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Thread: Next Arsenal Dilemmas: Part III

  1. #61
    Bowling Guru Amyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    I guess when it comes to arsenal selection....from what I've seen/read/heard...and maybe Bowl1820 even has USBC videos or old posts on this subject that will give us an even wider array of "theories"...but I've seen primarily TWO methods:

    1) Cover stocks (solid, hybrid, pearl)
    2) RG (2.49, 2.51, 2.53, 2.55)

    Now, both of these methods have positives and negatives, depending on who you talk to. For example;

    CoverStock:
    Pro: Most evidence shows that surface trumps cover and cover trumps the rest of the specs/variables.
    Con: There is also testing that leads us to believe (as Rob mentioned) that "pearl", "hybrid", "solid" are essentially meaningless advertising/sales tools.

    RG:
    Pro:
    If you're less concerned with building an arsenal with different ball motion "shapes"...and more concerned with building a progression where you have balls that go shorter to longer (in terms of when they change from skid phase to hook phase)...RG is a good way to put an arsenal together. Rob wrote a very good article on arsenal creation using RG as the primary factor...and since RG also encompasses (to varying degrees) core symmetry, core strength, and differential...it's a probably one of the better "spec-related" indicators of ball movement...at least in terms of when the ball starts to hook.

    Con:
    Well, first, a very small % of bowlers know what the RGs of their equipment is...the RG changes slightly based on weight and finding the RG for a non-15lb ball isn't always as easy, depending on the brand/website. Second, even if bowlers KNOW their RG...most would struggle to explain what it actually means. And probably the biggest "con" is that most verifiable testing leads one to believe that surface is so, so, so much more dominant than any spec....including RG....that nothing else really at the end of the day matters.

    So, let me post a few examples of how my "arsenal selection" process has went and what the lessons learned were (as mudpuppy cliff noted as I can be)...
    Isn't a combination of these methods exactly what I've been advocating? I agree with Rob about the pearl, hybrid, solid crap. Actually I think I was on that bandwagon before he was.

    Step 1. Determine what you need the ball to do
    Step 2. Determine what surface/cover combo is likely to fit that condition (cover I'm referring to is strength not type and yes this is guesswork to some extent)
    Step 3. Determine what RG is likely to fit that cover/surface combo and give you the desired shot shape.
    Step 4. Purchase ball that closely resembles those characteristics.

    It's not rocket science.
    I am a proud member of Bowlingboards.com bowling forums and ball contest winner

    Current arsenal

    900 Global Badger Claw - Radical Ridiculous Pearl - Spare Ball Ebonite T Zone

  2. #62
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Arsenal #2 (2015-2016)
    Brunswick Lethal Revolver, Columbia300 Dark Encounter, Rotogrip Asylum, Brunswick Melee Jab*, Brunswick Loaded Revolver

    This arsenal was created based on specs...but the progression was chosen by my coach. While the actual decision of which balls to put in the Arsenal was greatly influenced by what was in the "closet of destiny"...it also included some newer balls like the Asylum that I won in a weekly giveaway.

    * The Melee Jab was given to me by Rob...so it wasn't part of the original arsenal selection process.

    The driving factor in creating this arsenal was the belief that cover trumps all other specs. Ball manufacturer differences...RG...all that stuff is irrelevant compared to the cover on the ball. This decision was not only echoed by my coach...but I saw it first had when my hybrid, high RG Bullet Train hooked noticeably sooner than my solid, lower RG Rhythm from Arsenal #1. So I figured...if I lined it up Solid, Solid, Hybrid, Pearl, Pearl....and then tweaked it a little based on manufacturer tendencies (which both my coaches agreed on) and surface prep....I should be "good to go".

    Pros:
    1) If surface trumps specs, then cover should trump specs.
    2) Takes into account manufacturer differences inherent to one manufacturer versus another.
    3) Given that PerfectScale was the best indicator in the last arsenal, this arsenal/progression was also based on PerfectScale rating.
    4) By selecting the arsenal and drilling all of the balls at once...it allowed me two things:
    - First, I could change weights without mixing weights. That allowed me to go from 16lbs to 15lbs.
    - Second, it allowed my coach to select drilling layouts based on where in the progression I intended to use each ball.

