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briar_fan
02-07-2012, 02:58 PM
First a story, then a few questions.

The other night, I was talking to one of the younger guys at the bowling alley and we were talking about a spare shot that I had seen. He asked me what pins were left and I said "I don't know pin numbers without looking, but it was three on this side and two on this side." He looked at me with a smirk and said; "Ray, you mean to tell me you have been bowling for 21 years and you don't know pin numbers? That is just wrong! How do you do something for so long and not know the game?" I didn't know how to react. Then he went and got another guy and was basically making fun of me for not knowing pin numbers or whatever the hell PAP is or what certain pin leaves are called. I shrugged it off, but then got to thinking if it was wrong or not. The only good thing about this kid is I wipe the oil off the lanes with him 9 out of 10 times in match play, but does he have a point?

Is it wrong for me not to know this stuff? I mean I am a bowler just like everyone else here. I may not average deuce or above, its only 187-195 for me, but do I need to know all of the lingo?

Thanks in advance for any responses!

Ray

10-in-the-pit
02-07-2012, 03:27 PM
I don't think it matters. It's a little unusual to not at least know the pin numbers but in the end, it's all about the score.

briar_fan
02-07-2012, 03:34 PM
I just have never took time to really look at it...I mean I know what a 1, 5, 7, & 10 are...I just dont know what the position of the other pins are....

chrono00
02-07-2012, 03:38 PM
I know the positions, although sometimes I have to stop and think where certain numbered pins go for a second.

and if 1 or 2 pins stand up, I can't always tell which ones they are left. like if its a 4 or an 8 or whatever. It's a little easier now that i've got glasses again, but before that I was really tough

10-in-the-pit
02-07-2012, 03:42 PM
Aah, it's more wrong for that punk for trying to make you feel bad. What kind of loser does that?

briar_fan
02-07-2012, 03:47 PM
Well I have a great story that he tried to pull off, but I will leave it be for the fact I dont want to insult the real members of certain a sponsored staff

DaveAyotte
02-07-2012, 04:06 PM
It's just left to right/ front to back. Think about it that way, I guess... don't know if this is going to work...

7 - 8 - 9 - 10
4 - 5 - 6
2 - 3
1

DaveAyotte
02-07-2012, 04:06 PM
It looked prettier, but it didn't take my spaces. oh well.

RotoGrip_Jt
02-07-2012, 05:06 PM
Dosen't really matter, some people are alot more into the game then others which is no big deal, as long as you have fun bowling then it shouldn't matter =D

Jiffy Pop
02-07-2012, 05:41 PM
I think the only time it is really necessary is when you need to be able to tell a blind person which pins are left standing. 30 years ago when I bowled in a league for the Blind, each team had to have one sighted bowler. I knew the pin numbers without even thing about them. I did not bowl for about 25 years and now I have to really think hard about it, but you only really need to know the numbers when you need to tell the desk to re-set them for a spare.

J Anderson
02-09-2012, 08:51 AM
It certainly isn't wrong to not know the pin numbers. I've been bowling since 1975 and still have to think about what the pin number is when I need a pin reset. It does make it much easier to talk to other bowlers, whether you're bragging about converting the 6-7 split or griping about having a good game going and then leaving the 4-6 in the tenth.
Do I think pin numbers during the game? Heck no! I'm really thinking," I left the pin to the right of the head pin and the one behind it, I need to to stand on this board and target the third arrow.

gergy22
02-09-2012, 10:48 AM
The guy making fun of you was wrong. If you don't know the meaning of PAP, that doesn't necessarily matter but would be good to have a ball driller that knows it and takes time to apply that to any new equipment you were to buy. Not knowing the pins, probably doesn't matter at all. That said, if improvement is the goal, knowledge is going to be a great thing to gain. I bowled with a lady in a tournament the other day and I was telling her to make moves and her lack of knowledge prevented her from doing so properly. Long story short, more knowledge about most aspects of the game is necessary for improvement. Knowing pin numbers is not one of the necessary pieces of knowledge to have though. Good luck and good bowling.

