Buried 8 pin troubles

[ackwdw123]

Hi, I'm still reading and learning, tonight I left back to back buried 8 pins (right hander). I thought this is from ball coming in too hard and driving the 5 pin straight back. I moved 2 boards left to get into a bit more oil. Next 2 frames left flat10 pins, saw the 6 go around the 10. Since 8 pins are easier for me to shoot, I moved back to right 2 boards. Is there something different anyone might have done different? I'm throwing a Storm Optimus, but I don't have too much wrist yet so revs are still low.

[RobLV1]

While solid eight pin leaves were long considered to be the only true tap in bowling, they are actually the result of a hit that is just slightly weak. As your slight move didn't work, but your ball was still in the pocket, it may be that the Optimus, which is a pretty aggressive ball, may have been losing just enough energy through early roll to be the cause of your dilemma. Choosing a ball to use is not just a matter of finding the most aggressive ball that you can, but one that matches up to your style.

[fortheloveofbowling]

Hi, I'm still reading and learning, tonight I left back to back buried 8 pins (right hander). I thought this is from ball coming in too hard and driving the 5 pin straight back. I moved 2 boards left to get into a bit more oil. Next 2 frames left flat10 pins, saw the 6 go around the 10. Since 8 pins are easier for me to shoot, I moved back to right 2 boards. Is there something different anyone might have done different? I'm throwing a Storm Optimus, but I don't have too much wrist yet so revs are still low.

I don't think i would move off flush 8 pins. Just horrible luck.

[vdubtx]

Rob is right. No true taps in bowling. The pins left on the deck are always indicative of how the ball is coming in to the pocket and if the ball has enough energy to complete it's path.

Considering you were leaving 8's and then moved left 2 boards, then left flat 10's, how about a move 1 board instead of moving 2? When I a leaving 10's, a 1/2 board move depending on flat or ringers is usually all I need to get back to striking.

[fortheloveofbowling]

Rob is right. No true taps in bowling. The pins left on the deck are always indicative of how the ball is coming in to the pocket and if the ball has enough energy to complete it's path.

Considering you were leaving 8's and then moved left 2 boards, then left flat 10's, how about a move 1 board instead of moving 2? When I a leaving 10's, a 1/2 board move depending on flat or ringers is usually all I need to get back to striking.

Would you move off a flush 8 pin? You are right there is a reason you leave many pins. You are good enough if you are lined up to move and leave a flat 10, ring 10. A little tougher to do is leave a 4, light 7 or a 9 on purpose. But you can stand there all day and not leave a 8 on purpose. Because the shot was so close to perfect to don't move off it.

[Mike White]

While solid eight pin leaves were long considered to be the only true tap in bowling, they are actually the result of a hit that is just slightly weak. As your slight move didn't work, but your ball was still in the pocket, it may be that the Optimus, which is a pretty aggressive ball, may have been losing just enough energy through early roll to be the cause of your dilemma. Choosing a ball to use is not just a matter of finding the most aggressive ball that you can, but one that matches up to your style.

Maybe you're 8 pins, or those bowling with you are due to weak shots, but for most of us in the real world, who would consider the shot "buried" the ball is not weak, it is just a slight bit higher that perfect, and fluke pin deflection interferes with the 5 pin.

This video is the last 8 pin I have captured.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU1qvfKC8_s

At approximately 3:40 I leave an 8 pin, which in no way would be considered weak.

[Mike White]

Rob is right. No true taps in bowling. The pins left on the deck are always indicative of how the ball is coming in to the pocket and if the ball has enough energy to complete it's path.

Considering you were leaving 8's and then moved left 2 boards, then left flat 10's, how about a move 1 board instead of moving 2? When I a leaving 10's, a 1/2 board move depending on flat or ringers is usually all I need to get back to striking.

I have to disagree with you mainly because you started with "Rob is right".

The 8 pin is about how pins deflect off other pins, whereas the 10 pin is about how the ball deflects off the head pin.

Ball deflection is much easier to adjust.

[fortheloveofbowling]

Maybe you're 8 pins, or those bowling with you are due to weak shots, but for most of us in the real world, who would consider the shot "buried" the ball is not weak, it is just a slight bit higher that perfect, and fluke pin deflection interferes with the 5 pin.

This video is the last 8 pin I have captured.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU1qvfKC8_s

At approximately 3:40 I leave an 8 pin, which in no way would be considered weak.

