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Thread: Politcal Ramblings

  1. #41
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    I don't own a gun and haven't for about 45 years. I have no problem with anyone owning a gun. They don't need a gun that fires every time you pull the trigger and holds 30-40 rounds.
    Double barrel shot gun will take care of you at home. Revolver also. AK's with huge clips are crazy.

    The only people who should be out side of their home with a gun is a police officer at work. This isn't 1880 we should be a little more civilized.

    What about the bad guys you ask? Put a mandatory 20 years for walking around with a gun would stop a lot of the nuts.

    I think hunters should own bolt action rifles with no scope.

    Why do they train police officers to shoot people 16 times. Of course it keep the prison population down.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    The only people who should be out side of their home with a gun is a police officer at work. This isn't 1880 we should be a little more civilized.

    What about the bad guys you ask? Put a mandatory 20 years for walking around with a gun would stop a lot of the nuts.

    .
    If I came upon a situation where I had to rely on the police arriving or the guy next to me reaching for his Glock I would rather he pull his gun. Yes it's not the 1880 but as to civilized the bad guys still don't play by the rules. If the government took away all our guns the bad guys would still be able to get them. As to 20 years it won't matter they still carry the illegal guns. Seems the tighter gun control gets the worst the shootings are look at Chicago no guns allowed and still one of the highest firearm murder rates in the country. Like it or not guns are a necessity anymore. I remember growing up the doors never being locked but now it home invasion after home invasion. Our civilized world has regressed.
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  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    I think they are being cautious because the place being attacked was a county building and a lot of times when you're dealing with incidents like these at places like child protective services or courthouses...there's a strong possibility that it's a person who feels 'wronged' by a judge or the government.

    But, it'll come out eventually.


    Redunkulus.
    It would be a pretty good bet that political pressure is a huge part of the " we don't want to accuse Muslim Radicals, we are not fighting a religion"
    The sad truth is the person who started this so called religion, was none other than Mohammad, the founding radical muslim, they have been doing these same things
    from the beginning going back over 1000 years. The focus and goal have never changed, so lets not think they will be stopping anytime soon.
    All muslims are not terrorists but in recent history the vast majority of terrorists are muslims. The only way to stop it and preserve the non violent membership is for those people to unite against the radical members and provide intelligence to root out those who would kill in the name of Allah.

    This was a terrorist act, no doubt about it, watch as Obama does everything he can to deny it ....

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    The non radicals are cowards. We armed the Iraqi's an they dropped the guns and ran.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    The non radicals are cowards. We armed the Iraqi's an they dropped the guns and ran.
    Careful Bill Maher.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    All muslims are not terrorists but in recent history the vast majority of terrorists are muslims. The only way to stop it and preserve the non violent membership is for those people to unite against the radical members and provide intelligence to root out those who would kill in the name of Allah.
    Yeah. I mean, if we want to make it a competition, please list the last 250 terrorist attacks on civilians and we'll see how many are Christian, Hindu, Buddhist, or Jewish. I'm not saying Zero....but come on. If it wasn't for Timothy McVeigh's dumb a**...it wouldn't even be a fair contest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony View Post
    This was a terrorist act, no doubt about it, watch as Obama does everything he can to deny it ....
    I'll tell you what I tell my conservative coworkers...WHO CARES? He's President for one more year and has a Congress that will do absolutely nothing during that year. His opinion on World events is slightly lower in importance than Paul McCartney's or Usher at this point. I mean, the same people that yell at me for still brining up how horrible a President George Bush Jr. was are the same people that will throw a canary fit if Obama's shoes are untied.

    Perfect example: Obamacare. Democrats opposed the individual mandate in Congress. Republicans refused to consider it if the individual mandate wasn't part of it, and they were absolutely right in my opinion, because without it nobody would be forced to get insurance and you'd have the same problem. Then, fast forward, Obamacare gets passed...and the Republicans sued over the individual mandate claiming it was unconstitutional. Then why did you insist it be added!!? Just so you'd have something to sue over!!!??