gergy22
02-09-2012, 11:06 AM
That guy was wrong for making fun of you. Learning the game will help you improve in certain areas of your bowling but learning pins isn't necessarily one of them. Learning about equipment may help you find bowling balls that match your game better. Learning lane play will help your scoring, but know what spare your shooting at doesn't help you pick it up. forget him, keep practicing and good luck

briar_fan
02-14-2012, 08:32 PM
The diagram helped a lot. I will say that I do know what I have to do to pick up spares or to make a ball carry through sometimes. I have started asking one of my friends about the lingo they use when they talk and he is gracious and patient enough to explain (i.e. Greek Church...LMAO). He was talking to me the other night and mentioned that, and started laughing at the blank stare :confused: I gave him. Anywho, thanks for all the help and responses to my question.

littlelegs
02-15-2012, 09:12 AM
And for a quick reply to the PAP without going too technical.

PAP = Positive Axis Point. It's basically where the center of the ball is when it rotates from your release. That enables the driller to position your finger holes correctly in relation to the weight block in the middle of the ball. Think of a spinning top - the PAP is the middle of the disc i.e. center of the spin. It's the same with a ball.

Hmmm...reading that back that's either going to make perfect sense or really confuse. Oh well.

bowl1820
02-15-2012, 09:49 AM
For some info on the PAP take a look at Talkbowlings video
What is and how do you find the Positive Axis Point (PAP)?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KsYDqvSLplY

J Anderson
02-15-2012, 10:37 AM
A lot of the lingo is regional. Here in CT a ball hitting the wrong pocket is called a 'Brooklyn'. A friend who grew up in PA calls it 'going Jersey'. And it changes as well. The 'big four' split, ( e.i. the 4-6-7-10 ) used to be called 'double pinocle'.

DaveAyotte
02-15-2012, 10:50 AM
I thought "going jersey" was when it was a lefty hitting the wrong pocket... that's what I heard anyway. I've been working on getting a 6-bagger called a turducken though. (Think about it, Turkey in a Turkey -it makes sense.) I was even on ESPN with a poster for it, HA!

J Anderson
02-15-2012, 11:27 AM
Shouldn't that be for 9 in a row, a turkey of turkeys?

bowl1820
02-15-2012, 11:34 AM
I thought "going jersey" was when it was a lefty hitting the wrong pocket... that's what I heard anyway. I've been working on getting a 6-bagger called a turducken though. (Think about it, Turkey in a Turkey -it makes sense.) I was even on ESPN with a poster for it, HA!

Lets see
1 strike is a Strike
2 strike a Double
3 strikes is a Turkey (Which I believe came from houses (Back when), where if you got three strikes in a row. They gave you a Turkey.)
4 strikes use to be just a Four bagger, But Hambone is coming to a dubious popularity. (Hambone is a term made up at the start of the 2007-2008 Pro Bowlers Association (USA) season on ESPN by new announcer Rob Stone.)
5 strikes is a Five Bagger
6 strikes is a Six Pack.
7 and up don't really names other than local names.


In regards to the OP's question.
I think other than a casual, open bowler (maybe even then). You should at least know how the pins are numbered. If your in a league, you should at least know the pin numbers, that the arrows are on every fifth board and what board the dots on the approach are on.

So you'll know what you left, what you aimed at on the lane and where you stood on the approach.
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_XGVfvZuCPaY/SeN4tPjf5oI/AAAAAAAAGwc/iOQvEAb3TCA/Bowling%20Arrows.png

DaveAyotte
02-15-2012, 01:07 PM
7-Bagger - Shark Week?
8-Bagger - Octomom?

come on - there has to be some amazing ideas out there.

littlelegs
02-15-2012, 01:25 PM
7-Bagger = a Snow White?

bowl1820
02-15-2012, 01:35 PM
If you want you can use dice lingo.
7 is Big Red
8 is Eighter from decatur
9 is Nina from Pasadena

chrono00
02-15-2012, 03:49 PM
A lot of the lingo is regional. Here in CT a ball hitting the wrong pocket is called a 'Brooklyn'. A friend who grew up in PA calls it 'going Jersey'. And it changes as well. The 'big four' split, ( e.i. the 4-6-7-10 ) used to be called 'double pinocle'.

