Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 66

Thread: Too hard to join a league... : (

  1. #21
    High Roller vdubtx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Rockwall, TX
    Posts
    2,802
    Chats: 256

    Default

    My Tuesday night league has had 7 300's this year through 5 weeks of bowling. 1 800, and several others very close to the 800 mark. I would expect that the league would have upwards of 30-40 300's and a half dozen 800's by the time the season is done.
    High Sanctioned Scratch Game - 300(12) Hi Sanctioned Scratch Series - 822(3)
    2016/17 Book Average=221, 2017/18 Composite Average=223
    Equipment in the bag - Storm Crux Prime, Storm Physix, Roto Grip Idol, Roto Grip Idol Pearl, Roto Grip Hyper Cell Fused, Storm Sure Lock, Storm Drive, Roto Grip Winner Solid, Roto Grip Haywire, Storm Fever Pitch, Roto Grip Red ball spare.

    Rev Rate 400. Speed 18 at heads, 16.5-17 at pins. Axis tilt 10, Axis Rotation 55. PAP 5 5/8 x 5/8 up

  2. #22
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Hutchinson, KS
    Posts
    7,123
    Chats: 204

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by classygranny View Post
    This article is a few years old, but it has some of the numbers you are looking for....

    http://www.courierpress.com/news/200...-way-too-easy/
    That was actually the article I read where I got my initial numbers. The problem is, that data is a decade old and given vdub, Zax, 1820, et al's accounts...way, way, way lower than what we're seeing today.

    According to that article, 2002-2003 (1 decade ago), there were 43,812 sanctioned perfect games in that year...for around 1.8 million registered bowlers at 6400 centers in the United States. Thats 7 per year per alley. And, if we're looking at it as each perfect game is a different player (conservative of course)...thats roughly 2.5% of registered bowlers bowl a perfect game.

    Now, in that article...they are saying that THOSE numbers are absurd when you compare it to 1979-1980 when there were 5,373 bowled nationally. And, back then there were MORE registerred bowlers (4.8 million). Doing the math....0.1% of registered bowlers bowled a 300 game in 1979-1980 (again, conservative number as it assumes each 300 was a different bowler). That means, in 79-80, with MORE bowling centers and more than twice as many bowlers...there was less than 1 perfect game per bowling alley per year.

    So...here's the summary based on the numbers "today" extrapolating what the consensus is:

    1979-80: 5373 perfect games/year (less than 1 per bowling alley per year)
    1989-90: 12,766 perfect games/year (less than 2 per bowling alley per year)
    1999-2000: 39,470 perfect games/year (around 6 per bowling alley per year)
    2002-03: 43,812 perfect games/year (around 7 per bowling alley per year)
    2012-13: 153,600 to 1,830,400 per year (see below for individual estimates) (24-286 per alley per year)

    Zax's (2 per week): Extrapolates out to 665,600 perfect games per year (around 104 per alley per year)
    JauMau24 (1 per week in any given league): Extrapolates out to 332,800 perfect games per year (around 52 per alley per year)
    Bowl1820 (4-7 per week): Extrapolates out to 1,830,400 perfect games per year (around 286 per alley per year)
    Perrrin (24/year per alley): Extrapolates out to 153,600 perfect games per year (24/alley)
    vDub (35/year): Extrapolates out to 224,000 perfect games per year (35/alley)

    And those are CONSERVATIVE estimates assuming each alley has only one, good league. Obviously each alley is going to have 3-14 leagues runnning at any given time. However...the number is also going to be liberal given that the people posting here (except me) likely bowl in above average or scratch leagues with far better bowlers than an average "pizza league".

    Am I the only one that is kinda disappointed in that trend? I mean, assuming those numbers are accurate...to put it in perspective...between 1895-2000 there were 350,858 perfect games over 105 years. Between 2000-2006 there were 279,561 (in 6 years). Even if we use the most conservative number of our sample population...that number today is 307,200 every 2 years. Far, far less bowlers...far less alleys...yet more 300 games than the 6-year span between 2000-2006 and nearly as many as the first 105 years of bowling history.

    That makes me sad. Not only because it seems like it's easier to do and what that means in the "big picture"...but now I feel even $*&%ier that I've never bowled one!!
    In Bag: (: .) Zen Master Solid; (: .) Perfect Mindset; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
    USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 192; Lifetime Average = 172;
    Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 198

    Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!