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessiewoodard57 View Post
    Seems the tighter gun control gets the worst the shootings are look at Chicago no guns allowed and still one of the highest firearm murder rates in the country.
    Agreed. The problem with tightening gun laws is the only people that follow laws, aren't the ones we necessarily are worried about. I mean, whenever I hear some blow hard over-dramatically calling for tighter gun laws to end all the inner city shootings....all I can think is...well, that guy is a felon...so him having the gun in the first place violated his parole...so adding more laws for him to refuse to follow is probably not an A+ strategy.

    Same thing with Immigration. So you'll make laws that illegal aliens have to follow to stay in the country?? Yeah, because they were really good at following the multiple laws they broke when sneaking into the country or over-staying their VISAs and then working and not paying income taxes....that I'm sure now that amnesty is on the table...they'll all just come wandering to the nearest courthouse to pay a bunch of fines with the mucho dinero they've earned cutting grass. Are politicians really this stupid? Or are they just rolling out a massive April Fools joke?

    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    What about the bad guys you ask? Put a mandatory 20 years for walking around with a gun would stop a lot of the nuts.
    I don't know. Life sentences for murder don't seem to stop them from using the guns...I doubt a 20-year sentence is going to scare them. Not to mention, the liberal side of the party I will probably be forced to vote for in November (unless I move to Canada) wants to close prisons and let people out. They claim it's unfair and we have too many people locked up. Awww....those poor criminals. I mean, ya pistol whip a clerk, steal merchandise, punch a cop....and then, PURELY DUE TO THE COLOR OF YOUR SKIN...you get a 15-year sentence?? Where's the justice in that?

    We should just put everyone in prison at 18...and only let them out after they go 10 years without committing a crime. Screw it. Lets make the World into Hunger Games or something. This current reality doesn't work anymore.


    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    Why do they train police officers to shoot people 16 times. Of course it keep the prison population down.
    They train anyone in firearm training that if you draw the gun, you aim center mass and continue firing until the suspect drops. The simpler answer is, because they don't want to fire just 15 times...and get shot because they didn't fire a 16th. The cop in that video just happened to be a horrible shot...hit the guy all over the place, arms, hand, feet...he might have had his eyes closed.

    The more important question is...if it were YOU...and there was a 6'2" black man walking toward you drugged out of his mind on PCP...with a rap sheet longer than your arm...apparently not willing to follow even the simplest of instructions....carrying a knife....in the most dangerous area of the country... See, I already shot him. Because if you're a felon high on PCP not listening to me and you have a knife...I'm assuming you're not coming over to me to ask for directions to the nearest Best Buy.

    Listen...I've never had police issues. I've had police pull me over. I even once had one ask me to get out of my car. You'd be amazed how completely non-violent that interaction can be if you simply do as you're told and don't act like a complete ****. Does it always end with a tip of a hat and a smile. Nope. Once cop even yelled at me when he gave me the ticket. That was unsettling. But I didn't get out of my car, chase him down, and try to wrestle away his pistol. That would be a HORRIBLE decision. OR...we can assume if I was black...he'd have just shot me in the head. As if we have a rash of cops just driving around neighborhoods gunning down black children on their way home from Sunday school. Again...society needs a reboot. Get on it God.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessiewoodard57 View Post
    Even in church we have some that carry you never know when some idiot is going to walk into a "gun free zone" and open up on people.
    I used to carry when I lived in Michigan. I voted against the law simply because I felt the way it was written, it would turn to many law abiding citizens into criminals because it was so ridiculous. You couldn't carry in bars, stadiums, theatres seating more than 2500 people, schools, churches, government buildings, college campuses, or anywhere privately owned where they have a sign posted. It was so ridiculous that at the Michigan/Ohio border I had to take my gun out and where it in a should holster...then when I get back to the Michigan border....put it in the glove box...because in Ohio the cops wanted you wearing it so they can see it if they stop you. In Michigan, having it out in the open like that would be considered "brandishing" and result in loss of your permit and possibly your firearm.

