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Thread: leaving corner pins

  1. #1
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    Default leaving corner pins

    Any consensus on leaving corner pins? Game 3 tonight started with leaving a 7, then a 10, then a 4-7. The 4th frame I left a 9 so realized at that point I was hitting a little light (ball was in the pocket and looked good so wasn't off by much). It is possible the ball was losing steam and deflecting? I hadn't changed anything all night then suddenly started seeing this. My guess is either too much oil got carried down and the ball lost bite at the end of the pattern or the ball was burning up and deflecting? I switched to the Black Widow Gold and once I got it dialed in I hit a couple strikes that smashed through the pins perfectly.
    I started the night with the Kingpin that I hit with 1000 grit CTD before tonight so back to the OOB finish. At the end of the night I switched to the Black Widow Gold that I hit with the 3000 CTD a few weeks ago (no polish).

    I never really learned this stuff in my previous career (quit in 2002). I always stuck with my trusty Cobalt Rhino and just made adjustments and it usually worked. I had never heard of burning up or carry down until recently so trying to figure this stuff out.

    Similar thing happened to my friend/teammate when he got his new ball. It was a few boards stronger than his old ball and he struggled with it at first. One day he went back to his old ball and was hitting way too high. I told him to try the new ball and he was reluctant because it hooked more than his old ball. He finally switched and I think he struck out the last 5 or so frames with the new ball. He was surprised by it. I told him that the oil probably got carried down and the new ball had the extra oil at the end. His old ball was clearly too high so that wasn't a burn up issue causing the ball to deflect.
    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

  2. #2

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    Unless you are bowling against another lefty who is using plastic or urethane, what you are seeing is not carry down. For a lefty, deflection goes like this: nine pin results from a little deflection, weak seven results from a little more, and a seven-nine is more still. Watch the ball exit the pin deck. If it goes off the back between the eight and the nine, it is not losing energy. If it exits towards the eight, it is losing energy. If it exits towards the nine, it is hooking too late. Even on the left side, you need to find some oil down the lane to help to retain the energy in the ball in order to knock down pins.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    Unless you are bowling against another lefty who is using plastic or urethane, what you are seeing is not carry down. For a lefty, deflection goes like this: nine pin results from a little deflection, weak seven results from a little more, and a seven-nine is more still. Watch the ball exit the pin deck. If it goes off the back between the eight and the nine, it is not losing energy. If it exits towards the eight, it is losing energy. If it exits towards the nine, it is hooking too late. Even on the left side, you need to find some oil down the lane to help to retain the energy in the ball in order to knock down pins.
    Thanks Rob. There are 3 lefties on my team. One throws 3 or 4 different balls depending on needs but all are DV8 (newest being the Turmoil). The other throws an older ball, not sure what it is but could be urethane. But they both target the 2nd arrow where I'm closer to the 7 board if that little bit makes a difference. It just seemed too coincidental that I started leaving those pins all at the same time early in game 3. I left four 7's all night and only the 10 once and they were back to back shots (1st and 2nd frames of game 3). Then the 3rd frame left the 4-7 then the 4th frame left the 9. All signs of the deflection you mentioned? So 4 frames in a row that indicated deflection? What is the best course of action when you see that? All ball with less surface? Or move in a little with the 1st ball to get into more oil? Or is either one of those an appropriate solution? I changed to the Black Widow Gold after those 4 frames (3000 CTD no polish). Definitely hit better after the switch (3 strikes in the last 6 frames and 0 the first 4).

    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

  4. #4

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    If you are playing seven and they are playing ten, then when you stop carrying, you don't have to move in a little, you have to move in a lot! The idea is to keep friction to your left and oil to your right. If they've been playing ten (and probably hitting 10-12), you need to move in to twelve or thirteen. You may find that you need a ball that''s a little stronger to do this.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    If you are playing seven and they are playing ten, then when you stop carrying, you don't have to move in a little, you have to move in a lot! The idea is to keep friction to your left and oil to your right. If they've been playing ten (and probably hitting 10-12), you need to move in to twelve or thirteen. You may find that you need a ball that''s a little stronger to do this.
    Makes sense. I don't think I have ever been on a team with another lefty and now there are 3 of us. Never really had to make many adjustments or play around other lefties lines. That along with the new coverstocks is all new to me. It helps to visualize it too. With these apps showing what pins you left it makes it a little more clear what was happening at the start of the 3rd game. I don't think I had ever thought about that in real time but seeing it on the screen makes it stand out.
    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

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    Another question, when it dries up around the 5 board and my ball is losing energy would it be an option to go to a ball with less surface? Let's say I polish the Black Widow Gold with a 3000 surface? Or once the line is burned up it should be avoided? Just trying to get a better understanding.
    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by boatman37 View Post
    Another question, when it dries up around the 5 board and my ball is losing energy would it be an option to go to a ball with less surface? Let's say I polish the Black Widow Gold with a 3000 surface? Or once the line is burned up it should be avoided? Just trying to get a better understanding.
    Going to a ball with less surface may help in some situations, however there are so many variables that the same solution that worked last week may not work this week. Be careful of the knee-jerk reaction demonstrated by so many right-handed league bowlers: I'm really not comfortable moving, so I'll try a ball change instead. You are really a lot better off learning to move into the oil.

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    Thanks Rob. I try to stay close to the 1st arrow as much as possible but know I need to get out of my comfort zone there. I seem to be much more accurate at hitting the 5 board than the 10 or 15 for some reason. I seem to miss to the inside much more when I play more in the oil. Gonna have to work on that.
    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

  9. #9
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    Well tonight was a little different. The righties were complaining about how dry it was but it was about normal for me throwing the 5-7 board. One guy (one of the top averages in our league) said he was standing 20 boards left of center and throwing all the way across the lane to hit the pocket.

    Anyway, I used the Kingpin all night. I started out hitting the 7 board but was a little erratic. I would miss a couple inches light so move 1/2 a board and miss a couple inches high. Went the whole way through game 1 trying to figure it out and ended with a 170 with only 2 strikes. Part way through game 2 I was thinking of moving in closer to the 10 board but decided to try out closer to the 5 instead. Much better. Straight to the pocket and finished with a 200 with 7 strikes (including the final 4). Game 3 I was expecting I would start losing that line and leaving corner pins but it stayed with it and started that game with a 3 bagger so 7 in a row there. Ended again with a 200 with 6 strikes (left a 4-10 in the 10th so blew that game). Maybe I didn't lose my line because I was playing closer to the 7 or 8 board half the night then went out to the 5 board where nobody had thrown all night?

    I even hit my BWG with 1000 before warmups in case I had to move inside later on but never had to use it.
    Arsenal "15# Brunswick Kingpin" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 18.5 MPH * High Game: 266 - High Series: ~670ish (both in the late 90's early 2000's)
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!

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