Anyone ever play in a league that doesn't oil pre-league?

[Aslan]

ungreatful league bowlers, they want easy, pristine conditions, and a lower rate than open bowlers.

Last I checked, there is no requirement for a bowling center to have leagues. I mean, if they think it's costing them money and aren't willing to provide service at an expected level...I'm sure in SoCal out 150 bowlers could spread out to other houses and leave them their Tuesday night for their ever-so-profitable occasional date night or young adult bowlers.

Well...it is what it is. I mean, yeah, it's the same for everyone I guess. But what about a sport shot? If the sport shot league was at 8PM instead of 8AM...could they put down the Cheetah pattern in the morning and just tell the sport league, "oh well...it's been bowled on...but it's the same for everyone"? I doubt that would go over well.

It just erks me when centers carp on their league bowlers. They buy into all that garbage that it's casual bowlers that are driving the sport when in fact if you look at every really successful center...they have leagues almost every day and at least 4 strong league nights during the week. I've seen TWO AMF houses that gotta be on the verge of closing down that thought they could "poo" on leagues and become "family entertainment centers" only to realize too late.

As Warren Buffet would say; "It takes 20 years to build a reputation and five minutes to ruin it. If you think about that, you'll do things differently."

[RobLV1]

My wife and I are bowling in a recreational league at Suncoast (where we bowled the First Annual Aslan vs. Iceman Tournament) at 12:30 on Friday afternoons. The lanes are oiled prior to the center opening at 8 a.m., and bowlers are free to bowl as much as they want to before our league. The only rule we have about it is that you cannot practice on your pair for that day prior to the start of league. Prior bowling can, and does, affect how the lanes play, though if you are ever intending to bowl in tournaments where you change pairs after each game, you had better get used to it. Look at bowling on used lanes as practice for tournaments, rather than as an excuse for not being able to find a shot.

[Mudpuppy]

My saturday league doesn't oil and 8 year olds open bowl on it before we bowl so it's ugly

[Mike White]

But what about a sport shot? If the sport shot league was at 8PM instead of 8AM...could they put down the Cheetah pattern in the morning and just tell the sport league, "oh well...it's been bowled on...but it's the same for everyone"? I doubt that would go over well.

If the league is following the rules for a sanctioned USBC Sport shot that wouldn't be allowed.

Sport Bowling Rules.
2.2 – Integrity. It is critical to the integrity of the Sport Bowling program that the lane conditions present at the start of certified competition comply with Sport Bowling lane dressing specifications. In addition, when using PBA Experience patterns, they should be representative of the specific PBA Experience pattern being used. Therefore, once lanes are conditioned for a Sport Bowling league or tournament, there shall be no bowling prior to the start of the competition, except for a reasonable amount of practice balls authorized by the competition, not to exceed 30 minutes.

[Mike White]

It just erks me when centers carp on their league bowlers. They buy into all that garbage that it's casual bowlers that are driving the sport when in fact if you look at every really successful center...they have leagues almost every day and at least 4 strong league nights during the week.

You are completely wrong. Examine the history of Bowlmor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowlmor_Lanes

The company got started with one bowling center in Manhattan, and turned it into a night club style bowling alley, ant they made a TON of money.

That might not ultimately translate across the country.

[Perrin]

Around here is is house to house league to league for oil.

Most of the time it's fresh oil before the league. but there is one house that does the oil once a day thing (amf/bowlmor) and they only do that on days that have league. so if you try to open bowl on say Tuesday and they hacven't had league since Sunday night good luck throwing anything but plastic right of the headpin.

The other houses ususally oil before league starts but I know of some that they don't oil between early and late league shifts so that the late league can start earlier.

[Aslan]

You are completely wrong. Examine the history of Bowlmor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowlmor_Lanes

The company got started with one bowling center in Manhattan, and turned it into a night club style bowling alley, ant they made a TON of money.

That might not ultimately translate across the country.

Well, the LAST sentence was the pertinent one.

I've read the articles, I've read the interviews with the Bowlmor execs, and the paper/study they always cite as to how bowling is becoming a night club thing with elaborate gourmet cousine, dance clubs, black lights, and laser tag.

But, the BOTTOM LINE is....Bowlmor has bought TWO AMF centers near where I live and work...reduced their staff...reduced the hours of operation...lost most of their leagues...and last time I went to Center A; it was because my home center had a 45 minute wait and when we got there (center A)...5 people counting me and my coworker...and the lanes had obviously not been oiled in days since my Slingshot hooked left into the gutter at about 45 feet.

The OTHER center...went there after work to practice before the AVI Challenge...they had lost all their daytime leagues (which had moved to the private center down the street), the alley had all new screens and scoring equipment...and there were maybe 9 people there. Finally their league showed up and I think it was like 7 teams. They had an "arcade area" that was completely vacant...not one arcade game. There was one old one that wasn't plugged in sitting in the corner and they used much of the space to store tables and stuff. And the whole time I was there...not one person in the snack bar. The lady at the counter said if I needed something to let her know and she'd go back there and make it.

Welcome to everywhere else (that isn't Manhattan).

[axslinger99]

My house is large enough that they oil everything in the morning then keep the left half of the house for leagues and the right half for open bowling. If for some reason they have to use the league side for open bowling, they oil them before the league starts.

[Mike White]

Well, the LAST sentence was the pertinent one.

I've read the articles, I've read the interviews with the Bowlmor execs, and the paper/study they always cite as to how bowling is becoming a night club thing with elaborate gourmet cousine, dance clubs, black lights, and laser tag.

But, the BOTTOM LINE is....Bowlmor has bought TWO AMF centers near where I live and work...reduced their staff...reduced the hours of operation...lost most of their leagues...and last time I went to Center A; it was because my home center had a 45 minute wait and when we got there (center A)...5 people counting me and my coworker...and the lanes had obviously not been oiled in days since my Slingshot hooked left into the gutter at about 45 feet.

The OTHER center...went there after work to practice before the AVI Challenge...they had lost all their daytime leagues (which had moved to the private center down the street), the alley had all new screens and scoring equipment...and there were maybe 9 people there. Finally their league showed up and I think it was like 7 teams. They had an "arcade area" that was completely vacant...not one arcade game. There was one old one that wasn't plugged in sitting in the corner and they used much of the space to store tables and stuff. And the whole time I was there...not one person in the snack bar. The lady at the counter said if I needed something to let her know and she'd go back there and make it.

Welcome to everywhere else (that isn't Manhattan).

Bowling's problem isn't with Bowlmor directly. It's with the countless other businesses that think along the same lines as Bowlmor.

Priority #1, cut labor costs.

Less people working tends to mean less people league bowling.

[Aslan]

I don't mind the practice as much as the message it sends. Like Rob said...adjusting to lane conditions is becoming an ever more important part of the game so it's best to learn how to do it.

But...when you have a house that is worried about limiting league sizes so not to interfere with open bowling...when you have a house that is not giving a 1-pair cushion between open and league bowlers...and now a house that has just decided to stop oiling before leagues because it costs them the open bowling on those lanes for 30-45 minutes prior to league...it sends the message to league bowlers that despite the rhetoric and "Happy Birthday" wishes...the owner and management really look at leagues as more of a hinderance than a benefit.

The Brunswick house I bowl at with MikeW on Sundays seems to have a much better attitude towards leagues...but, with California traffic...a league in that center on a weeknight would be absolutely impossible. It's a 20 minute drive on Sunday mornings but a minimum of 45 minutes on Mon.-Thurs. evenings...on top of the hour commute back from where I work.