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Thread: Aslan's Scores (of the non-lady kind)

  1. #521
    Ringer Hampe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Another disappointing practice.
    I'll say. The most disappointing thing from my point of view is that your still just going to the alley and rolling 15 games for score everytime you practice. How about some single pin spare training? A minimum game? How about forgetting the score and just worrying about doing what your coach told you to work on?

    It's not just about how much you practice......it's about how well you practice. Going to the alley and rolling 15 games for score every time....I wouldn't call it a waste of time (I guess it's better than nothing), but it's certainly not the best use of your practice time.
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  2. #522
    High Roller vdubtx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hampe View Post
    I'll say. The most disappointing thing from my point of view is that your still just going to the alley and rolling 15 games for score everytime you practice. How about some single pin spare training? A minimum game? How about forgetting the score and just worrying about doing what your coach told you to work on?

    It's not just about how much you practice......it's about how well you practice. Going to the alley and rolling 15 games for score every time....I wouldn't call it a waste of time (I guess it's better than nothing), but it's certainly not the best use of your practice time.
    Whole heaping ton of truth to this. Practice with purpose.

    Aslan, you are so analytical, coming up with a practice regimen should not be hard. Spares one day, targeting, footwork, timing, arm swing, lane play......
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  3. #523

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    How about this: each time you go to practice, pick one physical thing that you are going to work on. Work on that one thing until your last game, and THEN bowl that game for score and keep track of your stats. I tried keeping stats for a while last year, but gave it up because I found that my own attention to maintaining or improving the stat, actually impeded my progress on improving the parts of my game that need improving. For example, if I am working on increasing the length of my fourth step, worrying about missing a spare because I was thinking about the length of my fourth step prevents me from trying to increase the length because it causes me to miss too many spares.

  4. #524
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    I think the disconnect is that just because I'm keeping track of the score; doesn't mean I'm not focusing on something or even practicing my spares.

    Given my 30% strike rate, I get in a great deal of spare shooting practice. Trust me…more than I want.

    Also, tracking the score on PinPal also gives me a great deal of statistical information.

    I think if I was at a higher level…like FTLOB, VDUB, or RobM…I might NEED to just focus on spares or something like that…because your game is already dialed in and you strike a lot…so there's not much opportunity to practice spare shooting.

    Usually when I practice, I am focusing on certain things. Last Monday it was the new stuff I learned at my lesson…stance, arm extension toward the target, and the change in my spare shooting targeting. This recent Monday I practiced the same things.

    One statistic that has really been an eye opener is tracking pocket %. I mean, if I'm hitting the pocket at < 60%…the I really, really need to fix that. More than spare shooting…more than strike rate…more than first ball average. If I hit the pocket, I tend to get good carry with my 16lb arsenal. But recently I've been all over the place. And thats a product of the wrist brace/no wrist brace situation and the new techniques.

    Not to be argumentative, and I appreciate the feedback; I just think I'm not at a high enough level where a structured, regimented practice session would get my game to the next level…not with a 20-30% pocket %.

  5. #525
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Tuesday League Night: low oil synthetics

    494 Series: 166-166-162

    Game 1 didn't shoot spares very well. Ended the game with a 4-bagger to salvage the 166. Game 2 I started by throwing the ball in the gutter but then struck to salvage a spare…and it didn't hurt me as much with it being the 1st frame. Only struck once, in the 3rd, but only opened twice including picking up a 2-7-8 split along the way. Game 3 I started off horribly so I was kinda just distracted with whether or not I was going to get the triplicate. Picked up a lot of spares, but had a few open spares.

    Arguably significant/insignificant Stats:
    First Ball Average: 8.12 pins
    Strikes: 26% (1 4-bagger and 5 singles)
    Spares: 62% picked up

    Single Pin spares: 72% (8/11)
    Never left a single 1-pin, 2-pin, 4-pin, nor 6-pin.

    Multiple Pin spares: 53% (7/13)
    Most common multi-pin leave: 1-2-4 (2x)

    Splits: 50% (2/4)

    Pocket Percentage: 29%
    Pocket Carry: 90%
    Double Percentage: 44%

    Average over 3 games: 164.67.
    Average had I picked up 100% of single pin spare leaves: 175.00.