    Negatives:
    1) It really underestimated the effect of RG and the other specs. While it took specs into account...it was still a "hodge podge" collection of balls.
    2) Since all of the balls were essentially OOB finish...it relied on there being a noticeable difference between coverstocks (solid, hybrid, pearl)...and that never really developed the way I had planned and leads me to sort of agree with what Rob discovered in his testing of coverstocks.
    3) By drilling the balls to fit in a pre-determined progression...there's a risk (i.e. Asylum) that you could cause an otherwise effective ball to be ineffective.
    4) The Melee Jab caused all kinds of "issues". It was newer technology...it was visibly the strongest ball in my bag, it had a lower RG, it was a sooner hooking Brunswick....YET....it didn't work well in the #4 slot...and worked better in the #5 slot. I'm still not sure why...but the 'theory' I gathered from my coach...is that when the breakpoint is drier and clean...the Jab was reacting unpredictably...because my release wasn't super-consistent. The Jab needed oil so not to over-react. And, by Game #3...when ball #5 usually came out on an easier THS...there was enough carry-down (to the breakpoint) that the Jab didn't over-react.

    LESSONS LEARNED:
    1) I think I need to consider all elements of the specs...not just coverstock and PerfectScale. Throwing high RG equipment ahead of low RG equipment just because it's a solid vs a hybrid is not ideal.
    2) Try to use RG more and coverstock less. You can always tweek surface later.
    3) There is a 'place' for a stronger, skid/flip ball...at the END of the progression. In other words...it's not as simple as "strong, medium, weak, weakest". You still need a ball that goes long in the dry...but still has enough power left to carry. So...rather than use a Track300A or a Strike King or a Columbia Freeze as Ball #4 (4-ball progression)...it might be better to use a Fortera Exile or something like that...a polished pearl that can give you length....but still have the power to make a turn in the carry-down (oil) and carry corner-pins.

    So, that's where I am now. I don't have a 4-ball progression right now...I'm gonna try and make a 3-ball progression and then if my coach thinks I need to slot in another ball somewhere...I can do that...either from the 'closet of destiny' or through purchasing one. The new arsenal/progression is still dependent on PerfectScale and coverstocks...but I tweaked the RG and differential numbers to weight them more than I did before. And I use manufacturer tendencies less...really just as a tiebreaker.

    I don't have the spreadsheet in front of me, but it essentially creates 4 slots by color (red, purple, green, dark grey).
    - Red ideally would be a low RG solid...Brunswick/Radical...> 0.052 diff (high flare), dull or sanded surface, PerfectScale > 220. It's purpose is to be the first ball out of the bag on fresh oil...probably not THS...but harder patterns, wider patterns, longer patterns, sport patterns, tournament play.
    - Purple would be a ball that isn't as strong as #1...maybe a first ball out of the bag on a THS...0.050-0.054 differential, > 210 PerfectScale, maybe a Storm/Rotogrip or Hammer, RG > 2.49...but more in the 2.50-2.51 kind of area, a hybrid cover, maybe a 1000-2000 OOB surface.
    - Green is your ball-down option when your THS starts to transition. It's also you "go to ball" on shorter, drier, more narrow patterns...especially if you have slower speed and 300 or higher rev rate. Generally it's going to be a Pearl, polished, 2000-4000 abralon OOB, a > 2.51 RG, 0.020-0.049 differential, PerfectScale < 210, and generally you're looking at a 900Global or Ebonite International (non-Hammer) ball.
    - Grey is the slot where you have two options. A strong skid/flip ball like a Pro level Pearl Rotogrip/Storm ball OR...you can use this slot for a dry lane/practice very weak ball like a entry level ball such as a Boost or a Strike King or a Freeze or a really polished Tropical Breeze...maybe even a urethane ball. The ideal specs here are different depending on which of those options you choose. It NEEDS to be a Pearl and it NEEDS to be polished to go in this spot. But if it's skid/flip...the RG is less important and you want a high differential and high PerfectScale value. But if it's just a long, dry lane, practice ball...then you want a lower PerfectScale number, RG > 2.51, differential <0.048, etc...

