great read

[rv driver]

Now to play devil's advocate and sort of agree with RV...one sport that I DO see the clique attitude hurting it is Golf.

I was thinking of this this morning. Lets say I want to take a friend or coworker to the golf course with me some weekend afternoon to golf...yet he's never golfed before.

I actually would NEVER do that. Why? Because with a new or bad golfer, everyone behind us would be totally peeved and upset. It would ruin whatever fun and relaxation the golfing provides.

I remember as a beginner golfer, one Saturday with another beginner golfer...it took us 6.5 hours to complete 18 holes (walking). We must have let 11-19 groups play through. And had we NOT let them play through...we'd have backed up the course so badly they'd have been shooting up on us or the Ranger would have showed up.

Golf, which has been in decline in much of the East/Midwest/South...is a dichotomy because they WANT it to be a popular sport...but they don't want more people cluttering up the courses and have no tolerance for any high handicap golfer they get stuck behind.

It sort of doesn't make sense to openly disdain newcomers to the sport. You'd think they'd be welcome with open arms... even if it is an inconvenience.

[Bunny]

HBO's Real Sports had a good story last week on the major decline of golf over the last few years.

[rv driver]

HBO's Real Sports had a good story last week on the major decline of golf over the last few years.

Thing about golf is that it's so dad gum EXPENSIVE!!! $500 or more for a good set of clubs, $200 for a bag, shoes, balls, tees, etc. Greens fees + club memberships are outrageous.

[Aslan]

It sort of doesn't make sense to openly disdain newcomers to the sport. You'd think they'd be welcome with open arms... even if it is an inconvenience.

Trust me...they are NOT.

You think smirks and giggling is bad in the pro shop...these guys welcome newbies by driving a ball and landing it next to them as a "warning shot" to hurry up. Imagine being at the bowling alley pro shop and a league player just throws a bowling ball and it lands next to you. A LOT more subtle of a "hint".

[bowl1820]

In regard to leagues wanting shorter "schedules" and lower costs. sanctioned leagues can set the length to whatever they want. The USBC doesn't set the length.

Becoming unsanctioned only has a minor affect on costs, league fees like lineage, prize money, sponsor fee's are set by the league and the house.

So becoming unsanctioned has little bearing on those.

How is the length of the league schedule determined?
The length of the schedule and other commercial aspects of the game (such as price of
bowling, time, number of teams, etc.) are matters to be negotiated by the league and the
proprietor. Because a proprietor has specific rights as an independent business person,
USBC has no jurisdiction over these commercial aspects,


Most unsanctioned leagues , became unsanctioned do to a feeling that they weren't getting their moneys worth from the USBC like the changes to the awards and do to rule restrictions.

Update: Now that they have the new usbc rules up and looking at the changes made.

About leagues wanting shorter "schedules"

according to the new rule changes for the new season.

It appears that there was a old rule (though I haven't found it in the old books yet), that if a adult league was shorter than 16 weeks it couldn't be a certified league. Thus they went unsanctioned.

But they have changed that now.

They can get the "Adult Basic Membership"

USBC Adult Basic membership
Bowlers competing in short-season leagues now can purchase a USBC Adult Basic membership. (Though it's only good for that league, if you bowl in another short league you have to get another card for it too. so your better off getting the regular card still)

(Bowlers with a current Adult Standard membership would not be required to purchase a USBC Adult Basic membership)

Available for bowlers who compete in leagues that have 16 or fewer sessions, the membership costs $10, not including state dues, and provides a USBC-certified average so bowlers can compete in local, state and national tournaments.

you can read about it here:
click for USBC Adult Basic membership

[rv driver]

Trust me...they are NOT.

You think smirks and giggling is bad in the pro shop...these guys welcome newbies by driving a ball and landing it next to them as a "warning shot" to hurry up. Imagine being at the bowling alley pro shop and a league player just throws a bowling ball and it lands next to you. A LOT more subtle of a "hint".

And we wonder why the sport doesn't grow. Sorry, even if the newbies are an inconvenience, this is tantamount to these redneck truck guys who use additives to purposely blow diesel smoke at people they don't like, and giving them the finger as they roar by. It's just poor form that fosters enmity rather than camaraderie.

[rv driver]

Update: Now that they have the new usbc rules up and looking at the changes made.

About leagues wanting shorter "schedules"

according to the new rule changes for the new season.

It appears that there was a old rule (though I haven't found it in the old books yet), that if a adult league was shorter than 16 weeks it couldn't be a certified league. Thus they went unsanctioned.

But they have changed that now.

They can get the "Adult Basic Membership"

USBC Adult Basic membership
Bowlers competing in short-season leagues now can purchase a USBC Adult Basic membership. (Though it's only good for that league, if you bowl in another short league you have to get another card for it too. so your better off getting the regular card still)

(Bowlers with a current Adult Standard membership would not be required to purchase a USBC Adult Basic membership)

Available for bowlers who compete in leagues that have 16 or fewer sessions, the membership costs $10, not including state dues, and provides a USBC-certified average so bowlers can compete in local, state and national tournaments.

you can read about it here:
click for USBC Adult Basic membership

Here's a question for you: I've bowled league, but never tournament. Are tournaments only open to USBC members with sanctioned averages? Or can anyone enter and take their chances?

[Amyers]

Here's a question for you: I've bowled league, but never tournament. Are tournaments only open to USBC members with sanctioned averages? Or can anyone enter and take their chances?

It depends on if it is sanctioned or not. If it is you must purchase a USBC membership and you can bowl but you must bowl scratch if you don't have a book average.

[rv driver]

It depends on if it is sanctioned or not. If it is you must purchase a USBC membership and you can bowl but you must bowl scratch if you don't have a book average.

I thought that might be the case. I simply don't have any experience with tournaments. (Last time I threw league was when it was ABC).

[Aslan]

Here's a question for you: I've bowled league, but never tournament. Are tournaments only open to USBC members with sanctioned averages? Or can anyone enter and take their chances?

Depends on the tournament/sponsor/association

PBA Tournaments often require a PBA card (>$$). USBC tournaments require some form of USBC membership dues (< $). ABTA and ABT and TNBA will often require you to join their association (< $). Local alley tournaments usually don't require a "membership" or dues or you to be sanctioned.

But the real disadvantage of being non-sanctioned is the average you take with you into handicap tournaments. For USBC tournaments, you NEED a book average OR sometimes they'll take a sanctioned league average. BUT...they will NOT take non-sanctioned averages. And if you bowl without a sanctioned average, you generally get 0 handicap or bowl in the highest division.

ABTA/ABT/TNBA generally also require some type of verified average. They are a little "looser"...and might except a non-sanctioned league sheet. I actually got annoyed at an ABTA tournament because one of the gals running it bowled with like a 165 average and I looked up her USBC book average and it was like 174. It seems to me that if you have a book, THAT should be used...not whatever you say your league average is.

So, the answer is, it varies. I've bowled in a USBC tournament and an ABTA tournament. The USBC ones are more strict and run better...it's more about the competition. The ABT/ABTA/TNBA are more about $$$ and sidepots and brackets and trying to win money/balls/bags...and the rules are more "lax". If you're a lower average bowler, the USBC tournaments will be better but you MUST have a USBC membership and be in a sanctioned league. If you're a 200+ scratch bowler...you might prefer the ABTA/ABT/TNBA where you can often make more money and the rules aren't as favorable to low average/handicap bowlers.