No "Skid/Flip" ball in my arsenal?

[Aslan]

My coach looked at my arsenal today and said all it was missing was a ball with a skid/flip reaction.

Now, I always thought that to get that really angular backend…you kinda need a decent rev rate. Especially after buying my Encounters and going by the numbers…they should be "skid/flip", angular backend balls.

Columbia300 Encounter: RG = 2.50, Diff. = 0.052, Pearl cover stock.

But, if THAT isn't a "skid/flip" ball…then what IS?

According to BallVersity…a skid/flip ball has a high RG, a high Diff./flare potential, and a pearl or polished cover stock. So I looked at my "wish list" of balls to see if any "fit" that mold. Here's what I found:

Brunswick Mastermind: (2.54/0.052)
RotoGrip Totally Defiant: (2.49/0.054)
Hammer Black Widow Assassin: (2.50/0.058)
Brunswick Fortera Exile: (2.562/0.050)

The thing is, only the Fortera Exile is actually talked about as a skid/flip ball. And it has a lower Diff. than the Encounter.

Not sure what I think about that. I looked at the other 5 asymmetric, 16lb balls I have in the closet but none really have the ball reaction that I would call "skid/flip". I have a Track706a and a Radical Reaxx Pearl, but the Track only has a Diff. of 0.047 and the Reaxx Pearl an RG of only 2.482.

It's just odd that of all the thoughts I've had or heard about balls and ball technology and despite an arsenal of 6 balls…when I never planned on ever having more than 4-5 at a time…I'm now looking at a "hole" in my arsenal.

[striker12]

I have a kinetic pearl that's a skid/flip ball and it has a rg-2.46 and diff- .046

I will look into some bowling balls for you that are skid/flips



-hammer bad a ss: classed as a skid/flip rg-2.48 diff-.048

-Columbia 300 freeze pearl/hybrid: classed as skid/flips

-DV8 hooligan: classed as skid/flip rg- 2.55-2.59 diff- .040

-motiv octane: classed as skid/flip rg- 2.55 diff- .043

these where the only ones I could find on bowlingball.com some of the bowling balls never had the info on the breakpoints

[RobLV1]

My coach looked at my arsenal today and said all it was missing was a ball with a skid/flip reaction.

Now, I always thought that to get that really angular backend…you kinda need a decent rev rate. Especially after buying my Encounters and going by the numbers…they should be "skid/flip", angular backend balls.

Columbia300 Encounter: RG = 2.50, Diff. = 0.052, Pearl cover stock.

But, if THAT isn't a "skid/flip" ball…then what IS?

According to BallVersity…a skid/flip ball has a high RG, a high Diff./flare potential, and a pearl or polished cover stock. So I looked at my "wish list" of balls to see if any "fit" that mold. Here's what I found:

Brunswick Mastermind: (2.54/0.052)
RotoGrip Totally Defiant: (2.49/0.054)
Hammer Black Widow Assassin: (2.50/0.058)
Brunswick Fortera Exile: (2.562/0.050)

The thing is, only the Fortera Exile is actually talked about as a skid/flip ball. And it has a lower Diff. than the Encounter.

Not sure what I think about that. I looked at the other 5 asymmetric, 16lb balls I have in the closet but none really have the ball reaction that I would call "skid/flip". I have a Track706a and a Radical Reaxx Pearl, but the Track only has a Diff. of 0.047 and the Reaxx Pearl an RG of only 2.482.

It's just odd that of all the thoughts I've had or heard about balls and ball technology and despite an arsenal of 6 balls…when I never planned on ever having more than 4-5 at a time…I'm now looking at a "hole" in my arsenal.

The biggest factor in a ball with a skid/flip type of motion is the reactivity of the cover material (particularly in the friction). The lower your rev rate, the less difference the differential makes. In terms of the Brunswick balls that you have listed, be careful when you look at the Brunswick website, as they list both the high rg (rg max) and low rg (rg min). In both cases you have listed the high rg which is irrelevant. Most companies don't list the high rg because it is easy to calculate; just add the differential to the low rg to find the high rg. In the case of the Brunswick balls that you have listed, there is nothing skid/flippy about the Mastermind, however the Exile is very skid/flippy. Another ball you might want to look at is the Storm Optimus.

[MICHAEL]

My coach looked at my arsenal today and said all it was missing was a ball with a skid/flip reaction.

Now, I always thought that to get that really angular backend…you kinda need a decent rev rate. Especially after buying my Encounters and going by the numbers…they should be "skid/flip", angular backend balls.