    So every place I'd WANT/NEED to carry a gun....bars, sporting events in downtown Detroit, churches where some idiot might go nuts, etc... I had to leave it in the car. And I just have a feeling...that would be the ultimate kick in the gonards...to FINALLY NEED IT....and you left it in the car because you're not allowed to carry it in a restaurant where 60% or more of it's income comes from liquor sales....uh oh...that might exclude some bowling centers...granted, that law assumes every place with a liquor liscence posts their balance sheet outside their building so you know their % of sales due to liquor...

    Ughh...

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    I don't own a gun and haven't for about 45 years. I have no problem with anyone owning a gun. They don't need a gun that fires every time you pull the trigger and holds 30-40 rounds.
    Double barrel shot gun will take care of you at home. Revolver also. AK's with huge clips are crazy.

    The only people who should be out side of their home with a gun is a police officer at work. This isn't 1880 we should be a little more civilized.

    What about the bad guys you ask? Put a mandatory 20 years for walking around with a gun would stop a lot of the nuts.

    I think hunters should own bolt action rifles with no scope.

    Why do they train police officers to shoot people 16 times. Of course it keep the prison population down.

    Who are you to tell ANYONE what they need and don't need? Your opinion, I get it. So here's mine.

    You say a double barrell will take care of me, and my family, at home? Against what? A single person with a knife? If I'm lucky, two guys with a knife? At least where I live, home invasions occur quite often and normally with more than one intruder each with a gun with a capacity larger than 1. If there's only two guys, each with a 6 shot revolver (rare in today's society) there's 12 possible shots coming at me and my family, and you want me to have 2?

    Hunters with no scopes... So, you are against improving shot accuracy, increasing the suffering of the animal? That's a nice thought.

    And you don't think anyone except police should have a gun outside their house? Really? Police response to a call outside the home is easily double that of a domestic call. Know why? How accurate are most folks under pressure with telling the dispatcher exactly where they are at any given time? It's laughable. And that's IF you have the opportunity to call. Next time you are out driving with your wife or kids, or girlfriend, whatever, at a random place that you are familiar with along the way ask them. " If you had to call the police right now, where would you tell them we are?" See how fast the response is, and truly listen from a dispatchers standpoint to see how helpful it is. Don't forget. The second question the dispatcher will ask you after they say "911, what is your emergency?" is "What town are you in?". And on most phones, once you are on a call, you can't look at your phone and google maps to see where you are. Hopefully, you have a good navigation system. Still, most folks don't.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...***-shootings/

    I won't let ANYONE tell me that I don't have the right to protect myself or my family outside my home. Whether we are traveling by car, in our boat, at a restaraunt, the bowling ally, movie theater, even kids sports function, I carry. I carry EVERYWHERE. I even carried when I coached kids soccer. NO ONE knew. Ever. Not my wife, the other parents, friends, and certainly not the kids, not even my own. That's the point of conceiled carry. It was there for protection and protection only. If it's not needed, no one well ever know. No conversation about it, no show and tell. And that's' the beauty of the concept.

    I think EVERY legal and sane person should carry EVERYWHERE. Even if you carry where you aren't supposed to, if done the way it's intended, no one will ever know. Carrying where you aren't supposed to might help ya make better decisions to keep you out of trouble and being found out about. But it's there if you need it.

    If EVERYONE assumes that EVERYONE else is carrying, I think we'd be a much more polite society. I bet the shootings in the "Gun-Free" zones would stop completely.

    Criminals, as history shows, more times than not tend to be cowards. They strike when and where they know, or think, they will face zero opposition. When faced with opposition, they run. Many mass murderers kill themselves rather that face opposition or come to grips with reality and pay for their mistakes.

