Pin placement?

[Greenday]

Basically, pin up and pin down are terms used by bowlers with outdated knowledge or those trying to sound like they know what they're talking about. That's not meant to offend anybody just an observation.

I'm going to have to disagree. It can still be a relative term to use even with new layouts. It's more of a generalized term to use to describe the drilling.

[billf]

But it doesn't. Given an average PAP of 4" over and 1/4" up, a 60° drill angle will be pin up. Seeing as that is not a long drill angle it doesn't correlate well at all.

[Mike White]

But it doesn't. Given an average PAP of 4" over and 1/4" up, a 60° drill angle will be pin up. Seeing as that is not a long drill angle it doesn't correlate well at all.

I think you mean Val angle. Drill angle doesn't factor into the pin up/down issue.

[billf]

Mike, however a 10° drill angle will roll the soonest while a 90° drill angle will roll later. Pin up in a PSA layout will roll later and pin down earlier.

[Perrin]

I think you mean Val angle. Drill angle doesn't factor into the pin up/down issue.

that would depend on the position of the CG.

CG towards grip center from the line of the move, pin up would be a narrower angle.
CG in line with the move would be no change of Angle.
CG towards PAP from line of the move, Pin up would be a wider angle.

[Mike White]

Mike, however a 10° drill angle will roll the soonest while a 90° drill angle will roll later. Pin up in a PSA layout will roll later and pin down earlier.

I meant changing the drill angle doesn't change whether the pin ends up above or below the fingers, changing the val angle does.

[billf]

I meant changing the drill angle doesn't change whether the pin ends up above or below the fingers, changing the val angle does.

OK, now we're on the same page.

[GoodGorilla]

Mike, however a 10° drill angle will roll the soonest while a 90° drill angle will roll later. Pin up in a PSA layout will roll later and pin down earlier.

So this is pretty much the answer then for up and down. What about pin left and right? Also, is dual angle system better than psa?

[Mike White]

So this is pretty much the answer then for up and down. What about pin left and right? Also, is dual angle system better than psa?

Moving the Pin Left or Right could change both the Pin to PAP distance as well as the Val angle.

Changing the Pin to Pap distance changes the flare potential, and the "energy burn rate"

[GoodGorilla]

Moving the Pin Left or Right could change both the Pin to PAP distance as well as the Val angle.

Changing the Pin to Pap distance changes the flare potential, and the "energy burn rate"

Probably off topic but how does rev's effect energy burn rate? I mean I know that revs = rotational energy when striking the pins, but if your ball burns energy from the revs why rev it up?