Columbia300 Encounter: RG = 2.50, Diff. = 0.052, Pearl cover stock.

But, if THAT isn't a "skid/flip" ball…then what IS?

According to BallVersity…a skid/flip ball has a high RG, a high Diff./flare potential, and a pearl or polished cover stock. So I looked at my "wish list" of balls to see if any "fit" that mold. Here's what I found:

Brunswick Mastermind: (2.54/0.052)
RotoGrip Totally Defiant: (2.49/0.054)
Hammer Black Widow Assassin: (2.50/0.058)
Brunswick Fortera Exile: (2.562/0.050)

The thing is, only the Fortera Exile is actually talked about as a skid/flip ball. And it has a lower Diff. than the Encounter.

Not sure what I think about that. I looked at the other 5 asymmetric, 16lb balls I have in the closet but none really have the ball reaction that I would call "skid/flip". I have a Track706a and a Radical Reaxx Pearl, but the Track only has a Diff. of 0.047 and the Reaxx Pearl an RG of only 2.482.

It's just odd that of all the thoughts I've had or heard about balls and ball technology and despite an arsenal of 6 balls…when I never planned on ever having more than 4-5 at a time…I'm now looking at a "hole" in my arsenal.

4 or 5 despite my arsenal of 6 ball.... What about the TEN I saw, in that hot a sweaty pictures you posted! All 10 of them looked pretty satisfied, nestled comfortably in the center of your bed! What did you do, sell some of them beauties!!

Storm is somewhat noted for their skid and flip movement! I know most of my storm balls do that movement, including the two that gave me the best games of my life, the IQ pearl, butterscotch symmetrical, and the V.G. nanno, that I dug up out of storage recently, asymmetrical but nice skid and flip, unlike the arc the Deadly Aim gives me.

Maybe your not counting balls that have not come out of the closet!! Hey,,, its the 2014's!!!! Roll and let Roll!!!

[Mike White]

My coach looked at my arsenal today and said all it was missing was a ball with a skid/flip reaction.

Now, I always thought that to get that really angular backend…you kinda need a decent rev rate. Especially after buying my Encounters and going by the numbers…they should be "skid/flip", angular backend balls.

Columbia300 Encounter: RG = 2.50, Diff. = 0.052, Pearl cover stock.

But, if THAT isn't a "skid/flip" ball…then what IS?

According to BallVersity…a skid/flip ball has a high RG, a high Diff./flare potential, and a pearl or polished cover stock. So I looked at my "wish list" of balls to see if any "fit" that mold. Here's what I found:

Brunswick Mastermind: (2.54/0.052)
RotoGrip Totally Defiant: (2.49/0.054)
Hammer Black Widow Assassin: (2.50/0.058)
Brunswick Fortera Exile: (2.562/0.050)

The thing is, only the Fortera Exile is actually talked about as a skid/flip ball. And it has a lower Diff. than the Encounter.

Not sure what I think about that. I looked at the other 5 asymmetric, 16lb balls I have in the closet but none really have the ball reaction that I would call "skid/flip". I have a Track706a and a Radical Reaxx Pearl, but the Track only has a Diff. of 0.047 and the Reaxx Pearl an RG of only 2.482.

It's just odd that of all the thoughts I've had or heard about balls and ball technology and despite an arsenal of 6 balls…when I never planned on ever having more than 4-5 at a time…I'm now looking at a "hole" in my arsenal.

Based on watching you bowl, you have two kinds ball reactions... Skid/Skid, and Hook/Roll

When you are on any kind of oil, it's Skid/Skid

If the lanes are really dry, you get a short Hook, and a long (too long) Roll.

[Aslan]

It just seems rather odd to me that a true "skid/flip" ball would be so hard to find. All of the ones striker listed have differentials much lower than some of the balls I have in my arsenal now or in my closet in reserve.

The Exile by Brunswick is the only one I could find that actually states in it's advertisements that it IS a skid/flip ball.

And I just don't understand how the Encounter...is NOT a skid/flip ball. It has the RG/Diff numbers and is a pearl cover stock with an assymetric core. It used to be Columbia's pro-performance Pearl ball in the Encounter line. So if it's NOT a skid/flip...then did Columbia not even HAVE a skid/flip ball in 2013??

Don't get me wrong...I'd LOVE to win an Exile and experience the "magic" of "skid/flip"...but I can't justify increasing my arsenal to 7 balls. I have the capacity to add a joey to the 4-ball bag and carry a 7th without upgrading my bag situation...but even as far back as when I started bowling in mid-2013...I contend that an amateur bowler really doesn't need more than maybe 4 balls to be competitive. At some point, changes to your game, line, release, approach MUST be part of the GAME. It can't be just an endless supply of bowling balls and hours of practice before a match to determine which of the 12-ball arsenal requires the least amount of work by you the bowler. What kind of sport is that?

