New ball-Radical Conspiracy

[JasonNJ]

Got the ball and dropped it at the pro shop. no bowling again until the 8th so we will see then

Let me know what you think of it? I love my Radical Intel and Katana so far so there may be room in the bag for a Conspiracy.

[boatman37]

Let me know what you think of it? I love my Radical Intel and Katana so far so there may be room in the bag for a Conspiracy.

Will do. But I will add this, we have a few bowlers in our league that have tried this ball. The PSO who is very hi rev said he didn't care for it. Another this has less rev and slower speed kept leaving corner pins but another that is a little lower rev and higher speed bowled the 813 and loves it. Based on the chatter I hear its good for a speed dominant bowler but that is my unprofessional assessment based on the comments I have heard....lol. Will definitely let you know though.

[RobLV1]

I would really be remiss if I didn't point out that there is no such thing as a "great" bowling ball. A ball is only great if if matches up with both the bowler, the oil pattern, and the characteristics of a particular bowling center. If you don't bowl in the same center as another bowler who has a bowling style that is similar to your own, take ball recommendations with a grain of salt... that's all they are worth!

[JasonNJ]

I agree with Rob, a ball is only as good as the bowler and if it matches up with the lane conditions. Your PSO could probably alter the surface and I would think he would like the ball better. As for the guy leaving corner pins, that to me isn't the ball, the bowler just needs to make a small adjustment. Corner pin leaves are not bad luck or bad carry, its just where the ball is entering the pocket.

[RobLV1]

I agree with Rob, a ball is only as good as the bowler and if it matches up with the lane conditions. Your PSO could probably alter the surface and I would think he would like the ball better. As for the guy leaving corner pins, that to me isn't the ball, the bowler just needs to make a small adjustment. Corner pin leaves are not bad luck or bad carry, its just where the ball is entering the pocket.

In modern bowling, more corner pin leaves are the result of energy loss than entry angle. This is why it is so important to differentiate a ringing ten for a right-hander, from a flat ten. A ringing ten is bad luck. A flat ten requires an adjustment to find more oil to retain energy to knock down all ten pins.

[boatman37]

In modern bowling, more corner pin leaves are the result of energy loss than entry angle. This is why it is so important to differentiate a ringing ten for a right-hander, from a flat ten. A ringing ten is bad luck. A flat ten requires an adjustment to find more oil to retain energy to knock down all ten pins.

Might sound like a very rookie question but what is the difference between a ringing 10 and a flat 10? I know a ringing 10 is when the pin goes off the lane and around behind the 10 pin but I never really paid much attention to what else might happen when you leave the 10. For me this would be the 7 but I don't seem to leave that many 7's (maybe 1 per game-checked my stats and left 44 in 47 games but I struggle to convert them (only converted 15 of those 44) so want to try to make sure I don't leave them). Seems understanding this would help to correct it.

[JasonNJ]

In modern bowling, more corner pin leaves are the result of energy loss than entry angle. This is why it is so important to differentiate a ringing ten for a right-hander, from a flat ten. A ringing ten is bad luck. A flat ten requires an adjustment to find more oil to retain energy to knock down all ten pins.

Rob, may I suggest a book called Bowling Beyond the Basics written by James Freeman and Ron Hatfield. I'm currently reading it now and I've spoken to Ron about this and the book is pretty much trying to look at bowling and debunk a lot of common misconceptions with math and physics. Anyway, Ron said the ringing ten and flat ten is basically the same. It the 3 pin being pushed directly back into the 6 pin causing the 6 pin to miss the 10 pin while going into the channel. The difference between flat and ringing is how hard the 6 pin is impacted. The book states that the pocket is the 17.5 board and if you impact the pins at exactly 17.5 then you strike regardless of entry angle. Anything else like the 18, 18.5, 17, 16.5 board may look like a perfect pocket shot from 60ft away may not cause the proper domino effect to take out the corner pins.


Anyway, its an interesting read.

[J Anderson]

Might sound like a very rookie question but what is the difference between a ringing 10 and a flat 10? I know a ringing 10 is when the pin goes off the lane and around behind the 10 pin but I never really paid much attention to what else might happen when you leave the 10. For me this would be the 7 but I don't seem to leave that many 7's (maybe 1 per game-checked my stats and left 44 in 47 games but I struggle to convert them (only converted 15 of those 44) so want to try to make sure I don't leave them). Seems understanding this would help to correct it.

The flat ten is when the six pin winds up lying down in the gutter. Likewise on a flat seven, the four pin goes in the channel and just lays there. For ringing tens or seven it has been suggested to set up 4” to 6” back on the approach, and take your normal length steps, so you finish 4” to 6” further back from the foul line. This gives the ball a bit more time on the lane so it finishes better. It does seem to work on those times I remember to do it. Of course I’m thrre times more likely to leave a flat ten than a ringer.

The traditional advice on the flat ten was to move very slightly right. For modern balls and lane conditions the advise should be to move left with eyes and feet to keep the ball in the oil so it doesn’t transition too fast.

[J Anderson]

Rob, may I suggest a book called Bowling Beyond the Basics written by James Freeman and Ron Hatfield. I'm currently reading it now and I've spoken to Ron about this and the book is pretty much trying to look at bowling and debunk a lot of common misconceptions with math and physics. Anyway, Ron said the ringing ten and flat ten is basically the same. It the 3 pin being pushed directly back into the 6 pin causing the 6 pin to miss the 10 pin while going into the channel. The difference between flat and ringing is how hard the 6 pin is impacted. The book states that the pocket is the 17.5 board and if you impact the pins at exactly 17.5 then you strike regardless of entry angle. Anything else like the 18, 18.5, 17, 16.5 board may look like a perfect pocket shot from 60ft away may not cause the proper domino effect to take out the corner pins.


Anyway, its an interesting read.

I knew Ron was writing this. Where is it available?

[fordman1]

I leave a lot of solid 10's and a few flat ones. I get so frustrated when I see the young guys getting off hits and messengers. I move around going in and out mostly. I can't use the move back on the approach thing. I usually just take longer steps and end at the same spot. Lately I have been going to weaker and weaker balls. Just move right and go straighter. Tired of weak 10 because coming in behind the head pin. At my age I haven't got the speed needed to carry many light hits either. That's the thing about bowling for every question there is a dozen answers and many of them could be right. Like Rob said every place and every lane is different.