    Didn't live up to my expectations. Like yesterday's practice, the lanes were drier than the last couple months so I really struggled to keep the ball right of the headpin. With my lower rev release, it's a bit unnerving to watch as my ball hooks the lane and hits the 4-pin. It was exciting to almost nail the triplicate and I bowled every game above my league average so that helped ease some of the disappointment. And the numbers were an improvement over last week. Not "great", but I'll take the improvement as at least a moral victory.

    A little rest now and then a LOT of bowling in the end of the month. Sunday league, Monday lesson, Tuesday league, 3 lunchtime practices (Wed-Fri) at the center where my tournament is going to be held, and then 4 squads of tournament bowling the 24th and 25th, then Monday practice, and Tuesday league again. So, 9 days straight. Should be tiring, but also enjoyable.
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  6. #526
    Ringer Hampe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    I think the disconnect is that just because I'm keeping track of the score; doesn't mean I'm not focusing on something or even practicing my spares.
    The fact that you are focusing on the score means you are taking focus and concentration away from what you're working on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Given my 30% strike rate, I get in a great deal of spare shooting practice. Trust me…more than I want.

    Also, tracking the score on PinPal also gives me a great deal of statistical information.
    That's part of the problem. You are practicing just the spares that you leave that day, and not the spares you struggle with. Your app tracks separate pin/leave percentages, no? Try spending a game or two a week JUST shooting at the pin or leaves you have trouble with. Forget the score....shoot both shots at that pin/leave.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    I think if I was at a higher level…like FTLOB, VDUB, or RobM…I might NEED to just focus on spares or something like that…because your game is already dialed in and you strike a lot…so there's not much opportunity to practice spare shooting.

    Usually when I practice, I am focusing on certain things. Last Monday it was the new stuff I learned at my lesson…stance, arm extension toward the target, and the change in my spare shooting targeting. This recent Monday I practiced the same things.

    One statistic that has really been an eye opener is tracking pocket %. I mean, if I'm hitting the pocket at < 60%…the I really, really need to fix that. More than spare shooting…more than strike rate…more than first ball average. If I hit the pocket, I tend to get good carry with my 16lb arsenal. But recently I've been all over the place. And thats a product of the wrist brace/no wrist brace situation and the new techniques.
    If pocket % is an issue then that's what you should be practicing. Try spending a practice session JUST throwing your strike ball. Forget the score! Getting to the pocket requires accuracy and consistency. You don't need a full rack to work on either of those things. Track your ball down the lane and see if you hit both points you're aiming for (did you hit your spot by the arrows? did you hit your break point board?). Try different lines (different aiming spots and breakpoints), not to see if they strike, but to see if you can hit them. If you can hit your two points consistently, you will be able to find the pocket on any pattern with any ball you have.

    You're an analytical guy.....you can even keep a journal or something and keep track of every shot. Which points are you aiming for? Did you hit your aiming spot, yes or no? Did you hit your breakpoint, yes or no? If not, how far left or right did you miss? Stuff like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Not to be argumentative, and I appreciate the feedback; I just think I'm not at a high enough level where a structured, regimented practice session would get my game to the next level…not with a 20-30% pocket %.
    A structured, regimented practice will help any bowler of any level. It will help you improve that pocket %.

    If you are working on your game, really, the worst thing you can do in practice is shoot for score.
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  7. #527
    Bowling Guru Amyers's Avatar
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    How is it that you are only hitting the pocket 29-30% of the time? Is your release truly that inconsistent that you really have no idea where the ball is going? I've wondered about this with you for a while now looking at your stats with the number of washouts and things like that. I won't say I throw a perfect pocket shot every frame of every game or that I never have a washout or pull one and have a Brooklyn it happens occasionally but missing 70% of the time I'm just not sure how that's possible for someone who bowls as much as you do.
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  8. #528
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amyers View Post
    How is it that you are only hitting the pocket 29-30% of the time? Is your release truly that inconsistent that you really have no idea where the ball is going? I've wondered about this with you for a while now looking at your stats with the number of washouts and things like that. I won't say I throw a perfect pocket shot every frame of every game or that I never have a washout or pull one and have a Brooklyn it happens occasionally but missing 70% of the time I'm just not sure how that's possible for someone who bowls as much as you do.
    It depends on "when" you're asking the question.

    Late 2013...I had a "bad loft" release which drastically decreased my ability to:
    A) Hit the target consistently
    B) Keep the ball from hooking too early.

    ..and because it was also a speed dominant type release...when it didn't hook early...because it had some "mustard" on it...it couldn't react with the lane and "find" the pocket...it was traveling too fast.

    During most of 2014, the issue was that I had lost what little rev rate I had and was sort of just throwing a very straight ball. When the lanes were drier (early 2014) I did quite well. I was more consistent, I had worked out many kinks in my approach and timing and release...and the lack of revs didn't hurt me as much. Then they put in synthetic lanes in my home center...and suddenly the ball wouldn't come back to the pocket...unless I "made it" or drastically reduced the speed from 16-17mph down to closer to 11-12mph. "Making it" is almost always a BAD idea. And slowing it down drastically knocks your timing out of whack. So the first 4 months bowling on those lanes...I had a lot of adjusting to do. I had to change targets, I had to reduce my speed, I had a new arsenal to figure out....etc...

    Then in the last couple months of 2014...with my frustration mounting...I turned to regular coaching. Rather than a lesson here or there...and some internet guidance...I decided to just pick a coach and as long as things were going okay...stick with it. Well, thats a great idea...but it means re-inventing a lot of things. Some things I thought I was doing fine...now needed to be changed. In the short 3 months of regular coaching....we've addressed this LIST of things:

    - sweep leg
    - sliding leg knee bend
    - head level during approach
    - initial stance (ball level)
    - thumb fit (in every ball)
    - spare shooting targets
    - arsenal progression
    - lateral movement vs. ball change strategies
    - getting rid of loft
    - adding loft back in the "right way"
    - arm bend during swing/release
    - changing targeting on strike shot
    - wrist brace or no wrist brace?

    Thats > 12 things in 3 months. And there's probably more that I forgot. I'd bet the VAST majority of bowlers on this site haven't changed 12 things in their game in the last 3 YEARS much less 3 MONTHS. Plus...add in a few changes I've chosen to make on my own either due to articles or watching PBA bowling events. It's a LOT of changes. A LOT of trial and error.

    But RECENTLY...like the last two nights where there was that low pocket %...I wasn't missing the SAME way I missed before. It wasn't a ball constantly missing right and leaving the 2-4-8 or the 1-2-4-7 or 1-2-4 or dreaded 1-2-4-10. Lately the misses have been LEFT through the center. My release is better (especially with the brace on)...I'm getting better movement...but now I'm at the mercy of lane conditions much more so than in the past.

    And the final problem/issue...which I mention very tenatively because it's an excuse everyone seems to use...probably over-use...is MOST of my bowling is in one of two houses. One house is a sport shot league. If anyone thinks a 40% pocket percentage is rediculous...try a sport shot league and make a video. There's very, very little room for error. MWhite is an exceptional bowler and there was a game or two Sunday that he was missing the pocket worse than I was. And...the OTHER house...is a low average house. I'm in a league over over 160 bowlers with only ONE bowler > 200 average. < 10 average 190 or more. Compare that to some other houses on league secretary. I think our average for the league as a whole is in the 150s. First they switched from wood to synthetics...which was a monster of a change. Remember...I beat MWhite HANDEDLY on those old wood lanes. Then, just as people got used to the new conditions...they decided in December to stop cleaning/re-oiling before leagues and flood the lanes in the morning and just leave them. That has created a NEW challenge..where plastic house balls smear oil up the right side of the lane leaving virtually no dry area.

    So...before Mudpuppy cliff notes me....the summary is:
    1) Lots of changes to my game in a short amount of time.
    2) More challenging conditions than a bowler who has only been bowling since August 2013 can deal with effectively.
    3) There's a possibility (and it's starting to look more and more like this is the issue) that I'm just a horrible bowler. I lack the GIFT. Marshall Holman and IceManGod agree...if ya aint got that magic...ya aint gonna learn it. I average 165 my first full league...166 my second full league...average a 166 composite now...and this past league night rolled a 166-166-162. Do you see a trend? Me neither. I see a bowler that is a mid-160s ability level despite multiple coaching attempts to change that. And that MAY be it. I may just have to face that reality.

    But here's some 'possibly' interesting numbers to illustrate how the centers have played a part (averages at each center):

    Home center (wood lanes): 168

    Centers SINCE then:

    Red Rock Lanes (LV): 206 <---RobM stomping ground
    Fountain Bowl: 185 <----as seen on TV
    Forest Lanes: 183 <----almost "too" dry...made me finally decide to use a plastic ball for spares
    Arlington Lanes: 181 <---MWhite's home center...dry lanes
    Suncoast Bowling Center (LV): 173 <---AVI Challenge!!!
    AMF Carter Lanes: 171 <---- an epic ****hole. Used to be the toughest lanes in Orange County...but I think they've lossened them up
    Brunswick Classic Lanes: 168
    Home center (synthetic lanes): 166
    LaHabra300: 162 <----home of the Glenn Allison infamous 1st ever (unofficial) 900 game
    AMF Friendly Hills: 161 <----a Bowlmor FAIL!
    Tustin Lanes: 161 <----- where I get my lessons, semi-dry conditions
    Riverside Lanes (Laughlin, NV): 161 <----my ONE (and only) sweeps in Laughlin
    Irvine Lanes: 155 <---- abta tournament...very heavy oil conditions; not my forte
    Brunswick Classic Lanes: 149 (sport shot average..adjusts to 173)
    Temecula Lanes: 138 <----the infamous 1ABHMAVZSCI...where MWhite was defeated on what he claims was a reverse-block pattern.

    So, that means the center I bowl at most regularly (684 games since synthetics)...is about in the middle in terms of average. The next most bowled at would be Brunswick Classic where I've average a combined 159...but most of that is on sport patterns...so it's more like a low 170s...and thats over 139 games. All the other centers range from 2-28 games...< 30. SO...

    Does that indicate that there's something significantly challenging about the home center...where after almost 700 games...a person (me) SHOULD be bowling better? Home field advantage and all??
    OR
    Does it further the premise that I'm a 166 average bowler...my center is the median...the midpoint if you will. Average the 15 centers together....168. Average if I take into account all my games at every center (including wood)...165. Average post wood lanes at every center...165.

    Maybe I should lower my expectations and reduce my goals to simply averaging 160-169...and getting as many triplicate series' as possible?

    And before I forget to answer Rob's last question...I'll be out your way in the elegant and morally superior city of Las Vegas on March 21st!! Mark me on your calender for a lesson on the 20th if there's some free time. If you have TWO open spots...I might have ya give my daughter a lesson as well. I'm thinking I might give up on my delusions of bowling greatness and try to live vicariously through her accomplishments. I'll probably arrive Thursday the 19th...not sure. When it gets closer I'm gonna have to announce that I'm coming on social media...and I'm almost positive my cousin and an old high school friend will want me to visit. The old high school friend is in Cirque so I might get tickets and take the daughter to that one of those days. Or I'll take her to the Hoover Dam or something. I'd like to see the Grand Canyon...but thats kinda a drive if I recall correctly...so we'll see. My parents might also meet us there in their motor home...it's still up in the air.

    Mudpupppy Cliff Notes:
    Aslan sucks at bowling...there's lots of reasons...deal with it.
    Last edited by Aslan; 01-15-2015 at 09:06 PM.
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    Ball Speed: 14.4mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181

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  9. #529
    Bowling Guru Amyers's Avatar
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    Wasn't trying to come down on you just seems hard to figure out and yes I know making changes is rough. I spent a lot of time fixing stuff over the summer and I just changed my push away over to the hinge maybe why I'm doing better but I've thought that before only to regress.

    My issues seem to deal more with how the ball hits the pocket not so much if I hit it of course I have an advantage from my youth days of bowling in some ways although in others it seems to cause problems. I've felt like it wasn't ever going to get better then it did too. Keep working at it I'm sure it will improve.
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  10. #530
    High Roller Blacksox1's Avatar
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    - sweep leg
    - sliding leg knee bend-------------------X
    - head level during approach------------X
    - initial stance (ball level)----------------X
    - thumb fit (in every ball)----------------X turbo switch grip
    - spare shooting targets
    - arsenal progression
    - lateral movement vs. ball change strategies
    - getting rid of loft------------------------X
    - adding loft back in the "right way"
    - arm bend during swing/release
    - changing targeting on strike shot
    - wrist brace or no wrist brace?
    -hand position throughout the shot-----X
    -visualize your shot, 1-2 seconds after getting on the approach--------------X
    -using some type of spare shooting system---------X
    Work on the X's and the improvements will follow.
    Last edited by Blacksox1; 01-15-2015 at 11:44 PM.
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