THE " Bill Hall Tri-Grip?

[Mike White]

Thats a lot of questions. Are you a cop? (kidding)

1. I tend to stand left foot 2 boards left of center dot. Obviously, that can vary depending on how the ball is moving...but in "general"...thats by starting point. I "like" to start all the way back...and generate 18-22mph ball speed by using the whole approach...but my coach is currently "curing" me of that bad habit and starting me with my heels on the foul line side of the first row of dots.

2. On dry lanes, I aim around 2nd arrow (board 10). Most of the time...board 10, one board left of it. Maybe one board right...maybe two boards left...but that general area. On synthetics...I have to move my target more towards the 15 board (3rd arrow in from the right) because the ball won't "come back" if I aim at the 2nd arrow...it just skids down and hits the 6 or usually the 3 pin. I "could" try to use the 1-5 boards (1st arrow)...where it's drier...but I get nervous throwing it along the edge of the gutter like that. God bless those who can do that like Del Ballard or Jess Stayrook...but I either get too nervous and "pull" it...or I "miss" and it goes in the gutter.

3. I am a very typical stroker. My swing/release is probably most like Dave Ferraro. My speed has been high lately...but like I said above...trying to dial that back. I think I can settle down into the 16-17mph range. Not sure what my rev rate is. I tend to loft it more...so rather than it sitting down 6 inches to 1.5ft...mine tends to land closer to the arrows.

Don't forget to include the fact that the force you use to pull the ball up in your back swing causes you to have a hop at the peak of your backswing.
If you hop the wrong amount, your forward swing is headed directly towards the gutter.

[Mike White]

Mike, you mentioned earlier that your PAP changed. Is there any guidance given to pro shops on this before they drill a ball? I don't suppose there's a general prediction on how it will change, right? I'm considering having a ball plugged and drilled, but I don't relish the idea of getting a surprise layout due to not knowing the PAP in advance.

I'd say pretty hard to predict.

The angle between the T-Grip centerline, and the Tri-Grip reference line has an offset based on the individual's span, and a hand measurement unique to the tri-grip.

For that reason, I suggest drilling a low end, (even plastic) ball to measure the new pap location.

[Mike White]

How was your ball drilled? where is the pin? above your fingers, below?? What position? The Frantic even with out the tri grip had more kick them my IQ pearl!! They were both drilled pin up off to the side of ring finger!! wow... maybe a balance hole in the wrong position???? take a picture, and post it of your ball!

I don't think Aslan has a consistent enough release yet to have pap.

Besides it's hard to find the PAP when the ball hits the gray board before the arrows.

[Mike White]

Well...threw the try-grip a little bit tonight.

1) The thumb hole...too big!! No sure why...Mike gave me a great measurement. The only thing I can think of is we had to do a little more "smoothing" than usual because my thumb pitch was weird and it went through the plug in partially into the ball...leaving a rough spot. But...easy fix...put a little tape in the hole...better to have it a little big than a little small.

2) LOVED IT. Thumbhole issue aside...the ball came off my hand so, so smoothly!! It felt like I was "dropping" it...but I wasn't. I was actually getting decent roll with it...but it came off the hand very smooth. And it sorta helped me not loft it as much. I think with the tri-grip...it isn't as easy to loft it...but thats okay...because I have more than enough loft.

Biggest test...it'll be my primary and spare ball for this Thursday's league (unless I really, really struggle with it or can't resolve the thumb issue). But...so far so good...definitely a noticeably different feel. If things go well...I might use the ball for the remainder of the Thursday league (6-8 more weeks) and then have Mike re-evaluate my mechanics and hopefully get one of my new balls drilled tri-grip!!

The thumb plug was angled based on a different person. It had forward and left pitch. Your hand needed reverse pitch. I could have drilled the thumb and replugged it giving the effect of a slug, but it would have required you to wait around another hour while the plug hardened.

[Aslan]

Don't forget to include the fact that the force you use to pull the ball up in your back swing causes you to have a hop at the peak of your backswing.
If you hop the wrong amount, your forward swing is headed directly towards the gutter.

I'm getting rid of the "hop". As I said in another post...had some coaching on Monday...I was AMAZED at how much air I got during my approach. And AMAZED at how high my backswing was. It took my coach taping it and showing it to me....I was like, "Whoa...did I actually have BOTH feet off the ground!?" and "Whoa!...I thought my backswing was parallel with my shoulder...not directly above my head!!"

