Why didn't he adjust?

[mattro]

I'm sorry if this is in the wrong location, but I'm new and haven't figured it out yet.

I was watching the Dick Weber Tourny today and was completely surprised that in the third match between Pete Weber and Walter Ray that Pete wasn't able to adjust a few throws into the match.

He kept trying to throw this big sweeping hook and he wasn't able to find the pocket consistently if at all. Mean while Walter Ray was setting them up and knocking them down.

I guess my question is this:

Why didn't he make an adjustment? I know it is easy to get caught up in what you are doing when you are competing and not see the obvious, but these guys are professionals. Is it that hard to make an adjustment, or does he just not have the shot that the situation called for?

Again I'm no pro bowler but when the guy is throwing a pretty straight ball and killing you when you are throwing a hook why not try and do what the guy that's beating you is doing?

[Graaille]

He was trying to make an adjustment with everything except the obvious - the ball. There is a lot that could be said - and probably will be said, but PDW just isn't one to change the type of ball at all. He may change to an identical ball w/a different layout, but it'll still be the same ball - and sometimes that's not gonna get it.

[mike-boogie]

I watched also, and noticed weber trying different spots adjusting his shots, but it wasn't working. How bout that outburst about the camera person?? Love it!! :)

[mattro]

So basically he's stubborn? If that's the case, man is that sad. Can't even make an obvious ball change to win your own late fathers tournament. Seems kinda silly to me.

What do you mean an identical ball with a different lay out? I'm unfamiliar with what are probably very juvenile bowling terms.

[Graaille]

So basically he's stubborn? If that's the case, man is that sad. Can't even make an obvious ball change to win your own late fathers tournament. Seems kinda silly to me.

What do you mean an identical ball with a different lay out? I'm unfamiliar with what are probably very juvenile bowling terms.

Not so much stubborn but a "Storm" staffer all the way. That's one of the differences between Pete and Norm. Both are Storm staffers, both are hall of fame players, but the last several years when it came to TV shows, Pete's only throwing the next "up and coming" piece from Storm - whereas Norm is willing to pull out a ball that's 1-5 years old because it's the right ball for the lanes at that time. Norm plays for the win, Pete's showcasing the ball - saying that he can make any ball perform.

I don't know Pete personally (or Norm for that matter), so I can't say if Pete actually keeps equipment for any length of time or not - it'd be interesting to know if he does. But I do think (Warning: personal opinion about to be written) if he's ever going to win again - and especially get the monkey off his back concerning WRW - he's got to be willing to go back to what works, be it equipment, mindset, focus, whatever.

And to answer your question, same ball - different layouts. All that basically says is where the Pin and the Mass Bias/CG is in relation to the grip. So Pete may have had 3 Invasions - but on one the pin was above the ring finger and the CG was at 45 degrees right, another had the pin above the index finger and the CG was in the center of his grip, the third being pin 2 inches right and above the ring finger with the cg being stacked beneath it. (Not saying that's what he had, but just giving examples)

[mattro]

And to answer your question, same ball - different layouts. All that basically says is where the Pin and the Mass Bias/CG is in relation to the grip. So Pete may have had 3 Invasions - but on one the pin was above the ring finger and the CG was at 45 degrees right, another had the pin above the index finger and the CG was in the center of his grip, the third being pin 2 inches right and above the ring finger with the cg being stacked beneath it. (Not saying that's what he had, but just giving examples)[/QUOTE]

Wow WTF was all that french you were just speaking? That is totally confusing if I may say so. I guess I don't understand the inner workings of bowling balls. I throw a 30+ yr old ball, maybe it's time to upgrade. :eek:

[Graaille]

Nope not French, perhaps Hebrew or Egyptian, all depends on how flexable the fingers are.

In english: Modern balls (aka last 10 years or so), have different shaped centers in them, and the pin marking on the surface of the ball shows where the top of that center (what we term as the Core) is. Now, where that pin is in relation to where you have the 3 holes drilled can have an effect on the reaction the ball gives.

That's the quick simplified English version.

[mattro]

Nope not French, perhaps Hebrew or Egyptian, all depends on how flexable the fingers are.

In english: Modern balls (aka last 10 years or so), have different shaped centers in them, and the pin marking on the surface of the ball shows where the top of that center (what we term as the Core) is. Now, where that pin is in relation to where you have the 3 holes drilled can have an effect on the reaction the ball gives.

That's the quick simplified English version.

Makes more sense but still a lil foggy, is understandable though. The different shape of the core will make the ball wobble differently than a spherical core, and the location of the finger holes will dictate the axis on which the ball spins. Sorta in the right ball park with that?

[JAnderson]

Well, something to understand is that in a one game match, you only have so many chances to adjust. When you're having problem with only one of the lanes - and it looked like Pete was struggling with the right lane mainly - you have only half a game. That's 4 or 5 chances to adjust.

If the first adjustment is wrong and the second adjustment is wrong, the bowler can sometimes "get behind" the adjustment curve and essentially is still adjusting to the pattern as it existing before the current round of adjustments started. The lanes (especially under 750 watt Fresnels) can change in that time which means that now the bowler is attempting to make adjustments from bad assumptions.

Toss one badly executed shot into the mix - any top level bowler is not going to adjust off a poorly executed shot - and the bowler is even further behind and more likely to make the wrong adjustment.

[JAnderson]

Sorry for the obscure Fresnel reference. Technical theatre background, don't ya know? ;)

Fresnel Example (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/195831-REG/Altman_65Q_65Q_Fresnel_Light.html)

There are more powerful/hotter ones, but they use a large number of these on a PBA set. Fresnels are so hot that you can't install the bulb with your bare hand or the bulb will break when it is turned on and heats up.

[Graaille]

Makes more sense but still a lil foggy, is understandable though. The different shape of the core will make the ball wobble differently than a spherical core, and the location of the finger holes will dictate the axis on which the ball spins. Sorta in the right ball park with that?

Close enough for government work. There have been the equivalent of several books written in posts that debate the core vs. pin placement in relation to the grip. It seriously interests some people, others wonder what the big deal is.