Non sanctioned leagues are just organized "open bowling" in my opinion. I prefer sanctioned leagues.
USBC sanctioned versus non-sanctioned leagues
This came up in another thread so I thought rather than derail that thread...why not start a new one (you're welcome Bowl1820).
This question has come up on a couple other bowling forums over the years...but never with any type of resolution. So the question is; "Is there an advantage to playing in sanctioned (USBC) leagues?" "Is it better to bowl in non-sanctioned leagues?" What do you prefer? Why?
My personal opinion is that I prefer sanctioned leagues. I believe back in the 70s and 80s...it was actually very uncommon to come across a non-sanctioned league. And I think they should go back to that...make all leagues sanctioned. And my reasons are as follows:
1) Why not make it "official"? A non-sanctioned league...in the eyes of the USBC...doesn't count...it never happened. It's like an NFL player that wants credit for breaking 20,000 yards career rushing but is counting not only his CFL stats...but also his college stats, the 1 year he played in the XFL, the 3 years in arena football, and countless Sundays where he just ran around in his backyard.
This recently came up with Ichiro Suzuki. He surpassed a hitting milestone that had never been reached by a professional baseball player...but ONLY if you count his japanese stats. So should they count? It's a different league....different rules...different levels of skill. And that's like a bowler that says he has a 200+ average, 9 x 300 games, and a 900 series...but no USBC number. Do those stats "mean" anything? If I bowl a 300 game in practice or during cosmic bowling...or no tap even....isn't that the same as bowling one in non-sanctioned league play?
Like the THS vs. Sport pattern vs. tournament vs. pro arguement that has been discussed here recently. If a person is "good" (> 175 average)...shouldn't they be expected to start playing in USBC sanctioned leagues rather than some Saturday morning fun league? Before we start chastising bowlers for not "stepping it up" and bowling against the big boys on sport patterns...shouldn't we criticize those afraid to even bowl in an "official" league??
2) It's $15-$24 a YEAR! Not per game, not per night, not even per league. You'll spend more on one night of beer and food than you will on USBC dues all year. And even if you don't win a "prize" or "honor"...shouldn't we all share the burden of promoting the sport through the USBC? It's like taxes...either everyone pays a little % of their income for the greater good...or we just rely on individuals to be "generous". Well, guess what...I only personally know ONE person that would give away a large % of his income to help others...and he'd only give it to some children's charity...not to pay for government. If only people that NEED welfare, unemployment, food stamps, head start were responsible for funding those programs...they wouldn't exist and our "needy" would be like circa 1200AD begging for alms and table scraps outside of churches.
Okay...that was too political...but the point is...I'm sure the USBC does a lot to promote the sport and grow it and make it better for everyone. But if leagues trend towards "non-sanctioned"...the USBC goes away...and bowling becomes something like shuffleboard, badmitton, or curling...where there's a few pockets of leagues and interest...but generally it disappears.
In Bag: (: .) Zen Master Solid; (: .) Perfect Mindset; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 192; Lifetime Average = 172;
Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 198
Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!
Non sanctioned leagues are just organized "open bowling" in my opinion. I prefer sanctioned leagues.
BowlingVids.com -- USBC Tennessee (2204-27181) California (222-32895)
IndexGenie.com -- In The Bag --> Roto Grip Wrecker - Roto Grip Hyper Cell - Storm Polar Ice Hybrid
What??
What was the question?
What ever it was, I do agree with you 100 percent on the question, or statement..
One thing that they do now and have for some time is KEEP RECORDS,,, league averages, achievements ect! That alone is COOL to Iceman!
Those records will be there as long as they exist!
Last edited by MICHAEL; 12-03-2013 at 07:49 PM.
Don't walk on Thin Ice!
although sanctioned is cheap, i dont see why it should be forced upon people as this is america not communist russia. Im only really pro sanction for the usbc rules specifcally about lane conditions if there is one. My house is horrible when it comes to my league about having proper conditions. Obv if you wanna be more serious about your bowling, sanctioned is the way to go but for a fun league like mine(which has very good bowlers), i see no reason for it to be sanctioned.
I am a proud member of Bowlingboards.com bowling Forums
Storm Crossroad, Roto Grip Defiant, DV8 Too Reckless, Brunswick Avalanche Urethane
Ball Speed: 18Mph
Rev Rate: 450
Current average: 199
High game: 300
High Series: 769
As i said in the other post, unless it is for awards or for people that are bowling in tournaments, the advantages and differences are slight. At least where I am, we get the same lane conditions as the sanctioned league. Even one of the guys that has worked there for a while says he can't see a real reason to bother with it. In the end, it is me versus the lane condititions. I know we are not shooting a pro shot very regularly if at all, but neither is the sanctioned league right next to me.
All things being equal, I'm good enough I would chose a sanctioned league, but since I'm not bowling in tournaments it really doesn't mean one darn thing what my average is and what I can bowl. I understand exactly that I'm a once-a-week bowler with 210 average on an incosistent house shot. Really for me it is a question of what counts more, being sanctioned or shooting on a pro shot. While you may believe that sanctioned makes your score "real", if your not shooting on something you will see in tournaments you really are just bowling in a fun league no matter how serious you take it.