[Aslan]

The thumb plug was angled based on a different person. It had forward and left pitch. Your hand needed reverse pitch. I could have drilled the thumb and replugged it giving the effect of a slug, but it would have required you to wait around another hour while the plug hardened.

It's cool. I'll just add some tape and it'll be fine. I defintitely can't throw it without adding the tape though. I tried on Monday and only threw it maybe 10-12 times...and the thumb joint was in pain and calloused. Had to really, really squeeze that thumb to hold onto the ball. But...hopefully the pro shop will have some bowling ball tape...if not I have electrical tape in my bag "just in case".

I would have bought tape Monday...but my coach is the pro-shop guy and he isn't a big fan of me using more than one ball...not to mention I don't know if he'd be upset that I took my business to another pro shop. I know it doesn't seem this way at ALL on the forum...but I tend to be a conflict AVOIDER as much as possible.

[Aslan]

Well, I got to Thursday league early because I wanted to bowl a couple games to get my "aim" down with the tri-grip drilled Columbia White Dot.

First 2 games; 106-116
Couldn't hit my target. The ball comes out of your hand SO fast...that I'm almost "dropping" it. So I had to buy a couple more games...because I didn't want to be a liability to my team trying this new grip out.

Next 2 games; 98-97

Got even worse...could NOT hit my target. I'd aim for board 11...miss 5 boards right. I'd aim for board 16...miss 4-5 boards right. I got so bad...I started aiming 5 boards left of where I wanted it to go hoping I'd hit my actual target. Again, it just seemed like the ball was falling off my hand too soon.

Did not use the ball during league play...not ready.

After Leagues...kinda "lit" and needed to kill some time while I sobered up...and also still really wanted to figure this issue out. I mean, I like the feel...I do....I really do! But...

1) Seems like it falls off my hand too early. Shouldn't matter. I mean, if you're throwing in a good line at the target...where you release shouldn't matter in terms of strictly hitting the target. Adding tape to the thumb hole helped immensely...but it still doesn't feel right coming off my hand.

2) Still some pain in the thumb. Still need to try to "pinch" the thumb to keep from dropping the ball...so developing a callous on the thumb.

First practice Series: 182-122-145
I started trying to intentionally delay my release. It hurt my thumb...but by delaying and avoiding "dropping" it, I was able to be more consistent hittng my target.

Tried one more series (to make sure it wasn't a fluke): 105-108-116
Well, in all honesty...the last 2 games I was too tired and my thumb hurt too much. I shouldn't have bowled the last 3. I mean, 13 games in a night is a little much.

So...still a lot of work ahead of me. I need to get some more confidence with it and then I'll start using it on Thursday nights for league play. But I can't do that until I'm more confident. I still think I like the grip...but I've probably went from 99% sure I wanted it on my next ball to 71% sure.

[MICHAEL]

Well, I got to Thursday league early because I wanted to bowl a couple games to get my "aim" down with the tri-grip drilled Columbia White Dot.

First 2 games; 106-116
Couldn't hit my target. The ball comes out of your hand SO fast...that I'm almost "dropping" it. So I had to buy a couple more games...because I didn't want to be a liability to my team trying this new grip out.

Next 2 games; 98-97

Got even worse...could NOT hit my target. I'd aim for board 11...miss 5 boards right. I'd aim for board 16...miss 4-5 boards right. I got so bad...I started aiming 5 boards left of where I wanted it to go hoping I'd hit my actual target. Again, it just seemed like the ball was falling off my hand too soon.

Did not use the ball during league play...not ready.

After Leagues...kinda "lit" and needed to kill some time while I sobered up...and also still really wanted to figure this issue out. I mean, I like the feel...I do....I really do! But...

1) Seems like it falls off my hand too early. Shouldn't matter. I mean, if you're throwing in a good line at the target...where you release shouldn't matter in terms of strictly hitting the target. Adding tape to the thumb hole helped immensely...but it still doesn't feel right coming off my hand.

2) Still some pain in the thumb. Still need to try to "pinch" the thumb to keep from dropping the ball...so developing a callous on the thumb.

First practice Series: 182-122-145
I started trying to intentionally delay my release. It hurt my thumb...but by delaying and avoiding "dropping" it, I was able to be more consistent hittng my target.