I think the nationally accepted term is brooklyn.

but being from philly, yea it's jersey. they'res always a joke about having to pay the bridge toll and stupid things like that lol

chrono00
02-15-2012, 03:51 PM
Lets see
1 strike is a Strike
2 strike a Double
3 strikes is a Turkey (Which I believe came from houses (Back when), where if you got three strikes in a row. They gave you a Turkey.)
4 strikes use to be just a Four bagger, But Hambone is coming to a dubious popularity. (Hambone is a term made up at the start of the 2007-2008 Pro Bowlers Association (USA) season on ESPN by new announcer Rob Stone.)
5 strikes is a Five Bagger
6 strikes is a Six Pack.
7 and up don't really names other than local names.




Ours or the same for the 1-4 but

5-yahtzee
6-I honestly don't remember
7- jiggly puff ( i have no idea, we just do)
8- Davey jones.

J Anderson
02-16-2012, 07:59 AM
Hey Chrono00,
Does your 'yahtzee' predate Rob Stone's?

chrono00
02-16-2012, 11:19 AM
Hey Chrono00,
Does your 'yahtzee' predate Rob Stone's?

I couldn't tell you. a handful of my friends are pretty good bowlers and have been for years. I just kinda randomly got suckered into a summer league about 2 years ago as an excuse to drink.

the hole staying under/behind the ball thing only just clicked in like november. I was basically struggling to hold an average in the 120's before, and now I throw somewhere around 500 pretty much every week

striker12
02-16-2012, 01:21 PM
chrono00 that thats pretty good that u are getting 500's im barly getting them soemtimes im below but its all about having fun and stuff like that...


theres alot of names for what ever pins u leave up like the big 4 (4-6-7-10) i know some people that call this the devil and then there is the 7-10 some people call that field goal posts

there lots of name for splits and strikes just hard to remember them all soo i jsut call them by there numbers it dose take time to figure out which ones they are i have to think for a couple seconds too a minute

briar_fan
02-17-2012, 11:45 AM
One of my teams uses these names:

3- Turkey
4- Driving the Truck (only because the house shows a 4 wheel drive truck smashing pins)
5- Yahtzee (not sure of Rob Stone's Date of use but we started it about 2005)
6- Magic Bananas (I saw the water filter commercial last year where it says that, and we didn't have anything)
7- Warhgarbal! (pronounced exactly like it looks. I have no idea why we use it)
8- ????
9- will now be called Turducken!

DaveAyotte
02-17-2012, 01:15 PM
Yea, but the thing with Turducken, it just needs to be 2 birds... although, magic bananas does have some strange 'appeal' to it. </corny>

(I like how this thread went from talking about pin placement, to naming strings of strikes - sorry Ray.)

edit: so onto the 10-bagger:
dime-piece? (perfect 10)
strike-strike? (X is the Roman Numeral for 10)
Hamilton? (On the 10 dollar bill)
Rorschach? (ink blot dude - developed 10 official patterns)

striker12
02-17-2012, 01:52 PM
dave those are come good one and briar thos eones are weird but they work i like the 4 strike drive the truck but i also think that should be the like the 5th or 6th one it would be much better cause your farther in and stuff like that but my buddy call the 10 frame strikes,

10-the bomb
11-back up
12-killer turkey

J Anderson
02-17-2012, 09:17 PM
Dave,
Isn't a "Turducken" a chicken stuffed in a duck stuffed inside a turkey?

chrono00
02-18-2012, 01:45 AM
dave those are come good one and briar thos eones are weird but they work i like the 4 strike drive the truck but i also think that should be the like the 5th or 6th one it would be much better cause your farther in and stuff like that but my buddy call the 10 frame strikes,

10-the bomb
11-back up
12-killer turkey

rather than killer turkey, I was thinking 12 could be a dolphin. undefeated does make sense....