    Do I NEED a 30-40 round clip? Nope. But that's just me. However, a law Limiting a clip or magazine to 10 rounds would make my wife's personal 9mm illegal. I want you to personally deliver that message to her that you don't think she needs it, or that the law makes it illegal. Let me forewarn you though...

    She carry's because her ex has verbally threatened her life as well as mine, too many times to count. Prior to the sheriffs deputies physically removing him from the house prior to their divorce, he had the muzzle of his .45 pressed against her head so hard it split it open...numerous times. He is not in jail. He is not restricted from purchasing another gun (his was confiscated by the Sheriff). He left the state to avoid being thrown in jail for child support and Protection Order Violations, and promptly purchased another .45, told the kids about it, and sent them pictures of he and his new wife (who is 2 years older than his oldest daughter) shooting it. And there's NOTHING anyone can do about it. It's actually illegal for us to keep our home address hidden from him, because of the kids. He's not restricted from seeing or contacting them. Judges are great, arent they? But we don't know where he is, ever. Numerous creditors and others, still call us looking for him.

    You have your opinions. More than likely, like myself, yours were developed from years of life experiences. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have mine. I'll live by mine. And I also will never support taking away anyone else's right to decide what is right for themselves, so long as they are legally, physically and mentally stable enough to do so.
    Last edited by Ptnomore; 12-04-2015 at 04:39 PM.
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  7. #47
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    I had this conversation with a coworker and while I am not a proud member of the NRA due to their over-the-top belief that we should all be allowed to own mortars, bazookas, claymores, gattling guns, tommmy guns, etc... I am also much further to the right than my liberal counterparts on the issue.

    Four things are usually the root cause of violence (gun or otherwise):
    - poverty
    - population density
    - radicalization
    - mental health issues

    Therefore...in a rational democracy...we would start a bipartisan effort to address those root causes and AT THE SAME TIME look at some unreasonable and unnecessary issues with our current gun laws (tightening background checks, closing loopholes, etc...). But this issue is like immigration...it has to be a compromise. If you're going to put more restrictions on gun ownership...we need real efforts to deal with those 4 root causes.

    But here's the real problem...should this issue and these root causes be brought up in a congressional committee...the response would be:

    On point A; poverty...
    Democrats: More spending on the poor and taxation of the rich.
    Republicans: No new taxes, trickle down economics.

    Point A dead in the water.

    On point B; population density...
    Democrats: Ease housing restrictions so low income families can purchase homes with little chance of paying their mortage and a high chance of default and make it easy to default and let the banks eat the loans.
    Republicans: Same as above, but make it much harder to walk away from the mortage to protect banks.

    Point B dead in the water, especially after easing housing restrictions in part led to the 2008 collapse that almost brought down our entire economy.

    On point C; Radicalization.
    Democrats: Limit the hate speech and rhetoric coming from right wing radio and Fox News that is stirring up domestic terrorists and state militias, but leave Muslims, PETA, Black Lives Matter folks alone because they are just exercising their freedom of speech and freedom of religion.
    Republicans: Close down mosques, attack Muslim countries militarily, arm civilians to combat potential threats, but protect domestic terrorists who are just trying to fight a corrupt big government and organizations like Planned Parenthood that condone and profit from murder.

    Point C dead in the water.

    On point D; mental health
    Democrats: Provide more domestic spending to house the homeless and provide jobs and money and drug treatment and halfway houses. Build more state hospitals to house mental patients. Focus on removing guns from society to limit the damage done by those crazies that act up.
    Republicans: Leave mental health to private facilities. Arm citizens to fight off crazy whack jobs.

    Point D, dead in the water.