1) It's not a political science dilemma. Most sports…when you play, you're part of some league/organization. I used to play hockey…guess what…every year…USA Hockey membership for like $25-$45 (but you did get a monthly magazine). Wanna play baseball? Little League organization. Wanna play youth soccer? Pop Warner? All organizations that govern the play.Originally Posted by e-tank
2) If your center is horrible about lane conditions…and you think they wouldn't meet USBC standards…then how can you be sure your scores are legitimate? What if your alley used lighter pins? Or a shorter lane? Or it was concave slightly in the middle? Not to mention…if it's not governed by the USBC…you don't need to use an approved ball. Thats why leagues SHOULD be sanctioned in my opinion…so each center has to follow the same rules and scores can be compared apples to apples. Certainly lane conditions are going to differ. My alley, in my opinion, is WAY easier to score high on than where I bowl on Thursdays. But people used to heavy oil and high revs…they can't stand my alley…way too dry. But…if both leagues were sanctioned (Thursdays isn't)…it's still apples to apples.
3) I don't understand the excuse, "I just bowl for fun." So is it "not fun" to bowl in a sanctioned league? Because I have more fun in my Friday sanctioned league than I do in my non-sanctioned league. I have fun in both…because I'm bowling…and I think the Thursday league is a bit more relaxed…but I thrive on competition and I like the idea that my scores are going to be recorded and "count" for something. Plus…with it being more serious…you don't have the stupid s*it going on like mega-sandbaggers or guys showing up for 2 weeks then not showing up anymore…or guys just throwing ball 25mph drunk off their ***. I'm not saying it isn't fun on Fridays or it's "serious"…it's not…it's fun and a good time…good food…good drinks…it's just minus most of the BS. So I don't buy that in order for a league to be "fun" it has to be non-sanctioned. I know I'm phrasing it differently…but when people say "I'm just having fun" it implies that a sanctioning of a league would somehow make it "not fun". I don't get that.
Obviously we're in agreement about progressing to a sport pattern, etc… But you can't ever make that step until you get a sanctioned book average. So while the difference between sanctioned and non-sanctioned is small (same alleys, same lanes, same conditions)…one is official and one is not. And you need that official average to enter official tournaments…and play on sport patterns, etc…
I don't think it's about "taking it seriously". I'm not good enough to take it seriously. If I did…I'd be even more bummed out. I think it's a matter of whether you're "league bowling" or just casual bowling. Because a 300 game in a non-sanctioned league is just as valuable as a 300 game in practice or during cosmic bowling at the end of the day. I mean, haven't we had forum members that have come in here saying they have 5-7 300 games and a 900 series…yet when you look up their USBC number it shows a 171 average with no honors/awards?? then the person responds, "Oh…well…those were non-sanctioned." Then they don't count. They never happened. I can tell everyone at my workplace that I hit a 500ft home run or a 300 yard drive…but what do I have to prove it? Maybe that 300 yard drive was with a strong wind at my back and an illegal golf ball. Maybe that 500ft home run was actually a 150 ft fly ball and I just tend to "embellish". And thats the key value of sanctioning. Like Iceman said (in his rather disconjointed way)…once you do it sanctioned…it's in the records forever. It never goes away. Some alleys even put little plaques up…or at least they used to with your name on them. I doubt they'll do that if you get a 300 during cosmic bowling.
And, just to be clear, I'm not calling anyone a liar. I have no reason to doubt anything…I'm just stating my opinion of why I think sanctioning is the way to go. I'm sure in sanctioned leagues…the stats people on here are touting would be the same.
Doesn't the USBC use some of that money to promote bowling and other charity stuff? I really don't know what they do.
BowlingVids.com -- USBC Tennessee (2204-27181) California (222-32895)
IndexGenie.com -- In The Bag --> Roto Grip Wrecker - Roto Grip Hyper Cell - Storm Polar Ice Hybrid
answered in bold
I am a proud member of Bowlingboards.com bowling Forums
Storm Crossroad, Roto Grip Defiant, DV8 Too Reckless, Brunswick Avalanche Urethane
Ball Speed: 18Mph
Rev Rate: 450
Current average: 199
High game: 300
High Series: 769
Your posts are way too long to read Aslan - cliff notes please.
If a league isn't sanctioned I will not bowl, period.
I keep forgetting about the Michigan contingent and the sub-standard reading comprehension.
But you appear to have grasped the concept just fine.
To me...a person that claims to have an average > 170 and 300 games and 700+ series yet has no USBC number and doesn't bowl in sanctioned leagues...is like:
1) That guy you golf with that claims he's a scratch golfer yet EVERY time you golf with him he shoots about 35 over and claims it's because THAT golf course doesn't maintain it's greens properly.
or
2) That kid in school that was really good at sports in gym class but never actually joined a team.
I played hockey with a kid in high school that was actually quite skilled. But our high school didn't have a team and he was too lazy to join an organized travel team. But I think it was more than just laziness. Like our previous discussions about THS vs. sport patterns and how afraid most "good" bowlers are of getting outside their comfort zone...I think he was "afraid"...that if he actually played against "real" players...he wouldn't be as good (comparitively speaking)...so he never bothered. He was probably good enough to "maybe" get a college scholarship had he applied himself...but he was content just being the best player at midnight every other friday for drop-in hockey. And thats sad (in my opinion).
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