I think I"m comprehending what Michael is saying. His strike ball hooks at a consistent rate. Attempting to throw the same hook at the ten pin turns into an adventure, plastic is too common and Norm is Norm. The idea is intrgueing. I wonder if Michael is trying to 'force' the elbow into the wrong direction. A ball drilled with the core flipped would work but only if Michael was completely behind the ball. Even then there would be a margin of error as that release become comfortable and worse yet, would it affect the feel of his normal release?
MikeWhite, did I do OK at avoiding the shiny object? ha ha that did make me chuckle.
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Your attention may have been removed from the shiny object, but you aren't focusing on Iceman's request.
Iceman didn't say throwing a the same hook was what he had problems with, although if he tried, I expect he like 99% of bowlers would.
He said with plastic there wasn't enough room for error.
His experience shooting at a 7 pin using the strike ball and the wall of oil gave him enough room for error.
He wanted a way to mirror the process, to use the other side of the wall to guide a ball into a 10 pin.
Last edited by Tony; 08-29-2015 at 10:38 PM.
Something to add or think about when discussing the back up ball thrown by Norm Duke, we are talking about a bowler who may be more specific about the feel of his ball than any one else. I remember talking to a storm staffer at nationals when they had balls of various pros out on display, one being Norm Duke. The thumb hole had 3-5 ovals drilled into it and split white tape in the front. While a large portion of this back up ball skill is repitition, I would have to think that a superior fit has a significant role in this.
Norm Duke is well known for tinkering with his thumbhole to get that perfect fit during bowling. He's a "tape master", when you wanted to learn how to put tape in a ball, He was the one to watch.
Here's a old article that tells about him and his fit, I'm sure he's made changes since then. But it should give some insight into how he does things with his fit.
http://www.kegel.net/v3/ArticleDetails.aspx?ID=43
Here's a photo of Norms thumbhole, which shows the oval notch and where they scribed the 1/8" offset they talk about in the article.
Last edited by bowl1820; 08-30-2015 at 10:07 AM. Reason: add image
Right handed Stroker, high track ,about 13 degree axis tilt. PAP is located 5 9/16” over 1 3/4” up.Speed ave. about 14 mph at the pins. Medium rev’s.High Game 300, High series 798
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Interesting article. Of paticular interest to me was the section discussing lateral thumb pitches. Now I'm going to pay attention to release position of bowlers and their lateral pitch.
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So I was thinking about this thread as I was driving home from bowling pot games this morning (yes, I realize that I really have no life!). Inititially, Michael asked about throwing a backup ball, using reactive resin, at the ten pin to give himself the same "miss room" when throwing at ten pins, that he has with his strike shot while hooking the ball into the pocket. The one thing that none of us bothered to address was what causes this miss room: for a right hander, there is friction to the right, and oil to the left on the strike ball, so if the ball misses right, it hooks back to the pocket, and if it misses left, it finds more oil that helps it to hold pocket. For a right hander throwing a backup ball with a reactive bowling ball, there is oil on the left, so if the backup ball misses left it finds more oil and misses the ten pin to the left, and if it misses right, it gets into the friction and backs up more, missing the ten pin on the right. For this reason, the best chance of picking up a ten pin is using a plastic ball that, using a normal release, will still give you the most miss room possible while attempting to pick up ten pins. Add to this, the fact that 99% of the top bowlers in the world throw plastic at spares certainly attests to the fact that your greatest chance at success in picking up ten pins is to use a plastic spare ball and practice A LOT!
Next, the thread got sidelined into this who discussion of Norm Dukes ability to use a reactive ball and throw it straight by using a backup release. First, Norm Duke does not use a special drilling to throw a back-up ball at the ten pin. To do so would negate his whole reason for not using plastic: he doesn't want to carry the extra ball! Hopefully, all of you have a PSO who is capable of drilling a ball that fits your hand perfectly. If you don't, find one!
Michael, you who have talked about "the gift" extensively in the past will certainly understand this: in terms of controlling the motion of a bowling ball, Norm Duke is as close to a bowling God as it gets! He can play everywhere from the right gutter to the left gutter. He truly has "the gift." Though we've had our differences in the past, please believe me when I tell you that I have your best interests at heart: practice with the plastic ball - anything else will just delay the inevitable conclusion that you as an intelligent bowler will come to... using a plastic spare ball gives you the best chance for picking up ten pins. Period.
Nope, he wanted the same miss room he has when shooting at a 7 pin. Similar, but different.
Again, Nope, he wanted to throw the back up ball on the left side of the lane, making the dry area to his left, and the oil to his right.
I told him the back up method would require a lot of practice as well.
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