Politcal Ramblings

[Timmyb]

"Someone brought up that they could be a machinist or journeyman."

That would have been me. My point was that I started learning my trade WHILE I was in high school. They had a strong vocational program that offered kids classes in welding, machining, sheet metal, and foundry, along with woodworking. Those options are gone nowadays. My school had one of the best equipped machine shops in the state of Wisconsin. It's gone, largely in part to the fact that schools refuse to offer that type of training. It's a "college only" mentality. If a kid wants to get his hands dirty, the opportunities are out there. They only need two thing. The nerve to go after it, and the wilpower to stick with it once they start. Most apprenticeships (by that I mean electricians, fitters, etc.) start paying in the mid-teens., far better than minimum wage. If we don't turn this around, the skills gap in the country will just continue to grow.

[Jessiewoodard57]

I was going to do a rebuttal but we shall have to agree to disagree

I will just say this Big government like big business have this in common, way too top heavy.

[Amyers]

I will say I consider myself a fiscal conservative but the big problem with the smaller government argument is that neither side ever does it more than just window dressing. They both want to spend the money just a question of where and how your going to get more of it. Their is no smaller government party in this country.

[Aslan]

I will say I consider myself a fiscal conservative but the big problem with the smaller government argument is that neither side ever does it more than just window dressing. They both want to spend the money just a question of where and how your going to get more of it. Their is no smaller government party in this country.

Agreed.

Nowadays, with Conservative talk radio and FoxNews; everybody gets "buzzwords" stuck in their head like "Big Government". What does that mean? They never define it. It's like "small business". They use a definition that would include Google as a small business. But I can guarantee < 2% of the population thinks Google is a "small business". Likewise, what is "smaller government"? Conservatives use Obamacare as an example of "Big government" interfering in people's lives. Yet, they almost universally stop short of calling for getting rid of Medicare....even though, Medicare and Medicaid are actually run by the government and Obamacare not as much. So, if you're a "small government" guy...I'd be interested to hear what parts of government you would shut down to make it smaller?

For example;
Department of Education? Maybe...I could see that being run better by the states so long as there are some minimum standards.
Homeland Security? Probably not a good idea.
Defense? Maybe. I mean, we do spend exponentially more than any other nation...but that also allows us to project our ideals globally.
Department of Justice? Definitely a 'no' on that one.
Interior? I don't even know what they do. I'm assuming Interior decorating of the White House but I doubt it. Phone a friend on that one.
Supreme Court? No...sorry Gov. Huckabee...that's a very important 3rd leg of the government...even when you disagree with them.
Department of Energy...ughh...probably not. Especially if we move to nuclear power plants.
The Fed? Probably a no on that one.
Housing and Urban development? Okay, that one can go.
Verteran Affairs? Definitely a no with all the wounded verterans we have.
FDA? If you know the history...you'd say no. Granted, it's fairly corrupt the way it's handled now...but this is a baby with the bathwater situation.
EPA? If you believe that corporations can self-police...and will look out for the good of their communities...you're an idiot, so no.
FBI? nope
NSA? nope
Secret Service? I'd like to see their fraud guys moved to the IRS...but I can't see where they aren't needed.


See...when politicians talk about making government smaller, they rarely tell you how they'd accomplish that other than just cutting their budgets....which doesn't get rid of them. Some politicians HAVE talked about getting rid of things and how they'd get to a smaller government and some of their ideas are decent. But most are just nonsense. Yet the biggest applause they get...is for the more radical proposals. Carly Firorina said the US tax code should be one page long. ??? My apartment lease is like 17 pages long. Is she writing the tax code on that scroll that Santa Clause uses for the nice/naughty list?

