I don't think that I consciously try to copy any of the pros. Having watched the P.B.A. Tour since I was a kid I may have adopted some things from the pros without realizing it. I did emulate my dad when I first started bowling, but I suspect that the only part of his game that remains in mine is the number of steps.Originally Posted by Aslan
If you do choose to copy one of the pros, you should probably pick one whose physical build is similar to your own. At 5'8", 150 to 160 pounds depending on whether my wife is on a diet or not, I'm not likely to have much success trying to throw like Wes Malott. Fortunately there are and nave been a number of great bowlers with similar builds, so I can choose from styles like Dick Weber, to Pete Weber, to Amletto Monicelli, to Tom Smallwood, etc.
In the end though it's going to be your style. Kepp practicing and trying different things until you find what work, and then practice till it becomes automatic.
John
So I watched some Earl Anthony and I noticed something. When i first started getting a lesson here or there...the first two things I was told to try and change were leaning over the foul lane after release and not taking such a long last step. Well...guess what Earl Anhtony does? Long last step and leaning over the foul line after release.
He does get a little lower and gets the ball down sooner...so I guess I could try to meld that into my game.
In Bag: (: .) Motiv Trident Odyssey; (: .) Hammer Scorpion Sting; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Radical Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 186; Lifetime Average = 171;
Ball Speed: 14.4mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181
Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!
Sorry, but I'm going to disagree here. While I am a big fan of Earl Anthony and believe he is the all-time greatest bowler, I believe you have to keep that in context of "during his time". With the modern game as it is, leaning over the foul line is NOT a good thing. You lose leverage when this is done, and a few other issues develop.
Now with the long last step, I won't entirely disagree with that. Most people fair well with a long slide step (but planting works too) providing you use it to get the knee bent and the plant foot centered under your body.
As I see it, Aslan, you seem to want to take everything you've been told and turn it around. Apparently, you just defy being told what to do, or what you should be doing. I believe you could be a coach's worst nightmare. When you do get coaching, try something new....LISTEN, and also, why don't you ask the coach WHY they suggest something and then go from there. It seems you take what they say and then try to get the people on this forum to back you up when you try and dissect it to be wrong.
Proud member of bowlingboards.com bowling forums & winner of bowling ball give-away!
High Series - 704; High Game - 290 (a long time ago) Current Average - 150
I think you must be confused or listening to hoffman or maybe it's just a personality conflict.
I got lessons from a guy, I listened, I incorporated a lot of what he said into my game...and got better. There were some things that didn't seem to fit. I went to a second guy, he had a completely different take so now I'm trying to incorporate some of things he told me into my game. Unfortunately, some of things guy #1 and guy#2 have told me are at odds...which makes it a little more difficult to "just do what I'm told". Actually, it would make it impossible barring the ability to clone myself.
I know you and hoffman seem to dislike my personality, I get it, I can even understand it. But geez, lets not turn every thread into personal attacks.
Last edited by Aslan; 10-01-2013 at 07:23 PM.
In Bag: (: .) Motiv Trident Odyssey; (: .) Hammer Scorpion Sting; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Radical Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 186; Lifetime Average = 171;
Ball Speed: 14.4mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181
Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!
I realize that it's natural to try to copy either the most flamboyant people or the most successful ones. Obviously you have chosen to study the successes rather than the excesses. Since WRW isn't a good match for you, instead of going back to Earl, why not try a right-hander from the current era who has been successful? Norm Duke and Pete Weber each have over thirty titles. Brian Voss has 25 and though he doen't regulayly compete on the tour his last title was only 3 years ago.
John
I'll take a look at a bunch of em. I watch a LOT of old ABC Sports bowling championships online. I did watch a little of Pete Weber versus Walter Ray.
