View Poll Results: What do you think of the potbowling.com concept

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Thread: Announcing potbowling.com , National Bowling tournament events daily.

  1. #1

    Default Announcing potbowling.com , National Bowling tournament events daily.

    New tournament concept merging technology with USBC sanctioned League and Tournament events. Post your score from those events at potbowling.com. You will be placed with three other teammates from around the country. The tournaments are run the next morning from the previous days play. Currently the tournament is free to play (no prizes awarded either, just bragging rights) while the tournament is in 'Beta' and being tested for bugs, load testing and bowlers acceptance. View the videos that are there for further details. Give it a try, let me know how you feel about the concept. Thanks.

    I received USBC certification today.
    Dear James Yeatrakas,
    Thank you for certifying your tournament with the United States Bowling Congress. Certifying a tournament with USBC is a benefit to you and all participating USBC members.

    ∑ potbowling.com:

    ∑ Certification #11925:

    We thank you and those who help you conduct this tournament and hope itís a great success!

    Sincerely,

    Katrina A. Smoot

    Rules Coordinator

    O 817.385.8395 | F 817.385.8260| katrina.smoot@bowl.com
    end of msg.

    JLY:
    Please take the time to visit the site, view the videos which cover everything from how to participate to how I got to where we are today. The rules and FAQ's are detailed and explain how I hope to revitalize the industry. I am offering the tournament to the USBC to operate and share proceeds with after I have the bowling communities acceptance of the concept. It just needs you good folks to visit the site, and participate to see how it works.
    Last edited by YankeeBastid; 06-12-2017 at 07:14 PM. Reason: added USBC certification and notes

  2. #2
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Like many previous virtual tournament/competition attempts...ripe for cheating and sandbagging.

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    Like many previous virtual tournament/competition attempts...ripe for cheating and sandbagging.
    Hi Aslan. I have been certified by the USBC. I invite you to visit the site and read the rules. This is not a virtual reality site and the ability to sandbag is severely restricted by the method of making the teams. I welcome your critique, but please understand how this concept works. I am sure you agree with me that bowling as an industry and as a sport could use revitalization. This is not a concept I just thought up. I have had proprietors involved.

    For the record:
    Dear James Yeatrakas,
    Thank you for certifying your tournament with the United States Bowling Congress. Certifying a tournament with USBC is a benefit to you and all participating USBC members.

    ∑ potbowling.com:

    ∑ Certification #11925:
    We thank you and those who help you conduct this tournament and hope itís a great success!



    Sincerely,

    Katrina Smoot

    Katrina A. Smoot

    Rules Coordinator

    O 817.385.8395 | F 817.385.8260| katrina.smoot@bowl.com

  4. #4
    Bowling God Aslan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeBastid View Post
    I welcome your critique, but please understand how this concept works.
    Basically, this was tried a couple different times recently. There was a version that was associated with the PBA...I think it was even an event sponsor a couple years back.

    There are basically two major flaws...and one minor flaw...off the top of my head (and after viewing the videos):

    1) There is no way to verify scores.
    I know you "think" there is...and we both like to think everyone is honest. BUT...very few centers upload to leaguesecretary.com. OF those that don't, most post their results online...but within a week of play being over. So, if "Iceman" (just to use a 'dummy name' ) enters a 767 series...you won't know if that is accurate unless the league uploads their results IMMEDIATELY to leaguesecretary.com. If that league does not, you can't verify that result for at BEST...2-3 days...maybe closer to 6. And THAT is if the center uploads results online at ALL. Many centers issue results by printout on league night...and some post them online, but require a league bowler to enter a login and password to view them.

    Now, having centers participate could solve some of this...but who verifies the centers? How many bowlers "know a guy" in the pro shop or are buddies with the people entering the scores? Maybe the guy at the desk gives their "buddy" 40 extra pins when he reports them...no way to know.

    In the VBT, I had participants take photos of their score sheets and monitors and email me the photos. That didn't work very well...printers at the centers didn't always work...monitors were hard to read in some cases...and in some cases there was a problem getting the picture to come through via email. Not to mention, the scores they took a picture of may not have even been bowled during league.

    2) Online gaming can be a BIG business. Online poker ran into some problems 5-10 years ago...when it was found that the people running the algorythms could make certain people win and certain people lose. How does the system police itself? How does it identify potential fraud? The team sorting should help alleviate some sandbagging issues...but it's not going to alleviate all of them. A person with a 178 average...who is a 211 bowler...can still enter once a month...and have a decent chance at making some big $$$. Then, they spend 3 weeks sandbagging to maintain their average.

    In my VBT, we countered this by having the players tournament results raise and lower their starting averages...but that takes a long time to adjust the average if it's grossly out of whack.

    3) A more minor issue...is house to house and region to region variances. In the VBT, I tried to require participants to bowl at randomly selected centers...so everyone would be outside their comfort zone and it would simulate actual tournament play.

    For example, take my case:
    - I average 184 at a center I couldn't quite figure out. Very few bowlers at that center average over 189.
    - I bowl at two other centers and average 195 at each. Still not very many 200+ average bowlers at that house...but if I enter the potbowling tournament with a 184...I could then bowl at the easier center when I wanted to bowl for the money...that gives me an 11-pin cushion right off the bat.

    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeBastid View Post
    I am sure you agree with me that bowling as an industry and as a sport could use revitalization. This is not a concept I just thought up. I have had proprietors involved.
    Changes certainly need to be made; but those changes are far more complex than simply running an online/virtual tournament.

    I like the concept and enthusiasm...but there's a lot of issues that need to be ironed out...probably more issues than can ever actually be ironed out.
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  5. #5
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    As to your Minor point. Virtual Tournaments used to give you your average based on league. You set up all your leagues then each week you could enter with each of your leagues. I'd have 3 entries a week and play doubles with myself (using different leagues). That way you don't have the establish at a tougher center then Bowl at a easier one for money.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by JaxBowlingGuy View Post
    As to your Minor point. Virtual Tournaments used to give you your average based on league. You set up all your leagues then each week you could enter with each of your leagues. I'd have 3 entries a week and play doubles with myself (using different leagues). That way you don't have the establish at a tougher center then Bowl at a easier one for money.
    . Since you do not know who your teammates are, you must always roll your best. Your average is updated each time you participate. There is no lag. Remember, the concept is designed for many thousands of bowlers. Even a small fraction of league bowlers participating smothers the efforts of sandbaggers. There is also a report that enables you to observe who has bowled in a particular center for verification. Thanks for your input, I look forward to your participation in the free for play events to experience for yourself this concept. Try it out and get back to me. Thanks again,

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    I've never been a big fan of pot bowling. As a coach, I know that there are a number of factors beyond a bowler's control that can affect his or her score. Therefore the only fair way to compete is head to head on the same lanes. I will enter the pot just to be sociable if the entry fee is low but then again the league where I do this is small and winning doesn't even cover my cost of bowling for that day.

    The fact that this enterprise puts teams together, not completely at random but with an eye to keeping team averages close, using bowlers from four different houses should minimize the chances that you will be competing against teams where all 4 bowlers bowl on easier conditions than your team or that you'll have teams o 4 sandbaggers.
    John

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