Another silly example...Flat tax. Everybody LOVEs that idea because it sounds perfect and fair. And it IS. The problem is, life isn't fair. Think of taxes like a see-saw on a playground. If you flatten that see-saw...making it level (flat)...the people in the bottom half will have to pay more while the people in the upper half will pay less. The mathematical problem with that proposal...and some debate moderators touched on it in the last debate...is raising the tax rate from 0-15% on poorer Americans does NOT come CLOSE to making up the revenue lost by lowering the top 50% down to 15%. We'd need a flat tax of probably 35-40% to even come CLOSE. Conservatives respond by saying, "well, we'll cut spending". On what? Last time they cut spending on school lunches. Really? With all the waste and nonsense and bridges to nowhere and pork spending....you're telling me the best way to cut spending is poor kid's food?? And they wonder why they (the Republican party) have a bad "image".

[Aslan]

Here's what I suggest.

Next time there is a "government shutdown" because our elected officials can't even do their job long enough to propose and pass a budget...we should shut down EVERYTHING in the federal government. Military, post office, IRS, FBI, NSA, park rangers, TSA/airports, etc...

Why?

Because the problem with government shutdowns is they don't affect the congress. I GUARANTEE if one of those Senators had to park is car on the street or take the subway to work....because the government employee working the parking garage in the capital building was no longer there to let them in...we'd have a budget well ahead of when it was due...every time.

But instead, those political cowards shut down monuments and national parks and then point at each other regarding who's fault it is. It's time Congress learned a lesson they should have learned in grade school...."I don't care who started it, you're both getting punished".

[Aslan]

And remember small government lovers...there are a LOT of countries with small, practically non-existent governments...very, very small...and most of those countries are not places you want to go.

Take Mexico for example. Nearby. Good hookers (non-5280 kind). Nice beaches. Nice historical monuments.

BUT....you have a 5% chance of being murdered by a drug cartel. If you get stopped by the cops, you will likely have to bribe them or risk rotting away in a Mexican jail, and you can't drink the water. Conservative paradise?? Probably not.

[Jessiewoodard57]

By smaller government I mean things like congressional staff. Do we really think they need a payroll of 1.2 million each on average? That's just salaries. Office expenses Average another 3.5 million each? The problem is our elected representatives are the ones that set these "allowances" Then you add the pork that they apply to every bill passed. I don't care what party we are talking about they all do it. By small I was referring to the cuts that could and should start in their own public accommodations. Since when do they need to live like and be served as you would a king? I'll bet their office furniture alone could pay off many of our homes. Why even their wage increases are voted on by themselves . All this extravagance yet our vets go homeless and don't receive the healthcare in time to save some of their lives. Vacations, how much has been spent on the Obama's vacations. Many of us get maybe one vacation a year but the "king" gets as many as he wants. This is the small government I speak of not scaling it back to the something out of the 30s. The "servants" should have working conditions like those being served. Is there a way to fix it? NO unless the spoiled decide to fix it the problem it won't be done.That is insane giving a crock the keys to the bank. If I touched on the entitlements that are handed out to those who could but won't work we would be here all day. all these items left unchecked we are headed for another depression that will make the 30s seem like a weekend picnic. It's not any one person's fault but all of them. If they ran this country like it were their own personal checkbook I'll bet things would come in line quick.

[Tony]

...


The issues facing the US economy (in no particular order) are:
1) High cost of labor.
2) High cost of regulation.
3) Political entrenchment.
4) Collapsing middle class.
5) National debt.

Long term, #4 is the biggest issue on that list...same as #5...with catastrophic consequences. But with the best middle class in the world; that'll take time to truly unravel.

#2 is a pain...especially in California or New Jersey. But as I tried to point out to Iceman about the FDA...there are benefits to regulations. For example, we don't need to bribe a police force to have our trucks move across the highway. We have a strong legal system that protects corporations and workers...making it very difficult to exploit people or resources. Would you want to eliminate the Department of Education and then find out you have to may $3500/year to send your kid to school? What if the school didn't want your kid? Or black kids? Or white kids? Or non-Christian kids? "Free education for all" is difficult when the schools are driven by profit. Do we want an EPA? Some would say "no". Okay...then whats stopping companies from contaminating water wells and drinking water? If it's simply a matter of being sued...a big enough company could bankrupt any private citizen(s) making claims...or at least block the trial long enough for the plantiffs just to die. All these "departments" were initially created for a REASON. And that REASON is usually = corporate greed leading to some disaster.

