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Thread: Sym vs Asym and when to use which?

  1. #11

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    I mean, I went hard into Asymm for a while to get more drastic reaction. However, the quote about Symm being more forgiving rings true to me personally. I like asymms when the oil is heavy personally. I then move down to symms when control is needed. BUt again, it's really on a personal level
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  2. #12
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    After last night (3 bad weeks in a row now) I'm up for either trying a new ball or throwing in the towel and being a 170 bowler
    Arsenal "15# Radical Squatch Pearl" "15# Radical Conspiracy" "15# Brunswick Kingpin (at home on the shelf now)" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
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  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by boatman37 View Post
    After last night (3 bad weeks in a row now) I'm up for either trying a new ball or throwing in the towel and being a 170 bowler
    Or, instead of spending another $200 trying to buy a game, you might try finding a coach and spending half that amount for some help. Just sayin'!

  4. #14
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    I did a search and all coaches near me are Level 1 or Bronze. There is one 33 miles from me that is a Silver level. IIRC Bronze and Level 1 are just to teach the basics of bowling? I searched a 50 mile radius and that 1 Silver is the only one not Bronze or Level 1.

    On a separate note, any disadvantage to standing more upright on release? I tried it a couple of times only because my knee was sore and didn't notice anything negative about it but just out of habit went back to bending the knee. Just wondered if this is something I should try to get used to? Any reason why one way is better than the other?
    Arsenal "15# Radical Squatch Pearl" "15# Radical Conspiracy" "15# Brunswick Kingpin (at home on the shelf now)" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 17.5 MPH * High Game: 267 - High Series: 657
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by boatman37 View Post
    I did a search and all coaches near me are Level 1 or Bronze. There is one 33 miles from me that is a Silver level. IIRC Bronze and Level 1 are just to teach the basics of bowling? I searched a 50 mile radius and that 1 Silver is the only one not Bronze or Level 1.

    On a separate note, any disadvantage to standing more upright on release? I tried it a couple of times only because my knee was sore and didn't notice anything negative about it but just out of habit went back to bending the knee. Just wondered if this is something I should try to get used to? Any reason why one way is better than the other?
    Level 1 coaches know how to teach the game to beginners. Many of them may be able to help more advanced players but they have not bothered to become certified at a higher level.

    Bronze coaches are a significant step up from level one. Considering that a large part of your problems come from poor spare shooting, I think a bronze coach would be very helpful to you.

    Generally speaking, not bending the knee causes the ball to be released higher from the lane surface. This results in either the ball striking the lane at too steep an angle, causing the ball to lose energy, or increases the loft distance which makes the ball read the lane later.
    John

  6. #16
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    thanks! lately my strike shooting has been worse than my spare shooting...lol. but yeah spares should not be missed and fixing that would have a huge impact on my game. There were a few bronze level coaches on the list in my area. might ask around Tuesday to see if anyone is familiar with any of them or recommends any certain one. there aren't many 'bigger' centers near me other than ours (40 lanes). there are a few smaller ones but the closest larger one is probably 30 miles away so most serious bowlers around here are at our center so should be in the know. i will ask the PSO also.
    Arsenal "15# Radical Squatch Pearl" "15# Radical Conspiracy" "15# Brunswick Kingpin (at home on the shelf now)" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 17.5 MPH * High Game: 267 - High Series: 657
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by J Anderson View Post
    Level 1 coaches know how to teach the game to beginners. Many of them may be able to help more advanced players but they have not bothered to become certified at a higher level.

    Bronze coaches are a significant step up from level one. Considering that a large part of your problems come from poor spare shooting, I think a bronze coach would be very helpful to you.
    The Levels/Certifications are a bit tricky with bowling.

    Here's my general breakdown...from someone that has had several coaches at various levels (worst to best*):

    9) High Average Bowler in your League- Just because a guy averages 200+, doesn't mean they know anything. But...to be fair...they DO know how to score highter than you...so it's an option...and a cheap (usually free) one.

    8) Pro Shop Owner/Operator (non-Level 1 and non-Certified)- Being an owner of a pro shop only requires the ability to drill bowling balls and use a cash register...don't assume they are professionals. But...some have been around bowling a LONG time and are up on the new technology...they just don't all feel like getting a Level 1 or Bronze certification because they don't really feel like "coaching".

    7) Level 1 Coach- Usually a pro shop owner or someone interested in youth coaching will get this. I took the class for it. It's very basic.