    So...unless our government actually learns to govern...the only chance to do ANYTHING is if one party wins both houses and the Presidency. But that's unlikely and unlikely to last...because the country tends to go in the wrong direction rather quickly when one side or the other has complete control (i.e. liberal California or conservative Texas).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptnomore View Post
    Who are you to tell ANYONE what they need and don't need? Your opinion, I get it. So here's mine.

    You say a double barrell will take care of me, and my family, at home? Against what? A single person with a knife? If I'm lucky, two guys with a knife? At least where I live, home invasions occur quite often and normally with more than one intruder each with a gun with a capacity larger than 1. If there's only two guys, each with a 6 shot revolver (rare in today's society) there's 12 possible shots coming at me and my family, and you want me to have 2?

    Hunters with no scopes... So, you are against improving shot accuracy, increasing the suffering of the animal? That's a nice thought.

    And you don't think anyone except police should have a gun outside their house? Really? Police response to a call outside the home is easily double that of a domestic call. Know why? How accurate are most folks under pressure with telling the dispatcher exactly where they are at any given time? It's laughable. And that's IF you have the opportunity to call. Next time you are out driving with your wife or kids, or girlfriend, whatever, at a random place that you are familiar with along the way ask them. " If you had to call the police right now, where would you tell them we are?" See how fast the response is, and truly listen from a dispatchers standpoint to see how helpful it is. Don't forget. The second question the dispatcher will ask you after they say "911, what is your emergency?" is "What town are you in?". And on most phones, once you are on a call, you can't look at your phone and google maps to see where you are. Hopefully, you have a good navigation system. Still, most folks don't.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...***-shootings/

    I won't let ANYONE tell me that I don't have the right to protect myself or my family outside my home. Whether we are traveling by car, in our boat, at a restaraunt, the bowling ally, movie theater, even kids sports function, I carry. I carry EVERYWHERE. I even carried when I coached kids soccer. NO ONE knew. Ever. Not my wife, the other parents, friends, and certainly not the kids, not even my own. That's the point of conceiled carry. It was there for protection and protection only. If it's not needed, no one well ever know. No conversation about it, no show and tell. And that's' the beauty of the concept.

    I think EVERY legal and sane person should carry EVERYWHERE. Even if you carry where you aren't supposed to, if done the way it's intended, no one will ever know. Carrying where you aren't supposed to might help ya make better decisions to keep you out of trouble and being found out about. But it's there if you need it.

    If EVERYONE assumes that EVERYONE else is carrying, I think we'd be a much more polite society. I bet the shootings in the "Gun-Free" zones would stop completely.

    Criminals, as history shows, more times than not tend to be cowards. They strike when and where they know, or think, they will face zero opposition. When faced with opposition, they run. Many mass murderers kill themselves rather that face opposition or come to grips with reality and pay for their mistakes.

    Do I NEED a 30-40 round clip? Nope. But that's just me. However, a law Limiting a clip or magazine to 10 rounds would make my wife's personal 9mm illegal. I want you to personally deliver that message to her that you don't think she needs it, or that the law makes it illegal. Let me forewarn you though...

    She carry's because her ex has verbally threatened her life as well as mine, too many times to count. Prior to the sheriffs deputies physically removing him from the house prior to their divorce, he had the muzzle of his .45 pressed against her head so hard it split it open...numerous times. He is not in jail. He is not restricted from purchasing another gun (his was confiscated by the Sheriff). He left the state to avoid being thrown in jail for child support and Protection Order Violations, and promptly purchased another .45, told the kids about it, and sent them pictures of he and his new wife (who is 2 years older than his oldest daughter) shooting it. And there's NOTHING anyone can do about it. It's actually illegal for us to keep our home address hidden from him, because of the kids. He's not restricted from seeing or contacting them. Judges are great, arent they? But we don't know where he is, ever. Numerous creditors and others, still call us looking for him.

    You have your opinions. More than likely, like myself, yours were developed from years of life experiences. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have mine. I'll live by mine. And I also will never support taking away anyone else's right to decide what is right for themselves, so long as they are legally, physically and mentally stable enough to do so.