I actually like Walter Ray's form. It's just not "conventional". I like the little "umphh" he puts on the ball at the end. I think if I can do something like that on my release, perhaps I can get a little more revs. Same thing with Anthony. I like that his backswing is rather small...that might help me as I try to figure out synthetics. My natural tendency is to have a high backswing...but it throws my timing off (I get to the line before the ball gets down and then I'm forcing it down). Not to mention, both coaches were in agreement that I don't need more speed. I didn't realize it...but I guess I was throwing in excess of 18mph. Kinda hard to get a ball to hook when you loft it 15ft at 18mph.
So for me, it's not about trying to "copy" a form. I mean, I don't like the way Anthony leans forward like he does. That tends to make my shoulders go out of alignment. But I do like his fluid approach and the easy way he sets the ball on the lane. And I might try to play the far outside of the lane like he does...again...something to maybe get some more reactivity. And I like Walter Ray's release. It's not enough "muscle" to throw the shoulders out of alignment, but enough to get the ball spinning. So maybe take both of those...add my own tendency to sweep my leg a bit more...it's just trying different things and seeing how they work.
All I know is...I'm not DRESSING like Ernie Schlegel.
In Bag: (: .) Motiv Trident Odyssey; (: .) Hammer Scorpion Sting; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Radical Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 186; Lifetime Average = 171;
Ball Speed: 14.4mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181
Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!
And like someone else mentioned...one of the things is trying to find a body type that matches. I am taller and lankier...so it's really hard to get super low. I'm not a young pup anymore and after 10-15 frames of a 90 degree sliding foot/knee bend...I start walking with a limp. So watching taller, lankier guys like Anthony and Williams...how low they get down or don't get down...kinda helps me guage what I should try doing. Shorter guys like Bohn, Weber, Duke....I love watching them and their forms...but I'd have trouble getting that low. So I do agree...I think finding a pro with a similar body style is important.
I'd love to throw like Tommy Jones or Sean Rash...I just don't know how they can get the revs they do. I think I throw a lot like Parker Bohn III...except from the right side. But Bohn uses the far outside of the lane and I struggle if I get near that first arrow...I get scared of the gutter.
In Bag: (: .) Motiv Trident Odyssey; (: .) Hammer Scorpion Sting; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Radical Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 186; Lifetime Average = 171;
Ball Speed: 14.4mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181
Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!
Aslan, it's not a personality conflict NOR a personal attack. I really don't care how you portray yourself on the boards as long as it isn't offensive to the general board members. I also realize you have been to two conflicting coaches. What I was attempting to instill is 1) decide who you want to listen to - coach wise, by either an in depth interview into their coaching methods, how they stay up-to-date on current bowling trends, etc and 2) make a decision of what you want to learn and stick with it. If you go back and reread the majority of your posts you will see how conflicted you really are. And, oh, by the way - it's getting a bit old...every post seems to turn into your conflicting this and that. I was this, but now I'm that, but that didn't work, so I'm doing this...and on and on.
What I was attempting to get across was that until you can get to the foul line on a consistent basis, all the other stuff isn't really going to matter much. Make one decision and stick to it long enough to see if it works or not...and anything less than 100 games is too little to make a determination.
Proud member of bowlingboards.com bowling forums & winner of bowling ball give-away!
High Series - 704; High Game - 290 (a long time ago) Current Average - 150
Good, it's much better to dress like Guppy Troup!
John
Aslan,
For the record, this isn't a personal attack nor a personality conflict. Feel I have to say something with the statement you made towards classygranny. From posts I have read where advice you have been given by her and others including myself, it truly seems you don't want to listen to them. The advice given over the past several weeks or month has been good and sound tips on what could be wrong with your game. For myself, and who really cares about what I say since you don't, I am done giving advice to you. I truly hope you find success in your bowling and you find whatever works for you. Best of luck!!
High Sanctioned Scratch Game - 300(12) Hi Sanctioned Scratch Series - 822(3)
2016/17 Book Average=221, 2017/18 Composite Average=223
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Rev Rate 400. Speed 18 at heads, 16.5-17 at pins. Axis tilt 10, Axis Rotation 55. PAP 5 5/8 x 5/8 up
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