#5, #3, and #1...are all failings of our elected officials. How come we have numerous congressmen running for President when the Congress has a 13% approval rating? They can't do their regular job...so we reward them with the Presidency?? Does that make sense to ANYONE??

Looking at your list of items having a detrimental effect on the economy of the US, I see one huge glaring item missing that some consider to be the number one item.
That is money spent on health care, this single item estimated at close to 18% of GDP is causing huge damage to our economy. Lets for a second look at the economy in general and consider that the 18% of money spent on health care cannot be spent on something else, so it takes away from everything.
Lets quickly look at the other industrialized nations and you would see that they spend around 11 % of GDP on Health care
So what does that come out to a 7% difference, at 2013 GDP that comes to 1.2 trillion dollars wasted on health care that leaves us last in infant mortality and last in life expectancy of the industrialized nations of the world.
Think for a second what that amount of money could have been used for instead ? There you have the reason some economists consider this to be the number one item killing out economy.

[Tony]

And remember small government lovers...there are a LOT of countries with small, practically non-existent governments...very, very small...and most of those countries are not places you want to go.

Take Mexico for example. Nearby. Good hookers (non-5280 kind). Nice beaches. Nice historical monuments.

BUT....you have a 5% chance of being murdered by a drug cartel. If you get stopped by the cops, you will likely have to bribe them or risk rotting away in a Mexican jail, and you can't drink the water. Conservative paradise?? Probably not.

Lets take a quick look at the current big government and big business effect on our country. The current politicians, lets call them the "Ruling Class" have developed a system where the people mean very little to them but big business means a lot to them, who funds them and provides them with services, money and other amenities ? Why of course , big business, and does BB do this out of the kindness of their hearts...of course not, they expect favors and votes to allow them to do the things that will bring them big profits and in turn the politicians get a cut ( in various ways) of that money. They lie, cheat and steal, telling us anything to get our vote and then do none of the hings they promised.
Was this the intention of the founding fathers when this country was formed ? Certainly not, they were trying to get out from under the ruling class at that time the king of England and hid cronies. Our politicians have slowly but surely duplicated much of that system by making up one set of rules for the peons and a separate and highly beneficial set of rules for themselves.
The solutions are not simple or easy and the ruling class has no incentive to make any of these changes, term limits, political contribution reform , one set of rules and laws that apply to everyone. Think how much difference it would make if the politicians relied on Social Security or Obama care for themselves instead of having their own posh plans. The bottom line is we start at the top electing non lawyers and non politicians to the White House and every office below it, and see if changes can be pushed through, if not the only way to change things is to throw out the government and start over... I for one am not looking forward to that.

[fordman1]

Many good and bad points have been made here by some very knowledgeable people. Now let me give a few.

If I were ruler of the world everyone would have free health care. It is a human right.

I read earlier about a skilled tradesman in 6 mo. to a year. Not going to happen it takes 4 to 8 years. You also have to know someone or forget it.

Make unions stronger not weaker give the workers a choice.

Why can't we put tariffs on the stuff coming into this country? Make it just as cheap to make stuff here.

Powerful wealthy people don't want a middle class.

When in history has there been a middle class except in the last 70 years?

OK lets get rid of a few things. Number one is the stock market. Stock holders look at workers as blood suckers. If they cut into their greedy pockets it is a bad thing.

No more wars unless they are total and final. No more police actions. War means kill the enemy not help civilians if you go to war with say a third world country create a parking lot.

Great President FDR. Not so great GWB and union busting Reagan.