    This is, by far, the best example as to why people should be allowed to carry. A member of my family, who I see often, has been in the same situation as you and your wife for the better part of 10 years. Her ex has been frequently warned, by the law and otherwise, to stay away from her. He knows damn well that if he comes over to her house, and I'm there, he will look down the barrel of my XDM. The law simply does not matter to certain people, and therefore it is incumbent upon the general society to be able to defend themselves. I will not be put in an undefended situation by someone else who thinks I don't need a gun. I too have carried for as long as it's been legal in my state. No one has ever known they're standing next to an armed man. I will guarantee though, that if I ever do have to use that weapon to defend myself, my family, or anyone else put in harms way, they'll be happy I was. You can live on your feet, or die on your knees. I'll take the first.
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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aslan View Post
    I had this conversation with a coworker and while I am not a proud member of the NRA due to their over-the-top belief that we should all be allowed to own mortars, bazookas, claymores, gattling guns, tommmy guns, etc... I am also much further to the right than my liberal counterparts on the issue.

    Four things are usually the root cause of violence (gun or otherwise):
    - poverty
    - population density
    - radicalization
    - mental health issues

    Therefore...in a rational democracy...we would start a bipartisan effort to address those root causes and AT THE SAME TIME look at some unreasonable and unnecessary issues with our current gun laws (tightening background checks, closing loopholes, etc...). But this issue is like immigration...it has to be a compromise. If you're going to put more restrictions on gun ownership...we need real efforts to deal with those 4 root causes.

    But here's the real problem...should this issue and these root causes be brought up in a congressional committee...the response would be:

    On point A; poverty...
    Democrats: More spending on the poor and taxation of the rich.
    Republicans: No new taxes, trickle down economics.

    Point A dead in the water.

    On point B; population density...
    Democrats: Ease housing restrictions so low income families can purchase homes with little chance of paying their mortage and a high chance of default and make it easy to default and let the banks eat the loans.
    Republicans: Same as above, but make it much harder to walk away from the mortage to protect banks.

    Point B dead in the water, especially after easing housing restrictions in part led to the 2008 collapse that almost brought down our entire economy.

    On point C; Radicalization.
    Democrats: Limit the hate speech and rhetoric coming from right wing radio and Fox News that is stirring up domestic terrorists and state militias, but leave Muslims, PETA, Black Lives Matter folks alone because they are just exercising their freedom of speech and freedom of religion.
    Republicans: Close down mosques, attack Muslim countries militarily, arm civilians to combat potential threats, but protect domestic terrorists who are just trying to fight a corrupt big government and organizations like Planned Parenthood that condone and profit from murder.

    Point C dead in the water.

    On point D; mental health
    Democrats: Provide more domestic spending to house the homeless and provide jobs and money and drug treatment and halfway houses. Build more state hospitals to house mental patients. Focus on removing guns from society to limit the damage done by those crazies that act up.
    Republicans: Leave mental health to private facilities. Arm citizens to fight off crazy whack jobs.

    Point D, dead in the water.

    So...unless our government actually learns to govern...the only chance to do ANYTHING is if one party wins both houses and the Presidency. But that's unlikely and unlikely to last...because the country tends to go in the wrong direction rather quickly when one side or the other has complete control (i.e. liberal California or conservative Texas).
    I think we could work with A) and D). C) Not to sure how to work with the Believers, As Bill Maher puts it, its nice to believe in fairy tales. B) Maybe more jobs and less guns would help. Yea the rich could live with a little less wealth.

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by fordman1 View Post
    The non radicals are cowards. We armed the Iraqi's an they dropped the guns and ran.
    The major problem was we pulled out all out our troops that were providing leadership and intelligence because Obama decided upholding a foolish uninformed promise he made was more important that keeping the middle east under control, and preventing the radical muslims from coming into power filling the vacuum of power we left open.

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