    6) Bronze Level Coach- Not much more than the Level 1 coach, but this is generally the level where coaches will start to be worth the money.

    5) Bronze Level Coach/PBA Card Holder/PBA Regional Competitor/Ball Company Staffers- These guys/gals not only have the academic background...but are competing and learning that way as well. It doesn't necessarily mean they are better technologically than a Bronze Level Pro shop guy...but they might be better at the physical stuff. The Ball Company staffers are usually gonna be good at both the technology AND physical...but usually aren't very current on equipment from other manufacturers.

    4) PBA50 Tour Member- These guys may not be current on the newest techniques, ball technologies, or bowling periodicals...but they've been doing it a LONG time and are still competing at the highest level. And, the added bonus is they usually have the best stories....sitting back and hearing about the tour in the 70s and 80s is almost worth the lesson cost.

    3) USBC Silver Level Coach (that don't coach PBA players)- Getting the Silver certification isn't easy...so these folks usually know their business. You can probably find at least one within 45 minutes drive. They may or may not be up on the technology, but they likely will be really strong on the physical fundamentals.

    2) PWBA or PBA Tour Pro- They aren't as cheap and the stories aren't as good...but they usually have a better grasp of the technology than the PBA50 guys. Just remember, great ATHLETES aren't necessarily great TEACHERS.

    1) Gold Level USBC, Team USA Coaches, Silver Level USBC Coach (that teaches PBA students)- These folks are generally teachers of the pros...so if they can teach the pros...they can certainly teach you. They won't be cheap...and you may not have one anywhere within a 3-hour drive. Generally you're looking at something like Camp Bakkes with Mark Baker or the ITRC center in San Antonio....both of which are VERY expensive.

    * Realize "worst to best" isn't cut in stone...it depends on the coach and what your needs are...this is just a general guide based on what I've found.

    If I were you, I'd look at the recent PBA regionals that occurred near you and it usually lists where their hometown is. If guys are good enough to be bowling in those regionals...they might at least 'know' of a good coach in your area. Try 2-3 different coaches and see who fits your needs the best. You also might have a couple coaches...one for year round and one (PBA pro) that you only visit when they aren't on the tour.
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  8. #18

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    I'd like to expand on a point that Aslan made, "Great ATHLETES aren't necessarily great TEACHERS." High average bowlers teach others to bowl the way that they do for the simple reason that it works for them. Coaches are trained to teach bowlers to bowl in a way that will be the most successful for them. I bowl with a senior bowler whose timing is so messed up that he couldn't hit the side of a barn, much less a one inch target at the arrows. He takes eight or nine steps because, he claims that a very well known PBA50 pro advised him to!

    The other issue that was not mentioned is that USBC Coaches (Silver and Gold) are trained to recognize the learning style of their athletes. There are three distinct kinds of learners; auditory, visual, and kinesthetic. How you teach each type of learner is totally different. If you try to tell a visual learner what to do, he will not have any clue as to what you are talking about. Conversely, if you show an auditory learner video of himself bowling, he'll get absolutely nothing from it.

    Long story short, if you have to drive 30 miles to see a Silver Level Coach, just pretend that you grew up in L.A. and 30 miles is nothing!

  9. #19
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    I agree 100% with the statement that just because somebody is good at something doesn't mean they can teach another. Or that what they teach will work. We have a couple of 215+ bowlers that have a very unique style that I would feel very awkward trying to duplicate. I could never bowl like my PSO. Shouldn't say never but he is a very high rev bowler that can go completely cross alley. I try that and it will be in the gutter 1/2 way down the lane...lol. I just don't have the same style he does. He averages about 225-230. Works for him though. I'm a visual learner. Show me then watch me do it until I get it right.

    So should have the Squatch pearl ready for Tuesday night. Might order a spare ball soon too. Will see how Tuesday night goes then gonna try to go out Friday for some spare practice and 1 step drills. If I'm still struggling then might just order the ball while I'm there and have it for the following Tuesday night. Son is getting married next month so gotta watch the spending though. Might be a little while before I get the spare ball or coaching.
    Arsenal "15# Radical Squatch Pearl" "15# Radical Conspiracy" "15# Brunswick Kingpin (at home on the shelf now)" "15# Hammer Black Widow Gold" "15# Brunswick Rhino Black Pearl"
    Rev Rate about 325 @ about 17.5 MPH * High Game: 267 - High Series: 657
    Oh, and LEFTY!!!
    I am a proud member of bowlingboards.com bowling forums

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