Do you still know how to count marks?

[bowl1820]

or did you ever know?

The old school bowler's will know what this is. it's become a lost art almost now, since the automatic scorers came out. In fact keeping score by hand has just about becoming a lost art also.

For you that don't know.
Back in the day when you kept score by hand, You know plastic overlay's, overhead projectors and pencils.

Counting marks was a way of estimating who was ahead, at anytime during a game. Without having to tally up the score, a simple system of adding up the number of strike and spares.

Here's how it was done.
A spare or strike is one mark; a double is two marks, a turkey is three.

There is also a "take off a mark." where you remove or not add a mark because a bowler scored five or less on a spare or double.

There are some variations to this, but this is the basic way.

There is also "Handicap Marks". Typically it was 1 mark for every 10 pins in the difference of team handicap. Like in your example, your team is getting spotted 34 pins you would get 3 handicap marks.

So say your team is getting spotted 40 pins, you'd get 4 marks for handicap.

Also if there is a absent bowler, they would have marks also, here is "The Absent Bowler's Marks Table"

Average---Marks
184-Over---10
174-183-----9
164-173-----8
154-163-----7
144-153-----6
134-143-----5
124-133-----4
114-123-----3
104-113-----2
94-103------1
under 94----0

[J Anderson]

Haven't thought about counting marks in years. I do have fond memories of keeping score by hand. Some of the scorekeepers would turn the numbers into pictures, like making 111 into a Greek temple. and of course if you or a teammate were into a string of splits or open frame you could draw a wall to try and stop it. All psychological but it usually worked.

[JerseyJim]

I still remember how to do it manually, although if the opposing team allows me to, I'll set up the overhead display to show marks instead of pin difference.

[DaveAyotte]

I actually print out sheets from Apollotemplates.com, and keep all my scores in a binder. It helps keep me focused, and my head in the game.

[The Mayor]

I've never counted marks due to automatic scoring being available where I grew up bowling. However, my uncle would make up fake games on a piece of paper and made me learn how to keep score. It's actually quite a fun thing to do if you're bored!

[Linsolv]

I can keep manual score (and I do, because I like to track my scores on paper--spent about a week working on a custom score sheet that has a few extra details) but this mark-counting system is not something I'm familiar with. Though, I assume that is what the TV fellows are talking about when they say "he must mark to win" or similar? Or is that a case of mis-using a term?

[bowl1820]

I assume that is what the TV fellows are talking about when they say "he must mark to win" or similar? Or is that a case of mis-using a term?

What they are saying there is that the bowler needs to either strike or spare (which are ”marks" and not have a open).

As for counting marks, sometimes when you figure score frame by frame. The score doesnt really tell you who is ahead or behind, because it hasnt factored in the following frames yet.

You could easly have two teams with the same score, say in the fifth frame. But if you count marks, it would show if one team is ahead on "marks". Though that doesnt mean they will win, just they are more likely too.

[Linsolv]

Interesting! I'll have to practice this next time I get out to the lanes, then! Hopefully won't take too much work to get to the point where it's easy and natural.

[Stormed1]

Back in the days of scratch bowling we would go as far as looking at pin count on strikes and spares and mentally subtract a mark or two based on lost pin count

[bowl1820]

Bowled league Tuesday so gave it a try counting marks again. Heres our second game, we won it (in fact we won all, in spite of there only being two of us.)
My team score was hdcp 849 for this game and they had 791.
Heres how the marks went.(The absentee marks were added in at the first frame. 5 each for a total of 10)




frames
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10


us
12
13
15
16
16
18
19
21
24
28


them
2
5
7
10
12
15
18
20
21
22

[striker12]

ohh i get this know this looks like fun to do i will have to give this a shot and see how i do but bowl can u more info on how to do it soo i dont mess nothign up on it and learn this it looks greats and would come in handy

[bowl1820]

ohh i get this know this looks like fun to do i will have to give this a shot and see how i do but bowl can u more info on how to do it soo i dont mess nothign up on it and learn this it looks greats and would come in handy

All the info you need is in the first post.Nothing I can add.

[striker12]

ooh wait i get it know for every strike and spare in perframe counts as 1and if i get 1 frame a strikes that 1 and if i get the 2nd frame a strike then im up to 3 know i get it thats pretty good im defently going to be useing this

[bowl1820]

ooh wait i get it know for every strike and spare in perframe counts as 1and if i get 1 frame a strikes that 1 and if i get the 2nd frame a strike then im up to 3 know i get it thats pretty good im defently going to be useing this

There you go, you got it. It's just a simple way to see who's ahead during a game.

[striker12]

alright thanks i will be defently doing this soo i get get better at it soo for next year i can do it easly

[bowl1820]

alright thanks i will be defently doing this soo i get get better at it soo for next year i can do it easly

Okay just remember that it's not really done anymore, its just part of bowling history.

[striker12]

yeah true but it will be fun to do and it will help see who is in the lead for teams

[bowl1820]

yeah true but it will be fun to do and it will help see who is in the lead for teams

Yep it's something to do, till you get up for the next ball.:rolleyes:

[peterfa]

The only thing I don't see mentioned in this discussion is the addition of marks in the first frame for the difference between the two teams handicap. EX: If your team is receiving 34 pins handicap MORE than the other team, you should add 3 marks to your first frame total.

[striker12]

yeha you should but i think this is for scrach caus eif you have higher handycap then if you are winning then it dose not matter but if you add the handy cap you could also be losing the match cause u could of miss calucalted there handycap or something

[bowl1820]

The only thing I don't see mentioned in this discussion is the addition of marks in the first frame for the difference between the two teams handicap. EX: If your team is receiving 34 pins handicap MORE than the other team, you should add 3 marks to your first frame total.

Your right you can add in marks for handicap. I'll add a update to the OP.

Typically it was 1 mark for every 10 pins in the difference of team handicap. Like in your example, your team is getting spotted 34 pins you would get 3 handicap marks.

Back in the day though I mostly saw "scratch marks" used, even in handicap leagues.

Looking at "handicap marks" today, could look really odd. Because you could easily have teams getting spotted 200-300 pins in handicap. Which would mean they'd get 20-30 "handicap marks". which would have been unheard of back then.