Drill pattern?

[dgz924s]

How do I determine my pattern other than pin up? I am lost when I see others post..#X#X# and would like to know how or do I need my pro to tell me? Here is a picture of mine if it helps. Keep in mind I am not good at geometry/physics so keep it elementary! :)

464465

[bowl1820]

How do I determine my pattern other than pin up? I am lost when I see others post..#X#X# and would like to know how or do I need my pro to tell me? Here is a picture of mine if it helps. Keep in mind I am not good at geometry/physics so keep it elementary! :)

The easy way is to ask your driller.

The first thing you need to know is your P.A.P. (Positive Axis Point), All layouts are based off this point.

The P.A.P. is the axis your ball rotates around, when you first throw the ball. Think of the earth spinning on it's axis, with the north pole the P.A.P. and the South pole the negative P.A.P.

Here's a video link telling how it's found
Talk Bowling #15 – How to Find Your Positive Axis Point (PAP) (http://www.talkbowling.com/talk-bowling-episode-0015/)

When you see a layout like this 45°X5"X30°, that's a layout done by the dual angle method.

Basically what you do is draw a line from the Mass Bias (the mark by your thumbhole in your pic.) to the Pin.

Then make a second line from the pin at a 45° angle to that first line and you then measure 5" from the pin on the second line and place a mark there this is where the P.A.P. is placed.

They then make a third line 30° to the second line, this is the V.A.L. (Vertical Axis Line).

They then use the coordinates of your P.A.P. location, let's say 5 7/8"> X 5/8"^ to measure back to the center of the grip to put in the finger holes.

They measure down the V.A.L. 5/8" from the P.A.P. mark , then on a line 90° from that point they measure over 5 7/8" this is where your grip center is.

You can see how it's done here, lots of pictures.
Click here for Dual Angle Seminar (http://www.morichbowling.com/Education/DualAngleSeminar/DualAngleSeminar.htm)

Also you might see layouts like this, 4" X 5". Which means the P.A.P. is 4" from the Pin and 5" from the CG.

You can see more info here.
Click here Motion Enhancement Guide (Pro Sect User Guide) (www.turbogrips.com/downloads/ProSectUserGuide.pdf)

[dgz924s]

Excellent! It is said "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" and with that info supplied I am going to debunk that old saying! It is probably easier than it looks, kind of intimidating at first.

Many thanks!

[billf]

I asked where my PAP was before and the driller said, "I don't know exactly but if you want to throw a few I can use an armadillo to find it." This was immediately after he drilled the ball. How could he drill it correctly if he didn't know where my PAP was?

[striker12]

billf i had that same thing a few years ago since i went to a different proshop hes marks out on a paper that has a ball on it where everyones pap is that gets a ball and he puts it with are layout soo when he gose to drill a new ball for someone he looks at where the pap is on the ball on the paper but he always wants me to bring up one of my balls cause hes having me try a new throw to try to get my track away from my fingers cause its right beside them.

right know my trakc is away from my fingers abit but not by that much more

[bowl1820]

I asked where my PAP was before and the driller said, "I don't know exactly but if you want to throw a few I can use an armadillo to find it." This was immediately after he drilled the ball. How could he drill it correctly if he didn't know where my PAP was?

Well technically you can't and given if you had a ball you were using before that. There's no reason he couldn't take it from that one before he drilled the new one.

Unless you were throwing a conventional grip and wanted to get your first finger tip grip ball. Throwing a ball with a conventional grip, won't have the same pap you would have with a fingertip ball.

Now there is a "Generic" PAP that was used you can find it in some of the older drill sheets and books. That they said to use for bowler's with unknown PAPs.
Heres from a Track Sheet

Basic Drilling Instructions
The basic layouts are simplified for a bowler with an unknown positive axis point (PAP).
All diagrams are based on a PAP of 5” over and .5” up.

and a old AMF manual had layouts for a unknown PAP. Like this:
For Maximum Hook and Backend Drilling.
Place pin at 12:00 in relation to CG. Place CG on midline 2" from center of grip. Place balance hole 4 1/2" from center of grip on midline.

There are some old school techniques, that don't rely as much on the pap or he could have just eye balled it. That doesn't say it won't work, just it might not be the optimum layout for you.

But your not going to fine tune the reaction of modern balls using them, like you can with the modern ways. Also if you have like a real high track or are prone to flaring over the finger holes. knowing things like the pap can help in setup the layout better to compensate for those things.

Heres a link to another discussion about drilling a ball without a pap. For some other views.
http://www.ballreviews.com/bowling/general/miscellaneous/positive_axis_point/5/16/284695/1/forumreplies.aspx

[dgz924s]

Thought came to mind, if I buy a Vivid or Deviant will the same pattern I have on my Infinite be the same on either of the 2 or must it be different?...I realize it could be different based on what results I want but could it be drilled the same and get a result change?

[billf]

Thank you. That article did answer a question I had. I always wondered if my variety of releases changed my PAP for the same ball.
Example; last night with the Nexxus lay down at 25 across to the 15 at the end of the pattern for two games.. Then moved to the 5 board, over to the 3 for two games. Same ball, different releases, rotation, tilt, revs and speed (obviously).

[DanielMareina]

Your Axis tilt will change between different shots, but not your axis most of the time. Most pro shop guys that have seen you bowl, can guess within an inch or so of where your axis is. We can also base it off the worn in track on the ball, if there is one. The problem is that one inch off of your true PAP makes a big difference in ball reaction. Also, if they base it off the PAP from your last ball, your PAP could have moved. Over the last year and a half my axis moved from 4 1/2" right and 1/2"up to 4 3/8" right and 3/4" up and is now 4 3/8" right and 1"up. All of this makes very small changes to ball reaction, but people like me can notice.