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Thread: Let's Talk Layouts

  1. #11

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    In terms of your finger positions, and more importantly, you fingers during the release, remember that it's the ring finger the puts forward roll on the ball, and the middle finger that puts on side roll. When throwing straight at your spare, try imagining that you are throwing a backup ball, and keep your middle finger quiet.

  2. #12

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    I read John Jowdy's article on hand positions, too, just the other day. I purchased his last book a few years ago and it took me a long time to understand what he meant by leading with your ring finger towards your target. It was not that long ago that it came to me why he mentioned that. I've tried that back up ball technique and I doubt that I have been able to accomplish it. That urethane covered Mix ball that I use for spares tends to get into a roll better than most balls I have even with many of them coming off my hand like a spinner. I'll continue to work on my hand position to avoid spinners in the future and think I have accomplished that. I saw a video with Mo Pinel talking about drilling methods to help people who tend to throw spinners by angling the hand position of the finger holes or something to correct for that. I'd rather do it with my own mechanics if I can. I think if I can keep my thumb pad engaged with the thumb hole throughout the swing I'll be in fine shape to do that... Thanks Rob...

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    In terms of your finger positions, and more importantly, you fingers during the release, remember that it's the ring finger the puts forward roll on the ball, and the middle finger that puts on side roll. When throwing straight at your spare, try imagining that you are throwing a backup ball, and keep your middle finger quiet.
    I remember at some point watching the PBA back when it was on ABC hearing Nelson Burton Jr comment that Walter Ray Williams Jr only had his thumb and one finger in the ball when shooting spares. Do you know which finger he left out? And given the USBC rule changes going into effect shortly would this technique be illegal under the new rules?
    John

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by J Anderson View Post
    I remember at some point watching the PBA back when it was on ABC hearing Nelson Burton Jr comment that Walter Ray Williams Jr only had his thumb and one finger in the ball when shooting spares. Do you know which finger he left out? And given the USBC rule changes going into effect shortly would this technique be illegal under the new rules?
    No and yes. LOL

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by J Anderson View Post
    I remember at some point watching the PBA back when it was on ABC hearing Nelson Burton Jr comment that Walter Ray Williams Jr only had his thumb and one finger in the ball when shooting spares. Do you know which finger he left out? And given the USBC rule changes going into effect shortly would this technique be illegal under the new rules?
    Walter Ray Williams said when he first came on the tour he hooked the ball a lot, When he realized spares were important. He started copying Gary Dickinson style of rolling the ball straighter.

    Now Dickinson used only his thumb and the middle finger in the ball to shoot straight at spares. But there were times when the announcers said Walter Ray took out the middle finger and left the ring finger in.

    Most likely Walter Ray tried both methods, But over time though he quit doing it because he felt it added too much strain and he found a plastic ball went straight enough without having to do it.

    In one of Bo Burton’s tips of the week one time he said for going cross lane, He recommended taking the middle finger out to cut down the hook.

    Right handed Stroker, high track ,about 13 degree axis tilt. PAP is located 5 9/16” over 1 3/4” up.Speed ave. about 14 mph at the pins. Medium rev’s.High Game 300, High series 798

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  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowl1820 View Post
    Walter Ray Williams said when he first came on the tour he hooked the ball a lot, When he realized spares were important. He started copying Gary Dickinson style of rolling the ball straighter.

    Now Dickinson used only his thumb and the middle finger in the ball to shoot straight at spares. But there were times when the announcers said Walter Ray took out the middle finger and left the ring finger in.

    Most likely Walter Ray tried both methods, But over time though he quit doing it because he felt it added too much strain and he found a plastic ball went straight enough without having to do it.

    In one of Bo Burton’s tips of the week one time he said for going cross lane, He recommended taking the middle finger out to cut down the hook.
    Given what RobM said about the ring finger imparting forward roll on the ball it would make sense that leaving the middle finger out would lead to throwing straighter. I think it also works taking the ring finger out due to the fact with only one finger in the ball you won’t be trying ‘to do’ too much to the ball in your delivery.
    It’s ironic that USBC’s belated attempt to tame bowling balls by eliminating weight holes eliminates a proven technique for throwing the ball straighter.
    John

  7. #17
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    Taking a finger out of the ball for spares is a very common tactic used in this area. When the new rules go into effect on August 1st this year, it is really going to impact a lot of people bowling on sanctioned leagues. Although, most people will probably continue to do it. It will be virtually impossible to enforce the rule and no one is going to be watching people that closely to even notice.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryster View Post
    Taking a finger out of the ball for spares is a very common tactic used in this area. When the new rules go into effect on August 1st this year, it is really going to impact a lot of people bowling on sanctioned leagues. Although, most people will probably continue to do it. It will be virtually impossible to enforce the rule and no one is going to be watching people that closely to even notice.
    If you are bowling in any "big money" leagues, I wouldn't bet that no-one is going to be watching if I were you.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobLV1 View Post
    If you are bowling in any "big money" leagues, I wouldn't bet that no-one is going to be watching if I were you.
    I actually bowl in the "big money" scratch league at my center and am quite shocked at the general ignorance for rules. There was only one time last season where someone saw that my teammate had a ball with a balance hole, and said to him "you know that needs to be plugged before next season, right?" My teammate said yes, and the guy said "Ok, just making sure you heard." Otherwise, it isn't uncommon for bowlers to let things go in terms of waiting for pins to be removed from the channel, getting fallen pins reset, etc. It irks me all the time...why bowl in the most competitive leagues in the house only to sidestep rules regularly?

    I have already refreshed my arsenal with equipment with no balance holes, and have never been one to leave a finger out of a hole for spares, so I am personally not concerned about the new rules. The thing that will bother me the most are the no-thumb or two-handed bowlers that will try to use a ball with a thumb hole and leave their thumb out for the first shot, and then use the same ball and put their thumb in it for spares. I have already seen a couple of arguments between people debating the rule and the no-thumb/two handed bowler saying they can do that under the new rules. Then you mention to a no-thumb/two handed bowler that they need to mark on their ball where grip center is and that always has to be in their palm when they deliver the ball, and you would think their head is about to explode.

    We are two and a half weeks away from the rule taking effect, and there have been no reminders at the bowling center or emails from the USBC or local association reminding bowlers. This has been two years in the making, and the communication (as usual) has been very poor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryster View Post
    We are two and a half weeks away from the rule taking effect, and there have been no reminders at the bowling center or emails from the USBC or local association reminding bowlers. This has been two years in the making, and the communication (as usual) has been very poor.
    There was an announcement last week at the start of doubles league that weight holes need to be plugged by August 1. The announcement was prefaced with “Chris has asked us to announce...”, Chris being the owner of the pro shop. I think it’s more a case of not wanting to have a hundred bowlers show up July 31st demanding to have three or four balls plugged by the next day than looking for extra business.
    John

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