Tried one more series (to make sure it wasn't a fluke): 105-108-116
Well, in all honesty...the last 2 games I was too tired and my thumb hurt too much. I shouldn't have bowled the last 3. I mean, 13 games in a night is a little much.

So...still a lot of work ahead of me. I need to get some more confidence with it and then I'll start using it on Thursday nights for league play. But I can't do that until I'm more confident. I still think I like the grip...but I've probably went from 99% sure I wanted it on my next ball to 71% sure.

I use to have thumb problems till a guy introduced me to those pre cut tapes that come in various textures!! WORK LIKE A CHAMP!!! I found that by putting the tape ON MY THUMB both sides, it does away with the pain, and the ball comes off the thumb great! get some and lean how to use it, makes all the difference in the world!

I just ordered some things from bowlingball.com, and among them they have their bowling thumb sock on sale for 9.98! I ordered one for me and my wife just to give it a try! Will let everyone know how the sock works out! I know the tape has changed my game 100 percent, and had that 300 with tape on my thumb, along with my recent 725!

[MICHAEL]

Dougb:

I switched to pro shops recently (Pinole Bowlers Supply in CA) and got a WikiFit using the Morich fitting tubes, etc. Immediately my average jumped 15 pins. Last weekend Bill Hall was at the shop doing a clinic and laying out balls using his system. It is a totally different animal. As comfortable as my WikiFit was, in comparison Bill's fit sat right in the palm of my hand. It sure didn't feel like I was holding a 15 lb orb, and I already found the WikiFit pretty effortless.

He used the measurements off my WikiFit chart but after the ball was punched up it looked completely different than my others. The ring finger looked dropped although the length was the same. The thumb appeared offset (and I don't want to get into one of those "there's no such thing as an offset thumb" debates here -- I'm just talking about how it looked). My finger inserts (lifts) were tilted at an angle instead of dorectly down at the thumb hole. Unfortunately I can't post a pic because the machine to a nice gouge out of my brand new ball and it's being repaired.

As for the effect? Well it was a brand new Brunswick Ringer and I got about one game on it, so the jury is out. But the feel was so comfortable I think I will end up switching my other stuff. And being an up the back of the ball guy with a lot of forward roll, he increased my tilt and I was getting a very strong ball motion. Sorry I don't have measurements guys. Instead of the dual angle system he used his own measurements when I told him what I wanted the ball to do (roll early and turn the corner with a hard driving Brunswick arc). He delivered exactly what I wanted.

My driller said these two systems are complementary. I honestly don't know a lot about any of this stuff. I just know the WikiFit felt so much better than what I had before and the Tri-Grip felt even better.

I will post more later -- and hopefully a pic -- when I get the ball back.

j_w73:

I'm somewhat close to Pinole. Does the operator there now do the Tri-grip system as well??

Dougb:

Garrett Richardson in Pinole does it. Only pro shop in California to do it. Tell him you heard it from Doug!

I'm attaching two pics. The Ringer is the one with the Tri-Grip. Note how the inserts are tilted at a different angle than in my other ball, the Brunswick Aura (laid out using the WikiFit). The ring finger also appears to be slightly dropped in the Ringer, but I think Garrett told me my span didn't change.

I probed a little more on the changes but Bill was keeping the whole system pretty close to the vest. I could appreciate that... why give it away for free? But I watched him lay out my ball with a ruler and a pencil. No Pro Sect involved. I was surprised how low he placed the pin but man that ball does exactly what I requested!

Sorry I can't provide more info guys. I know people on this site are really into the science of this stuff.

j_w73:

Thanks for the info. So just looking at it, it looks like he aligned your inserts to be with your CLT maybe??.. It looks like the ring finger would be dropped in relation to the CLT.. Do you track any different as it related to the finger and thumb hole on each ball??

Dougb:

Yes it looks like the inserts might be aligned with my CLT, but you guys would know better than me. He must've changed my pitches, too. So I don't think the picture shows it all. Needless to say, the ball fits me like a glove now. I cannot describe how well it feels.

As for tracking, I get much more tilt and rotation from this ball than anything else. My track has stayed in the same area -- just more flare.

[MICHAEL]

BP'S Pro Shops type in on Facebook just as shown. ( BP'S Pro Shops ) you will see what people in the Kansas city Missouri area are saying about the Tri grip.
Everyone seems to like! A lady here bowled a 300 with the new grip. Lots of comments on the Facebook site. Any questions ask Bruce/James on their site.