  3. #23
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Hutchinson, KS
    Posts
    7,123
    Chats: 204

    Default

    And just as a sidenote....

    I will NEVER say bowling a 300 is too easy. Even if I don't like those numbers...even if I feel a person who really shouldn't be able to but does it and it's more ball than talent...I personally don't feel ANYONE who has never bowled a 300 should be able to say it's "too easy". The numbers are what they are...a reasonable deduction can be made...but my personal belief is that the only people who should be able to answer that question are those who are in that club. It's a "membership benefit".

    I mean, my goal each time I bowl is a clean game. And I've only ever done that once. So...no matter how obvious the numbers are...I won't say those words. BUT...if I ever do bowl one...then I get to comment.
    In Bag: (: .) Zen Master Solid; (: .) Perfect Mindset; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
    USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 192; Lifetime Average = 172;
    Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 198

    Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!

  4. #24
    What is Bowling? BDOG10's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Coden, Alabama
    Posts
    9
    Chats: 0

    Default

    Asian, Hey man keep your head up man you will get that 300 one day. If that is what you want to do than keep that goal in your sites. Keep bowling and practicing and you will get there man.. I believe in you.

    If I may add some other information to this discussion that at times has gone astray. We must understand several things here when we look at the national average of 300 per year. The average league bowler whom you note, bowling multiple 300 games spends these men and women spend a great deal of time working on there game, and also mastering his/her skill simply bowling multiple times each week in league as well as practicing. Please understand to the credit of some blowers they have been bowling on more challenging oil patterns as well. With this said, the typical house shot is much easier plus forgiving and because of the already growing experience in these bowlers whom have bowled on challenging oil patterns, faced tough tournament conditions, and practiced many times a week have a better understanding of there equipment and the lane condition of the house they usually bowl in.

    In closing we must also understand on the bowling centers perspective that due to the better equipment that we have at our disposal at this time in age, and the bowling centers strive to keep bowlers in league play it has become more and more important that the shot stays much easier to give novice bowlers a chance to score higher to keep these bowlers interested in returning to the bowling centers. In return the bowlers whom wish to seek a more challenging oil pattern will normally only bowl in a sports shot league in this case the average will be lower and the overall 300 drop dramatically in number as well.

    Keep your head up man thanks for your time.

  5. #25
    Super Moderator
    bowl1820's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Central, Florida
    Posts
    6,713
    Blog Entries
    12
    Chats: 554

    Default

    Aslan 40-50,000 would be a fair estimate of the number of 300's in the country. But it might be a little higher Imo

    Doing extrapolations you have to realize they are just estimates and your basing them on a small data sample and a rate of occurance thats taking place at one place or at one time. And those rates might not be constant and/or are not the same at all alleys or all leagues. Which will give you some inaccurate numbers.

    Like when I said we had 7 300's in one night, you can't get a good estimate for the number of 300's for the country just based on that sample. That rate is not maintained through the whole season.

    Also there are areas where scoring is higher and you have lots of honor scores vs areas where scoring is always lower. So you can't base your estimates just on one or the other you wont get a good accurate estimate.

    Right handed Stroker, high track ,about 13 degree axis tilt. PAP is located 5 9/16” over 1 3/4” up.Speed ave. about 14 mph at the pins. Medium rev’s.High Game 300, High series 798

    "Talent without training is nothing." Luke Skywalker

  6. #26
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Hutchinson, KS
    Posts
    7,123
    Chats: 204

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by bowl1820 View Post
    Aslan 40-50,000 would be a fair estimate of the number of 300's in the country. But it might be a little higher Imo
    Well, maybe I'll write to the USBC and see what they say. In this age of email and websites...who knows? Maybe they'll reply.

    I know the sample size we have here is relatively low...but if you have 5 guys/gals saying they see 2 per week or 1 per week or 35/year...and bowling lanes are "supposed to be" similar in length, house patterns, most are synthetic...there really shouldn't be much difference alley to alley.

    One other contributer, although I think minor compared to the equipment issue, is that back in the day...when a 300 was rare...the USBC sould shut down that lane, have the 300 bowler send his/her ball in for measurements, and they'd inspect the lane before officially recognizing the accomplishment. I don't remember when they stopped doing it.