    BUT...and this is important before you start tearing this idea to pieces...it is almost NEVER...the case that a ball is "all Red" or "all Green". Usually there is going to be some spec that doesn't quite fit. That's when you have to sort of "average". Like, lets say you have 6 variables...3 Red and 3 Green. That ball would get slotted as a Purple #2 ball. IDEALLY, you'd select a ball that is "all purple" for the #2 slot....but I presently 'closet of destiny' restrictions...so I have to slot balls that aren't 'perfect'.
    In Bag: (: .) Motiv Trident Odyssey; (: .) Hammer Scorpion Sting; (: .) Brunswick Endeavor; (: .) Radical Outer Limits Pearl; (: .) Ebonite Maxim
    USBC#: 8259-59071; USBC Sanctioned Average = 175; Lifetime Average = 171;
    Ball Speed: 14.7mph; Rev. Rate: 240rpm || High Game (sanc.) = 300 (268); High Series (sanc.) = 725 (720); Clean Games: 181

    Smokey this is not 'Nam', this is bowling. There are rules. Proud two-time winner of a bowlingboards.com weekly ball give-away!

  3. #63
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    You might check out this video called advancing your bowling performance


    The part called Ball matrix (at about the 17:44 min. mark)



    Right handed Stroker, high track ,about 13 degree axis tilt. PAP is located 5 9/16” over 1 3/4” up.Speed ave. about 14 mph at the pins. Medium rev’s.High Game 300, High series 798

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  4. #64
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowl1820 View Post
    You might check out this video called advancing your bowling performance


    The part called Ball matrix (at about the 17:44 min. mark)
    Interesting. I think they echoed alot of what we've all been talking about.

    1) They sort of recommended my old "benchmark" system...even though I kind've abandoned that.
    2) They did a good job of showing "dull" vs. "shiny" and how sometimes dull doesn't hook as much as shiny because it loses energy too early.

    They talked alot about what Amyers and I were arguing about. They seem to be in the "Amyers camp" that it's just so hard and there are so many factors that there's no way to really develop a matrix. I still disagree. I don't like the excuse, "it's too difficult". It "can" be done...it just isn't "simple". Thats why after 3 years of trying...I'm nowhere near finished with it. There are a LOT of variables to consider...and isolating those variables to TRULY test them...is very difficult unless you work for a ball company and have an endless supply of balls to play with.

  5. #65

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    I keep going back to the concept that you've adopted that an arsenal is a fixed thing... arsenal 1, arsenal 2, etc. Have you ever considered that every ball you have is part of your arsenal, and whichever balls you decided to take with you to a certain event or center is just your temporary arsenal for the day?

  6. #66
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    I keep going back to the concept that you've adopted that an arsenal is a fixed thing... arsenal 1, arsenal 2, etc. Have you ever considered that every ball you have is part of your arsenal, and whichever balls you decided to take with you to a certain event or center is just your temporary arsenal for the day?
    Yes and No.

    Technically I have about 4-5 drilled balls from prior arsenals...but the only way I could mix and match is if I mix weights. One of the reasons I've switched out arsenals all at once is because Arsenal #1 was 16lbs and Arsenal 2 was 15lbs. Arsenal #3 is likely to go back to 16lbs.

  7. #67
    Pin Crusher Jaescrub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Yes and No.

    Technically I have about 4-5 drilled balls from prior arsenals...but the only way I could mix and match is if I mix weights. One of the reasons I've switched out arsenals all at once is because Arsenal #1 was 16lbs and Arsenal 2 was 15lbs. Arsenal #3 is likely to go back to 16lbs.
    What's your reason for the mix of 16 and 15 # equipment?

  8. #68
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaescrub View Post
    What's your reason for the mix of 16 and 15 # equipment?
    I started with 15 and thought I'd try 16. Then I thought I'd try 15 again. By being able to throw either weight with success...it gives me a bit more options. 16lb balls will often go on clearance and sell for very little, despite being popular models...because fewer people are throwing 16lbs now. I figure eventually...I'll settle on a weight I like best...probably 15lbs...but until I figure it out...I keep my options open.

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