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Thread: Lofting?!?!

  1. #21
    Member DMS's Avatar
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    EVERY sport has seen it's players get bigger, stronger and more technically knowledgeable. Meh.

    EVERY sport has seen at least incremental advances in equipment. Meh.

    EVERY sport has left the playing field, itself, pretty much as it was when the sport originated. Notably, football has the artificial / natural turf distinction, and in horse racing there's now synthetic versus natural dirt tracks. Meh.

    So, instead of reinventing the wheel, why not just look at similar situations? And here, I would direct you to a cousin sport... Candlepin (and Duckpin) bowling. To whit:

    They've had a lofting limitation forever... It's right in the rules. They have no trouble enforcing it... There's major championships held in both formats that go reasonably without controversy.

    You could chuck a Candlepin ball all the way to the pin deck... overhand... if you wanted to! I don't know if it'd improve your scoring potential, but it'd be NO PROBLEM to do it.

    I think this whole thing stems from one thing.... A bunch of fat old dudes that wrote the rules for our sport in the 1890's never imagined human beings with enough strength and mastery of physics to loft a sixteen pound bowling ball 20 feet down a lane. They'd have thought "That's just impossible!" Remember... Weighing 250 lbs., drinking HARD, and smoking a pound of tobacco a day were considered signs of affluence. Our ancestors where in abysmally BAD shape. The modern 'health and strength' culture didn't arise until the 1920's.

    I think this entire debate could be solved by instituting a 'loft line' just like they currently have in CP and DP, and enforce it exactly like they do. It's a completely known factor to them.

    I don't know if they do it with lights, cameras or just simple line judges but they DO police it... and well enough for everyone to agree on it's enforcement. SO simple. BTW... Tennis is still officiated by line judges... using human eyes. Works for them. Same for most field sports, too... it's officiated by human referees. Instant playbacks are a very recent phenomena, as are photo finishes for racing (don't even get me started on that!... I've felt it's sting too many times! <g>).

    Loft line on the lane. Solves the problem. Next?
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  2. #22

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    Hmmm, Candlepin lanes have a lob line marked at 10 feet down-lane of the foul line.
    During televised matches and I assume during championship matches, there is a "Lob Line Judge" that sits over a few alleys at the 10ft lob line.

    Not really sure how that could work during the Open.

  3. #23
    Member DMS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jamoke View Post
    Hmmm, Candlepin lanes have a lob line marked at 10 feet down-lane of the foul line.
    During televised matches and I assume during championship matches, there is a "Lob Line Judge" that sits over a few alleys at the 10ft lob line.

    Not really sure how that could work during the Open.
    Well, ideally we'd develop a sensor like a foul line sensor. Simple engineering problem. They've already got speed and scoring cameras on the ball return covers, so there's already power there. Just be one more blister on the ball return covers.

    This issue would be so easy to solve. My real suspicion is that nobody REALLY wants to solve it. The real answer is to just play what the lanes are giving you. Norm Duke wasn't lofting the gutters... He was just playing a really inside line. Bowlers complain a lot when conditions don't suit their style.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMS View Post
    Well, ideally we'd develop a sensor like a foul line sensor......This issue would be so easy to solve.
    A lot of problems are easy to solve if you can throw money at it to take care of the development, equipment and installation costs etc. Then of course there's determining whose going to pony up that money and there's the determining the rules of where the line should be, the penalty for violation of the rule etc.

    A simpler solution would be to just not use the extreme conditions (Double burn) that caused the use of the extreme lofting seen in the Open in the first place.

    That kind of extreme lofting IMO really isn't going to be a problem in leagues, Leagues generally do not have double burn conditions (As much as some player might like to think they have them).

    Also if players start going on to the approaches of the adjacent lanes during league to loft the gutters, that's not going to sit well with the players on those lanes and the situation will most likely police itself. After some complaining and/or someone tripping or running into another player.

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  5. #25
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    Or mandatory re oiling after every 3 games.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by bowl1820 View Post
    That kind of extreme lofting IMO really isn't going to be a problem in leagues, Leagues generally do not have double burn conditions (As much as some player might like to think they have them).
    The problem with putting the pros on conditions that separate them further from league bowlers is that the league bowlers lose interest in watching the pros on TV. No viewers = no broadcasts = no pro bowlers... it's just that simple.

  7. #27
    Bowling Guru Amyers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    The problem with putting the pros on conditions that separate them further from league bowlers is that the league bowlers lose interest in watching the pros on TV. No viewers = no broadcasts = no pro bowlers... it's just that simple.
    Truth. I didn't watch a single frame of the open this year for that very reason.
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