    It's just sad that it went from being such a badge of honor...like a hole in one in golf...and now it's something that is happening so often we can't even count how many times it actually happens.
    In Bag: (: .) Zen Master Solid; (: .) Perfect Mindset; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
    USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 192; Lifetime Average = 172;
    Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 198

    Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!

  7. #27
    Cranker JaMau24's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    925
    Chats: 326

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    It's just sad that it went from being such a badge of honor...like a hole in one in golf...and now it's something that is happening so often we can't even count how many times it actually happens.
    and so often that the USBC will only give one (more) ring in your lifetime from here on out...

  8. #28
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Hutchinson, KS
    Posts
    7,123
    Chats: 204

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JaMau24 View Post
    and so often that the USBC will only give one (more) ring in your lifetime from here on out...

    OMG!! It's funny that you mentioned the ring! I was actually going to ask if they still do that!! So they still give out rings? I was going to ask but then got wrapped up in the stats/numbers (because I'm a dork) and forgot.

    Also...I know theres a lot of ole timers on here...youth challenged if you will...does anybody remember bowling back in the 60s/70s? Do you notice the difference in the way a 300 is treated now versus then? Any interesting stories? How many do you remember back then per alley? I didn't start bowling till the 80s...but only casually; so I don't really remember.
    Last edited by Aslan; 10-03-2013 at 07:24 PM.
    In Bag: (: .) Zen Master Solid; (: .) Perfect Mindset; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
    USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 192; Lifetime Average = 172;
    Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 198

    Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!

  9. #29
    Bowling God billf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Sidney, Ohio
    Posts
    5,982
    Blog Entries
    1
    Chats: 217

    Default

    Here's something to mess up your numbers. We had four 300s last season, two by the same bowler. This season, one so far. The twenty previous 300s have been thrown by a total of four bowlers.
    USBC SILVER CERTIFIED COACH
    Gold Coach Candidate
    Owner/Operator of Bowlerz Score Coaching
    Tweener Rev Rate of 420, Speed 19 mph
    Key Bowling Staff Member
    Key Bowling Coaching Staff

    IBPSIA member
    Former Staff Bowler at www.BowlerX.com

  10. #30
    Super Moderator
    bowl1820's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Central, Florida
    Posts
    6,713
    Blog Entries
    12
    Chats: 554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Well, maybe I'll write to the USBC and see what they say. In this age of email and websites...who knows? Maybe they'll reply.
    They should reply, the info is on the website it's just hard finding stuff on the site.

    I know the sample size we have here is relatively low...but if you have 5 guys/gals saying they see 2 per week or 1 per week or 35/year...and bowling lanes are "supposed to be" similar in length, house patterns, most are synthetic...there really shouldn't be much difference alley to alley.
    Alley's are not even remotely the same! The lanes in one house are not even the same from one end of the house to the other! They might have the same general spec's, but they don't play the same. A lot has to do with the topographical conditions of bowling lanes, the weather etc.

    here's a article with just a little info: Topography: What does it mean.
    http://www.kegel.net/V3/ArticleDetails.aspx?ID=51

    The same lanes won't play exactly the same from night to night, let alone week to week. Houses near the coasts score differently than those that are more in the middle of the country (one scores higher than the other, I don't remember which way it went.).

    One other contributor, although I think minor compared to the equipment issue, is that back in the day...when a 300 was rare...the USBC would shut down that lane, have the 300 bowler send his/her ball in for measurements, and they'd inspect the lane before officially recognizing the accomplishment. I don't remember when they stopped doing it.
    They stopped doing it quite awhile back, because there were so many 300's being shot, it got to be too much trouble and expense.

    It's just sad that it went from being such a badge of honor...like a hole in one in golf...and now it's something that is happening so often we can't even count how many times it actually happens.
    It's still a badge of honor, Just ask someone who just shot one for the first time. While there are a lot of bowlers who have multiple 300's, there a lot more who have only one and for them it's a badge of honor.
    Last edited by bowl1820; 10-03-2013 at 09:18 PM.

    Right handed Stroker, high track ,about 13 degree axis tilt. PAP is located 5 9/16” over 1 3/4” up.Speed ave. about 14 mph at the pins. Medium rev’s.High Game 300, High series 798

    "Talent without training is nothing." Luke Skywalker

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •