right.


Hey Iceman. You have any pics of that setup? I'd really like to see your design and exactly how it works. Sounds very interesting!

[greyhound rick]

Just a quick follow up to my previous post....

Last night i bowled 8 games and averaged 189 which for me is pretty good. Four games were over 200 and those are the first 200 games ive had since coming back from a multi year layoff.

I found that keeping the armswing loose helped a lot and also with regard to my release, i just started with the 45 degree position (axis tilt) and tried to keep my hand there the whole swing.

My Track was 4" from my thumbhole but the ball reaction seemed good. I was getting the ball down the lane with pretty decent snap on the backend.

Can i be successful with a Track that low? Would love to hear your thoughts on that.

thanks again,

rick

[Strike Domination]

Success is a relevant term. If you want to bowl on house shots mostly and average 200+, I bet you could probably do that with a track 4" from the fingers/thumb. However, I would go for a track no further than 2-3" away for an ideal ball reaction. I believe my initial track is around 2" away, my PAP is 4 5/8" over and 3/8" up so I don't spin the ball but I don't have a huge amount of roll either. If the track was 3" away I bet you could do well enough given the right equipment and adjustments.

To raise your track more, make sure you stay behind the ball longer. You pretty much don't want to turn your hand on purpose, that's how a really low track starts. Either that or your thumb gets stuck. Also if you are lofting the ball a bit that could mean you're holding on too long which can also cause a low track.

[greyhound rick]

Success is a relevant term. If you want to bowl on house shots mostly and average 200+, I bet you could probably do that with a track 4" from the fingers/thumb. However, I would go for a track no further than 2-3" away for an ideal ball reaction. I believe my initial track is around 2" away, my PAP is 4 5/8" over and 3/8" up so I don't spin the ball but I don't have a huge amount of roll either. If the track was 3" away I bet you could do well enough given the right equipment and adjustments.

To raise your track more, make sure you stay behind the ball longer. You pretty much don't want to turn your hand on purpose, that's how a really low track starts. Either that or your thumb gets stuck. Also if you are lofting the ball a bit that could mean you're holding on too long which can also cause a low track.

Thanks for the input!!

Yes, im definitely "helping" the ball by turning my hand and will practice keeping my hand more in its initial position tonight when we practice. Will ley you know how that works. Thanks again for the help!!:)