It'll be interesting. I have more to say that is coaching related but I'll start another thread.

[dnhoffman]

Holy walls of text!

Get a Yeti Untamed, roll the ball onto the lane at the foul line, don't squeeze the damn ball, give it time to rev up, and it will skid/flip regardless of your rev rate,... I've seen your videos - remember that balls don't rev up in the air... You gotta lay that thing down and roll it.

[RobLV1]

It just seems rather odd to me that a true "skid/flip" ball would be so hard to find. All of the ones striker listed have differentials much lower than some of the balls I have in my arsenal now or in my closet in reserve.

The Exile by Brunswick is the only one I could find that actually states in it's advertisements that it IS a skid/flip ball.

And I just don't understand how the Encounter...is NOT a skid/flip ball. It has the RG/Diff numbers and is a pearl cover stock with an assymetric core. It used to be Columbia's pro-performance Pearl ball in the Encounter line. So if it's NOT a skid/flip...then did Columbia not even HAVE a skid/flip ball in 2013??

Don't get me wrong...I'd LOVE to win an Exile and experience the "magic" of "skid/flip"...but I can't justify increasing my arsenal to 7 balls. I have the capacity to add a joey to the 4-ball bag and carry a 7th without upgrading my bag situation...but even as far back as when I started bowling in mid-2013...I contend that an amateur bowler really doesn't need more than maybe 4 balls to be competitive. At some point, changes to your game, line, release, approach MUST be part of the GAME. It can't be just an endless supply of bowling balls and hours of practice before a match to determine which of the 12-ball arsenal requires the least amount of work by you the bowler. What kind of sport is that?

It'll be interesting. I have more to say that is coaching related but I'll start another thread.

What part of "it's mainly related to the cover don't you understand"? You keep talking about differential like a high differential is going to make a ball skid/flippy. It's not. A high differential just determines how much the core is going to "wobble" within the ball creating more flare potential. Whether the ball flares a lot or not, it's how much traction it finds when it hits friction that determines how much it flips. Columbia is not known for skid/flip reactions, and nor is Brunswick. The Exile is unchartered territory for Brunswick, a company known for producing "rolly" balls that read the oil very well and don't over-react to the friction. I'd love to know how it's selling.

[Aslan]

What part of "it's mainly related to the cover don't you understand"? You keep talking about differential like a high differential is going to make a ball skid/flippy. It's not. A high differential just determines how much the core is going to "wobble" within the ball creating more flare potential. Whether the ball flares a lot or not, it's how much traction it finds when it hits friction that determines how much it flips. Columbia is not known for skid/flip reactions, and nor is Brunswick. The Exile is unchartered territory for Brunswick, a company known for producing "rolly" balls that read the oil very well and don't over-react to the friction. I'd love to know how it's selling.

I understand that the cover stock is an essential component to skid/flip. It needs to be a pearl and it needs to be shiny. And it probably needs to be rather aggressive. But where there is a disconnect…is that the Encounter is a Pearl. The Slingshot is a Pearl. Neither of them are skid/flip.

I have always believed (and sort of still do) that you can't truly get an angular back end reaction without a > 250 rev rate. It's just physics. BUT…I admit I'm not 100% on the various cover stocks and how they differ. It just strikes me as odd that a bowling ball manufacturer would make an entire line of pro performance bowling balls and leave out a skid/flip ball. What do they tell their pros? "It's okay, just throw an Exile"?

IF I were to fill in that gap…which I am pretty sure I'm not going to because I'm about at my limit of what I want to carry around with me to league night and sport league. BUT…WHEN I win the VBT…I DO get a $25 gift certificate…sooooo…I was thinking of getting a Storm Gizmo…but I already have a training wrist brace. I was thinking maybe some abralon pads…maybe a bowling glove. But maybe I get the Exile! I hate paying more than $79 for a bowling ball though. But, maybe.

[striker12]

aslan if you want a skid/flip ball for a cheap price go with the freeze pearl or hybrid.

here in Canada it costs like $150-170 drilled with thumb slug and finger grips.

then in the US it would be a lot cheaper then that the freeze is a great ball its the ball I shot 8 strikes in a row and finished with a 234 because I went.

open/spare/spare/open/x/x/x/x/x/xxx

also shot a 265 with it but I doubles spared in the 5th and 6th and on last shot in 10th only got 8 pins