striker12
02-18-2012, 09:22 AM
yeah he could not think of one for the 12th stirke soo he sat in one spot thinking of it for over 30min not bowling it was funny then he came upwith killer turkey, cause a turkeyis 3 strikes and u can get 4 turkeys in 12 strikes soo he called them killer turkeys cause remember sometimes u will end up leaving up 1 pin and getting that 299 or in that area its jsut funny when he dose it when he gets the 12 strikes.

he tarts jumping around yelling i killed the killer turkey then th next game first shot messes up and he says killer turkeys killled me its so funny when he dose it

and srry about above its killer turkeys i forgot the S at the end of turkeys

abelgutierrez
02-18-2012, 11:31 AM
Its great to see how every region has its own terminology for the different leaves and shot. lol

I have been bowling for years and honestly it was until three years ago that I learned the pin numbers after bowling on a team with an avid bowler who was coaching bowlers. I found it helped with explaining my leaves when asking for advice on where I should start on the approach.

kev3inp
02-18-2012, 12:20 PM
There are a lot of NY'ers down here and they call it a jersey, but everybody else says brooklyn. My wife seems to have a hard time identifying front to back pins, so I've taken to calling out her adjustments and what pin or pins it is or there are. ;) I learned the pin numbers better in the place where we bowl, as they were once notorious for screwing up spare settings, and you'd have to tell the desk what you needed set up.

striker12
02-18-2012, 02:04 PM
when i elarned the numbers i learned it on my first year cause i was bad at spares and my buddy showed me them and its helped me get my spares much better since i know the numbers better soo it come sin ahdny to know numbers cause u can see where to throw the ball and how much speed , revs and other stuff to make that spare/split

DaveAyotte
02-22-2012, 09:10 AM
Dave,
Isn't a "Turducken" a chicken stuffed in a duck stuffed inside a turkey?

after careful review... you are correct. Historically, that's what it was. I will hold my head in shame.

billf
03-27-2012, 11:07 AM
Last time I checked they didn't award extra pins for knowing the numbers. Next time you beat him, ask if he knows those numbers and point to the score.

As for bowling blind: I bowled blind from Nov 3, 2010 til Jan 4, 2012. My team mate and tourny doubles partner would hand me my ball and talk me into my starting position. After the first shot he would tell me where and how the ball went then give me the pin numbers to get the spare. It took awhile before I was confident in where a certain pin was and what adjustment I needed.

Funny side story to this. One one strike roll a guy on the lane next to me got loud and nasty saying he was still on the lane when I started my approach. All I said was, "sorry, I didn't see you."
"Then take off the f%$&ing sunglasses a@@hole." came his reply
My team mate spoke up, "Won't do any good. He would STILL BE BLIND."
When we were done I asked what the loud mouth scored. Being told I beat him by 93 pins I leaned over and asked him, "Excuse me but I can't see the score. Did I beat you?"

briar_fan
03-27-2012, 11:44 AM
That was a great way to handle that....I love that story....I will have to pass that story on if you dont mind.....Speaking of the guy who made fun of me....I have worn him out for the last two tourneys....last night I only shot 1,452 for 7 games....he had a 1,319....I just asked him if he knew what the number of the pins were that he left....he just looked at me and said no....and walked out of the house.....he is learning that me being 18 years senior to him puts me in a state of mind that my G.A.F has left so he doesnt say much anymore....:o

Hampe
04-04-2012, 07:37 AM
I don't know if it's "wrong" to not know the pin numbers.....maybe a little strange if you've been playing for a long time and still don't know them, but it's not like knowing them makes you better at bowling (as the guy who was making fun of you found out).

As far as interesting/funny names for leaves, here in Switzerland we call the 2-8, 1-5, or 3-9 (any leave with one pin directly in front of another) a "Schwiegermutter" (Mother-in-law). That always made me chuckle when I first heard it.

billf
04-04-2012, 09:14 AM
Mother-in-law; I absolutely love it! I'm going to start using that around here.