Maybe you should have squared up another 1/5 board to the right off that.:)

[vdubtx]

Would you move off a flush 8 pin? You are right there is a reason you leave many pins. You are good enough if you are lined up to move and leave a flat 10, ring 10. A little tougher to do is leave a 4, light 7 or a 9 on purpose. But you can stand there all day and not leave a 8 on purpose. Because the shot was so close to perfect to don't move off it.

I certainly would if I, like the OP, was leaving a string of 8 pins. Why stay when it's not working. If you wouldn't move, that is fine.


I have to disagree with you mainly because you started with "Rob is right".

Wouldn't expect any less of you. :rolleyes:

[fortheloveofbowling]

[QUOTE=vdubtx;126062]I certainly would if I, like the OP, was leaving a string of 8 pins. Why stay when it's not working. If you wouldn't move, that is fine.

I would move off a shaker 8 not a flush one like he was leaving but as you said to each his own

[NewToBowling]

Maybe you're 8 pins, or those bowling with you are due to weak shots, but for most of us in the real world, who would consider the shot "buried" the ball is not weak, it is just a slight bit higher that perfect, and fluke pin deflection interferes with the 5 pin.

This video is the last 8 pin I have captured.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU1qvfKC8_s

At approximately 3:40 I leave an 8 pin, which in no way would be considered weak.

Like your form. Very smooth. How long you been bowling?

One other question, I notice you muscle through the ball once it passes your slide foot. Is the purpose of this to increase revs on the ball (the same moment hand starts rotating around ball) or increase ball speed down lane or both?

[Mike White]

Like your form. Very smooth. How long you been bowling?

One other question, I notice you muscle through the ball once it passes your slide foot. Is the purpose of this to increase revs on the ball (the same moment hand starts rotating around ball) or increase ball speed down lane or both?

I've been bowling since the 1970's, with an absence from the game during the 1990's and 2000's.

Started back in 2012 only to realize my body got old during that time.

Ball speed come from the legs, I accelerate the follow thru to increase rev rate.

That ball was a Storm Mix (urethane), on lanes that were a bit on the oily side, so it resulted in a number of light hits.

[NewToBowling]

I've been bowling since the 1970's, with an absence from the game during the 1990's and 2000's.

Started back in 2012 only to realize my body got old during that time.

Ball speed come from the legs, I accelerate the follow thru to increase rev rate.

That ball was a Storm Mix (urethane), on lanes that were a bit on the oily side, so it resulted in a number of light hits.

Thanks. I'm powering thru also but I'm probably doing it for the wrong reasons. Need to focus on the revs.

When you say oily lanes resulted in light hits do you mean the oil kept the ball skidding and didn't have a chance to roll?

I'm learning that dry lanes have a big effect on ball energy. It just sucks up all the energy and you get weak pin action.

[ackwdw123]

While solid eight pin leaves were long considered to be the only true tap in bowling, they are actually the result of a hit that is just slightly weak. As your slight move didn't work, but your ball was still in the pocket, it may be that the Optimus, which is a pretty aggressive ball, may have been losing just enough energy through early roll to be the cause of your dilemma. Choosing a ball to use is not just a matter of finding the most aggressive ball that you can, but one that matches up to your style.

Thanks for the info here. I'm thinking you hit it right on the head with losing energy. The past 4 weeks I have been trying to cup the ball, to get my revs up. I tanked my average down 15 pins during this time, and decided to go back to wrist guard and closing fingers during release. Is there something that is evident with ball rotation that I can watch for that would indicate the ball lost it's energy? Seems like I'm asking a stupid question.

[Mike White]

Thanks. I'm powering thru also but I'm probably doing it for the wrong reasons. Need to focus on the revs.

When you say oily lanes resulted in light hits do you mean the oil kept the ball skidding and didn't have a chance to roll?

I'm learning that dry lanes have a big effect on ball energy. It just sucks up all the energy and you get weak pin action.

I don't think many of those shots had the ball reach the roll phase.

I get hook due to rev rate being close to forward speed, but the urethane ball doesn't slow down, and rev up to match like a reactive resin ball does.

I had to settle for that ball because the next up ball (Trop Breeze) reacted way too much.

[foreverincamo]

In my opinion, a " stone 8 " pin is a bad break. A string of them should result in a trip to the bar.

[Mike White]

In my opinion, a " stone 8 " pin is a bad break. A string of them should result in a trip to the bar.

In one game while subbing for a team I started with a strike, ended with a strike on the count ball in the 10th.

In between those I left in no particular order, 3 ringing 10 pins, 2 solid 9 pins, 2 solid 8 pins, a 4 pin, and a nose dive 6 pin.

Had I been a drinker, I'm pretty sure I would have partaken.